RBOS Loan mystery!!

[patrickq1]

also don't forget that the 6 year SB rule works both ways

this is true STATUTE BARRED (SB) 6 year rule ,but if its only just been discovered that there has been overpayments that has gone on and on without the DCA informing them that an oversight had occured then i think it can then go back to the OC and the SAR stands and should be complied with imo

patrickq1

[foxyflugel]

I've just had a thought!! The one loan statement that I do have for 2008 - I am going to compare it to the statement that they have sent me - figures etc. It is just one statement (in statement form) - but surely there should have been more than one and one for every year?? If they are true copy statements - it just looks like a print out type of statement - but on statement paper - if you know what I mean.

[diddydicky]

the company is obliged to send you any information it holds about you under a SAR

 

the company is legally obliged to keep documentation relating to the transaction with you for (i beleive) at least 6 years after the relationship has ended therefore they cannot deny that they have information to disclose

[patrickq1]

thanks dd i think fg is waiting for the dat to come from the bank and until she receives this their isnt a great deal that can be done

patrickq1

ps..thanks dd for visiting the thread

[foxyflugel]

Hi everyone

 

Well, the plot thickens yet again!! Have recieved the SARs back (for what they are worth - there isn't really much on them tbh - it says at the top 'extracted from Collections Centre records'.

 

HOWEVER, it does say on 5 May 05 - about refinancing loan and overdraft together blah blah ..... charges for Royal Bank Loan refinance £1500 + £9272 = £10,800 60 mths 4.9% no insurance doesn't want = £224.10 pm

 

12 May 2005 - Declined refinance loan £10,800 (then says about refunding charges of £245 & OH withdrew £200 cash off this and they didn't allow for that blah blah) will now need to look at loan of £11,200 (flat rate loan £9443.80 & o/d £1697) been processed as Automated Products (APS dec) set up decline with added 3% so will need to apply all other APS dec conditions??????????

 

19 May 2005

 

APSXXXXXX (- APS means Automated Produce Setup) £11300

 

frl (flat rate loan) £9392.34 o/d £1826.47 (=11,218.81)

remove limit repayments 1 mo nth after drawdown - new cca reqd.

 

23 May 2005 loan drawdown £11,300 x 60 mths

 

 

 

Firstly, why all the different amounts??? I think this says it all (obviously imo) as it states that the loan is £11,300 surely?????? What do you think? and what do I do now - send them a letter saying that he wants his overpayments back??????????? Can't get a copy of the agreement - we haven't got one - I don't think he ever had one tbh!! What do I do them for? - I really cannot believe they have done this - total dishonesty - they have taken (and actively chased) an extra £1000 (approx). Shysters.

[foxyflugel]

Can anyone PLEASE advise on this matter?????????? Many thanks in advance.

[diddydicky]

of more importance is the remark

 

NEW CCA REQD

 

did you sign a new CCA ?

[foxyflugel]

It was my OH DD - and he doesn't remember as it was 2005. I don't think he did as he would have given it to me for our filing system - they also state in the SAR that they were unable to locate the agreement in April 2008!!

Edited March 12, 2010 by foxyflugel

[diddydicky]

then you should send a 78 request and ask for it!!

 

could be quite a damning statement

[foxyflugel]

I already have DD and they sent me a letter saying that as the loan is repaid in full and closed they no longer have to comply with my request and enclosed my £1 postal order.

[pebsham]

Was it not included with your SAR stuff?

[diddydicky]

if the loan is paid off and no longer exists then they are correct

[pebsham]

It should still be held up to 6 years after the account has been "settled" and should be enclosed within the documents sent under the SAR

[patrickq1]

Subject access request that they were unable to locate the agreement in April 2008...result unable to locate agreement ?

s78 when did you send this ? and what was the result ?

cca they sent your 1.00 back for the cca?

[diddydicky]

SAR requires them to provide the INFORMATION they hold about you NOT the documents themselves

 

some lenders do in fact send a copy of the agreement but they are not obliged to do so

 

its worth a try though

[pebsham]

SAR requires them to provide the INFORMATION they hold about you NOT the documents themselves

 

some lenders do in fact send a copy of the agreement but they are not obliged to do so

 

its worth a try though

 

I'm sorry diddy but I'm confused. Every time I've DSAR'd a bank / CC I've received a "pile" of copies including agreements, phone logs etc. Sometimes I've chased them up for specific items missing etc.

