Jump to content


  • Tweets

  • Posts

    • He was one of four former top executives from Sam Bankman-Fried's firms to plead guilty to charges.View the full article
    • The private submersible industry was shaken after the implosion of the OceanGate Titan sub last year.View the full article
    • further polished WS using above suggestions and also included couple of more modifications highlighted in orange are those ok to include?   Background   1.1  The Defendant received the Parking Charge Notice (PCN) on the 06th of January 2020 following the vehicle being parked at Arla Old Dairy, South Ruislip on the 05th of December 2019.   Unfair PCN   2.1  On 19th December 2023 the Defendant sent the Claimant's solicitors a CPR request.  As shown in Exhibit 1 (pages 7-13) sent by the solicitors the signage displayed in their evidence clearly shows a £60.00 parking charge notice (which will be reduced to £30 if paid within 14 days of issue).  2.2  Yet the PCN sent by the Claimant is for a £100.00 parking charge notice (reduced to £60 if paid within 30 days of issue).   2.3        The Claimant relies on signage to create a contract.  It is unlawful for the Claimant to write that the charge is £60 on their signs and then send demands for £100.    2.4        The unlawful £100 charge is also the basis for the Claimant's Particulars of Claim.  No Locus Standi  3.1  I do not believe a contract with the landowner, that is provided following the defendant’s CPR request, gives MET Parking Services a right to bring claims in their own name. Definition of “Relevant contract” from the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012, Schedule 4,  2 [1] means a contract Including a contract arising only when the vehicle was parked on the relevant land between the driver and a person who is-   (a) the owner or occupier of the land; or   (b) Authorised, under or by virtue of arrangements made by the owner or occupier of the land, to enter into a contract with the driver requiring the payment of parking charges in respect of the parking of the vehicle on the land. According to https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2006/46/section/44   For a contract to be valid, it requires a director from each company to sign and then two independent witnesses must confirm those signatures.   3.2  The Defendant requested to see such a contract in the CPR request.  The fact that no contract has been produced with the witness signatures present means the contract has not been validly executed. Therefore, there can be no contract established between MET Parking Services and the motorist. Even if “Parking in Electric Bay” could form a contract (which it cannot), it is immaterial. There is no valid contract.  Illegal Conduct – No Contract Formed   4.1 At the time of writing, the Claimant has failed to provide the following, in response to the CPR request from myself.   4.2        The legal contract between the Claimant and the landowner (which in this case is Standard Life Investments UK) to provide evidence that there is an agreement in place with landowner with the necessary authority to issue parking charge notices and to pursue payment by means of litigation.   4.3 Proof of planning permission granted for signage etc under the Town and country Planning Act 1990. Lack of planning permission is a criminal offence under this Act and no contract can be formed where criminality is involved.   4.4        I also do not believe the claimant possesses these documents.   No Keeper Liability   5.1        The defendant was not the driver at the time and date mentioned in the PCN and the claimant has not established keeper liability under schedule 4 of the PoFA 2012. In this matter, the defendant puts it to the claimant to produce strict proof as to who was driving at the time.   5.2 The claimant in their Notice To Keeper also failed to comply with PoFA 2012 Schedule 4 section 9[2][f] while mentioning “the right to recover from the keeper so much of that parking charge as remains unpaid” where they did not include statement “(if all the applicable conditions under this Schedule are met)”.     5.3         The claimant did not mention parking period, times on the photographs are separate from the PCN and in any case are that arrival and departure times not the parking period since their times include driving to and from the parking space as a minimum and can include extra time to allow pedestrians and other vehicles to pass in front.    Protection of Freedoms Act 2012   The notice must -   (a) specify the vehicle, the relevant land on which it was parked and the period of parking to which the notice relates;  22. In the persuasive judgement K4GF167G - Premier Park Ltd v Mr Mathur - Horsham County Court – 5 January 2024 it was on this very point that the judge dismissed this claim.  5.4  A the PCN does not comply with the Act the Defendant as keeper is not liable.  No Breach of Contract   6.1       No breach of contract occurred because the PCN and contract provided as part of the defendant’s CPR request shows different post code, PCN shows HA4 0EY while contract shows HA4 0FY. According to PCN defendant parked on HA4 0EY which does not appear to be subject to the postcode covered by the contract.  