Craig vs Paragon PPI

[needrevenge]

Damn, i'm upset

 

Just about to clear a loan off with Imagine Finance (actual lender is Paragon) after 14 months of the 120 month loan term.

 

It was a joint loan with 10 year term for £35,500 (we were very vunerable at the time). This loan included 5 year cover PPI which cost (including interest) £8701.20 which covered my wife only for Disability, Redundance & Life. We have made no claims on the cover.

 

After reading the loan documents it clearly states that cover was optional and we have signed it. I cannot remember it being optional - I was under the impression one of us needed cover to get the loan (I cannot prove this and the signed loan agreement clearly states 'optional')

 

Have I just thrown £8700 down the pan or is there a slight chance of recovering all / some of this somehow. I would have liked to have though I would have been entitled to a partial refund as have settled loan 14 months into 60 months PPI cover period.

 

Just a note to say, the actual cost for the cover was £6216.05 and the rest was interest over the 120 month period. I note that there is nothing on the signed agreement that states that full premium is due even if cancelled early - does this make any difference

 

Craig

[Bigmac versus]

Check into the PPI FORUM and seek advise, my feelings are that you will be arguing that you were mis-sold the PPI which takes a little time because you have to go through the companies internal proceedings first.

look for username reidnet (IAN) he is pretty much clued up on all of this and read up his threads.

good luck and hope this helps.

[needrevenge]

Check into the PPI FORUM and seek advise, my feelings are that you will be arguing that you were mis-sold the PPI which takes a little time because you have to go through the companies internal proceedings first.

look for username reidnet (IAN) he is pretty much clued up on all of this and read up his threads.

good luck and hope this helps.

 

I was going to, as a starter, SAR them, however, the Paragon loan was done through the Imagine finance broker - who do I send the SAR to?

 

Also, as part of the SAR can I request transcripts for any recorded telephone calls?

 

Craig

[needrevenge]

Check into the PPI FORUM and seek advise

 

I thought this was the PPI forum???

 

Craig

[itsmeandonlyme]

Hello Graig...it's a PPI forum:))))u r in the right place.... with your SAR you can also send this and amend in the way you want:

It would be grateful if you would provide the following: -

• Full copies of all contracts which you believe exist between myself and your organisation, including copies of any documents you hold in support of same.
  
• Details of the identity of any individuals or organisations who have provided you with my personal information together with copies of any letters of instruction provided by them, or any contracts entered into between yourselves and the third party, and the relevant dates to which those contracts related.
  
• Copies of all documents which include any of my personal information including copies of any contracts or invoices, emails or computer records containing my personal information, or any records which pertain to this information.
  
• Full details and copies of any documents upon which you relied when you have provided my personal or financial information to any individual, organisation or third party.
  
• Full copies or transcripts of any computer logs or database records kept in relation to myself or in relation to my financial or personal information.
  
• Full copies of any correspondence in postal, email or any other format which you have entered into with any individual, organisation or third party which contains my personal or financial information, or which pertains to myself.
  
• Details of all systems you currently have in place to ensure my personal or financial information is kept securely, including details of those officers who currently have control of same, and at the time it was held or provided to a third party.
  
• Where any previous information or records held have been deleted or disposed of, the methods used to do so, including dates, certificates or references confirming details of destruction. Where you are unable to provide such certificates, please provide a declaration, signed by an authorised officer of your company, confirming the dates and methods of destruction of this data.
  
• Full hard copy print outs of any of my personal or financial information held in a digital, magnetic or any other format which is held in any archives, backups or other storage devices / locations. And Audio files
  
• Your registration number with the Information Commissioners Office.
  
• Your Consumer Credit License number.
  
• Your VAT reg number

Where reference to emails is given above, these emails should be taken from your email servers or backups / archives held in a magnetic or digital format. These emails may not be present on a user’s local system, and may require the assistance of your IT department / IT providers, who you should contact immediately for their provision.

