jazzyb v's HSBC

[Bean]

Your call, but I would not entertain anything less than an offer of full payment.

 

Here is my reasoning. You could accept the offer in partial payment, but there are some problems in doing that:

 

1. Your LBA presumably said "if you do not comply fully within 14 days then I shall begin a claim against you...". Accepting a partial offer is not in line with what you said you would do.

 

2. If you deduct the partial sum (£1260) from the £1400 before you receive it, you will be removing the heat from the £1260 unless within the partial settlement agreement you set very clear and specific terms for it's payment (e.g. whether it's to be paid by cheque or direct to your account, within 48 hours or 7 days, etc.). From what I have read, given a chance some banks seem to pay as slowly or as late as possible even for payments which are the subject of a County Court claim, just prior to the hearing or other critical point.

 

3. If you wait for them to partially settle before continuing with your claim for the remaining £140 they have succeeded in stalling your claim.

 

4. What are the terms of their offer? Any agreement of partial settlement would have to address these. If they are akin to 'will pay x into your account, you must attend account review, all to be confidential, in full and final settlement' you need to decide which terms to accept.

 

Hope that helps,

[jazzyb]

Yep, i agree with what you've said, my only concren is that i have seen a few threads recently that would indicate that if a case did actually make it to court (and it's bound to be mine! ) the judge may not look upon it favourably (that HSBC had made me an offer and i declined) however the chances of it actually ending up in court are very doubtfull so i think i shall ignore the offer letter and stick to my timetable. onwards and upwards!

Thanks Bean

[Bean]

...my only concren is that i have seen a few threads recently that would indicate that if a case did actually make it to court (and it's bound to be mine! ) the judge may not look upon it favourably (that HSBC had made me an offer and i declined)...

 

An offer is exactly that, it can be accepted or declined. No obligation (unless it's perfect). Surely the court would not expect you to accept any offer unless it was a full settlement with no conditions. This is a first offer, close to your deadline, presumably on their terms, and falls 10% short of your full sum. I, for one, think that you are perfectly justified in issuing your claim.

 

Bear in mind that the bank/solicitors have contacted you (which is a more positive response than many of us have had) so as a simple matter of courtesy you should respond, but also as a matter of legal record you need to demonstrate that you have at least considered their offer. You have a duty to mitigate your losses, to show you want to foster meaningful dialogue, but you also need to ensure you don't get taken for a ride.

 

In summary, I would write to decline their offer, and I would issue the claim. If they are this close, perhaps first make a phone call to tell them this is your solemn intention. Maybe it will encourage them to settle in full.

[nikki]

it is against the banking practice. I used to work for lloyds tsb and this sort of thing is deemed really unprofessional and problematic by the FSA and the banking code. I dont know who you could take it up with, but its definately worth doing.

[Bean]

it is against the banking practice. I used to work for lloyds tsb and this sort of thing is deemed really unprofessional and problematic by the FSA and the banking code. I dont know who you could take it up with, but its definately worth doing.

 

Hello nikki,

 

What is against banking practice? What sort of thing? What is definitely worth doing?

 

?!

[jazzyb]

After sending back a letter to accept offer as part payment and pursue for rest, received a letter today offering full amount (hipeee:D ) Thanks everyone for your help and i shall be making a donation when the money arrives. Now i've got the hang of this there's a couple of credit cards i'm going after.

Thanks again;)

[Bean]

Congratulations jazzyb!!!

 

Well done.

 

Have you had any more thoughts on recovering costs of the loan you took out to deal with spiraling charges?

[jazzyb]

Hi bean, thanks alot:D Yep i'm still thinking about it, i've tried to read Janeyb thread but alot of it seems to be missing so am sure of the process and on what grounds i would make a claim. This is my understanding so far....i have had £1400 worth of unlawful charges in the last 6 years, the o/d at the time of the loan was around £1600 and the loan amount was £2000, do i claim back the interest against £1400 of the loan because theoretically had i had not had those charges levied against my account i would be only £200 o/d and so would not have required a loan......How am i doing so far:confused:

[Bean]

Hi bean, thanks alot:D Yep i'm still thinking about it, i've tried to read Janeyb thread but alot of it seems to be missing so am sure of the process and on what grounds i would make a claim. This is my understanding so far....i have had £1400 worth of unlawful charges in the last 6 years, the o/d at the time of the loan was around £1600 and the loan amount was £2000, do i claim back the interest against £1400 of the loan because theoretically had i had not had those charges levied against my account i would be only £200 o/d and so would not have required a loan......How am i doing so far:confused:

 

Hi jazzyb, be careful not to step off well-trodden ground:

 

This is new territory and so far not covered on this site so if you intend to proceed with it you MUST seek appropriate advice. I suggest you ask the Moderators for their views, and you would also be well advised to seek advice from a qualified professional.

