We want our money back Nat West *** WON ***

[katesage]

Hold tight Wem!

 

Natwest have a tendency to submit their defence at the 11th hour. I received mine on the very last day.

It's at this stage that they start making 'proper' partial offers (roughly half) which is really encouraging.

loads of luck mate and let us know......

[wemfish]

Thanks for the encouragement Kate.

 

 

Just opend MCOL and found this;

 

 

Claim Description bank charges

Claim Number #########

Status of this Claim Defence

You are unable to take any further action online on this claim.

 

The Defendant disputes the whole amount you have claimed. Your claim cannot proceed online and will be transferred to the appropriate court for continuation. You will receive confirmation to where the claim has been transferred to shortly.

 

 

What normally happens now, and how much longer does it normal take before they pay out??

[Michael Browne]

It is being transferred to your local court who will send you their defence and an AQ

[wemfish]

Hi all,

We received two letters today, one from Cobbetts and one from the Local Court, I gather from reading other cases on here that the CPR Part 18 is replied to with a “no I am not going to do this, it is intimidatory” letter, with a copy of the excel print out of charges, counter copied to the court. And that the court letter (allocation questionnaire) has to be fully complied with.

Do I understand this properly?

If so, can someone confirm this for me and if necessary put me on the right track?

Thank you for any help.

[Michael Browne]

Spot on:

 

Dear Sir or Madam:

 

Claim No: 1111111

 

I Acknowledge the receipt of the defence posted on behalf of National Westminster Bank plc.

 

I am not prepared at this stage to answer the CPR Part 18 Request. I anticipate that the claim will be allocated to the small claims track and would not then expect to have to deal with a Part 18 request since these are specifically excluded under Part 27 unless the court specifically orders me to do so of its own initiative

 

Furthermore I consider that the CPR part 18 request is intimidatory and I intend to bring the intimidation to the notice of the court.

 

However, for clarity, I confirm the charges I am claiming were applied to the following accounts:

 

Account numbers: 1111111 and 1111111

 

Sort Code: 11-11-11

 

 

Please also find enclosed a breakdown of all charges I am claiming. This schedule of charges was provided to National Westminster Bank in earlier correspondence, and is based on the information acquired from the Bank’s own records.

 

 

Yours sincerely

[wemfish]

Thank you Michael

 

I was searching the forums for that letter but could not find it.

 

I have found the Allocation Questionnaires - A guide to completion to help with that bit.

[wemfish]

I am just now filling in the allocation questionnaire, what have other claimants put in the “G – Other information” box?

Cheers for any help.

[Michael Browne]

You can request Standard Disclosure:

 

SECTION G STANDARD DISCLOSURE

I am respectfully requesting that my claim be allocated to the small claims track. This issue is not a complicated one; it is an issue of fact and not of law. The issue is only whether the money levied by the Defendant in respect of its customer’s contractual breaches exceed their actual costs incurred. I am happy to pay their actual costs and I am surprised the Defendant did not counterclaim for these, because I would have paid them without argument.

However, the continuing problem is, (in common with the 100s of other cases currently being brought by other bank customers), that the banks refuse to reveal the details of their penalty-charging regime. As the banks have a fiduciary duty towards their customers, they have a duty to deal straightforwardly and in utmost good faith.

Accordingly, I would respectfully ask that the court in this case, not withstanding allocation to the small claims track, order standard disclosure. I understand that it is in the courts discretion to do so. This would bring a rapid end, not only to this litigation, but would also likely bring an end to much of the litigation in progress against other high-street banks.

 

And/or refute their contention re: lack of particulars (amend to suit)

 

SECTION G OTHER INFORMATION

The defendant in its defence contends that this claim is not suitably particularised and the statement of claim is “embarrassing” and shows no reasonable grounds for the claim to be brought. The Claimant disagrees with this contention entirely. The claims particulars clearly state the statutory and common law provisions on which this claim relies, and the claimant will of course elaborate upon the claim particulars at such time as is required upon the direction of the court. Further, contrary to the contention of the defendant, the relevant numbers of the account in question were clearly identified in the claimant’s particulars of claim, and a full schedule of the charges which form the sum claimed from the defendant was sent to Northampton bulk court on the day of issue for inclusion alongside the claims particulars. Additionally, the defendant was served with this information on two occasions previously within a 28 day period allowed by the claimant to attempt to resolve the issue prior to the commencement of this litigation. For the sake of expediency, I have attached another copy of the schedule to this allocation questionnaire.

As is known to the defendant, I am a litigant in person in this case. It is respectfully submitted that the contentions of the defendant are highly likely to be an attempt to distress and intimidate, rather than presenting any valid or reasonable objections to the clarity of the Particulars of claim.

[wemfish]

Thankyou Michael, that's great.