6.2         The entrance sign does not mention anything about there being other terms inside the car park so does not offer a contract which makes it only an offer to treat,  Interest  7.1  It is unreasonable for the Claimant to delay litigation for  Double Recovery   7.2  The claim is littered with made-up charges.  7.3  As noted above, the Claimant's signs state a £60 charge yet their PCN is for £100.  7.4  As well as the £100 parking charge, the Claimant seeks recovery of an additional £70.  This is simply a poor attempt to circumvent the legal costs cap at small claims.  7.5 Since 2019, many County Courts have considered claims in excess of £100 to be an abuse of process leading to them being struck out ab initio. An example, in the Caernarfon Court in VCS v Davies, case No. FTQZ4W28 on 4th September 2019, District Judge Jones-Evans stated “Upon it being recorded that District Judge Jones- Evans has over a very significant period of time warned advocates (...) in many cases of this nature before this court that their claim for £60 is unenforceable in law and is an abuse of process and is nothing more than a poor attempt to go behind the decision of the Supreme Court v Beavis which inter alia decided that a figure of £160 as a global sum claimed in this case would be a penalty and not a genuine pre-estimate of loss and therefore unenforceable in law and if the practice continued, he would treat all cases as a claim for £160 and therefore a penalty and unenforceable in law it is hereby declared (…) the claim is struck out and declared to be wholly without merit and an abuse of process.”  7.6 In Claim Nos. F0DP806M and F0DP201T, District Judge Taylor echoed earlier General Judgment or Orders of District Judge Grand, stating ''It is ordered that the claim is struck out as an abuse of process. The claim contains a substantial charge additional to the parking charge which it is alleged the Defendant contracted to pay. This additional charge is not recoverabl15e under the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012, Schedule 4 nor with reference to the judgment in Parking Eye v Beavis. It is an abuse of process from the Claimant to issue a knowingly inflated claim for an additional sum which it is not entitled to recover. This order has been made by the court of its own initiative without a hearing pursuant to CPR Rule 3.3(4)) of the Civil Procedure Rules 1998...''  7.7 In the persuasive case of G4QZ465V - Excel Parking Services Ltd v Wilkinson – Bradford County Court -2 July 2020 (Exhibit 4) the judge had decided that Excel had won. However, due to Excel adding on the £60 the Judge dismissed the case.  7.8        The addition of costs not previously specified on signage are also in breach of the Consumer Rights Act 2015, Schedule 2, specifically paras 6, 10 and 14.   7.9        It is the Defendant’s position that the Claimant in this case has knowingly submitted inflated costs and thus the entire claim should be similarly struck out in accordance with Civil Procedure Rule 3.3(4).   In Conclusion   8.1        I invite the court to dismiss the claim.  Statement of Truth  I believe that the facts stated in this witness statement are true. I understand that proceedings for contempt of court may be brought against anyone who makes, or causes to be made, a false statement in a document verified by a statement of truth without an honest belief in its truth.   
    • Well the difference is that in all our other cases It was Kev who was trying to entrap the motorist so sticking two fingers up to him and daring him to try court was from a position of strength. In your case, sorry, you made a mistake so you're not in the position of strength.  I've looked on Google Maps and the signs are few & far between as per Kev's MO, but there is an entrance sign saying "Pay & Display" (and you've admitted in writing that you knew you had to pay) and the signs by the payment machines do say "Sea View Car Park" (and you've admitted in writing you paid the wrong car park ... and maybe outed yourself as the driver). Something I missed in my previous post is that the LoC is only for one ticket, not two. Sorry, but it's impossible to definitively advise what to so. Personally I'd probably gamble on Kev being a serial bottler of court and reply with a snotty letter ridiculing the signage (given you mentioned the signage in your appeal) - but it is a gamble.  
    • No! What has happened is that your pix were up-to-date: 5 hours' maximum stay and £100 PCN. The lazy solicitors have sent ancient pictures: 4 hours' maximum stay and £60 PCN. Don't let on!  Let them be hoisted by their own lazy petard in the court hearing (if they don't bottle before).
  • Our picks

    • If you are buying a used car – you need to read this survival guide.
      • 1 reply
    • Hello,

      On 15/1/24 booked appointment with Big Motoring World (BMW) to view a mini on 17/1/24 at 8pm at their Enfield dealership.  

