Jump to content


  • Tweets

  • Posts

    • He was one of four former top executives from Sam Bankman-Fried's firms to plead guilty to charges.View the full article
    • The private submersible industry was shaken after the implosion of the OceanGate Titan sub last year.View the full article
    • further polished WS using above suggestions and also included couple of more modifications highlighted in orange are those ok to include?   Background   1.1  The Defendant received the Parking Charge Notice (PCN) on the 06th of January 2020 following the vehicle being parked at Arla Old Dairy, South Ruislip on the 05th of December 2019.   Unfair PCN   2.1  On 19th December 2023 the Defendant sent the Claimant's solicitors a CPR request.  As shown in Exhibit 1 (pages 7-13) sent by the solicitors the signage displayed in their evidence clearly shows a £60.00 parking charge notice (which will be reduced to £30 if paid within 14 days of issue).  2.2  Yet the PCN sent by the Claimant is for a £100.00 parking charge notice (reduced to £60 if paid within 30 days of issue).   2.3        The Claimant relies on signage to create a contract.  It is unlawful for the Claimant to write that the charge is £60 on their signs and then send demands for £100.    2.4        The unlawful £100 charge is also the basis for the Claimant's Particulars of Claim.  No Locus Standi  3.1  I do not believe a contract with the landowner, that is provided following the defendant’s CPR request, gives MET Parking Services a right to bring claims in their own name. Definition of “Relevant contract” from the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012, Schedule 4,  2 [1] means a contract Including a contract arising only when the vehicle was parked on the relevant land between the driver and a person who is-   (a) the owner or occupier of the land; or   (b) Authorised, under or by virtue of arrangements made by the owner or occupier of the land, to enter into a contract with the driver requiring the payment of parking charges in respect of the parking of the vehicle on the land. According to https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2006/46/section/44   For a contract to be valid, it requires a director from each company to sign and then two independent witnesses must confirm those signatures.   3.2  The Defendant requested to see such a contract in the CPR request.  The fact that no contract has been produced with the witness signatures present means the contract has not been validly executed. Therefore, there can be no contract established between MET Parking Services and the motorist. Even if “Parking in Electric Bay” could form a contract (which it cannot), it is immaterial. There is no valid contract.  Illegal Conduct – No Contract Formed   4.1 At the time of writing, the Claimant has failed to provide the following, in response to the CPR request from myself.   4.2        The legal contract between the Claimant and the landowner (which in this case is Standard Life Investments UK) to provide evidence that there is an agreement in place with landowner with the necessary authority to issue parking charge notices and to pursue payment by means of litigation.   4.3 Proof of planning permission granted for signage etc under the Town and country Planning Act 1990. Lack of planning permission is a criminal offence under this Act and no contract can be formed where criminality is involved.   4.4        I also do not believe the claimant possesses these documents.   No Keeper Liability   5.1        The defendant was not the driver at the time and date mentioned in the PCN and the claimant has not established keeper liability under schedule 4 of the PoFA 2012. In this matter, the defendant puts it to the claimant to produce strict proof as to who was driving at the time.   5.2 The claimant in their Notice To Keeper also failed to comply with PoFA 2012 Schedule 4 section 9[2][f] while mentioning “the right to recover from the keeper so much of that parking charge as remains unpaid” where they did not include statement “(if all the applicable conditions under this Schedule are met)”.     5.3         The claimant did not mention parking period, times on the photographs are separate from the PCN and in any case are that arrival and departure times not the parking period since their times include driving to and from the parking space as a minimum and can include extra time to allow pedestrians and other vehicles to pass in front.    Protection of Freedoms Act 2012   The notice must -   (a) specify the vehicle, the relevant land on which it was parked and the period of parking to which the notice relates;  22. In the persuasive judgement K4GF167G - Premier Park Ltd v Mr Mathur - Horsham County Court – 5 January 2024 it was on this very point that the judge dismissed this claim.  5.4  A the PCN does not comply with the Act the Defendant as keeper is not liable.  