 

You seem to suggest that they would be within their rights to send you some kind of "list" of items they hold. The information they hold is often contained within "documents" so without sending copies of the documents they cannot surely be complying.

 

Correct me if I'm in error

[pebsham]

Foxy,

I've re-read this thread a couple of times and the contributions made by patrick et al. Ignoring the possible involvement of "router accounts" for the moment (Sorry Sparkie and & Paul) I have some queries:

 

The original "loan" was for what? consolidation of current debt, overdraft, straight forward loan etc?

 

You stated that you bounced payments at the beginning etc so they may have added charges etc.

 

This to my tiny mind is a very cluttered thread and I can't really get a grip on it.

 

Can you list if possible everthing in one place so that I and maybe the others can get a grasp of it.

 

I think I need at least the following:

 

Date of loan start & full amount at start

payments made by your OH by year

any charges levied by the bank over the course of the loan.

any defaults issued during the course.

 

If you can possibly list at least the above we may be able see what the correct status of the account is before too much time passes.

 

Finally do you have the date that the account was supposedly repaid?

 

Cheers

 

P

[foxyflugel]

Foxy,

I've re-read this thread a couple of times and the contributions made by patrick et al. Ignoring the possible involvement of "router accounts" for the moment (Sorry Sparkie and & Paul) I have some queries:

 

The original "loan" was for what? consolidation of current debt, overdraft, straight forward loan etc?It was for consolidation of previous loan and overdraft.

 

You stated that you bounced payments at the beginning etc so they may have added charges etc.

 

This to my tiny mind is a very cluttered thread and I can't really get a grip on it. Apologies Pebsham. It is a rather long thread as I have just been posting (and posting in detail) when I have received various documents so as to give all info.

 

Can you list if possible everthing in one place so that I and maybe the others can get a grasp of it.

 

I think I need at least the following:

 

Date of loan start & full amount at start 23/5/05 full amount was £15,763.20 (or so it says on the loan statement)

payments made by your OH by year

He started paying £65 per week in Sept/Oct 2005 (when it went to collections). He then received a letter telling him that his loan account was £6k+ in arrears. That is when we realised that they had failed to transfer over the payments from the current account (3 years worth approx).

 

The total amount in his current account was £7,159.47 and this was transferred into his loan a/c on 21 Jan 2008.£260 transferred into loan a/c on 7 March 2008.

 

Including these amounts the statement says that he paid: -

 

£7969.47 from 21 Jan 2008- 20 May 2008 (this is also £50 per week as from 11 March 2008) - balance outstanding £7793.73dr

 

£800.00 from 28 May 2008 - 9 Sep 2008 - bal o/s £6993.73dr

 

£1800.00 from £16 Sep 2008 - 19 May 2009 - bal o/s £5193.73dr

 

The statement only goes up to this date but he has continued to pay £50 pw up to and inc 8 Jan 2010 when I stopped the payment. I have worked this out to 34 weeks x £50 = £1,700.00

 

TOTAL £12,269.47

 

any charges levied by the bank over the course of the loan. Unsure on this as originally Triton said that there was a charge for credit - and when I asked if this was interest the young lady said no -a charge for credit.

 

However this is taken from SAR notes - 12 May 2005 - Declined refinance loan £10,800 .................... will now need to look at loan of £11,200 (flat rate loan £9443.80 & o/d £1697) been processed as APS dec(Automated Products set up decline) with added 3% so will need to apply all other APS dec conditions??????????

 

any defaults issued during the course. Default was issued in 28 Oct 2005 when payments were missed. This is when it was sent to collections.

 

If you can possibly list at least the above we may be able see what the correct status of the account is before too much time passes.

 

Finally do you have the date that the account was supposedly repaid?

No. He has failed to receive any kind of confirmation in writing only the letter refusing to comply with the CCa request. On the SAR notes it says on 18.2.10 that CCA request rec'd etc etc - loan repaid in full - so no need to comply with request.

Cheers

 

P

 

Hope this answers your questions Pebsham and thanks for all your help.

 

Foxy

[pebsham]

Hi Foxy, thanks for the quick reply. I'll have a digest of what you've written shortly.

