'Tish vs Abbey'

[adamc6671]

Hi All. I'm in the process of taking on Abbey for my 'other half' (Tish). Its quite a story so far, so here goes!

 

She has 2 a/c's with Abbey, one of which has been referred to 'Debt Management & Collection Services, and latterly 'Equidebt Limited', for recovery of £405 (made up only of charges!) and to which she now has no access other than to make monthly payments into to clear the debt. The other a/c has a zero balance & we have been trying to get Abbey to close since last October but all they do is bounce her between Branch and HQ and still a/c is not closed. Saw Branch manager today and filled in another form to close the a/c. QUESTION - does anyone know if its Abbey policy to keep an a/c open if you're trying to reclaim charges? My feeling is that if she has no open a/c with Abbey the only way they can pay settlements etc is by cheque rather than her trying to extract money from Abbey a/c's that are no longer used (she now has a/c at another bank).

 

Story so far - sent SAR last June and went through the usual v. long battle over microfiches etc and finally got statements late Feb this year. At same time as SAR, sent initial request for repayment of just over £2,000 in charges taken over only 14 months on one of the a/c's - only result was usual fob-offs etc etc. Did 2nd letter mid-Jan, but again only fob-offs. Did 3rd letter early Feb '07 making 'without prejudice' offer stating she would accept this ammount in order to avoid full claim for all charges on both a/c's, which were expected to exceed £4,000. Again nothing but fob-offs. Statements finally arrive late Feb. One a/c shows £3,100 taken in charges and the other £430. Did full spreadsheets for both a/c's, including 8% stat interest. Sent LBA to Milton Keynes address 16th March (recorded delivery), enclosing spreadsheets and claiming over £3,500 and stating if cheque for full ammount not recieved by 5th April, claim will be filed at Court for this ammount, plus £680 stat interest (to date), plus Court fees, plus minimum of 22 hours of (my) time at £20 per hour, making at least £4,700. Finished letter of with 'for the avoidance of doubt' statement regarding ammounts, timescales, and dates. Does this all sound OK, especially doing 2 a/c's on one claim .

 

Must admit, getting worried now that time for filing claim is getting v. close!!!!!!!!!!!!! Having said that, have spent literally dozens of hours reading CAG site, and others, so am probably fairly well up to speed. Biggest worry is getting Court 'bundle' together - seems to be reams of it!

 

By the way - hugely grateful to 'teebum' for his thread - VERY helpful, and very encouraging!

[adamc6671]

Still no reply to the following question from the above thread -

 

QUESTION - does anyone know if its Abbey policy to keep an a/c open if you're trying to reclaim charges? My feeling is that if she has no open a/c with Abbey the only way they can pay settlements etc is by cheque rather than her trying to extract money from Abbey a/c's that are no longer used (she now has a/c at another bank).

 

Does anyone have any thoughts on this please - is it better to have an a/c open with Abbey whilst taking them on, or are we OK with no open a/c? Any thoughts would be greatly appreciated.

[Mad Nick]

Hi, I don't think it makes the slightest difference to how they'll treat your claim. Regards, Mad Nick

[Gez]

Wether you keep the account open or close it, it makes no difference to the reclaiming process whatsoever. The only change will be in how you are paid. Usually if the account is open they will deposit the money there, if it is closed they will pay by cheque. Either way, you WILL get paid.

[adamc6671]

Thanks Nik & Gez, both for the help & the encouragement! Would much rather have a cheque, so we'll keep pushing Abbey to close the a/c - wether they will or not remains to be seen - been trying to close it since last Oct!

[julied1]

Thanks for your reply on my thread, I will keep watching yours.

[adamc6671]

HELP PLEASE -

 

I'm filling in the N1 Claim form for this claim, and wish to claim for time in preparing the claim (as others have successfully done), and for expenses such as postage, photocopying etc. I have done a simple spreadsheet for these ammounts, and put the total in the 'Value' section. In Section 5 (Accordingly the Claimant claims) I have put -

 

d)the return of costs and expenses incurred in preparing this claim in the sum of £479.00, for which a schedule is attached.

 

Can someone tell me please if this is OK, and if not how do I go about claiming these expenses which I see others have successfully done.