 

Please confirm whether you hold a physical file with details of my personal and / or financial information. If so, please provide details and dates of any instance when this file has left your control, to whom it has been communicated, the method of transportation / communication e.g. Royal Mail, courier, by hand, electronically. Please provide a full copy of this file Where my physical file has left your offices, please provide details of any precautions taken to ensure that my information has not been lost, stolen, misplaced or made available to anybody who does not have authorised access, including those who would use my information for the purposes of identity theft, or registered with any credit agencies. Please also confirm whether any of the documents held within the physical file are computer generated.

 

Under S.40 of The Administration of Justice Act 1970, if you believe you have provided my information to any organisation, agent, or individual who could, or may have used it for unlawful purposes, you should contact me immediately, and provide full details of their identification and address, together with full details of any instructions you have provided to them. If you have forwarded or communicated my personal or financial information to any person, company, or organisation, please provide a copy of the authority, signed and dated by myself upon which you have relied prior to doing so. As requested above, you should provide copies on any such communications.

 

Under the Data Protection Act 1984 / 1998, as a Data Controller, you are responsible for the complete retraction of all information provided to any third party, should I request you to do so, and have a duty to myself to ensure that any personal or financial information I have provided to you is kept securely, and is only communicated to those to whom I have given my express permission / authority.

 

If you are unable to deal with this request, you should immediately forward it to the person within your organisation responsible for Data Protection. If you do not provide the information requested within the given time limits (final date xx/xx/xx) under current Law, I shall have no choice but to forward all information to the information commissioners office.

 

....and wait for the reply:)))))

Regards and good luck

 

 

[needrevenge]

progenic7 vbmenu_register("postmenu_550742", true); wrote:

Craig,

 

all is not lost mate, but it depends really on the situation you were in at the time, was this done over the phone (or by any distance selling ?) or was it done face to face ?

if you feel that the insurance was sold under the impression it was a necessity rather than an option then you have a case. How well you argue that is down to you of course.

 

It was done over the phone, the contract was delivered by a courier who waited for us to sign them and then took them away leaving us a copy. I feel we were pressurised into signing quickly so courier could leave (you know what couriers are like!).

[needrevenge]

Thanks everyone,

 

I have drafted this letter, please can I have some feedback before I send.(especially on the paragraph in red at the bottom of the letter)

 

Customer Service Manager

Paragon Personal Finance Ltd.

St Catherine’s Court

Herbert Road

Solihull

West Midlands

B91 3QE

 

 

DATE

 

Data Protection Act 1998

Subject Access Request

 

Dear Sir/Madam

 

ACCOUNT NUMBER: xxxxxxxxxx

 

It would be grateful if you would provide the following: -

• Full copies of all contracts which you believe exist between myself and your organisation, including copies of any documents you hold in support of same.
  
• Details of the identity of any individuals or organisations who have provided you with my personal information together with copies of any letters of instruction provided by them, or any contracts entered into between yourselves and the third party, and the relevant dates to which those contracts related.
  
• Copies of all documents which include any of my personal information including copies of any contracts or invoices, emails or computer records containing my personal information, or any records which pertain to this information.
  
• Full details and copies of any documents upon which you relied when you have provided my personal or financial information to any individual, organisation or third party.
  
• Full copies or transcripts of any computer logs or database records kept in relation to myself or in relation to my financial or personal information.
  
• Full copies of any correspondence in postal, email or any other format which you have entered into with any individual, organisation or third party which contains my personal or financial information, or which pertains to myself.
  
• Details of all systems you currently have in place to ensure my personal or financial information is kept securely, including details of those officers who currently have control of same, and at the time it was held or provided to a third party.
  
• Where any previous information or records held have been deleted or disposed of, the methods used to do so, including dates, certificates or references confirming details of destruction. Where you are unable to provide such certificates, please provide a declaration, signed by an authorised officer of your company, confirming the dates and methods of destruction of this data.
  
• Full hard copy print outs of any of my personal or financial information held in a digital, magnetic or any other format which is held in any archives, backups or other storage devices / locations. And Audio files
  
• Your registration number with the Information Commissioners Office.
  
• Your Consumer Credit License number.
  
• Your VAT registration number.

Where reference to emails is given above, these emails should be taken from your email servers or backups / archives held in a magnetic or digital format. These emails may not be present on a user’s local system, and may require the assistance of your IT department / IT providers, who you should contact immediately for their provision.