      Car was dirty and test drive was two circuits of roundabout on entry to the showroom.  Was p/x my car and rushed by sales exec and a manager into buying the mini and a 3yr warranty that night, sale all wrapped up by 10pm.  They strongly advised me taking warranty out on car that age (2017) and confirmed it was honoured at over 500 UK registered garages.

      The next day, 18/1/24 noticed amber engine warning light on dashboard , immediately phoned BMW aftercare team to ask for it to be investigated asap at nearest garage to me. After 15 mins on hold was told only their 5 service centres across the UK can deal with car issues with earliest date for inspection in March ! Said I’m not happy with that given what sales team advised or driving car. Told an amber warning light only advisory so to drive with caution and call back when light goes red.

      I’m not happy to do this, drive the car or with the after care experience (a sign of further stresses to come) so want a refund and to return the car asap.

      Please can you advise what I need to do today to get this done. 
       

      Many thanks 
      • 81 replies
    • Housing Association property flooding. https://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/topic/438641-housing-association-property-flooding/&do=findComment&comment=5124299
      • 161 replies
    • We have finally managed to obtain the transcript of this case.

      The judge's reasoning is very useful and will certainly be helpful in any other cases relating to third-party rights where the customer has contracted with the courier company by using a broker.
      This is generally speaking the problem with using PackLink who are domiciled in Spain and very conveniently out of reach of the British justice system.

      Frankly I don't think that is any accident.

      One of the points that the judge made was that the customers contract with the broker specifically refers to the courier – and it is clear that the courier knows that they are acting for a third party. There is no need to name the third party. They just have to be recognisably part of a class of person – such as a sender or a recipient of the parcel.

      Please note that a recent case against UPS failed on exactly the same issue with the judge held that the Contracts (Rights of Third Parties) Act 1999 did not apply.

      We will be getting that transcript very soon. We will look at it and we will understand how the judge made such catastrophic mistakes. It was a very poor judgement.
      We will be recommending that people do include this adverse judgement in their bundle so that when they go to county court the judge will see both sides and see the arguments against this adverse judgement.
      Also, we will be to demonstrate to the judge that we are fair-minded and that we don't mind bringing everything to the attention of the judge even if it is against our own interests.
      This is good ethical practice.

      It would be very nice if the parcel delivery companies – including EVRi – practised this kind of thing as well.

       

      OT APPROVED, 365MC637, FAROOQ, EVRi, 12.07.23 (BRENT) - J v4.pdf
        • Like

shagtastic v nationwide story upto MCOL so far..***WON***


style="text-align: center;">  

Thread Locked

because no one has posted on it for the last 6186 days.

If you need to add something to this thread then

 

Please click the "Report " link

 

at the bottom of one of the posts.

 

If you want to post a new story then

Please

Start your own new thread

That way you will attract more attention to your story and get more visitors and more help 

 

Thanks

Recommended Posts

Hi all,

 

I'm new here and have already received invaluable advise from chloe jane regarding MCOL amongst other things. I can understand why a lot of people prefer to go to court the 'old fashioned way' as MCOL can be really daunting and there is no way i would have filled it all in correctly had i not come here for advise first...Also the link CJ gave me explaining the MCOL procedure was fantastic. I would have easily overlooked the fact i needed to send 2 copies of a schedule of my charges to the court before the claim is served had i not read that.

 

Also the templates are fantastic too..thankyou so much.

