Help! High Court Enforcement Officer has taken my car.

[Guest DebtWeary]

Hi, I have just had the unpleasant experience of seeing my car removed. I explained to the officer that I need the car for my work, and thus he was not entitled to take it, but he said that I would have to prove this to a judge.

 

The debt is with Southern Water and they have obtained a High Court Judgement against me.

 

I have always believed that anything needed for your business could not be removed.

 

Please help!

[tomtubby]

This is happening so many times and in particulsr with this water company who are sending their County Court Judgments to the High Court to be enforced.

 

For anybody else viewing this post, it is so important to know that this situation can be avoided by responding to the County Court Summons and completing the relevanat forms to pay the debt back in installments when the case is still with the County court.

 

Even aftere the Judgment has been granted, you can complete the N245 to VARY the Court Order and pay the debt back monthly. This would avoid entirley the debt then being transfrred up to the High Court for Enforcement.

 

I am sorry to be the bearer of bad news but the situation concerning a vehicle needed to work/employment is a very grey area indeed and I will attempt to make it simple.

 

Everybody could claim that a vehicle is necessary for employment and we have dealt with many such arguments. The courts will say that if the vehicle was for instance heavily signed, ie: advertising that you are a plumber/tv engineer/builder etc then we have always been sucessful in having the vehicle released. In addition, a licensed taxi cab etc would also be exempt.

 

An ordinary everyday car that you use to go back and forward to work will not be exempt.

 

However, was the vehicle subject to finance, in particular hire purchase? If so, exempt.

 

If you can please provide some more detail I can respond.

[Oh Boy!]

What do you do for a living

[Guest DebtWeary]

I'm self-employed, in IT, I cannot visit my clients, some of whom are only really accessible by car. I could not make use of public transport. The officer said basically tough luck!

[Guest DebtWeary]

Thanks for replying, no unfortunately it is my car now, although it originally was purchased via lease purchase. It is 10 years old and at best it is worth around £500. The debt at CCJ stage was £1311 but has subsequently risen to over £3000!

 

I have phoned Southern Water to make them aware of the situation and someone is going to call me back. I can see that it is a matter of interpretation as to what can be construed as a necessary vehicle but I have no chance of being able to carry on my business any more without transport of my own. I do not have the financial means to pay for anything else.

 

When I speak to Southern Water again I shall explain this. I doubt if it will cut any ice with them, but they are in effect shooting themselves in the foot if they make it even more impossible for me to pay them off than it is already by killing my business!

[Guest DebtWeary]

In a strange turn of events, I received a phone call from Sherforce saying they would send me release papers to go and collect the car! So I now have it back.

 

I had already sent them an official complaint saying I would take legal action unless they returned it forthwith.

 

Their only explanation was "your solicitor has instructed its release" which is quite clever as I neither have a solicitor nor have I instructed one!

 

I don't get it really. Perhaps they realised they were on dodgy ground and that it wasn't worth the hassle. If they come back again there will be hell to pay.

 

There is still some worrying note on the papers I was presented with this morning - "You should be aware that Sherforce has authority to force entry to remove goods which have been levied upon". Not sure exactly what that means but they had better not try!!

 

Thanks for all the help.

[Guest DebtWeary]

I have established why I got my car back. It seems Southern Water requested that the account be put on hold for 14 days,this happened too late to stop what the HCEO did, but it meant he had to have my car returned to me. I checked with Sherforce, the 14 days is until 12th March.

 

I have emailed Sherforce and informed them that I cannot offer a repayment plan until I get 2 priority debts sorted out. Further, I told them that I have been suffering a long-term illness (it's a stress related thing) and as such, according to their rules, I am a vulnerable case. I have not had a reply.

 

I suspect that, in spite of what I said to them, I shall get another visit. I have spoken to Southern Water on the phone, they tell me that it is out of their hands and that I must deal with Sherforce. Frankly, I do not believe this as they are still in control of what Sherforce does.

 

I am not sure how to proceed. Can someone answer the following.

 

1. AM I right in thinking Southern Water can dispense with Sherforce if they wish so that I can deal directly with them?

 

2. If I do enter into some form of repayment plan, does that constitute acceptance of the absurd additional charges that Sherforce have added?

 

3. Should I write to them again and request confirmation that they will not visit me again because of the vulnerable case situation?

 

Any advice would be very welcome.

 

Thanks.

[Guest DebtWeary]

I have today received a letter from Sherforce stating that Southern Water has accepted my payment proposal of £10 per month. It came in the form of a standard letter accompanied by the usual threats if payments are not maintained but said nothing about the excessive charges they raised. So I have emailed them and requested a breakdown of charges.

