Hi Remember Me? Youngs Vs Lloyds TSB

[Bev77]

bump

[BARTY]

Hi

I would give them a ring.

Barty:)

[Bev77]

Well apparently there were a batch of Notice of Issues that went out with the wrong dates on them. I rang MCOL and they said they'd be sending another one out, but still haven't received it yet, although I did manage to get the correct dates from them.

 

I've received Notice that Acknowledgement of Service has been filed this morning. LTSB have 28 days from the date of service to respond. the date of service was 2nd May, does that make it 30th May? Or is it 28 working days, I can't remember?

 

Now I should send a copy of the claim details to SC&M, to the address on the Acknowledgement of Service? Is that correct?

 

Getting nervous now, especially as the claim is in my husbands name, and I'm the one dealing with it all. I just know at some point I'm not going to be allowed to go any further and he'll have to take over, but frankly, he hasn't got a clue!

 

Also, do I send just the schedule of charges or the one with the 8% on as well?

[BARTY]

Hi

It's 28 calender days. Yes send another copy of your schedule with the 8% on to SC&M, the address is:

Sechiari, Clark & Mitchell

Department SO

PO Box 499

Lower Ground Floor

1-5 Queens Road Quadrant

Brighton

East Sussex

BN1 3XJ

 

Barty:)

[Bev77]

Thanks once again. That's the same address as is on the form.

[Bev77]

Well, I've received Notice of Transfer of Proceedings this morning.

 

Lloyds are defending and have 3 pages worth to their defence! But the Judge at Northampton CC, has dismissed the need for an AQ, is this normal?

 

I'll type the letter in it's entirety. Be warned, it'll be long.

 

To all parties

 

 

A defence to this claim has been filed.

 

The claim has been transferred to the court covering the area where the claimant lives or carries on business.

 

Please read the accompanying documents carefully and note that the allocation questionnaire should be returned to the XXXXXXX County Court.

 

All further communication should be addressed to:- My court address

 

NORTHAMPTON COUNTY COURT

 

 

Between

YOUNG

And

Lloyds TSB

 

In the County Court: XXXXXXX

Court Code: XXX

 

Before District Judge MXXXXXX

 

Sitting at Northampton County Court

 

Without hearing

 

IT IS ORDERED THAT:-

 

1. The filing of an allocation questionnaire be dispensed with in this case unless the District judge at the court of transfer orders otherwise. **

Note: Any party affected by this Order may under Rule 3.3 (5) apply to have it set aside, varied or stayed. Such a party must apply under Rule 23.3 within 14 days of service of this order.

 

** Please note that an allocation fee may be payable in this instance. Please contact the court of transfer for further details.

Date order drawn: 18 May 2007.

 

GD

 

 

Defence and Counterclaim (specified amount)

 

 

1. I dispute the full amount claimed as shown on the claim form.

2. Do you dispute this claim because you have already paid it? No

3. Defence

1. The defendant Lloyds TSB Bank plc ‘’the Bank’’ is a Bank whose registered office is 25 Gresham Street, London, EC2V 7HN. It is admitted that the Claimant has been a customer of the Bank at all material times.

2. By opening an account with the Bank, the customer enters into a commercial arrangement with the Bank for the provision of banking services. The Bank is entitled, as part of that arrangement, to charge for those services. At account opening a customer is provided with details of the Bank’s charges, currently in a leaflet a guide to our banking charges. By using the account, the customer acknowledges that the charges are incorporated into the contract. For personal customers, a number of services are provided for free, notwithstanding that they are an expense to the Bank. Such services presently include, but are not limited to, providing; cheques, bank statements, the facility to make payments by direct debit and standing order, debit cards, ATMs ‘’cash machines’’.

3. By maintaining the account in credit, or within any limit agreed with the Bank, the customer may avoid most if not all charges. If the customer fails to ensure that there are sufficient cleared funds in the account to cover payments, whether by cheque, debit card, standing order or direct debit, the customer makes a request for a payment to be made form the bank’s own funds. If the Bank makes payment, or returns the payment, it provides a service as specified in the leaflet and makes a charge in accordance with the terms of the contract. On page 1 of the leaflet the Bank explains that ? there are normally no charges for everyday banking at Lloyds TSB when your account is in credit. When you use an agreed overdraft, there is no monthly fee and we only charge interest on the amount you are overdrawn each day. Where you go overdrawn without an agreement, or where you use special services, such as copy statements, we will make a charge. This guide explains how these charges work, and when they will apply. If you want to use a service that we haven’t listed, we’ll tell you the cost of that service before you give us the go-ahead’’.

4. There is no breach of contract; the charge cannot therefore be a penalty; consequently there is no requirement that the charge be a pre-estimate of the Bank’s loss.

5. The customer is given advance warning of charges being imposed; statements show the charges, if any, the customer has incurred during the course of a month, and which will appear as debits on the following month’s statement. Customers are warned by letter when they go overdrawn or over their agreed limit without arrangement with the Bank. If the customer fails to remedy the position, and payments such as standing orders and direct debits are refused then again the customer is warned by letter.

6. The charges are fair and reasonable, and it is denied that they are unlawful.

7. The customer is notified of the charges in plain intelligible language at the conclusion of the contract, and on each monthly statement. The charges are terms which relate to the price payable by the customer for a service provided by the bank and pursuant to Regulation 6 of the Unfair Terms in Consumer Contracts Regulations 1999, are not subject to the assessment of fairness.

8. In the premises:

 

8.1 the charges are for banking services, and are not damages nor a penalty;

8.2 the Bank is entitled by contract to impose the charges, which are fair and reasonable;

8.3 it is denied that the charges are unlawful or contravene any statute or regulation.