 

Please confirm whether you hold a physical file with details of my personal and / or financial information. If so, please provide details and dates of any instance when this file has left your control, to whom it has been communicated, the method of transportation / communication e.g. Royal Mail, courier, by hand, electronically. Please provide a full copy of this file Where my physical file has left your offices, please provide details of any precautions taken to ensure that my information has not been lost, stolen, misplaced or made available to anybody who does not have authorised access, including those who would use my information for the purposes of identity theft, or registered with any credit agencies. Please also confirm whether any of the documents held within the physical file are computer generated.

 

Under S.40 of The Administration of Justice Act 1970, if you believe you have provided my information to any organisation, agent, or individual who could, or may have used it for unlawful purposes, you should contact me immediately, and provide full details of their identification and address, together with full details of any instructions you have provided to them. If you have forwarded or communicated my personal or financial information to any person, company, or organisation, please provide a copy of the authority, signed and dated by myself upon which you have relied prior to doing so. As requested above, you should provide copies on any such communications.

 

Under the Data Protection Act 1984 / 1998, as a Data Controller, you are responsible for the complete retraction of all information provided to any third party, should I request you to do so, and have a duty to myself to ensure that any personal or financial information I have provided to you is kept securely, and is only communicated to those to whom I have given my express permission / authority.

 

If you are unable to deal with this request, you should immediately forward it to the person within your organisation responsible for Data Protection.

 

I enclose the statutory maximum fee of £10. You have 40 days in which to comply. If you do not provide the information requested within the given time limits (final date xx/xx/xx) under current Law, I shall have no choice but to forward all information to the information commissioners office.

 

Furthermore, if I discover that I have been a victim of misrepresentation in respect to being sold PPI, then I shall be making a claim under the Misrepresentation Act. Also, If it is found that your nil refund policy upon early settlement is unfair and does not represent your actual costs in administering the PPI policy, a claim will be made under the Unfair Terms in Consumer Contracts Regulations 1999.

 

If there is specific information which you require in order to satisfy yourself as to my identity, please let me know by return. However, please note that the above address is the one which you normally use to communicate my private business to me and which you have hitherto found to be acceptable.

 

Yours faithfully,

[needrevenge]

As part of my SAR to Paragon, I would like to put the following to show my intentions;

 

Furthermore, if I discover that I have been a victim of misrepresentation in respect to being sold PPI, then I shall be making a claim under the Misrepresentation Act. Also, If it is found that your nil refund policy upon early settlement is unfair and does not represent your actual costs in administering the PPI policy, a claim will be made under the Unfair Terms in Consumer Contracts Regulations 1999

 

Does this read ok?

 

Many Thanks

 

Craig

[needrevenge]

SAR sent today, i'm looking forward to find out what information they have on how the PPI was sold to me when I took out the loan.

 

I took any mention of taking action against them out of the SAR as don't want to upset the applecart just yet.

 

Craig

[needrevenge]

I think i'll be claiming for being missold the PPI (which i'm concerned about as cannot recall the conversations when took out loan). However, I certainly would not have agreed to pay £8000 for PPI if I had been given the choice. It concerns me that it just covers my wife - this vaguely rings a bell.

 

The forms were completed beforehand (including PPI) for me to sign when courier brought them and took them away again (leaving me a copy)

 

It clearly states on contract the cost of PPI. Also would I have not had a cooling off period that I could have cancelled which would have allowed me plenty time to review the contract.

 

I was never made aware of the total cost or interest that would be added or it was not explained to me that it would all be lumped on at the beginning and was not cancellable. However, again, it clearly states this on the contract - this worries me.

 

Do I really have a case? - I will just have to wait till I get all the documentation from the SAR to see what I was actually told before signing this contract - Hopefully there will be no evidence of me being explained that it is optional, how it would work, what it would actually cost, whether I was made aware it only covered half the term of the loan and that it was not cancellable at all.

 

Also this loan was arranged through lmag1ne F/nance - do I need to SAR them as well (I think the only thing we signed was the contract from Parag0n)

 

Any comments - i'm not feeling very confident at the moment about this.

