Jump to content


  • Tweets

  • Posts

    • further polished WS using above suggestions and also included couple of more modifications highlighted in orange are those ok to include?   Background   1.1  The Defendant received the Parking Charge Notice (PCN) on the 06th of January 2020 following the vehicle being parked at Arla Old Dairy, South Ruislip on the 05th of December 2019.   Unfair PCN   2.1  On 19th December 2023 the Defendant sent the Claimant's solicitors a CPR request.  As shown in Exhibit 1 (pages 7-13) sent by the solicitors the signage displayed in their evidence clearly shows a £60.00 parking charge notice (which will be reduced to £30 if paid within 14 days of issue).  2.2  Yet the PCN sent by the Claimant is for a £100.00 parking charge notice (reduced to £60 if paid within 30 days of issue).   2.3        The Claimant relies on signage to create a contract.  It is unlawful for the Claimant to write that the charge is £60 on their signs and then send demands for £100.    2.4        The unlawful £100 charge is also the basis for the Claimant's Particulars of Claim.  No Locus Standi  3.1  I do not believe a contract with the landowner, that is provided following the defendant’s CPR request, gives MET Parking Services a right to bring claims in their own name. Definition of “Relevant contract” from the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012, Schedule 4,  2 [1] means a contract Including a contract arising only when the vehicle was parked on the relevant land between the driver and a person who is-   (a) the owner or occupier of the land; or   (b) Authorised, under or by virtue of arrangements made by the owner or occupier of the land, to enter into a contract with the driver requiring the payment of parking charges in respect of the parking of the vehicle on the land. According to https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2006/46/section/44   For a contract to be valid, it requires a director from each company to sign and then two independent witnesses must confirm those signatures.   3.2  The Defendant requested to see such a contract in the CPR request.  The fact that no contract has been produced with the witness signatures present means the contract has not been validly executed. Therefore, there can be no contract established between MET Parking Services and the motorist. Even if “Parking in Electric Bay” could form a contract (which it cannot), it is immaterial. There is no valid contract.  Illegal Conduct – No Contract Formed   4.1 At the time of writing, the Claimant has failed to provide the following, in response to the CPR request from myself.   4.2        The legal contract between the Claimant and the landowner (which in this case is Standard Life Investments UK) to provide evidence that there is an agreement in place with landowner with the necessary authority to issue parking charge notices and to pursue payment by means of litigation.   4.3 Proof of planning permission granted for signage etc under the Town and country Planning Act 1990. Lack of planning permission is a criminal offence under this Act and no contract can be formed where criminality is involved.   4.4        I also do not believe the claimant possesses these documents.   No Keeper Liability   5.1        The defendant was not the driver at the time and date mentioned in the PCN and the claimant has not established keeper liability under schedule 4 of the PoFA 2012. In this matter, the defendant puts it to the claimant to produce strict proof as to who was driving at the time.   5.2 The claimant in their Notice To Keeper also failed to comply with PoFA 2012 Schedule 4 section 9[2][f] while mentioning “the right to recover from the keeper so much of that parking charge as remains unpaid” where they did not include statement “(if all the applicable conditions under this Schedule are met)”.     5.3         The claimant did not mention parking period, times on the photographs are separate from the PCN and in any case are that arrival and departure times not the parking period since their times include driving to and from the parking space as a minimum and can include extra time to allow pedestrians and other vehicles to pass in front.    Protection of Freedoms Act 2012   The notice must -   (a) specify the vehicle, the relevant land on which it was parked and the period of parking to which the notice relates;  22. In the persuasive judgement K4GF167G - Premier Park Ltd v Mr Mathur - Horsham County Court – 5 January 2024 it was on this very point that the judge dismissed this claim.  5.4  A the PCN does not comply with the Act the Defendant as keeper is not liable.  No Breach of Contract   6.1       No breach of contract occurred because the PCN and contract provided as part of the defendant’s CPR request shows different post code, PCN shows HA4 0EY while contract shows HA4 0FY. According to PCN defendant parked on HA4 0EY which does not appear to be subject to the postcode covered by the contract.  6.2         The entrance sign does not mention anything about there being other terms inside the car park so does not offer a contract which makes it only an offer to treat,  Interest  7.1  It is unreasonable for the Claimant to delay litigation for  Double Recovery   7.2  The claim is littered with made-up charges.  7.3  As noted above, the Claimant's signs state a £60 charge yet their PCN is for £100.  7.4  As well as the £100 parking charge, the Claimant seeks recovery of an additional £70.  This is simply a poor attempt to circumvent the legal costs cap at small claims.  