No Breach of Contract   6.1       No breach of contract occurred because the PCN and contract provided as part of the defendant’s CPR request shows different post code, PCN shows HA4 0EY while contract shows HA4 0FY. According to PCN defendant parked on HA4 0EY which does not appear to be subject to the postcode covered by the contract.  6.2         The entrance sign does not mention anything about there being other terms inside the car park so does not offer a contract which makes it only an offer to treat,  Interest  7.1  It is unreasonable for the Claimant to delay litigation for  Double Recovery   7.2  The claim is littered with made-up charges.  7.3  As noted above, the Claimant's signs state a £60 charge yet their PCN is for £100.  7.4  As well as the £100 parking charge, the Claimant seeks recovery of an additional £70.  This is simply a poor attempt to circumvent the legal costs cap at small claims.  7.5 Since 2019, many County Courts have considered claims in excess of £100 to be an abuse of process leading to them being struck out ab initio. An example, in the Caernarfon Court in VCS v Davies, case No. FTQZ4W28 on 4th September 2019, District Judge Jones-Evans stated “Upon it being recorded that District Judge Jones- Evans has over a very significant period of time warned advocates (...) in many cases of this nature before this court that their claim for £60 is unenforceable in law and is an abuse of process and is nothing more than a poor attempt to go behind the decision of the Supreme Court v Beavis which inter alia decided that a figure of £160 as a global sum claimed in this case would be a penalty and not a genuine pre-estimate of loss and therefore unenforceable in law and if the practice continued, he would treat all cases as a claim for £160 and therefore a penalty and unenforceable in law it is hereby declared (…) the claim is struck out and declared to be wholly without merit and an abuse of process.”  7.6 In Claim Nos. F0DP806M and F0DP201T, District Judge Taylor echoed earlier General Judgment or Orders of District Judge Grand, stating ''It is ordered that the claim is struck out as an abuse of process. The claim contains a substantial charge additional to the parking charge which it is alleged the Defendant contracted to pay. This additional charge is not recoverabl15e under the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012, Schedule 4 nor with reference to the judgment in Parking Eye v Beavis. It is an abuse of process from the Claimant to issue a knowingly inflated claim for an additional sum which it is not entitled to recover. This order has been made by the court of its own initiative without a hearing pursuant to CPR Rule 3.3(4)) of the Civil Procedure Rules 1998...''  7.7 In the persuasive case of G4QZ465V - Excel Parking Services Ltd v Wilkinson – Bradford County Court -2 July 2020 (Exhibit 4) the judge had decided that Excel had won. However, due to Excel adding on the £60 the Judge dismissed the case.  7.8        The addition of costs not previously specified on signage are also in breach of the Consumer Rights Act 2015, Schedule 2, specifically paras 6, 10 and 14.   7.9        It is the Defendant’s position that the Claimant in this case has knowingly submitted inflated costs and thus the entire claim should be similarly struck out in accordance with Civil Procedure Rule 3.3(4).   In Conclusion   8.1        I invite the court to dismiss the claim.  Statement of Truth  I believe that the facts stated in this witness statement are true. I understand that proceedings for contempt of court may be brought against anyone who makes, or causes to be made, a false statement in a document verified by a statement of truth without an honest belief in its truth.   
    • Well the difference is that in all our other cases It was Kev who was trying to entrap the motorist so sticking two fingers up to him and daring him to try court was from a position of strength. In your case, sorry, you made a mistake so you're not in the position of strength.  I've looked on Google Maps and the signs are few & far between as per Kev's MO, but there is an entrance sign saying "Pay & Display" (and you've admitted in writing that you knew you had to pay) and the signs by the payment machines do say "Sea View Car Park" (and you've admitted in writing you paid the wrong car park ... and maybe outed yourself as the driver). Something I missed in my previous post is that the LoC is only for one ticket, not two. Sorry, but it's impossible to definitively advise what to so. Personally I'd probably gamble on Kev being a serial bottler of court and reply with a snotty letter ridiculing the signage (given you mentioned the signage in your appeal) - but it is a gamble.  
    • No! What has happened is that your pix were up-to-date: 5 hours' maximum stay and £100 PCN. The lazy solicitors have sent ancient pictures: 4 hours' maximum stay and £60 PCN. Don't let on!  Let them be hoisted by their own lazy petard in the court hearing (if they don't bottle before).
  • Recommended Topics