 

Craig

[reidnet]

Hi Craig,

you said that the loan was arranged through Imagine Finance, are they agents for Paragon ?.

 

If you set up the loan through Imagine Finance and the actual agreement came from Paragon, I would tend to go after Imagine Financial, they will have passed all the details etc to Paragon and this of course would include details of PPI etc. It is similar to my ongoing case against Ge Money / Purpleloans, they arranged a loan for me but the loan was actually provided by Firstplus. Firstplus simply acted on the Information thet GE had passed onto them. I have since cleared the Firstplus Loan and am fighting with GE over the Mis-Selling of PPI etc.

 

Hope that helps.. If not shout..

 

Ian

[needrevenge]

I've got the SAR ready to send to Parag0n. I think the phone calls were with lmagine and Paragon (can't really remember) - who do you think I should issue the SAR? I would think if the legal contract is with Parag0n, they should have all the details of the application?

 

Craig

[reidnet]

Yeah Paragon will have all the details on the actual Agreement, though the Information that they have re the Agreement could have been passed on from Imagine Financial.

[needrevenge]

SAR posted recorded today to Parag0n.... (i'm feeling impatient already!!!!)

 

Craig

[reidnet]

I know the feeling Craig..lol Ive been impatient with GE since October..lol Now Im losing my patience with them..

 

Ian

[needrevenge]

just spoken to Parag0n, as the policy was taken out through a broker, 1magine finance, I need to SAR them.

 

I have told Parag0n that I still want everything they have about me under the data protection act. They were trying to fob me off with giving me a copy of my original agreement and they would return the postal order for £10. I explianed that as I was going to take action the SAR route would be required.

 

C

[needrevenge]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Keith22

Hi,

 

I recovered a total of £5200 (two claims - business accounts with Lloyds TSB) via the FSO with no problems whatsoever. I have since recovered another £1000 for a third policy by dealing direct with Lloyds TSB and not involving the FSO. I believe there are quite a number of people who have had refunds via the FSO but unfortunately they don't post here. You generally only hear about those whose claims were turned down by the FSO. Unfortunately the FSO route is not an a totally easy option as you still have to make a written case with evidence BUT you won't be relying on legal precedents etc.

 

Great advice Keith - Cheers. I will attempt to make a case myself and challenge via FSO. If this fails then i'll just have to go legal.

 

Any advice, guidance on complaining via FSO? (Does the FSO cover Scotland too?)

 

 

I have looked at the FSO website and it does not appear to look at individual complaints, I have found this on the brokers website "Imagine Finance is a trading name of Park Financial Services Ltd, who are members of FISA. (Registered in England and Wales under number 3450432), Valley Road, Birkenhead, CH41 7ED. Licensed credit broker in accordance with Consumer Credit Act. Authorised and Regulated by the Financial Services Authority".

 

Should I complain to Imagine initially and copy in FISA?

 

C

[reidnet]

Hi,

I would complain to them and also to the FISA, but to be Honest I dont think the FISA have much balls so to speak, I complained to them re GE Money and to be honest it was a waste of paper and stamps. GE did not take any action when the FISA siad that they had talked to a seniors member of GE and that GE Would Contact me to try and resolve the matter..Did GE Contact me ..Did they Hell..

 

I suppose the more we raise complaints with these outfits and their so called regulating Organsations then the Issue of PPI may eventually come to a head.

 

Good Luck

 

Ian

[Keith22]

Hi Craig,

 

Once you have established your grounds for a complaint of misselling the next step is to download and fill in the form from the FSO. It is a simple document but you have to remember that the FSO decides on documentary evidence put before them - it is extremely unlikely that there will be any face to face discussions nor investigative procedures by them as this is not how it works. Your written complaint therefore has to be the best and most comprehensive you can manage and you have to try and anticipate all the angles that the Bank will put in their documentary submission. I'm no expert but I'm more than happy to help you and run my eye over anything if you wish.

 

 

Good luck

 

KH

[needrevenge]

Thanks Keith,

 

I really appreciate that.

 

I will have to wait 40 days or so while I wait for information being returned from the SAR to 1magine.

 

Craig