Struggling Simon vs Cabot **WON**

[Struggling_Simon]

Hi All,

 

Just spent a couple of days reading through some of threads on here after a very nasty telephone call with these Cabot monkeys.

 

As background, I got a letter out of the blue 13th November, saying that I owed them £849.91. I knew that I had a default on my credit file registered for that amount to Kings Hill No1 previously, but as it was not a priority at the time, I haven't done anything about it.

 

Lo and behold, in November, the name of the creditor on my credit file miraculously changed to Cabot Financial UK Limited. I've never seen anything about the transferral of this 'debt'.

 

I thought that I would be proactive and ask what Cabot may be able to settle for. Imagine my shock to find out that they now state that the alleged debt is now at £1500+. I asked them to explain this to me and was told that it was interest upon the original debt.

 

Lastly I note that the starting date of the debt is 3rd May 2001 accroding to the credit file. Surely this means that it's statue barred? Although there is a line that says payment start date 15th July 2002.

 

How should I proceed?

[Newborn]

Hi Struggling Simon,

 

Kings Hill No1 changed its company name to Cabot Financial UK earlier this year.

At the same time another company named Cabot Financial UK changed its name to Kings Hill No1.

Very confusing, but companies house have confirmed this and said it's 'normal practice'.

So the debt wasn't technically transferred.

Statute barring is relevant if you have not acknowledged or made a payment towards the debt in the last 6 years (5 years if you are domiciled in Scotland).

Unless this is overdraft or mobile phone related, your first move should be to ensure that the DCA is legally empowered to recover the debt by sending them a CCA request. The first line of which should be 'I do not acknowledge this debt to you or anyone you represent'. Do not sign the letter and enclose a £1 postal order made payable to the DCA.

 

Newborn

[Seahorse]

Statute barred if 6 (or 5) years have passed since last acknowledgement of a debt either by making a payment, or otherwise in writing. Not 6 years after the start of your account, or your first payment.

[NailPost]

Adding interest to the account is only allowed if there's a clause in the original agreement to that effect. Well if Cabot haven't got that agreement then there is no way they can add interest.

 

I would CCA them as soon as possible and see what they have or haven't got. If they don't have a CCA then you can deal with them from a position of strength. In short you can tell them to go away and never bother you again.

[Struggling_Simon]

OK, thanks for the responses so far, I want to be very careful as this is new territory for me.

 

Do I send CCA requests to both Associates (the Original Creditor, now owned by CitiCards) or just to Cabot?

 

Which variety of the 'Cabot' club do I send this CCA request to? From my learnings, there's about 16 of them.

I reckon it has to be Cabot Financial(Europe), as the UK variety doesn't have any people working for them.

Can anyone confirm thats OK?

 

I plan to use the template letter N from the templates library , with the 'i do not acknowledge' line added. Would that be sufficient?

 

Thanx

S

[Seahorse]

It's Cabot Financial (Europe) Limited who do all the donkey work for the group, so that's who you send the CCA request to. You will get the usual template back saying they acquire the rights but not the duties, but they'll helpfully try to get the agreement from the OC. And you'll get your £1 back. I still haven't cashed the cheque they sent me, as I don't accept that the CCA doesn't apply to them, and cashing it would be seen as agreeing with their position.

 

Letter N from here will be fine, as you have said.

 

You might wish to SAR Associates too. If there are any penalties orcharges on there that there shouldn't be, then obviously any default notice that might have been issued to you will be invalid by virtue of the fact that the amount on the notice is inaccurate. That being the case, should they really have sold your debt on? Hmm

 

Anyway, wait until Cabot answer your CCA request and we'll see where to go from there.

[Struggling_Simon]

OK, I've started the ball rolling today.

 

Posted off Subject Access Request to the Data Controller of Associates ( Now Citicards ).

Included my tenner as a postal order.

I confirmed the address of the Data controller with the ICO website.

 

------

Posted off my CCA request to Cabot Financial (Europe) with my £1 postal order.

 

----

Both letters sent recorded delivery, so should be received on or before Monday 7th. Will be tracking them via Royal Mail Website.

 

Here's hoping!

[Struggling_Simon]

Just thought that I'd upload my letters in case anyone wants to view them.