  • Our picks

    • If you are buying a used car – you need to read this survival guide.
        • Like
      • 1 reply
    • Hello,

      On 15/1/24 booked appointment with Big Motoring World (BMW) to view a mini on 17/1/24 at 8pm at their Enfield dealership.  

      Car was dirty and test drive was two circuits of roundabout on entry to the showroom.  Was p/x my car and rushed by sales exec and a manager into buying the mini and a 3yr warranty that night, sale all wrapped up by 10pm.  They strongly advised me taking warranty out on car that age (2017) and confirmed it was honoured at over 500 UK registered garages.

      The next day, 18/1/24 noticed amber engine warning light on dashboard , immediately phoned BMW aftercare team to ask for it to be investigated asap at nearest garage to me. After 15 mins on hold was told only their 5 service centres across the UK can deal with car issues with earliest date for inspection in March ! Said I’m not happy with that given what sales team advised or driving car. Told an amber warning light only advisory so to drive with caution and call back when light goes red.

      I’m not happy to do this, drive the car or with the after care experience (a sign of further stresses to come) so want a refund and to return the car asap.

      Please can you advise what I need to do today to get this done. 
       

      Many thanks 
      • 81 replies
    • Housing Association property flooding. https://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/topic/438641-housing-association-property-flooding/&do=findComment&comment=5124299
        • Like
      • 161 replies
    • We have finally managed to obtain the transcript of this case.

      The judge's reasoning is very useful and will certainly be helpful in any other cases relating to third-party rights where the customer has contracted with the courier company by using a broker.
      This is generally speaking the problem with using PackLink who are domiciled in Spain and very conveniently out of reach of the British justice system.

      Frankly I don't think that is any accident.

      One of the points that the judge made was that the customers contract with the broker specifically refers to the courier – and it is clear that the courier knows that they are acting for a third party. There is no need to name the third party. They just have to be recognisably part of a class of person – such as a sender or a recipient of the parcel.

      Please note that a recent case against UPS failed on exactly the same issue with the judge held that the Contracts (Rights of Third Parties) Act 1999 did not apply.

      We will be getting that transcript very soon. We will look at it and we will understand how the judge made such catastrophic mistakes. It was a very poor judgement.
      We will be recommending that people do include this adverse judgement in their bundle so that when they go to county court the judge will see both sides and see the arguments against this adverse judgement.
      Also, we will be to demonstrate to the judge that we are fair-minded and that we don't mind bringing everything to the attention of the judge even if it is against our own interests.
      This is good ethical practice.

      It would be very nice if the parcel delivery companies – including EVRi – practised this kind of thing as well.

       

      OT APPROVED, 365MC637, FAROOQ, EVRi, 12.07.23 (BRENT) - J v4.pdf
        • Like
  • Recommended Topics

Fredrickson not accepting payment offer


WetCloth
style="text-align: center;">  

Thread Locked

because no one has posted on it for the last 5171 days.

If you need to add something to this thread then

 

Please click the "Report " link

 

at the bottom of one of the posts.

 

If you want to post a new story then

Please

Start your own new thread

That way you will attract more attention to your story and get more visitors and more help 

 

Thanks

Recommended Posts

I am sick and on Income support. I owe to multiple creditors. The vast majority have accepted my nominal proposals except Fredrickson International who tell me in their letter that I 'have failed to make an acceptable repayment proposal'.

 

I don't know what else to do, I cannot afford to offer them any more than I have. Unfortunately it's for an old bank overdraft which I was reclaiming charges against and was rejected when the judgement was made.

 

They keep on asking me to call in these letters, but I can't due to my condition, and I've even had a threat letter From Bryan Carter solicitors.

 

Any advice would be appreciated.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Sorry to hear about your circumstances. There are several others here like your self.

 

Ignore their requests to call them. Instead write to them explaining your circumstances and offering them £1/month. Send the first payment (postal order) with your letter and send the letter by recorded delivery.

Every month after this send another £1 payment. Ensure you do this religiously.

 

Then just ignore any correspondence they might send.

 

Fredricksens/Bryan Carter might lodge a claim in the County Court but it won't get very far if you can show that you have been making regular payments - and that Freds have been making no attempt to resolve the matter.

Should a judgment (CCJ) be granted then you will not be asked to pay more than you can afford (you will need to be able to prove your financial circumstances to the court).

 

Stick with it. Come back here for advice and support - sometimes the latter can be just as important when you're out on your own.

I really do appreciate all those 'thank you' emails - I'm glad I've been able to help. Apologies if I haven't acknowledged all of them.

You can also ding my gong if you prefer. :)

Link to post
Share on other sites

Sorry to hear about your circumstances. There are several others here like your self.

 

Ignore their requests to call them. Instead write to them explaining your circumstances and offering them £1/month. Send the first payment (postal order) with your letter and send the letter by recorded delivery.

Every month after this send another £1 payment. Ensure you do this religiously.

 

Then just ignore any correspondence they might send.

 

Fredricksens/Bryan Carter might lodge a claim in the County Court but it won't get very far if you can show that you have been making regular payments - and that Freds have been making no attempt to resolve the matter.