7.5 Since 2019, many County Courts have considered claims in excess of £100 to be an abuse of process leading to them being struck out ab initio. An example, in the Caernarfon Court in VCS v Davies, case No. FTQZ4W28 on 4th September 2019, District Judge Jones-Evans stated “Upon it being recorded that District Judge Jones- Evans has over a very significant period of time warned advocates (...) in many cases of this nature before this court that their claim for £60 is unenforceable in law and is an abuse of process and is nothing more than a poor attempt to go behind the decision of the Supreme Court v Beavis which inter alia decided that a figure of £160 as a global sum claimed in this case would be a penalty and not a genuine pre-estimate of loss and therefore unenforceable in law and if the practice continued, he would treat all cases as a claim for £160 and therefore a penalty and unenforceable in law it is hereby declared (…) the claim is struck out and declared to be wholly without merit and an abuse of process.”  7.6 In Claim Nos. F0DP806M and F0DP201T, District Judge Taylor echoed earlier General Judgment or Orders of District Judge Grand, stating ''It is ordered that the claim is struck out as an abuse of process. The claim contains a substantial charge additional to the parking charge which it is alleged the Defendant contracted to pay. This additional charge is not recoverabl15e under the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012, Schedule 4 nor with reference to the judgment in Parking Eye v Beavis. It is an abuse of process from the Claimant to issue a knowingly inflated claim for an additional sum which it is not entitled to recover. This order has been made by the court of its own initiative without a hearing pursuant to CPR Rule 3.3(4)) of the Civil Procedure Rules 1998...''  7.7 In the persuasive case of G4QZ465V - Excel Parking Services Ltd v Wilkinson – Bradford County Court -2 July 2020 (Exhibit 4) the judge had decided that Excel had won. However, due to Excel adding on the £60 the Judge dismissed the case.  7.8        The addition of costs not previously specified on signage are also in breach of the Consumer Rights Act 2015, Schedule 2, specifically paras 6, 10 and 14.   7.9        It is the Defendant’s position that the Claimant in this case has knowingly submitted inflated costs and thus the entire claim should be similarly struck out in accordance with Civil Procedure Rule 3.3(4).   In Conclusion   8.1        I invite the court to dismiss the claim.  Statement of Truth  I believe that the facts stated in this witness statement are true. I understand that proceedings for contempt of court may be brought against anyone who makes, or causes to be made, a false statement in a document verified by a statement of truth without an honest belief in its truth.   
    • Well the difference is that in all our other cases It was Kev who was trying to entrap the motorist so sticking two fingers up to him and daring him to try court was from a position of strength. In your case, sorry, you made a mistake so you're not in the position of strength.  I've looked on Google Maps and the signs are few & far between as per Kev's MO, but there is an entrance sign saying "Pay & Display" (and you've admitted in writing that you knew you had to pay) and the signs by the payment machines do say "Sea View Car Park" (and you've admitted in writing you paid the wrong car park ... and maybe outed yourself as the driver). Something I missed in my previous post is that the LoC is only for one ticket, not two. Sorry, but it's impossible to definitively advise what to so. Personally I'd probably gamble on Kev being a serial bottler of court and reply with a snotty letter ridiculing the signage (given you mentioned the signage in your appeal) - but it is a gamble.  
    • No! What has happened is that your pix were up-to-date: 5 hours' maximum stay and £100 PCN. The lazy solicitors have sent ancient pictures: 4 hours' maximum stay and £60 PCN. Don't let on!  Let them be hoisted by their own lazy petard in the court hearing (if they don't bottle before).
    • Thanks for all the suggestions so far I will amend original WS and send again for review.  While looking at my post at very beginning when I submitted photos of signs around the car park I noticed that it says 5 hours maximum stay while the signage sent by solicitor shows 4 hours maximum stay but mine is related to electric bay abuse not sure if this can be of any use in WS.
    • Not sure what to make of that or what it means for me, I was just about to head to my kip and it's a bit too late for legalise. When is the "expenditure occured"?  When they start spending money to write to me?  Or is this a bad thing (as "harsh" would imply)? When all is said and done, I do not have two beans to rub together, we rent our home and EVERYTHING of value has been purchased by and is in my wife's name and we are not financially linked in any way.  So at least if I can't escape my fate I can at least know that they will get sweet FA from me anyway   edit:  ah.. Sophia Harrison: Time bar decision tough on claimants WWW.SCOTTISHLEGAL.COM Time bar is a very complex area of law in Scotland relating to the period in which a claim for breach of duty can be pursued. The Scottish government...   This explains it like I am 5.  So, a good thing then because creditors clearly know they have suffered a loss the minute I stop paying them, this is why it is "harsh" (for them, not me)? Am I understanding this correctly?  
  • Our picks

    • If you are buying a used car – you need to read this survival guide.
      • 1 reply
    • Hello,

      On 15/1/24 booked appointment with Big Motoring World (BMW) to view a mini on 17/1/24 at 8pm at their Enfield dealership.  