SAR_030108_copy.pdf

Cabot_cca_copy.pdf

[Struggling_Simon]

Update -

 

I got another letter from cabot today (not that I feel like doing anything with it until later).

 

-------------------

Dear Mr xxxxxxx,

 

Further to your recent communications, regarding the account detailed below.

 

 

Original Lender : Associates

Account Type : Classic

Account Number : xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

 

Current Outstanding Balance : £1385.84

 

 

Associates assigned their rights to add interest to us on 27th September 2002, subsequently we are entitled to charge interest at an equivalent rate to that applicable under the original credit agreement.

 

Please could you contact Elaine in our customer relations department on the number below to give us an update to your financial situation. We may also be able to negotiate a reduction in the interest which has been charged to date and possibly freeze future interest charges.

 

We trust that this clarifies the situation an look forward to hearing from you soon.

 

---------------------

Contacting Cabot

 

If you have any queries, please call one of our customer advisors on 01732 524615

 

Yours Sincerely

Emma Robertson

Customer Relations Manager

[Struggling_Simon]

Current Outstanding Balance : £1385.84

 

OK, so thats £533.93 more than their first letter on the 13th November.

 

Associates assigned their rights ...

 

No mention of duties though, I wonder?

 

... to add interest to us on 27th September 2002

 

Prove it to me by showing ...

a) A Notice of Assignment from the original creditor, and proof that I received it

b) A true copy of the original credit agreement with its prescribed terms and conditions, signed by me.

If you have these in your possesion, why would you wait 5 years 2 months to persue the alleged 'debt'?

 

... subsequently we are entitled to charge interest at an equivalent rate to that applicable under the original credit agreement

 

I don't think that £355 interest per month on a debt of £849.91 is as the per the original terms and conditions.Show me where the rate is set please.

 

Please could you contact Elaine in our customer relations department ....

 

No thanks, not right now.

 

We may also be able to negotiate a reduction in the interest which has been charged to date and possibly freeze future interest charges.

 

Why would you make such a business decision if you're claim is solid?

 

We trust that this clarifies the situation an look forward to hearing from you soon.

 

No, actually it doesn't, and please don't hold your breath to hear from me until you have fulfilled my CCA request sent to you on the 3rd Jan. It'll clear a lot of my confusion regarding the matter.

 

--------------------------

I feel that persuant to a CCA request they are supposed to send a statment of account, which should show any charges and how they were calculated - I look forward to that?

 

Can anyone comment?

[Seahorse]

That's the spirit, Simon. I think you've said enough, don't you?

 

Just sit tight and wait to see if an actual agreement turns up. Take things from there. But as you've rightly pointed out, if there never was an agreement, then their comical attempts at justifying their somewhat extortionate interest rate will be so much toilet paper.

 

Actually, our elusive Ms. Robertson has a point. They ARE allowed to charge an equivalent rate as that of the original agreement, IF such a beast exists that is. BUT. If they don't HAVE the original agreement, as quite clearly they don't at the moment because they say they have to go back to the OC, how the HECK do they know what the interest rate was in the first place?

 

And by definition, how many non-CAGGERs are they duping into paying an interest rate over and above any alleged interest rate that MIGHT have been agreed????

 

They're at it. They really are. And it's making me annoyed. I'm off to my blog for a rant.

[Seahorse]

Ranted. In a polite fashion, of course.

[Struggling_Simon]

My point being that charging £500+ in interest for a period just over six weeks is hardly an equivalent rate as the orginal, don't think I would have entered into such an agreement.

 

I expect that the CCA request will be delivered by Monday, so I'll soon know...Or maybe not ;-)

---

 

Mr. Seahorse, I've just read your rant in the other place, and I'm very tempted to ask that very same question, but I'll leave be for the moment.

 

Mr Cabot, Can you please demonstrate to me how you calculated the increase, and where are the documents which prove you are basing your rate upon the original agreement?

 

If the new figure is right, why does the dodgy 'default' record on my credit file show a differing value .... aren't you supposed to ensure that the records placed there are accurate, 'cos I'm pretty sure that you are obliged to under the Data Protection Act?

You Cheeky monkey!

[Seahorse]

If you keep pushing them, quite often they'll tell you that they are NOT adding any interest whilst the dispute is ongoing. How absolutely charming of them.

 

Of course, if they can't prove diddly, then they can add all the interest they want, cos they'll never see a penny of it.

