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Jacobs Bailiffs - Parking Fines - NEED HELP!

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Hi all,


I'm new to these forums and I've been browsing about and I'd just like to say what a great place it is. This is my first post so your help is very much appreciated. (At this point I'd like to say I think it WILL be a long post!)


Right, think this might be a bit complicated but any help welcomed.


My brother had a number of PCN's over a year and a half ago, but he moved abroad about Feb 08 without paying them. He was receiving a number of letters so I just kept them aside as they were addressed to him. However, around June 08 time, numerous letters addressed to my brother were being hand posted but either in unsealed envelopes or without envelopes at all. These must have obviously been by the visiting bailiff.


Now, although clearly marked Private and Confidential, I was able to view the contents of the letters addressed to my brother, which were threatening removal of goods and demands for payment etc. Obviously I was extremely worried about this and I wanted to avoid these problems. Therefore I called up the bailiff on the letters and I explained that my brother no longer lived here and that I was willing to help with the payments to avoid the threatened action. Now I didn't know exactly what the debts were for so I queried them with the bailiff, he explained the amounts and that they were for unpaid PCN's. Therefore, after more discussions with the bailiff, I agreed to pay £899.48 on the basis that this would be clearing all the unpaid PCN's. This payment was taken out of my personal current account a few days later and I thought that was the end of all that.


Now my brother was still receiving numerous letters but I just kept them to the side. Fast forward to Feb 09 and a few more unsealed letters from Jacobs were posted through the box. Now these letters were from a different bailiff, but still working for Jacobs. Therefore I called up this new bailiff to query the situation and these further demands for payment. He explained that they were for unpaid PCN's, and I queried how many PCN's there were and the amount. He told me this information and again I explained to him that I made a payment last year on behalf of my brother and that my brother no longer lived at this address. I explained that it was pointless him chasing these debts as my brother didn't live here anymore and I wasn't prepared to help him pay for them this time, and that was the end of the conversation.


Fast forward to now and my brother has now moved back. I discussed this briefly with a friend of a friend who works at CAB and they said that I can ask for my money back as simply put I paid for a debt which simply wasn't mine.


My brother wrote to Jacobs at the start of this month to explain his situation, that he has now moved back, he wants to pay off the debts, complained about how this clearly Private & Confidential was discussed with me, queried what the payment I made was for and that I would be asking for it back, and asked for a statement of account of outstanding PCN's etc. He also wrote to the council asking for the same info but he still hasn't heard back from them.


He's now had a reply from Jacobs and they simply state that they confirm that all letters are posted in sealed envelopes. That was it into the complaint my brother made about the conduct of the bailiff. (After reading other posts on here, I thought DCA's and bailiffs weren't allowed to discuss clearly Private & Confidential matters with work colleagues, neighbours or even family members?) Now it turns out that my brother has 6 PCN's to his name (6 x £187.51 = £1125.06), and I'm assuming that my payment wasn't used at all towards the payment of these PCN's as they are still outstanding. Jacobs state in their letter that they confirm they took my payment of £899.48. They also state that I can have this payment back BUT only when my brother has cleared the outstanding debt.


Now my question is, what is my legal position with getting my money back? And how should I go about doing this? Will I need to get a solicitor and will I need to take them to court? They clearly state in their letter that they know they've taken this £900 payment but I can't have it back. Not just yet anyway, not until my brother has cleared the fines. Now I know my brother doesn't have the money to clear them all off at once, so if they were to stick to their word, I know I wouldn't be getting my money back for another long time! Also, if my brother did have the money to pay the outstanding sum of £1125, I'm worried Jacobs wouldn't pay me back my £900 after they've received the £1125 payment!


What really annoys me is that I only made the payment because of the hand posted and unsealed letters. If they weren't posted like this in the first place then I wouldn't have known and made the payment! And I only made the payment after discussing with the bailiff that my payment would be clearing off all my brother's PCN's. Now I know that this was only a verbal conversation and it wasn't in writing, but I thought the payment would have been allocated to paying most of the PCN's at least. Jacobs simpy respond in their letter that the bailiff is no longer in their employment so they can't respond to these allegations.


Finally, my brother stated in his letter that he wouldn't be able to make any offer of payments until he has received a statement of account from both Jacobs and the parking section of the local council so that he can match them off. His reply from Jacobs is that they demand payment within 7 days or they will take further action. Now my brother still hasn't received a reply from the council and the 7 days is almost up, what can he do? Should he simply reply and tell Jacobs again that he can't make any offer until he has also had a reply from the council? Also, my brother remembers the PCN's date back to roughly Oct-Nov 07. The statements he has received from Jacobs state the 6 PCN numbers, but they date them ALL to the same date of 20th Oct 08. Simply put, these PCN's were no way issued on this date (didn't have the car and wasn't in the country for starters). Can he dispute this fact or is the date just the date that Jacobs first issued these statements? But the thing is, this can't have been the first date Jacobs chased up these debts because I've still got the letters from when I made the payment in June 08!


If you have got to here then I know this was a really long post but I would like to say thank you for your time and ANY help is really really appreciated.


Thank you once again.


Troubled by bailiffs Montana.

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I wouldn't have paid it in the first place as it's not your debt and if your brother didn't live with you all you had to do was fill in a declaration to stat this.


You should contact tomtubby she is the bailiff expert on here and when is a pcn that much money anyway?


there taking the mick

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I am not an expert at all, but this is clearly quite complicated!!!


First things first, have you contaced the Council about these debts?


Phone the Council and ask them to explain the actions of THEIR sub-contractors! They employ the Baillifs; they are accountable for their actions. The Council are their bosses.


I think that is a good place to start.


It seems to me your actions have been as a result of your ignorance of the law and how best to deal with it. I've got that tee-shirt, undercrackers, scarf the lot!


The Baillifs won't be rational. I would suggest starting with their employers...


But do ask others, there is a wealth of experience on here :)

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Thanks for the reply ambershadow and blurredfx. Yeah, I just didn't know the law and how it worked back then. I just saw Bailiffs and Removal of Goods on their letters and thought I'd better sort out that lil gits mess before it even got messier!


I will call the Council tomorrow and get in touch with tomtubby on here. Hopefully she can offer some advice if she isn't too busy.

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