      Car was dirty and test drive was two circuits of roundabout on entry to the showroom.  Was p/x my car and rushed by sales exec and a manager into buying the mini and a 3yr warranty that night, sale all wrapped up by 10pm.  They strongly advised me taking warranty out on car that age (2017) and confirmed it was honoured at over 500 UK registered garages.

      The next day, 18/1/24 noticed amber engine warning light on dashboard , immediately phoned BMW aftercare team to ask for it to be investigated asap at nearest garage to me. After 15 mins on hold was told only their 5 service centres across the UK can deal with car issues with earliest date for inspection in March ! Said I’m not happy with that given what sales team advised or driving car. Told an amber warning light only advisory so to drive with caution and call back when light goes red.

      I’m not happy to do this, drive the car or with the after care experience (a sign of further stresses to come) so want a refund and to return the car asap.

      Please can you advise what I need to do today to get this done. 
       

      Many thanks 
      • 81 replies
    • Housing Association property flooding. https://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/topic/438641-housing-association-property-flooding/&do=findComment&comment=5124299
      • 161 replies
    • We have finally managed to obtain the transcript of this case.

      The judge's reasoning is very useful and will certainly be helpful in any other cases relating to third-party rights where the customer has contracted with the courier company by using a broker.
      This is generally speaking the problem with using PackLink who are domiciled in Spain and very conveniently out of reach of the British justice system.

      Frankly I don't think that is any accident.

      One of the points that the judge made was that the customers contract with the broker specifically refers to the courier – and it is clear that the courier knows that they are acting for a third party. There is no need to name the third party. They just have to be recognisably part of a class of person – such as a sender or a recipient of the parcel.

      Please note that a recent case against UPS failed on exactly the same issue with the judge held that the Contracts (Rights of Third Parties) Act 1999 did not apply.

      We will be getting that transcript very soon. We will look at it and we will understand how the judge made such catastrophic mistakes. It was a very poor judgement.
      We will be recommending that people do include this adverse judgement in their bundle so that when they go to county court the judge will see both sides and see the arguments against this adverse judgement.
      Also, we will be to demonstrate to the judge that we are fair-minded and that we don't mind bringing everything to the attention of the judge even if it is against our own interests.
      This is good ethical practice.

      It would be very nice if the parcel delivery companies – including EVRi – practised this kind of thing as well.

       

      OT APPROVED, 365MC637, FAROOQ, EVRi, 12.07.23 (BRENT) - J v4.pdf
        • Like

Liz v Barclays - Mercantile Court **WON**


style="text-align: center;">  

Thread Locked

because no one has posted on it for the last 6385 days.

If you need to add something to this thread then

 

Please click the "Report " link

 

at the bottom of one of the posts.

 

If you want to post a new story then

Please

Start your own new thread

That way you will attract more attention to your story and get more visitors and more help 

 

Thanks

Recommended Posts

Where IS the Mercantile Court anyway? :-?

 

Royal Courts of Justice Group

Admiralty & Commercial Registry

Room EB13

Royal Courts of Justice

Strand

London

WC2A 2LL

Link to post
Share on other sites

  • Replies 126
  • Created
  • Last Reply

Top Posters In This Topic

Top Posters In This Topic

Where IS the Mercantile Court anyway? :-?

http://www.hmcourts-service.gov.uk/HMCSCourtFinder/Search.do?court_id=145

 

Is where all of our cases have been intialy transfered to, however I am not sure this is where the conference will be held as a lot of their work is being transferred at present apparently

 

EDIT: see above !

Link to post
Share on other sites

Just had a call from Dan Pope at the Mercantile court..

 

Due to the number of cases currently in the system, I am not needed at the case conference on Monday. ( Due to recent events this is not going ahead)

 

All claims against the banks are being sent over the Judge Machie (not sure on spelling) on Monday.

 

After he has reviewed them all a date will be set or I think he will make a judgement once and for all ..not sure

 

But I have been told to wait and not go to court on Monday, which is a shame as I have just left a message on Mr Jeremiah's voicemail telling I would see hiim on Monday -

Link to post
Share on other sites

Just had a call from Dan Pope at the Mercantile court..