[wemfish]

I have just this morning received a letter from Cobbett’s, offering me £1500. In their letter they also state;

“Upon consideration of your schedule of charges we note that you set out in your schedule charges that incurred between 7th June 2000 and 4th July 2000. Under the Limitation Act 1980, you cannot bring a claim more than 6 years after (before?) the date on which the cause of action accrued. You issued your claim on 22nd September 2006, as such, you cannot claim for the first 2 entries relating to charges on your schedule”

My reply (not yet sent, until someone can say its ok) is;

-----------------------------------------------

Dear Cobbett’s

Thank you for your letter dated 20th November 2006, I respectfully decline your offer of settlement and request, once again, that you return to me all charges imposed on this account, totalling £####.##

I will only accept the sum offered only as part settlement and on the clear understanding that I will continue to pursue recovery of the remainder with the County Court claim. Also I will not agree to your terms, it is me taking your client to court, and it is me or the court who will set any conditions, not you.

 

Your letter states that I cannot claim the first two charges, the 6 years starts when I first asked for my money back, not when the court process stated, there have also been more charges since the schedule was produced, I can of course add a claim for those as well. This would add approximately £140 to the total.

 

 

It is believed that you cannot go beyond six years because a reasonably diligent person could have known that penalty charges were unlawful all along, so it cannot be said that they just found out about it.

I would beg to differ.

 

While it is true that (however unlikely) I could have known that penalty charges are unlawful, I could not possibly have known that the banks charges were penalties. This is because:

 

A. The banks, to this day, keep the breakdown of their costs secret.

B. When asked for a breakdown, they will not tell reveal them

C. They say that their charges are not penalties.

 

For me, they key event was the OFT's statement earlier this year to the effect that they consider the banks charges to be excessive.

 

I trust this clarifies my position.

----------------------------------------

 

Does this look ok, or should I change it?

 

Thanks for any help.

 

[Michael Browne]

Seems fine to me.

[wemfish]

Thanks Michael

letter sent, hope that does the trick

[wemfish]

Hi all, I got a "notice of allocation to the small claims track (hearing)" in the post today.

It says;

1/Each party shall deliver to every other party, and to the court office copies of all documents on which he intends to rely at the hearing.

2/the copies shall be delivered to the court by 4pm on Wednesday, 13th December 2006

My question is, what am I supposed to send to the court and does the bank have to disclose there costs regarding fees at this point?

If so this is likely to be the end of the line for my claim as the banks wont reveal there fees and so should I get the money in the next three weeks?

[Deller]

You do seem to be getting close to a result now wemfish, but its still advisable to be prepared and send the info requested. See the link below for some assistance on this.

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/bank-templates-library/33060-basic-court-bundle.html

[wemfish]

Should I edit and send just the court bundle and I presume the schedule of charges. Anything else?

 

Can I add charges on my account since the court claim began??

[Deller]

 

Can I add charges on my account since the court claim began??

 

You can amend the amount of the claim anytime up until the point where you submit your claim through the courts, so in this case I'm afraid not.

 

Supply them with as much information to back up your claim as you can, treat it as though you are actually going to court (you wont be), and supply the evidence that you would use.

[wemfish]

One thing I am not sure about is that Cobbett’s have said that I cannot claim for the first 2 entries relating to charges on my schedule as they are outside the 6 year limit. Is this serious, or can I ignore it as intimidation.

[Deller]

They do try this on, they've stated the same in the defence on my claim. So long as the two entries fall in the 6 year timescale from when you sent your preliminary letter to the bank then you can ignore this.

[wemfish]

What about six years and one week for the first one? the second one is ok

[wemfish]

I am just at the moment filling in the court bundle

 

In the contents, there is a section, 'statements' I have hundreds of pages of statements,

 

Do I have to supply all the bank statements to the court and a copy to Cobbetts, as well as keeping a copy for myself? Or can I just delete that bit from the contents as the important information is covered in the schedule of charges?

[Michael Browne]

The statements are the proof that you have been charged the penalties listed in your schedule, so include the ones with charges on.

[wemfish]

I have a lot of photocopying to do then :o(

[wemfish]

Got a check in the post for the full amount WooHoo!! :D

 

 

As we are overdrawn about 2500, is it safe to pay the check in to the bank?? or will they just take the lot against the overdaft??

[wemfish]

Can a Moderator move this tread to the 'won' section please

 

 

Thankyou everyone for your support and help, its now on with the next account.

 

Is it worth sending a letter to cobbetts saying,

 

"we are about to start another claim, to save time, expense and trouble, why not just pay out now?"

[Deller]

A big Well Done, there's been a few payouts already this week.....where's mine!!

 

Is it worth sending a letter to cobbetts saying,

 

"we are about to start another claim, to save time, expense and trouble, why not just pay out now?"

 

I don't know if that will go down too well. LOL