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    • further polished WS using above suggestions and also included couple of more modifications highlighted in orange are those ok to include?   Background   1.1  The Defendant received the Parking Charge Notice (PCN) on the 06th of January 2020 following the vehicle being parked at Arla Old Dairy, South Ruislip on the 05th of December 2019.   Unfair PCN   2.1  On 19th December 2023 the Defendant sent the Claimant's solicitors a CPR request.  As shown in Exhibit 1 (pages 7-13) sent by the solicitors the signage displayed in their evidence clearly shows a £60.00 parking charge notice (which will be reduced to £30 if paid within 14 days of issue).  2.2  Yet the PCN sent by the Claimant is for a £100.00 parking charge notice (reduced to £60 if paid within 30 days of issue).   2.3        The Claimant relies on signage to create a contract.  It is unlawful for the Claimant to write that the charge is £60 on their signs and then send demands for £100.    2.4        The unlawful £100 charge is also the basis for the Claimant's Particulars of Claim.  No Locus Standi  3.1  I do not believe a contract with the landowner, that is provided following the defendant’s CPR request, gives MET Parking Services a right to bring claims in their own name. Definition of “Relevant contract” from the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012, Schedule 4,  2 [1] means a contract Including a contract arising only when the vehicle was parked on the relevant land between the driver and a person who is-   (a) the owner or occupier of the land; or   (b) Authorised, under or by virtue of arrangements made by the owner or occupier of the land, to enter into a contract with the driver requiring the payment of parking charges in respect of the parking of the vehicle on the land. According to https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2006/46/section/44   For a contract to be valid, it requires a director from each company to sign and then two independent witnesses must confirm those signatures.   3.2  The Defendant requested to see such a contract in the CPR request.  The fact that no contract has been produced with the witness signatures present means the contract has not been validly executed. Therefore, there can be no contract established between MET Parking Services and the motorist. Even if “Parking in Electric Bay” could form a contract (which it cannot), it is immaterial. There is no valid contract.  Illegal Conduct – No Contract Formed   4.1 At the time of writing, the Claimant has failed to provide the following, in response to the CPR request from myself.   4.2        The legal contract between the Claimant and the landowner (which in this case is Standard Life Investments UK) to provide evidence that there is an agreement in place with landowner with the necessary authority to issue parking charge notices and to pursue payment by means of litigation.   4.3 Proof of planning permission granted for signage etc under the Town and country Planning Act 1990. Lack of planning permission is a criminal offence under this Act and no contract can be formed where criminality is involved.   4.4        I also do not believe the claimant possesses these documents.   No Keeper Liability   5.1        The defendant was not the driver at the time and date mentioned in the PCN and the claimant has not established keeper liability under schedule 4 of the PoFA 2012. In this matter, the defendant puts it to the claimant to produce strict proof as to who was driving at the time.   5.2 The claimant in their Notice To Keeper also failed to comply with PoFA 2012 Schedule 4 section 9[2][f] while mentioning “the right to recover from the keeper so much of that parking charge as remains unpaid” where they did not include statement “(if all the applicable conditions under this Schedule are met)”.     5.3         The claimant did not mention parking period, times on the photographs are separate from the PCN and in any case are that arrival and departure times not the parking period since their times include driving to and from the parking space as a minimum and can include extra time to allow pedestrians and other vehicles to pass in front.    Protection of Freedoms Act 2012   The notice must -   (a) specify the vehicle, the relevant land on which it was parked and the period of parking to which the notice relates;  22. In the persuasive judgement K4GF167G - Premier Park Ltd v Mr Mathur - Horsham County Court – 5 January 2024 it was on this very point that the judge dismissed this claim.  5.4  A the PCN does not comply with the Act the Defendant as keeper is not liable.  