 

Due to the number of cases currently in the system, I am not needed at the case conference on Monday. ( Due to recent events this is not going ahead)

 

All claims against the banks are being sent over the Judge Machie (not sure on spelling) on Monday.

 

After he has reviewed them all a date will be set or I think he will make a judgement once and for all ..not sure

 

But I have been told to wait and not go to court on Monday, which is a shame as I have just left a message on Mr Jeremiah's voicemail telling I would see hiim on Monday -

 

Bugger!! :(

I will not make any deals with you. I will not be pushed, filed, stamped, indexed, briefed, debriefed or numbered. My life is my own. Number 6

Link to post
Share on other sites

Sorry to butt in...but has anyone who has been transferred to the mercantile court had to attend an allocation hearing first? I have started a claim against Natwest and after we have both returned the allocation questionnaire the judge has said the case is unsuitable for small claims and set a date (20th Nov - ages away) for an allocation hearing - can't find anything anywhere on this and don't know what I need to do next...am I going to the mercantile court too?

Link to post
Share on other sites

Sorry to butt in...but has anyone who has been transferred to the mercantile court had to attend an allocation hearing first? I have started a claim against NatWest and after we have both returned the allocation questionnaire the judge has said the case is unsuitable for small claims and set a date (20th Nov - ages away) for an allocation hearing - can't find anything anywhere on this and don't know what I need to do next...am I going to the mercantile court too?

 

Could be but do you have a thread with details of your claim posted?

 

It could be that youre going to fast track though so difficult to know.

 

HTH

 

Glenn

Kick the shAbbey Habit

 

Where were you? Next time please

 

 

Abbey 1st claim -Charges repaid, default removed, interest paid (8% apr) costs paid, Abbey peed off; priceless

Abbey 2nd claim, two Accs - claim issued 30-03-07

Barclaycard - Settled cheque received

Egg 2 accounts ID sent 29/07

Co-op Claim issued 30-03-07

GE Capital (Store Cards) ICO says theyve been naughty

MBNA - Settled in Full

GE Capital (1st National) Settled

Lombard Bank - SAR sent 16.02.07

MBNA are not your friends, they will settle but you need to make sure its on your terms -read here

Glenn Vs MBNA

Link to post
Share on other sites

Don't know how to set up a link - sorry!

 

But my thread is 'Give up? No chance!' in the Natwest section - it is under £5,000 so I was expecting it to go on small claims track and the judgement talks about considering a test trial case or something along those lines (sorry I'm at work and don't have the paperwork handy) - what's the difference between fast track and small claims?

Link to post
Share on other sites

Claudia

 

go to your thread and click on the (permalink) icon top right of your post. This changes the internet in your internet explorer tool bar, highlight and copy this and past the address in a post of pm so that you can direct people to your thread directly.

 

HTH

 

Glenn

Kick the shAbbey Habit

 

Where were you? Next time please

 

 

Abbey 1st claim -Charges repaid, default removed, interest paid (8% apr) costs paid, Abbey peed off; priceless

Abbey 2nd claim, two Accs - claim issued 30-03-07

Barclaycard - Settled cheque received

Egg 2 accounts ID sent 29/07

Co-op Claim issued 30-03-07

GE Capital (Store Cards) ICO says theyve been naughty

MBNA - Settled in Full

GE Capital (1st National) Settled

Lombard Bank - SAR sent 16.02.07

MBNA are not your friends, they will settle but you need to make sure its on your terms -read here

Glenn Vs MBNA

Link to post
Share on other sites

Don't know how to set up a link - sorry!

 

But my thread is 'Give up? No chance!' in the NatWest section - it is under £5,000 so I was expecting it to go on small claims track and the judgement talks about considering a test trial case or something along those lines (sorry I'm at work and don't have the paperwork handy) - what's the difference between fast track and small claims?

 

the difference between fast track & small claims as far as I understand it is that in fast track, if you lose you are liable for tiher costs. can anyone confirm

Link to post
Share on other sites

cAN i get this right in my head then

 

ALL cases, or only barclays cases are being transferred to judge mackie?

 

Im here, bumbling about dunno whats going on, feel a bit lonesome!