 

MANY thanks. :confused:

[Mad Nick]

Hi, costs are not normally awarded in small claims (only if the other party behaves totally irresponsibly. Isn't that what Banks are doing - I wouldn't go there). Instead, as part of Judgement or settlement you can claim £9.25 per hr for preparing your Court Bundle, and since Abbey only seem to settle once you've submitted one, just make sure that you include enough hours (if you know what I mean !) in your phone/letter haggle with Abbey prior to Court. But don't put it on your N1. Regards, Mad Nick

[adamc6671]

Hi Nick - hugely grateful - many thanks. Will ammend the N1 before submitting - didn't understand how people were doing it. Once again, many thanks - will give you a click for that one!

[adamc6671]

Hi All. No response at all from Abbey to our LBA which has now expired - have therefore filed claim at local County Court this morning - very nervous now (!!!!!!!!), but hopefully will win in the end!

 

Have been looking very closely at the next stage - the AQ - and as a result am a bit unsure about one area of the form - could someone HELP please??? :confused: As far as I understand it, I put in ( or attach to) Section G (Other Information) a draft Order for Directions, and a request for the Judge to allow me to speak for my other half as her 'Lay Representative' should it come to actually having to go into Court. Is this correct, and is there anything else I should be putting in that Section?

 

Many thanks, in anticipation.

[adamc6671]

Have been looking very closely at the next stage - the AQ - and as a result am a bit unsure about one area of the form - could someone HELP please??? :confused: As far as I understand it, I put in ( or attach to) Section G (Other Information) a draft Order for Directions, and a request for the Judge to allow me to speak for my other half as her 'Lay Representative' should it come to actually having to go into Court. Is this correct, and is there anything else I should be putting in that Section?

 

Many thanks, in anticipation.

 

Can anyone help with this please?

[Karish]

Hi. I attached the draft order for directions to my allocation questionnaire. There is a section entitled New Strategy for allocation questionnaires on this site that is very useful. Good Luck

 

Karish

[adamc6671]

Hi Karish - many thanks for the reply. I have read the 'New Strategy', but I'm actually looking for specific advice, as above, on what I actually need to put in Section G of the AQ!

 

Once again, many thanks - Adam

[adamc6671]

Hi All - starting to feel very lonely now!!! - is there anyone who can answer my question about AQ Section G, as in posts 10 and 11 (above) PLEEEESE? Many thanks - Adam.

[noobrider]

you should put something like this

 

You should state here that you believe the case will last no longer than 1 hour.

 

You may wish to add reasons why the case is more suitable for Small Claims Track if your claim value exceeds £5,000 or provide reasoning why the other side should provide evidence of their costs!

 

We recommend that include a request for the Judge to order a form of 'basic' disclosure from the bank. Many courts have now started to issue these, so the request is likely to have been seen by your Judge before.

 

A small note explaining its intended use would help. Do not make this too lengthy, just explain that it has been attached for consideration and you believe it will bring a speedy end to Litigation. State that it was devised by the Mercantile Courts for a similar case.

 

and also state that you are acting on behalf of someone. Also attach the draft directions and make reference to them in this section

[adamc6671]

Cheers, and MANY thanks, Noobrider - hugely appreciated. Have read your first claim thread, and picked up much useful info from that - hope ours doesn't get that complicated, but hopefully I'm well prepared if it does!

[noobrider]

No problem, my first claim was a nightmare one but mainly around the circumstances that were affecting me personally rather than the case itself. On My second and even larger claim at the moment with more confidence than I really deserve.

[adamc6671]

I'm sure you deserve every bit of confidence - you know exactly where you're going, viz the help you've given me! Will watch your 2nd thread with great interest.

[adamc6671]

Hi All - just an update on progress. Letter from Court that Claim was deemed to be served on 19th April. That was followed by Notice from the Court that Abbey filed an 'Acknowledgement of Service' on 23rd April indicating an intention to defend all the claim, and that they have 28 days from date of service (19th April) to file a defence.

 

This seems pretty standard stuff as far as I can see, apart from the (remarkably?) quick time in which they filed their acknowledgement! Can anyone see any ulterior motive in Abbey filing that quickly?

