Computer-whizz-kid-forged-rail-tickets-ordered-pay-12-000-skipped-fares.

[dx100uk]

Computer whizz-kid who forged rail tickets ordered to pay back £12,000 in skipped fares | Mail Online

 

 

dx

[Madamfluff]

He said he could offer no excuse for his client’s actions other than to say he was undergoing difficulties both at home and at work.

Read more: Computer whizz-kid who forged rail tickets ordered to pay back £12,000 in skipped fares | Mail Online

Rubbish - nasty little thief who got caught

[andydd]

He said he could offer no excuse for his client’s actions other than to say he was undergoing difficulties both at home and at work.

Read more: Computer whizz-kid who forged rail tickets ordered to pay back £12,000 in skipped fares | Mail Online

Rubbish - nasty little thief who got caught

 

Cant say I agree with that, in fact I have on occasions not paid the full fare on when this topic cropped up recently I was suprised that most of my friends had too, they (nor I) are people who would go out and steal but the huuuuge fares charged by rail companies does make it very tempting at time especially in these times of recession.

 

Andy

[Madamfluff]

Sorry andydd

Have to disagree yes fares are high but the guy chose to live in one area and work in another I mean there MUST be IT jobs in Brighton - I pay over £40 a week for my fares but its my choice to work in zone 5 when I live in zone 1 and my husband is out of work and times are hard but I PAY my fares

 

I would like a nice joint of Lamb for Sunday lunch but the price is huuuge and there is a recession on - does that mean I have the right to go into Asda and shove one down my knickers and walk out with it - no thats theft

 

Tell me what the difference is

[andydd]

Sorry andydd

Have to disagree yes fares are high but the guy chose to live in one area and work in another I mean there MUST be IT jobs in Brighton - I pay over £40 a week for my fares but its my choice to work in zone 5 when I live in zone 1 and my husband is out of work and times are hard but I PAY my fares

 

I would like a nice joint of Lamb for Sunday lunch but the price is huuuge and there is a recession on - does that mean I have the right to go into Asda and shove one down my knickers and walk out with it - no thats theft

 

Tell me what the difference is

 

Shoplifting is a victimless crime........like punching someone in the dark - Nelson Muntz

[Madamfluff]

hmmm taking your moral values from a cartoon character eh and there was me thinking I was on an adults forum

Love to see you trying that excuse in a court of law

[dx100uk]

no andy is not like that, just a social comment on what shoplifters think is an acceptable excuse. not!

 

dx

[andydd]

no andy is not like that, just a social comment on what shoplifters think is an acceptable excuse. not!

 

dx

 

dx..Why thank you, if anyone actually watched that particular episode it is rather a moral one and young Bart gets his comeuppance, as did the train ticket forger, but I wouldn't put him in the 'nasty' list im afraid thats for real criminals, murderers, thugs, child molesters, drug dealers...

 

I personally feel no animosity towards someone who screwed a TOC out of some money, although while I have (on occasion) bunked a few fares (as I would suggest have the majority of londoners at one time or another), I admit continually forging tickets is a bit much !

 

 

As for this being an 'adult' forum you, they obviously havn't visted the Bear garden recently..hee

[Old-CodJA]

You'll note that not one of the news reports on this subject mentions how much Mr Moore was earning whilst stealing more than £12,000 worth of rail travel.

 

I know that railways revenue protection and the decision to prosecute isn't seen as the most freindly of occupations, but I have always tried to be scrupulously fair in dealing with these issues.

 

In my long experience, I have found that a very high proportion of those who go out of their way to steal rail fares fall in the category that are most able to pay. These are people who steal just because they can!

 

I have great sympathy with those hit hardest by high fares and low salaries, but the law is the law and I don't agree that we can use such an excuse as 'fares are too high so it's Ok not to pay' in order to erode society's morals still further.

 

By his actions Mr Moore stole a considerable amount in terms of unpaid rail fares whilst the vast majority of law-abiding and decent people make sacrifices in order to maintain their dignity and integrity.