 

I just wanted to pick your brains regarding the legality of banks/building societies closing accounts after settling in court. I read a thread on moneyexpert which stated that nationwide (who one of my claims is against) told someone that as they are not abiding by T & C's of contract they will be closing the account in 28 days...do they haveto give you 28 days notice or can they just close the account when they please. I have a £1000 O/D with my nationwide account and have opened a parachute account with alliance and leicester but with no O/D as due to unforseen circumstances (ie. ex husband emigrating and no longer paying child support) my budgeting has gone up the swanny and i have gone slightly over my O/D by a £ or 3 and the A & L state that you haveto have at least 2 days a month in credit which i do and also stay within your O/D limit which unfortunatly for the last 3 months i've tipped it by a couple of quid for a day each month so dont really want to activate the acc til i can get the O/D sorted...which i will monitor meticulously for june ( yes i've already buggered up may).

 

hope someone can advise

 

 

many thanks

 

 

shaz

Link to post
Share on other sites

HI Shaz

 

CJ is fab and i am not surprised she has given you lots of great info!

 

With regards to the threat of closure, any Bank can close your account if you do not abide by the T&C, and usually it is 28 days notice. HOWEVER they cannot close your account as retaliation. The Financial Ombudsman Service frown on this and will take action if you find this is the case. Have a look at this link which will give you a clearer picture BBC NEWS | Programmes | Moneybox | Bank account closures criticised

 

If you find this happens to you (although I doubt it will as Banks are aware of cases being taken to FOS) then we will help with you making a complaint to FOS

 

Hope this helps

 

Link to post
Share on other sites

great thanks for that!

 

Can i ask a really dumb question? I'm trying to get to grips with the abbreviations on the threads..one that has stumped me is LBA? its probably really obvious but my brain is slowly turning to mush with all the info!

 

thanks again

 

shaz

Link to post
Share on other sites

letter before action...ask any question you have we all started somewhere, but a great thing for it is search...type into there and you may find the question has already been asked. Also check out http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/welcome-our-forum/69359-cant-find-what-youre.html

 

absolutely fantasic!!

 

Link to post
Share on other sites

Title is self explanatory really!

 

Just wondered if anyone had actually won compensation...Is it true that banks/BS are less likely to close accounts now?

 

I was reading a thread on moneyexpert about someone who had won in court and got their charges back but during the court process their account had incurred more charges so they started a new claim with the BS who then wrote to them and basically said 'you cant have a free account and if you try and reclaim again we are going to close your account'

 

As it was only £60 they didnt bother,but surely the whole point of this excercise is that the charges they are charging are too high?? If the banks/BS haven't learnt that lesson after having to repay charges then thats their problem surely?

 

All they need to do is reduce charges to be realistic and fair!

 

shaz

Link to post
Share on other sites

Guest louis wu

Hello,

 

Yes, some people have had accounts closed, but it doesn't seem to happen as much now.

 

If you are claiming, and concerned, then you should look at opening another account

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/welcome-our-forum/58685-do-you-need-parachute.html

 

At the end of the day, if they want to play games like that, would you want to continue banking with them anyway.

 

Louis

Link to post
Share on other sites

HI Shaz

 

There has been a few accounts closed but the financial Ombudsman Services do not take this retaliatory action lightly. One case we know about (link here) BBC NEWS | Programmes | Moneybox | Bank account closures criticised

 

However i wouldnt worry too much about it as I think the banks realise that consumers will not put up with this and will make a complaint to the FOS

 

Link to post
Share on other sites

24/2/07 request S.A.R - (Subject Access Request) (received statements within 40 days sent special delivery)

 

4/4/07 sent letter to nationwide requesting payment of £721 (without interest added)

 

15/4/07 received letter back saying ...eh...na (dated 13/4/07)

 

30/4/07 sent LBA to respond within 14 days

 

16/05/07 claim issued MCOL this time i added the statutory interest for each charge so total claim is now £981.86 plus court costs of £80.00. (claim will be served on 21/5/07 they have until 4/6/07 to respond)

 

16/5/07 posted 2 schedules of charges with the template letter to court to attach to claim and send with claim when served to nationwide

 

17/5/07 received another letter from nationwide saying sorry but we still not giving you your money. Really..didn't see that coming....