 

For discussion purposes only, as I see it there are potentially three levels you could pitch a claim at:

1. Claim loan costs for £1400 (i.e. the loan interest on £1400 of it, and a proportion of set-up cost in the ratio £1400/£2000, i.e. 70%).

2. Claim loan costs on £1400, plus £1400 of the loan sum.

3. Claim all loan costs and all of the loan sum (in your case £2000) as janeyb successfully did.

 

Presumably, which of these you choose will depend on how well you can show the charges influenced the loan application process and your loan-taking decision.

 

Sorry I can't be of more help, but as you will appreciate you should only ever act on solid and specific advice.

[alanfromderby]

Hi bean, thanks alot:D Yep i'm still thinking about it, i've tried to read Janeyb thread but alot of it seems to be missing so am sure of the process and on what grounds i would make a claim. This is my understanding so far....i have had £1400 worth of unlawful charges in the last 6 years, the o/d at the time of the loan was around £1600 and the loan amount was £2000, do i claim back the interest against £1400 of the loan because theoretically had i had not had those charges levied against my account i would be only £200 o/d and so would not have required a loan......How am i doing so far:confused:

 

What I would say is that you would have been best to include that with your original claim, as the legal arguments you will be using are largely the same. Certainly you have a valid claim for the interest and any other consequential costs, but remember that the bank has settled without admitting liability, therefore you are starting from square one.

[jazzyb]

Thanks Alan, Bean had suggested the same thing earlier in my claim, but i didn't get my act together. If i did decide to pursue for the interest etc. obviously the wording of the initial claim letter is going to be different, do you know of any templetes on the site that are usable or do you have any suggestions?

Appreciate your help:D

[alanfromderby]

As I said before, the difficulty is that your arguments are exactly the same. You are stating that over the period of your claim the charges were levied in breach of all the legislation and regulations that you originally quoted. All you are adding is that, as a consequence of all this etc etc.....

 

The fact that they have given you a refund has no bearing whatsoever, as they have done this without admitting liability. You literally now have to go to the beginning of the process and even restate what charges they have levied, only this time you are not asking for them to be refunded.

[jazzyb]

Cheers Alan, i am now clear of my position. I will think about my next move and keep you informed.

[jazzyb]

If HSBC don't pay the rufund in my account by the agreed date is the agreement void and in which case can i carry on my claim to the courts and include the interest on my loan?

[alanfromderby]

I don't see any problem with that.

[jazzyb]

Well payday has been and gone! HSBC have not credited my account within the agreed time:-x Was thinking of sending them a email to remind them and give them 24 hrs to pay or i will put a claim in at the courts, Is this fair? Does any one know of an email address that has proved fruitfull in getting to the right people. Colin Langdale is the guy who the letter was from so would really want it to land on his desk. Any thoughts anyone.

[Bean]

Hi jazzyb,

 

Can you clarify - have you issued your claim yet or not? From what you say, it looks like you were about to issue it when you received the full offer - Is this correct?

 

Why not see if you can contact Langdale directly (or any others who handled the offer) to arrange payment within 24 hours? If no payment within 24 hours, issue your claim to cover what they have taken plus court costs, and your consequential losses - you may wish to view my thread "Bean's Timeline (Current Account)" in the Lloyds TSB forum for wording of your 'Particulars of Claim'.

[jazzyb]

Hi Bean, no i havn,t put a claim into the court yet, i had sent my LBA letter out and then the next day received an offer which i rejected and then received a full offer a few days later. I will try today and speak direct to somebody in Langdales office and if i have no joy will put a claim in.

Thanks

[jazzyb]

Spoke to Colin langdale on friday last week in regards to no payment, he told me that he hadn't received my signed agreement by which i replied when and by whom it had been signed for and so he faxed over another agreement for me to sign and fax back, the money was in the account that day. I also managed to persued him to cancel £125 of charges due to come out my account this month. He actually was very apologetic for the delay in payment and came across as being very reasonable, so if you are having problems it might be worth giving him a ring 0800 881 155. I have filled out the survey and made a donation. I have just sent a DPA for an account that is now closed which i had forgotten about and will start another thread.

Thanks to you all:D

[Bean]

Well done jazzyb,

 

Do you mind me asking, did you agree to any conditions and did they include some/all of your loan/loan costs in your settlement?

 

Congratulations, and good luck with your new claim.

[jazzyb]

Thanks Bean

 

There were no conditions specified in the agreement apart from " Full and final Settlement". The settlement did not include any amount of the loan or its costs and realistically the reason why we were in the position we were financially at the time of taking the loan was due more to our spending habits.

 

Good luck with all your claims:D

[Bean]

OK - just so long as you are entirely happy with your settlement - enjoy it!