 

One more quick question - Am I right in assuming that Abbey will probably take all the 28 days (or maybe more!) to file their defence, and that the AQ (if the Judge chooses to request it) will be issued after the defence is filed?????

 

Many thanks - Adam

[adamc6671]

Hi All

 

I've just read, with great interest, Bankfodder's announcement (at the top of this forum) about 'Wasted Costs Orders'.

 

Quote -

 

". . . .. Although banks almost always file a defence, these defences are sham and it is clear that the banks have no intention of going to court.

The pressure put on legitimate claimants and the court system is enormous. This style of litigation is vexatious in that it causes a drain upon the public resource and it frustrates justice. . . ."

 

He goes on to say that CAG now recommend applying to the Court for one of these orders, after the bank settle just before the Court date, in order to formally recoup all the costs involved in putting together a claim that the bank had no actual intention of defending in Court.

 

My question is this -

 

Does anyone think it would be worthwhile informing the bank before Court action starts, that if they don't settle before the claim is issued, then file a defence and force you all the way to the Court door, as it were, before settling, that you will apply to the Court for a 'Wasted Costs Order' against them on the grounds stated in Bankfodder's announcement?

 

What does anyone think?

[julied1]

Hi Adam

 

I personally think this is a great idea. It may make the banks settle quicker without anyone havng to go through the daunting process of filing at court (not that I've actually got to that stage with any of my claims ........yet!) It would be nice if someone could draft a template to this effect because if everyone was using the same letter the banks might just get the message,

 

Regards

Julie:)

[dennisjackie]

Intresting when I saw it I wanderd the same thing, am about to send in a prelim request to capatal One for a small amount about £350. I cant see it doing any harm may be I should try it someone has to.

[adamc6671]

Hi Julie & 'DJ' - many thanks for the replies and encouragement!

 

Julie - not sure how to ask someone to do a template, but agree that it would be a good idea!

 

'DJ' - Would be great to see someone try it - bit late for me now as claim is issued, but will try it if they file a defence, which they almost certainly will! Would suggest that you try it at the LBA stage rather than prelim.

 

All the best - Adam.

[dennisjackie]

Adam,

 

May be we should move this to the thread you started about it?

 

I Will try it will be sending first request for repayment on monday. so will do it at the LBA stage 2 weeks monday unless they pay up in 14 days LOL

 

Dennis

[adamc6671]

Quite agree, and quite happy for this chunk of 'Tish vs Abbey' to be moved to my other thread in the 'General' forum. Problem is I've no idea how to do that - perhaps a Mod can help?

 

Also - Julie - I've had some thoughts about a template letter, which I've pasted a draft of below. However I'm NOT an expert in these things, so I'm NOT posting it for actual use, but am doing so for the consideration of those that have far more knowledge and experience of these things than I do. Would therefore be very grateful if someone in that position could cast their eyes over it - many thanks.

 

QUOTE -

 

 

Your Name & Address

 

 

 

Banks Name & Address

 

 

Date

 

 

 

 

Account Number xxxxxxxxxxx

 

 

 

Dear Sir or Madam

 

With reference to my request for the refund of the charges you have applied to my account, I wish to inform you of the following.

 

Should you fail to refund the charges you have levied upon my account, and thereby oblige me to issue a claim against you in the County Court for which you subsequently file a defence and thereafter settle the claim without appearing in Court, I will request the Court to issue a Wasted Costs Order against you. This would be to the value of all the costs I incur, including my time, in preparing the claim from the date of my Letter Before Action (DD/MM/YYYY) up to and including the date of settlement. I would in that case request the Order on the basis that in this case, and in many other cases that I can quote, that you apparently never had the intention of defending in Court thereby wasting the very valuable resources of both the Court and myself, and in doing so you have frustrated justice. I believe that would be unreasonable behaviour in litigation on your part, and that it could be seen as an abuse of the Court process.

 

I look forward to your early settlement of my claim.

 

Yours faithfully

 

 

 

xxxxxxxxxxx

 

 

 

Once again, this is NOT intended for actual use. It is intended only for the considetation of those with far more knowledge and experience than me to suggest whether or not we're doing the right thing!

 

Having said all that, hope it helps - Adam.