 

 

anyway, thats me so far on this particular claim.

 

 

thanks for looking and wish me luck!

Link to post
Share on other sites

24/2/07 request S.A.R (received statements within 40 days sent special delivery by nationwide!)

 

4/4/07 sent letter to nationwide requesting payment of £721 (without interest added)

 

15/4/07 received letter back saying ...eh...na (dated 13/4/07)

 

30/4/07 sent LBA to respond within 14 days

 

16/05/07 claim issued MCOL this time i added the statutory interest for each charge so total claim is now £981.86 plus court costs of £80.00. (claim will be served on 21/5/07 they have until 4/6/07 to respond)

 

Also posted 2 copies of schedule of my charges to the court with the template covering letter asking to attached to claim when served.(very important!)

 

17/5/07 received another letter from nationwide saying sorry but we still not giving you your money. Really..didn't see that coming....

 

 

anyway, thats me so far on this particular claim.

 

 

thanks for looking and wish me luck!

 

nb...sorry i posted this twice by mistake..this is the correct post though as i meant to edit the other one to add the fact i sent schedule of charges but appeared to duplicate post!

Link to post
Share on other sites

They will no doubt defend the claim but do not panic.

 

They did this with my claim and then they sent me a letter about a week after in which they repaid all of my charges,court costs and interest.

 

So stick with it-it will all turn out ok in the end.

PPMAN159

 

If this comment has helped please click on the scales.

Link to post
Share on other sites

quick question. Sent MCOL off on Mon night, put in the notes about interest but forgot to add it on my claim. Not to bothered about the amount but am worried that it may ruin my chances due to incompetence.

Nationwide - S.A.R sent 3/1/07

Statements receieved 01/02/07

Pre Lim sent 10/02/07

LBA sent 25/02/07

MCOL Submitted 14/05/2007

Case Closed - Won from NW 14/06/2007

 

 

Lloyds TSB -

Prelim sent 30/04/07

LBA Sent 15/05/07

 

OHs Lloyds TSB

Pre Lim Sent 30/04/07

LBA Sent 15/05/07

 

T-Mobile - Prelim sent 8/1/07 **WON** 18/1/07

 

 

Capital One - Prelim sent 10/01/07

Offer letter receieved 29/01/07

Link to post
Share on other sites

Hi all,

 

I posted the following on the MBNA board but no-one has responded and am a bit anxious now!

 

can anyone advise?

 

 

shaz

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

hiya,

 

i was just reading through a post below..sorry cant remember who it is now...:-|

 

but when i requested the S.A.R from MBNA they just sent me a list of all the charges which they levied to my account..after reading the above post i read that this list is insufficient in court! and i should have had statements..problem is i've started MCOL last week (see my post below)

 

Have i buggered it up for myself now? The list MBNA snet does state what each charge was for..the date etc..why would the court not accept this?

 

When i sent off the schedule of charges to be served with my claim i just sent it in my own format which i created on my pc which obviously had all the info so surely this is what the courts will have to peruse?

 

 

help!

 

just checked-it was jw-v-mbna thread

Link to post
Share on other sites

after filing my claim through MCOL i sent a copy of my schedule of charges to the court but just realised i put the amount on the letter without adding the 8% interest which was on the POC.

 

have i buggered it up?

 

will they take the amount on the POC as being the amount or the letter to the court?

 

should i send another letter to the court?

 

 

 

thanks

Link to post
Share on other sites

I've just checked details of my claim, if i can just tell you what i've done...hope i haven't buggered it up.

 

With the nationwide POC on the ...return of the amounts debited..i put £721.. this is the amount of charges without adding the 8% interest then on the next bit where it says 8% interest i put £260.86 whcih is 8% interest upto date of claim for all the charges. I never put in the grand total on POC just the 2 seperate amounts. Except where it says amount claimed the grand total is there(grand total is 981.86)

 

On the attached schedule of charges it shows each individual charge, what its for, then statutory interest for each charge, then total amount at bottom. this is all the same as whats on the POC.

 

I believe the mistake i made was i should have put toital amount debited at 981.86 then added on a further 8% interest on the POC..is that right?