 

One other thing springs to mind. Have you obtained a recent copy of your OH's credit record? It should show the debt as "repaid" or "satisfied" or some such nonsense since the debt is the result of a default notice and closure. See when it was defaulted. Did you get a copy of the default notice (or do you still have it) in the SAR bundle?

 

Cheers

[foxyflugel]

Thanks Pebsham for your reply. Not obtained a copy of OH credit report recently. Think I still have the default notice somewhere - will have to dig it out. Do you want details off it - and if so - which details do you need? Also - didn't get a copy of the DN in the SAR docs - they were just extracts from Manual Diary Entries.

[pebsham]

Foxy,your loan should be a fixed interest, fixed term loan and the fact that you have never seen a copy of the agreement is very worrying.

 

Your starting balance was about £15,800

 

You appear to have repaid the following:

 

2005-2007 @ £10,000

2008-2009 @ £1,800

May 2009-Jan 2010 @ £1,700

 

I'm confused about this part "£7969.47 from 21 Jan 2008- 20 May 2008 (this is also £50 per week as from 11 March 2008"

 

Are the above figures about right and can you clarify the 7969.47 bit please?

[pebsham]

Thanks Pebsham for your reply. Not obtained a copy of OH credit report recently. Think I still have the default notice somewhere - will have to dig it out. Do you want details off it - and if so - which details do you need? Also - didn't get a copy of the DN in the SAR docs - they were just extracts from Manual Diary Entries.

 

You will need to reply to RBOS asap stating that they have not complied with your request under the DPA since you know they have copies of the Credit agreement and default notices. They are also by law I believe meant to send you a yearly statement. Specifically ask for copies of statements and / or a complete list of account entries both in and out over the course of the loan.

 

Keep the pressure on them and keep coming back to us on here.

 

PS get the other half today to sign up for a "free" month's trial with Experian (cancel as soon as you have your report) and get a copy of what they hold on him. It's online and immediate so you should be able to see the RBS stuff. (If they used Experian)

 

Let us know what it says with regard to RBS

 

Sorry another question: Who did you send the SAR request to Triton or RBS themselves?

Edited March 13, 2010 by pebsham

[patrickq1]

it seems it was triton who were witholding monies without passing it back to rbs until they were caught out...i think whats happened here is that extra interest and charges were added becuase of triton witholding the monies ie the 7000 plus and eventually when it was queried triton has paid it over but penalties have arrived at the door that should nt have happened this is why both triton and the bank are trying to withold information and are deliberately trying to frustrate any claim,perhaps they are thinking along the lines of statute barred and also it does not look like the contract loan has been consolidated in the correct fashion hence no contrac is available...imo

patrickq1

[diddydicky]

I'm sorry diddy but I'm confused. Every time I've DSAR'd a bank / CC I've received a "pile" of copies including agreements, phone logs etc. Sometimes I've chased them up for specific items missing etc.

 

You seem to suggest that they would be within their rights to send you some kind of "list" of items they hold. The information they hold is often contained within "documents" so without sending copies of the documents they cannot surely be complying.

 

Correct me if I'm in error

 

 

OK, i'll correct you- they are under no obligation to provide you with a copy of the credit agreement, or any other document- only the INFORMATION they hold about you

 

(which is not surprisingly why it is called a Subject INFORMATION request)!!

 

yes many do just simply send what they have but they dont have to (if only we could guarantee to get our agreements that easily)

 

they can provide the information in any form they like

 

when you look at an agreement- which is a pre printed list of terms and conditions- there is very little information on it about you that they would not have provided to you from other sources in their systems

[pebsham]

OK,

(which is not surprisingly why it is called a Subject INFORMATION request)!!

 

 

 

I believe it's actually called a "Subject Access Request" and whilst the information commisioner's office states that all computer information held on you must be provided it also allows for some paper information dependent upon how and why the information is stored.

 

 

Anyway back to the actual business at hand. Since Triton / RBS have stated that the debt is repaid I would request the information that shows the account closure since this must be held by them.

 

Can anybody point me to any legislation that would mean contract information must be kept past the end of the relationship.

 

Could Foxy not sue RBS for sight of the contract / statements etc since she believes that she may be owed substantial amounts due to errors on the part of a large corporation?

Edited March 13, 2010 by pebsham