Should a judgment (CCJ) be granted then you will not be asked to pay more than you can afford (you will need to be able to prove your financial circumstances to the court).

 

Stick with it. Come back here for advice and support - sometimes the latter can be just as important when you're out on your own.

 

Thanks for your time and advice.

 

I offered £3 - should I now offer less or the original payment?

Link to post
Share on other sites

have you considered claiming your bank charges under the hardship scheme

 

I did and was flat out rejected by Natwest, despite having multiple creditors, difficulty paying my utilities etc..

 

Prior to claiming charges Natwest treated me with appaling suspicion and doubled the balance of the account by piling on interest while I was making nominal payments.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Did they offer a reason? did you complain to any regulator on their decision

 

No just a vague statement saying they did not beleive I was suffering hardship.

 

Don't I have to complain to them first?

Link to post
Share on other sites

No just a vague statement saying they did not beleive I was suffering hardship.

 

Don't I have to complain to them first?

 

You do but then you need to proceed to the FOS if the bank dont comply or give a good reason, FOS has had a go at banks for using the letter of rejection to test peoples resolve to continue, basically not even looking into the account details and circumstances...

 

Never ever give up at the first letter of rejection ;-)

 

S.

Link to post
Share on other sites

...Or.... being a little devil I would CCA s78 the DCA chasing the debt, overdrafts are partially covered under CCA1974

 

Its up to them to provide info on the initial request for an overdraft and claim exemption of the CCA :-D

 

S.

 

They already provided statements after I sent them a prove it letter. Would they not consider such a move spurious and simply ignore it?

Link to post
Share on other sites

Not if they want to collect the debt, under CCA they have to respond to the s78 in 12+2 days...

 

A little bit of light reading :-) Taken from an overdraft thread on this board...

 

I've underlined the important bit.....

 

An overdraft is a debtor creditor agreement as defined under section 8 and 13 of the CCA and is running account credit as defined in section 10. This has high court case law - coutts vs sebastyn.

When they say it is not CCA, what they mean is that there is part v exemption from the CCA but,

-they still need to show the contractual arrangement set up with 30 days of the o/d

-they still need a valid default notice

-they still need a termination notice.

 

A current account is covered by the banking code (FSA) and does not offer credit facilities. An overdraft is a credit agreement and as such CCA.

 

This is my specialist area I've seen off HSBC and LTSB on this. They will try to tell you that CCA does not apply to an o/d this utter nonsense. What tehy mean is that they have the part v exemption. So a SAR requesting specifically the default and termination notices plus the letter they sent you within 30 days of setting up the o/d (which must include interest rate and conditions such as limit) will tell you if they can enforce it. But I would still start with a CCA for the o/d it is for them to prove part v exemption.

 

A CCA request applies to an overdraft until and unless they tell you in writing that it is Part V exempt. At that point they must provide all the documents under the determination for the overdraft to be enforceable else section 78(6) of the CCA applies.

 

[edit: Apologies for being unable to say which thread and who posted this originally... my index doc got corrupted :-(]

 

S.

Link to post
Share on other sites

You do but then you need to proceed to the FOS if the bank dont comply or give a good reason, FOS has had a go at banks for using the letter of rejection to test peoples resolve to continue, basically not even looking into the account details and circumstances...

 

Never ever give up at the first letter of rejection ;-)

 

S.

 

Could I complain about their general handling of my debt prior to my claim for charges/hardship - would this constitute 2 separate complaints?

 

Also, would the debt then be in dispute under the banking code if I chose to complain/dispute to natwest about the decision?

 

They also called in the DCA before I received my final rejection that they would not consider my case under the normal rules. Isn't there meant to be an 8 week period of possible appeal/complaint after the decision? Can they pursue the debt during that period?

Link to post
Share on other sites

  • 2 weeks later...

I haven't been well and Fredrickson have flat out rejected my offer of repayment, threatening to use Bryan Carter if I don't pay in full in 48 hours.

 

Haven't CCA'd them yet due to illness. Will do monday. I would be grateful if someone could help me with the questions I asked in my previous post too if possible.

 

Also, which address should I use for the CCA?

Link to post
Share on other sites

The Banking Code no longer exists. It was replaced by the Lending Code last November.

 

It will come as no surprise that the new Lending Code disclaims any validity in relation to making complaints to such bodies as the Financial Ombudsman Service. Look at the introduction point 5 here - http://www.lendingstandardsboard.org.uk/docs/lendingcode.pdf.

I really do appreciate all those 'thank you' emails - I'm glad I've been able to help. Apologies if I haven't acknowledged all of them.