[Struggling_Simon]

Except that I have it in writing from them, and signed to boot!

 

Have a look at the attached files. I don't see how the fact that they have added interest could be denied.

 

We'll see what transpires, but thanks for your continued support.

I guess nothing more to be said for a couple of weeks, at least.

Cabot_13_10_2007_copy.pdf

Cabot_28_12_2007_copy.pdf

[Struggling_Simon]

update - CCA request letter delivery confirmed.

 

 

By my reckoning, that makes d-day Thursday Jan 24th 2008.

[Seahorse]

Don't hold your breath

[Struggling_Simon]

Seahorse, I'm fired up about this because -

 

I had a run in with CSL,recently, bloody clowns! The matter at that time concerned a mobile phone I had from 3. No sooner was that matter settled (only 4 months after the contract finished, letter from 3 to prove it), after a further 6 weeks of harrasment, CSL received a STOP CALLS letter from me.I never heard from them again, because they had passed it back to 3. Game over. Contract is finished, after that no benefit can be gained from it.

 

I will get round to a complaint letter to Mr Hutchinson, not top priority, as the account is clear, showing 1 missed payment in the CRA reports.

 

The very next day, guess what, A letter from these golly chaps!

 

I simply telephoned them to ask if they would remind me of who the OC was. Could I have a statement of account since your assignment, and a breakdown of any costs.

BOOM!

Sorry matey I WILL not be shouted at nor talked over, I refuse to be made in fear of ( 'in terrorem' , bad starting point) your attempts to coerce me into 'making a payment' the amount of which alters from letter to call, and letter to letter.

 

There's a glaring lack of logic to them, to wit - not only unconvicing, but also obviously transparent, ahem ,res ipsa loquitur, as it were.

 

(For those reading in non latin please refer to the signature,

Somper in excretia, som solem profundus variat means Always in the crud, only the depth that varies.)

 

..................................D-Day is coming!

[Struggling_Simon]

UPDATE

 

My,my aren't the lovely chaps over at West Mailing paying attention.

 

Today, I received a letter from Cabot. I'm impressed, was posted the day they got my CCA request.

 

Alas, it's only a template (reference:CCA008, no less).

 

 

I shall disect at my discretion and respond accordingly.

 

 

I wonder, Did their previous template(CCA007 one would assume) make reference to the Law of Property Act 1925, in days of yore?

 

Aye ,Aye,

Ah ken yer game,pal.

 

ya diddy.

 

 

Please do feel free to comment.

[Seahorse]

A REAL signature from the lovely Ms Robertson????

 

And looks like they have amended their template too.

 

Can't remember about their assertion re. LOP. I THINK it may have been in response to letters further on in the dispute. I'd have to check through my Big Bundle of Cabot Guff.

[Struggling_Simon]

Response #1 :To the lovely Ms Robertson (attached) sent 1st Class today.

------------

2x Times Data Protection act 1998, Subject Access Requests

To Both Cabot(UK) Ltd. and Cabot (Europe) Ltd.

 

Those will be deleivered Monday.

 

Any comments?

MyReplyCCA_copy.pdf

[Struggling_Simon]

Today is the 16th of January.

 

I have a nice letter, dated 14th.

 

An Acknowledgement of my Subect Access Request. They recommend/suggest that I S.A.R (Subject Access Request) Citi Financial

1. Who may have information on you which we may not hold.

   (meaning .. we don't have what you want.)

   It's a good thing then, I posted the subjest access request to Citi Financial was signed for on the 4th... is due to breach on March 7th.

   No acknowledgement yet from Citi).

    

    

    

[Seahorse]

Puts paid to their claim that they have bought everything lock, stock and barrel. If t'were so, surely they would have ALL the data pertaining to your account.

 

But as we all know, that's an impractical proposition in light of how many debts they buy. But that's hardly OUR concern, is it?

 

As an aside, I see Citgroup have announced even more redundancies in light of the sub-prime fiasco (on top of the 17,000 globally already announced). And dividends will be down in an effort to save some $5 billion. Shame, innit?

[Struggling_Simon]

I have an update - I have had a Identity form to fill for Citi in regard to my SAR in yesterdays post.

[Seahorse]

Sign nothing, send no original docs. If you DO have to sign anything, use a squiggle.