 

I would rather be dealing with Southern Water but I can live with this arrangement as long as they leave me well alone!

 

DebtWeary

[tomtubby]

You MUST write to Sherforce to enquire into the fees. In particular because the payments of £10 per month will not only take YEARS to repay the debt...but I am assuming that Sherforce will be deducting their fees first, in which case the water company will not get any money for a long time !!

 

I am assuming that you are dealing with the Essex office of Sherforce. If so, is this case being addressed by Mr C.B ?? If I am right, then do push for an answer on this point...he should sort this out.

[Guest DebtWeary]

Hi Tomtubby, there is no name on the letter, so do you mean I should address a specific HCEO ( a real one as opposed to a delegated one who I encountered)?

[tomtubby]

YES.

 

Mr C. Badger.

 

I have always found him to be very helpful.

[letsmakeamark]

You could also if you want throw a spanner in the works by asking for the judgement to be set aside. I know this application will fail but then you can offer how much you can pay per month etc and also have the case taken back from the hceo.

[Guest DebtWeary]

Thanks for the advice. I had a shock today as I actually got a reply to my email to Sherforce asking for a breakdown of fees! They sent it as a Word document with an image file embedded. I am going to try and embed it in this post.

 

They seem to have gone to great lengths to justify the ludicrous charges by quoting from HCEO regulations. It should be noted that the majority of costs fall under the miscellaneous section of the regulations, which state that these costs have to be approved, plus £625 for taking my car, which I got back anyway. I signed NO Walking Possession which they have charged me for.

 

I am not sure which parts I can challenge and would be very grateful for any advice.

 

Thanks,

 

DebtWeary

Edited March 30, 2009 by DebtWeary

[pt2537]

Debt weary

 

the attached file is tooooo small to read

 

can you possibly upload it into photobucket?

[Guest DebtWeary]

Sorry not sure if this is any better!

Edited March 30, 2009 by DebtWeary

[Guest DebtWeary]

Try this!

Edited March 30, 2009 by DebtWeary

[pt2537]

nope

 

goto Image hosting, free photo sharing & video sharing at Photobucket and upload it there

and then paste a link to the image here

[Guest DebtWeary]

Sherforce picture by DDSH - Photobucket

 

Hope you can see this!

[ohitsonlyme]

Thanks for the advice. I had a shock today as I actually got a reply to my email to Sherforce asking for a breakdown of fees! They sent it as a Word document with an image file embedded. I am going to try and embed it in this post.

 

They seem to have gone to great lengths to justify the ludicrous charges by quoting from HCEO regulations. It should be noted that the majority of costs fall under the miscellaneous section of the regulations, which state that these costs have to be approved, plus £625 for taking my car, which I got back anyway. I signed NO Walking Possession which they have charged me for.

 

I am not sure which parts I can challenge and would be very grateful for any advice.

 

Thanks,

 

DebtWeary

On this alone you appear to be the victim of fraud, follow nintendo pu,s letters to the chief constable in your county, be prepared to be fobbed off and then send the second letter I have copies if you need them

 

You are added to my list

Onlyme

[Nintendo Pü]

£1500 fees on a debt of £1100 is not reasonable costs.

 

If you havnt paid the fees yet, then the law does not obligate you to pay them. The bailiff must show it is reasonable costs.

 

If a bailiff cannot show any evidence of his disbursements by sending you a letter or visiting you then you dont have to pay.

 

If a bailiff wants to charges you a fee for giving a breakdown of costs, then this can be interpreted as the bailiff is unable or unwilling to show its reasonable costs.

[Guest DebtWeary]

Thanks for that, I have been paying £10 per month for the last few months towards the original debt, it was never my intention to pay these ludicrous fees. I am unsure as to whether the money I have paid to date would have been passed on to Southern Water. I came to this arrangement after dealing direct with Southern Water direct, it was just to get them off my back - too many other things going on at the time to give it my proper attention.

 

I am unclear as to how I would challenge these fees. Itsonlyme refers to a fee assessment in the High Court so I'd be interested in finding out how this is done.

 

If you have looked back through the thread you will have seen that although my car was originally towed away, I had it released to me a few hours later. A proper explanation for this was never given. It would seem to me that all charges related to that part of what they did were not reasonable.

[Guest DebtWeary]

After some deliberation and talking it over with my wife, I have now paid off the original Judgement Debt to Southern Water. Our resources have had to be spread a bit thin, but given the time the debt has been outstanding we decided it should be done.

 

I shall wait for Sherforce to make the next move.