A number of cases involving various defendants have been passed to Judge Mackie for consideration, at the last count there we 10-15 in the pile, I think some were settled yesterday so the number on his desk is reducing, however it is the principal that is being tested, not a specific Bank / defendant

Link to post
Share on other sites

the difference between fast track & small claims as far as I understand it is that in fast track, if you lose you are liable for tiher costs. can anyone confirm
Technically yes, although if you are acting as a litigant in person this is unlikely as the court would see that it is unrealistic and disproportionate to your means.
Link to post
Share on other sites

hmmm, in theory...... What is likely to happen if Judge Mackie rules in favour of us lot??

a) Would he be able to put some kind of condition on being able to claim back charges? i.e. only those cases that have already been started/stayed/ be paid up?

b) Would all and sundrie now be able to claim back charges easily and simply?

c) Can he put a condition on in that the banks don;t have to pay out for past charges, but cannot continue to charge anymore??

 

What happened with OFT and the credit card companies, are people still claiming the £12 back they now charge, or are they getting somewhere with arguing that this is still a penalty chaarge?

 

Hmmm, my unlegal brain working overtime!

Link to post
Share on other sites

Technically yes, although if you are acting as a litigant in person this is unlikely as the court would see that it is unrealistic and disproportionate to your means.

 

FWIW

 

Typically costs in fast track are limited to a max of 750 should you lose.

 

However, i understand it that the judge could order you to pay the defendants costs where they have been put to extra effort. The example i was given was the cost of preparing the standard disclosure.

 

I understand that if you lost and the defendant applied for their costs and the judge agreed it could amount to several thousands of pounds.

 

Multi track the cost imploications are that everything is up for grabs should you lose.

 

Ultimately there is an element of risk and as said if youre a lititgant in person and acting in good faith then its unlikley that the court would award horrendous costs against you.

 

Note 'unlikely' not impossible.

 

HTH

 

glenn

Kick the shAbbey Habit

 

Where were you? Next time please

 

 

Abbey 1st claim -Charges repaid, default removed, interest paid (8% apr) costs paid, Abbey peed off; priceless

Abbey 2nd claim, two Accs - claim issued 30-03-07

Barclaycard - Settled cheque received

Egg 2 accounts ID sent 29/07

Co-op Claim issued 30-03-07

GE Capital (Store Cards) ICO says theyve been naughty

MBNA - Settled in Full

GE Capital (1st National) Settled

Lombard Bank - SAR sent 16.02.07

MBNA are not your friends, they will settle but you need to make sure its on your terms -read here

Glenn Vs MBNA

Link to post
Share on other sites

Claudia

 

go to your thread and click on the (permalink) icon top right of your post. This changes the internet in your internet explorer tool bar, highlight and copy this and past the address in a post of pm so that you can direct people to your thread directly.

 

HTH

 

Glenn

 

OK, here's the link then in case anyone is interested...

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/natwest-bank/15110-give-up-no-chance-2.html#post271046

 

Not sure if I'm going to Mercantile or not but looks quite likely judging by the order I've just received (see link) - we'll find out 20th Nov.! (will be watching mercantile forum with interest - Good luck everyone!)

Link to post
Share on other sites

I was wondering as well, any news?

Abbey - Claim 1

full hearing 22 Feb 07 - Settled in full £710 :D

Abbey (Claim 2)

full hearing 22 Feb 07- Settled in full £4000 :D

Abbey (Claim 3)

Court date 27 June -

Capital One (claim 1)

£467 Settled in full 20 Sep :D

Capital One (claim 2)

£72 refunded 19 Aug :-D

Associates (Citicards)

claim 8 Aug/judgment by default 30 Aug/set aside hearing 9 Oct/Stay denied, ordered by Judge to reveal breakdown of charges andfull hearing 24 May/FULL DISCLOSURE ORDERED BY 8 MARCH/JUDGE TO STRIKE OUT DEFENCE AS NON-COMPLIANCE/DEFENCE STRUCK OUT PAYMENT IN FULL REQUIRED IN 14 DAYS

Link to post
Share on other sites

Judge Mackie was due to review the files today, and will pass a direction from there, I am expecting some feedback either late this afternoon, or early tomorrow morning.

 

Will let you all know from there, also FYI in the end there were about 10 cases with various defendants that went before His Honour Judge Mackie QC for consideration.

Link to post
Share on other sites

UPDATE;

 

I have been informed that Judge Mackie has now reviewed the cases place before him and he has directed that a formal case management conference shall take place on the 18th of October at 10:00 am.

 

Would any parties who’s case have been referred to mercantile, and who wish to take part in this CMC please contact me as a matter of urgency

Link to post
Share on other sites

What's the bet that Mr J will be calling you on the 16th, with F&F file_wizard :o .

If not, can't wait to hear what the Wunch have got to say for themselves:D . Have you pm'd BF?

Link to post
Share on other sites

  • Recently Browsing   0 Caggers

    • No registered users viewing this page.

  • Have we helped you ...?


×
×
  • Create New...