No Breach of Contract   6.1       No breach of contract occurred because the PCN and contract provided as part of the defendant’s CPR request shows different post code, PCN shows HA4 0EY while contract shows HA4 0FY. According to PCN defendant parked on HA4 0EY which does not appear to be subject to the postcode covered by the contract.  6.2         The entrance sign does not mention anything about there being other terms inside the car park so does not offer a contract which makes it only an offer to treat,  Interest  7.1  It is unreasonable for the Claimant to delay litigation for  Double Recovery   7.2  The claim is littered with made-up charges.  7.3  As noted above, the Claimant's signs state a £60 charge yet their PCN is for £100.  7.4  As well as the £100 parking charge, the Claimant seeks recovery of an additional £70.  This is simply a poor attempt to circumvent the legal costs cap at small claims.  7.5 Since 2019, many County Courts have considered claims in excess of £100 to be an abuse of process leading to them being struck out ab initio. An example, in the Caernarfon Court in VCS v Davies, case No. FTQZ4W28 on 4th September 2019, District Judge Jones-Evans stated “Upon it being recorded that District Judge Jones- Evans has over a very significant period of time warned advocates (...) in many cases of this nature before this court that their claim for £60 is unenforceable in law and is an abuse of process and is nothing more than a poor attempt to go behind the decision of the Supreme Court v Beavis which inter alia decided that a figure of £160 as a global sum claimed in this case would be a penalty and not a genuine pre-estimate of loss and therefore unenforceable in law and if the practice continued, he would treat all cases as a claim for £160 and therefore a penalty and unenforceable in law it is hereby declared (…) the claim is struck out and declared to be wholly without merit and an abuse of process.”  7.6 In Claim Nos. F0DP806M and F0DP201T, District Judge Taylor echoed earlier General Judgment or Orders of District Judge Grand, stating ''It is ordered that the claim is struck out as an abuse of process. The claim contains a substantial charge additional to the parking charge which it is alleged the Defendant contracted to pay. This additional charge is not recoverabl15e under the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012, Schedule 4 nor with reference to the judgment in Parking Eye v Beavis. It is an abuse of process from the Claimant to issue a knowingly inflated claim for an additional sum which it is not entitled to recover. This order has been made by the court of its own initiative without a hearing pursuant to CPR Rule 3.3(4)) of the Civil Procedure Rules 1998...''  7.7 In the persuasive case of G4QZ465V - Excel Parking Services Ltd v Wilkinson – Bradford County Court -2 July 2020 (Exhibit 4) the judge had decided that Excel had won. However, due to Excel adding on the £60 the Judge dismissed the case.  7.8        The addition of costs not previously specified on signage are also in breach of the Consumer Rights Act 2015, Schedule 2, specifically paras 6, 10 and 14.   7.9        It is the Defendant’s position that the Claimant in this case has knowingly submitted inflated costs and thus the entire claim should be similarly struck out in accordance with Civil Procedure Rule 3.3(4).   In Conclusion   8.1        I invite the court to dismiss the claim.  Statement of Truth  I believe that the facts stated in this witness statement are true. I understand that proceedings for contempt of court may be brought against anyone who makes, or causes to be made, a false statement in a document verified by a statement of truth without an honest belief in its truth.   
    • Well the difference is that in all our other cases It was Kev who was trying to entrap the motorist so sticking two fingers up to him and daring him to try court was from a position of strength. In your case, sorry, you made a mistake so you're not in the position of strength.  I've looked on Google Maps and the signs are few & far between as per Kev's MO, but there is an entrance sign saying "Pay & Display" (and you've admitted in writing that you knew you had to pay) and the signs by the payment machines do say "Sea View Car Park" (and you've admitted in writing you paid the wrong car park ... and maybe outed yourself as the driver). Something I missed in my previous post is that the LoC is only for one ticket, not two. Sorry, but it's impossible to definitively advise what to so. Personally I'd probably gamble on Kev being a serial bottler of court and reply with a snotty letter ridiculing the signage (given you mentioned the signage in your appeal) - but it is a gamble.  
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12+2 Days Required if Proof of Receipt available?