 

I don't defend high fares, but I do applaud high morals.

[andydd]

You'll note that not one of the news reports on this subject mentions how much Mr Moore was earning whilst stealing more than £12,000 worth of rail travel.

 

I know that railways revenue protection and the decision to prosecute isn't seen as the most freindly of occupations, but I have always tried to be scrupulously fair in dealing with these issues.

 

In my long experience, I have found that a very high proportion of those who go out of their way to steal rail fares fall in the category that are most able to pay. These are people who steal just because they can!

 

I have great sympathy with those hit hardest by high fares and low salaries, but the law is the law and I don't agree that we can use such an excuse as 'fares are too high so it's Ok not to pay' in order to erode society's morals still further.

 

By his actions Mr Moore stole a considerable amount in terms of unpaid rail fares whilst the vast majority of law-abiding and decent people make sacrifices in order to maintain their dignity and integrity.

 

I don't defend high fares, but I do applaud high morals.

 

I suppose a large part of this problem is that there is (or appears to be) no competition on the railway lines, they seem to be able to increase fares year after year, if my local supermarket did this the customers would say 'screw this, im goinmg to the cheaper xx one day the road'.

 

Before I was made redundant, my season ticket was my single biggest monthly expense, even more than my mortage ! and I can say honestly I didnt think it was value for money, the train staff seemed to strike at the drop of a hat for ever higher wage increases whilst no doubt many of the passangers would be accepting pay cuts and freezes. I accept that travelling without a ticket is unlawful, and I consider myself a very moral person and I wouldn't dream of shoplifting or being invloved in crime but I did on occasion not buy a full ticket, the complexities of peak/off peak/rail/oyster/tfl travel does provide many options to travel just 1 or 2 stops further than your ticket allows and save a great deal of money. Obvioulsy this is somewhat different than sitting at home printing off fake tickets, although most train companies could easily wipe out this type of fraud by investing in a smart card system like Oyster, however they were all nearly too greedy to invest in such a sytem even when given some cash incentives by ol' Ken.

 

Andy

[Old-CodJA]

most train companies could easily wipe out this type of fraud by investing in a smart card system like Oyster, however they were all nearly too greedy to invest in such a sytem even when given some cash incentives by ol' Ken.

 

Andy

 

This simply isn't true Andy.

 

I do sympathise with the fact that rail fares are a very big expense and proportionately higher than any other form of travel, but to believe that smartcard ticketing could wipe it out at a stroke is simply not true.

 

The Oyster system simply provides different ways of fiddling fares and these are only too readily exploited by the deliberate fare evader.

 

A great many offenders are being brought to book and many known fiddles are targeted daily by revenue staff, but as the ticket system evolves, so do the fiddles.

 

The Magistrates Courts will always be filled with such cases and it is worth noting that a more serious view of this is being taken by the Courts, with harsher penalties being imposed on a regular basis.

[andydd]

This simply isn't true Andy.

 

I do sympathise with the fact that rail fares are a very big expense and proportionately higher than any other form of travel, but to believe that smartcard ticketing could wipe it out at a stroke is simply not true.

 

The Oyster system simply provides different ways of fiddling fares and these are only too readily exploited by the deliberate fare evader.

 

A great many offenders are being brought to book and many known fiddles are targeted daily by revenue staff, but as the ticket system evolves, so do the fiddles.

 

The Magistrates Courts will always be filled with such cases and it is worth noting that a more serious view of this is being taken by the Courts, with harsher penalties being imposed on a regular basis.

 

Ok..fair point, it would add other ways of evading fares but this case (the guy printing off tickets with a printer), would be eliminated, you try making an oyster card at home, I'm currently sitting here with chopped up credit cards, sticky back plastic and old yoghurt pot and it aint working !

 

Although I believe this guy didnt get a harsh penalty, didnt he get a suspended sentence and just had to pay the money back ? (depending on his earnings this could take many many years)

 

Andy

 

Andy

[MrShed]

Bear in mind that fares are made higher by exactly this type of action.