 

Please tell me i haven't mucked it up!

 

I've also claimed for MBNA but in total amount debited on POC i put charges plus interest then added on the further 8% but the schedule of charges just shows the charges and 8% interest on charges. Not the court amount of 8%

 

Which is the right way?

Link to post
Share on other sites

I've just realised i've made a mistake on my nationwide MCOL POC!

 

for the amount debited in the POC i put the total of charges without the 8% interest and in the next bit i just put the interest for the charges upto the date of the claim. I realsie now i should have put the total of both amounts in the first bit then added the extra 8%!

 

Can i amend the claim? its due to be served tomotrrow i think

 

pls advise!

Link to post
Share on other sites

Yes you can amend a claim, but it will cost £35 which is non returnable.

 

You will need to fill in the N244 form.

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/bank-templates-library/41901-form-n244-application-notice.html

  • Haha 1

HOW TO...DUMMIES GUIDE TO CAG...Read here

STEP BY STEP GUIDE...Read here

F&Q's... Read here

EVERYTHING YOU NEED THE A~Z GUIDE...Read here

 

Go to our Cag Toolbar Download page here

 

Please don't forget this site is run on DONATIONS If this site has helped in any way, then please give a little back. ;-)

Any opinions are without prejudice & without liability. All I know has come from this site. If you are unsure, please seek professional advice. .

Link to post
Share on other sites

24/2/07 request S.A.R - (Subject Access Request) (received statements within 40 days sent special delivery)

 

4/4/07 sent letter to nationwide requesting payment of £721 (without interest added)

 

15/4/07 received letter back saying ...eh...na (dated 13/4/07)

 

30/4/07 sent LBA to respond within 14 days

 

16/05/07 claim issued MCOL this time i added the statutory interest for each charge so total claim is now £981.86 plus court costs of £80.00. (claim will be served on 21/5/07 they have until 4/6/07 to respond)

 

16/5/07 posted 2 schedules of charges with the template letter to court to attach to claim and send with claim when served to nationwide

 

17/5/07 received another letter from nationwide saying sorry but we still not giving you your money. Really..didn't see that coming....

 

update

 

21/5/07 claim has been acknowledged by nationwide (very quick!) i assume i now wait til i have received the notice of acknowledgement from the courts then i send schedule of charges to nationwide solicitors?

Link to post
Share on other sites

I know i've done this correctly now but my confusion is with MBNA and CAP 1 MCOL applictions....I requested O/D int with both of these in my PL and LBA (i didn't with nationwide until i started MCOL) so according to the guidance notes on here below...

 

 

...return of the amounts debited of £XXXX; - This is the total of your charges, plus the overdraft interest if you are reclaiming these.

 

...S.69 County Courts Act of 8% - £xxx - This is the total of the 8% interest calculated by the spreadsheets on our site. Enter the total at the date of the court claim.

 

 

i put the total amount plus o/d int in the first bit then added on another 8% to the first amount in the second bit in th POC for mbna and cap 1

 

have i misunderstood the above notes?

Link to post
Share on other sites

Hello shagtastic!

...21/5/07 claim has been acknowledged by nationwide (very quick!) i assume i now wait til i have received the notice of acknowledgement from the courts then i send schedule of charges to nationwide solicitors?
U seem to have at least TWO parallel Threads for the same Claim???...

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/nationwide/91749-help-pls-different-amount.html

 

U will get confusing/misleading advice unless U just keep to one Thread as others who post on your Threads may have NOT read about your WHOLE circumstances etc etc.

Link to post
Share on other sites

???...Where does ANY Bank have an O/D Interest Rate of 8% APR???

 

I'm sorry if my misunderstanding of this is so incredulous to you but i am new to all this and some things are difficult for a novice like me, to get my head around.

 

I obviously don't have the insight to these matters as you do..but thankyou for making me feel i little bit more stupid about it now!

Link to post
Share on other sites

  • Recently Browsing   0 Caggers

    • No registered users viewing this page.

  • Have we helped you ...?


×
×
  • Create New...