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Hello everyone,

 

I known that we need to allow 12+2 days for a CCA request to be considered in default.

 

However, does the +2 part still apply if you have proof the letter was received on a specified date?

 

Thanks!

after the 12+2 has exspired remember to send the acc in despute letter to them,again recorded delivery.
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The 12+2 refers to the 12 days together with a day's postage at each end. You have circumvented the first 'end' by obtaining proof of delivery on a specific date. Hence, in your case, the required period for compliance is now 12+1 from the recorded delivery date.

 

Incidently, despite many assertions on CAG, the account doesn't automatically become disputed if the creditor/DCA does not comply. You must write and say the matter is in dispute and give the failure to comply as your reason.

Bear in mind that creditors/DCAs cannot read your mind.

I really do appreciate all those 'thank you' emails - I'm glad I've been able to help. Apologies if I haven't acknowledged all of them.

You can also ding my gong if you prefer. :)

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Thanks for the added detail palomino, very useful information - especially re the account not being in dispute until i actually tell them it is due to them defaulting on the CCA request

I've penned the next letter now (bases on the 12+2 template) but will wait for Tuesdays post anyway (seeing as I can't post until then) to see if anything comes through from them.

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Incidently, despite many assertions on CAG, the account doesn't automatically become disputed if the creditor/DCA does not comply. You must write and say the matter is in dispute and give the failure to comply as your reason.

Bear in mind that creditors/DCAs cannot read your mind.

 

I think there's more than one way of approaching this one.... since you can almost guarantee that the creditor/DCA will contact you once your payments have ceased. I've never sent an "account in dispute" letter and to date, have had no problem with it. CCA law is quite clear and if/when they play silly b*ggers, it's sometimes more effective to write to them then.

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It's an old account - (less that 6 years though) the details of which I'm 'disputing', so there are currently no payments being made anyway - I have a proper thread relating to it here.. http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/debt-collection-industry/238839-clarification-cca-requirement.html

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It's an old account - (less that 6 years though) the details of which I'm 'disputing', so there are currently no payments being made anyway - I have a proper thread relating to it here.. http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/debt-collection-industry/238839-clarification-cca-requirement.html

 

Then the onus of responsibility is on them to prove any legal right to start collecting from you in the first place.

 

If you feel better sending the "account in dispute" letter, that's fine.... but please remember to include the words... I DO NOT ACKNOWLEDGE ANY DEBT TO YOUR COMPANY.... on the top and send by rec. delivery.

 

:)

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BTW and this is most likely not the issue in your case but some people think that once an CCA request is not adhered to or sent to you and the account is thus in dispute that the debt is no longer a debt...

 

That is what I firest believed (silly me) but just in case an outsider is looking in and things 'oh, so if I send off a CCA request and when they can't/dont (the dca or original creditor) send it back within the prescribed time limit and and I then send them a dispute letter that thats it....I no longer owe them any money ..yippee!!!

 

It's not quite like that....it simply means that unil such time as they can/do supply an alleged credit agreement you don't have to pay them any more money and neither should they be able to request it from you.

It is your personal choice as to whether you continue to pay them while the account is in dispute.....

 

Obviously once they supply you with the CCA or at least what their idea of a CCA (depending on how they interpret the consumer credit act section for sending out 'true/signed copies) is...well then technically you should start paying them again. However, in my on personal experience many of the CCA's I have been sent are either fraudulent or are simply terms and conditions (the dca's interpretation as to what they have to send you) and usually followed up with a demand for the full balance on the account......again it's for you to decide if you think what they've supplied is legal/relevant/enough for them to have you by the short and curlies but in my on experience in all cases where CCA requests have eventually been sent on ..some have taken as long as four monhsm, some I'm still waiting for....the ones sent have been naf anf full of discrepancies that I've written back to them stating that until they send better information I ain't paying them any more.....thus far I'm paying but one of them and thats one that haven't actually requested a cca from just yet...

 

Just for those that think that a cca not sent exhonerates them from ever having to pay the debt..ever..

I reside in Dawlish Warren but am not a rabbit.

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Obviously once they supply you with the CCA or at least what their idea of a CCA (depending on how they interpret the consumer credit act section for sending out 'true/signed copies) No, The Consumer Credit Act is not up for interpretation.... is...well then technically you should start paying them again. "Technically" doesn't come into it... However, in my on personal experience many of the CCA's I have been sent are either fraudulent or are simply terms and conditions (the dca's interpretation as to what they have to send you) and usually followed up with a demand for the full balance on the account......again it's for you to decide if you think what they've supplied is legal/relevant/enough for them to have you by the short and curlies but in my on experience in all cases where CCA requests have eventually been sent on ..some have taken as long as four monhsm, some I'm still waiting for....the ones sent have been naf anf full of discrepancies that I've written back to them stating that until they send better information I ain't paying them any more.....thus far I'm paying but one of them and thats one that haven't actually requested a cca from just yet...

 

Just for those that think that a cca not sent exhonerates them from ever having to pay the debt..ever..

 

Well, until they can come with the real deal.... it does.

 

:)

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