 

If I saw a TV in a shop and felt it was too expensive - I wouldnt walk out with it, I would simply not buy.

 

this person had a choice - what they cannot choose is to think a service is too expensive and then use it anyway.

[Old-CodJA]

He has a suspended prison sentence of 9 months and had to pay the prosecution costs of £510 in addition to compensation of the £12k+ in fares that he had avoided.

 

You're right, that is not a 'harsh' penalty given the pre-meditated intent that is clearly evident in this case.

 

He was described in Court as an IT Consultant, apparently a 'computer whizz kid'.

 

Given his profession and the fact that most people are full aware of the likely remuneration for top earners in this work, I'd like people to hazard a guess at his average earnings at the time of offending to see in their own minds whether he was treated harshly or not?

 

In my mind, one thing is certain, he wasn't struggling to keep a job and pay a mortgage on less than average wages whilst bringing up a young family to be decent and honest citizens.

 

It may not have escaped your notice that I have no sympathy for the fact that he was caught and prosecuted.

[MrShed]

Given his profession and the fact that most people are full aware of the likely remuneration for this work, I'd like people to hazard a guess at his average earnings at the time of offending to see in their own minds whether he was treated harshly or not?

 

Whilst not disagreeing with your point, I do feel I need to point out that the stereotyping of IT workers earning megabucks is completely false - and I am speaking from experience....

[Old-CodJA]

Whilst not disagreeing with your point, I do feel I need to point out that the stereotyping of IT workers earning megabucks is completely false - and I am speaking from experience....

 

I agree completely, but we are discussing the convicted fare evader Mr Moore.

 

My point is that he was described as an IT consultant and a 'whizz kid' at the higher level of his profession.........

 

Top skills usually command top dollar.......

[andydd]

Bear in mind that fares are made higher by exactly this type of action.

 

If I saw a TV in a shop and felt it was too expensive - I wouldnt walk out with it, I would simply not buy.

 

this person had a choice - what they cannot choose is to think a service is too expensive and then use it anyway.

 

True..but fares are almost made higher by recession and less people travelling,government intervention in wanting a huge cut of the profits, rail workers continually striking, fat cat shareholders, and the fact that method for working out ticket rises is rather unfair (i.e this year they were allowed to raise them steeply despite being in a recession.

 

The TV analogy is fair but not strictly accurate, many people find that they have no choice but to travel to work, 'get a local job' wont be a fair answer because there often arnt any, they have found like me that price rises such as gas, leccy, etc have eaten away at their wages and they reach the decision to sometimes travelling without paying, it may be wrong and unlawful but so is downloading copyrighted films and music, yet I'm sure a large number of us here do that without a second thought.

 

I have to agree with the point about people earning top bucks in IT..It just isnt so, I speak from experience too.

 

Andy

 

Andy

[MrShed]

Of course people have no choice but to travel. but that still doesnt justify skipping the fare.

 

but so is downloading copyrighted films and music, yet I'm sure a large number of us here do that without a second thought.

 

Absolutely. I also bet that 99.9% of them would agree that what they are doing is wrong.

[andydd]

Of course people have no choice but to travel. but that still doesnt justify skipping the fare.

 

 

 

Absolutely. I also bet that 99.9% of them would agree that what they are doing is wrong.

 

HHmm..but they cant feel its that wrong is they still do it.

[MrShed]

Thats not the point is it to be fair.

 

I never disputed that "people skip fares".

 

I disputed that the treatment of such people WHEN CAUGHT is unfair, due to political mumbo jumbo about high fares.

[timbo58]

I do hope the inspector who caught him got a bonus (although I suspect not) as they were VERY good forgeries IME, I expect the rears were blank though.

He's very very lucky to get the fine and repayment order, he could have got 3 months imprisonment for fare evasion, and if (unlikely) he'd been prosecuted for forgery a maximum of 10 years!

[nene avenger]

I'm still wondering how madam Fluff got a leg of lamb down her Knickers

I must be sad