You can also ding my gong if you prefer. :)

Link to post
Share on other sites

The Banking Code no longer exists. It was replaced by the Lending Code last November.

 

It will come as no surprise that the new Lending Code disclaims any validity in relation to making complaints to such bodies as the Financial Ombudsman Service. Look at the introduction point 5 here - http://www.lendingstandardsboard.org.uk/docs/lendingcode.pdf.

 

That's terrible - what counts as a dispute now then? :eek:

Link to post
Share on other sites

What it means is that any breach of the lending code cannot be the basis of any claim to the FOS.

Which raises the point about what exactly it is for. But this is moving slightly off-topic.

I really do appreciate all those 'thank you' emails - I'm glad I've been able to help. Apologies if I haven't acknowledged all of them.

You can also ding my gong if you prefer. :)

Link to post
Share on other sites

if they don't want to accept your offer then write and tell them that you will make an application to the court for a time order

 

I'll see what happens down the s.78 route first. Presumably they'll claim exemption and I'll end up having to SAR them for the relevant documents.

 

I'm kind of hoping another definitive avenue for claiming charges back will arise soon. Been treated appallingly by both Natwest and Fredrickson over the past couple of years or so. My health is suffering because of them. The balance is basically made up of what I've been charged over the years, plus extortionate interest which doubled the balance of the account while I was making token payments. They knew I was ill and on benefits; they had the evidence, yet acted like complete pigs, even sending me a patronsing letter doubting everything on my financial statement. I'm just full of rage, contempt, fear and sadness about all this.

Link to post
Share on other sites

What it means is that any breach of the lending code cannot be the basis of any claim to the FOS.

Which raises the point about what exactly it is for. But this is moving slightly off-topic.

 

Hmm but if the lending code is a "code of practice" then it does become binding under Consumer Protection from Unfair Trading Regulations 2008

 

 

S.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Ok, after ignoring my initial financial statement, they have now sent me this cracker to fill out:

295vout.jpg

 

 

I haven't included the reverse. Should I even bother, or should I simply resend my cccs form along with proof of benefits?

Link to post
Share on other sites

I know what I would do and it aint a pretty sight

 

It's a nice thought , but i actually want them to accept my offer and leave me alone for a while.

 

All the form appears to be geared up to do is find out whether someone has assets and to gain access to an individual's bank details - probably for the purpose of intimidating them into selling their posessions. I can't see why else they'd be asking such specific questions i.e. whether you are a furnished or unfurnished tennant.

 

This question on the reverse is also telling:

 

"Please confirm you have discussed the use of assets to make lump sum payments?"

Link to post
Share on other sites

Ok, after ignoring my initial financial statement, they have now sent me this cracker to fill out:

 

 

 

I haven't included the reverse. Should I even bother, or should I simply resend my cccs form along with proof of benefits?

 

haha they really do take the biscuit... someone comes along they want to pay and are willing to pay what they can afford and yet they still try and make them jump through hoops! :mad::mad:

 

Yep, definately do NOT fill in that form, far too much detail on there, or alternatively just transcribe the bits you have given them already onto their form and leave the others blank :-)

 

S.

Link to post
Share on other sites

haha they really do take the biscuit... someone comes along they want to pay and are willing to pay what they can afford and yet they still try and make them jump through hoops! :mad::mad:

 

Yep, definately do NOT fill in that form, far too much detail on there, or alternatively just transcribe the bits you have given them already onto their form and leave the others blank :-)

 

S.

 

Well there is no way they are getting any bank account details anyway because I don't do direct payment. As you say I may just ammend the form or leave stuff blank, and include a copy of my original statement.

 

I'm willing to pay token installments in the interim. I'll have a look at the relevant documents after they respond to my s.78 cca request (if I have them, if not then I'll s.a.r. them). If they comply then, fine, I'll pay what I can afford. If they don't then....

Link to post
Share on other sites

Not if they want to collect the debt, under CCA they have to respond to the s78 in 12+2 days...

 

A little bit of light reading :-) Taken from an overdraft thread on this board...

 

I've underlined the important bit.....

 

 

 

[edit: Apologies for being unable to say which thread and who posted this originally... my index doc got corrupted :-(]

 

S.

 

"-they still need to show the contractual arrangement set up within 30 days of the o/d"

 

Which document/s would they need to provide to show this?

Link to post
Share on other sites

  • Recently Browsing   0 Caggers

    • No registered users viewing this page.

  • Have we helped you ...?


×
×
  • Create New...