9. The Claimant’s claim is denied in it’s entirety. It is further denied that the Claimant is entitled to the sum claimed or to any sum for the Bank.

 

4. If you wish to make a claim against the claimant (a counterclaim) left blank

 

5. Signed The defendant believes that the facts stated in this form are true. I am duly authorised to sign this statement. Dean Lightwood for the Defendant Bank.

 

From reading around this seems to be quite a normal 9 point defence. If someone could just clarify for me, that'd be good?

 

Is it a good thing to not have an AQ? Does this mean that Lloyds will apply for it to be stayed? What happens now? I just wait to hear from my local court?

 

Any advice greatly appreciated.

[broke dave]

Looks like perfectly normal defence. It is now usual to dispense with AQ.

Yes just wait for your local court to send you a date (this took just over a week for mine)

You should note that if your claim is over £1500 you will still have to pay £100 allocation fee.

[Bev77]

Ah pooey! My claim is for just under 5k, so that means I'll have to pay the fee then? Why do you still have to pay it, and do you get it back?

[broke dave]

Don't know why you have to pay it but you do get it back as part of your court costs.

[Bev77]

Ok, thanks.

[Bev77]

I'm sure I remember reading on someone's thread that there is a date by which to pay the AQ fee. Anyone know what it is likely to be, even if there is no AQ?

 

I guess my best bet is to ring the local court first thing tuesday morning, eh?

[broke dave]

In the next couple of days you should receive "Notice of Allocation to the Small Claims Track (Hearing). With this will be a "Notice to Pay Fee." This will give you the date by which the fee must be paid. In my case the notice was dated 9th May and I had until 18th May to pay.

[GuidoT]

Read this thread, you need to consider sending the New Strategy Order:

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/general/80091-your-court-dispensing-allocation.html?highlight=dispensing

[Bev77]

Read this thread, you need to consider sending the New Strategy Order:

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/general/80091-your-court-dispensing-allocation.html?highlight=dispensing

 

 

I don't really understand this bit though? What is it to do with? Is it to go to the court with anything? Or just by itself? Do I need to attach a SOC or anything? I don't want to just do it without understanding what it's about or for.

 

On another note, I rang my local court on Thursday 31st May to ask what stage my claim was at, and was told that it was with the Judge and that I should expect to hear something within the next few days. I've not heard anything as yet (ok, only a few days since), but I'm assuming this will be the Hearing (the notice of allocation to track)?

 

Which would then mean to expect a letter from SCM a few weeks later?

[Bev77]

Could someone please clarify what the new Draft Order is all about for me, please? Explain it to me, as I don't quite understand what it is for.

 

Thanks in advance

Bev

[GuidoT]

The draft order contains a set of directions that you are asking the judge to consider ordering.

 

It compels you to issue your documentation and then the Bank to issue theirs. I have not yet known a bank to comply and issue the documentation, therefore the defence gets struck out and you win.

 

It usually speeds up the process and cuts out the requirement for a hearing.

 

From a poll on this site Judges order it about 40% of the time. See here for further information:

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/general/53570-new-strategy-allocation-questionaires.html

[Bev77]

Thanks Guido for the explanation. When you say documentation, what does that involve? Is that the basic court bundle, or just the SoC?

 

What is the first step, just to send the Draft Order and wait to see what the Judge says?

[GuidoT]

The documents are these:

• a) A schedule setting out each charge repayment of which is sought, showing the date, amount, and reason given (if any) for that charge being made;

• b) Copies of any statement or other document relied upon as showing that each and every charge has been made;

• c) A statement of evidence of all matters relied upon as tending to show that the charges are irrecoverable as penalties or otherwise;

• d) Copies of decided cases and other legal materials to be relied upon.

Yes you need to send the draft the order.

 

I do not mind helping, but this is a self help site. All the answers to your questions are contained in the links I previously posted.

 

If you do not understand the contents of the links then read then again the day following, eventually you will understand them.

[Bev77]

I'm going to send a 'nudge' letter, as suggested in another thread. http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/hsbc-bank/78873-new-after-28-days.html?highlight=nudge+letter

I'd like to put in there somewhere about expecting a cheque, as I don't want it to go into the account. The account has now been defaulted, our internet banking has been suspended, and we have no bank card, as it ran out last month and I'm guessing because the account is in default, they're not going to send another one. In theory, SCM could have actually paid all the money in and we'd never know.

 

Anyone have any ideas on how to word it or where to put it in the letter?

 

Maybe at this bit I hope to hear from you very soon by way of cheque so that a reasonable conclusion to this claim might be achieved? Blue is what I have added myself, or do you think it is too early to ask for a cheque at this stage?

 

Hope I don't offend anyone with my questions, but I HAVE searched any can't find anything on this.

[broke dave]

Looks OK to me. Yes you should be asking for the money, that's the idea of the nudge letter. You are perfectly within your rights to ask for a cheque.

[Bev77]

Cheers Broke Dave.

[broke dave]

For inspiration look at the Marconi thread - another winner!!!!!

[Bev77]

Is this normal? After receving the last letter from Northampton County Court who dispensed with the AQ, it seems that the Judge at my local court DOES want an AQ? Can he do that after it has already been stated that no AQ is needed?

 

Well, that's what I've received this morning anyway an AQ. The accompanying letter says:-

 

'You have already been sent a copy of a defence from the defendants in this claim. The time for all the defendants to file their defences has now elapsed and I am enclosing an allocation questionaire for you to complete. No further defences have been received.'

 

And then the details of when to pay by, where to pay and the fee being payable.

 

So I guess I have to fill it in and hand it in with the £100 fee? I just don't think it's fair that 1 judge says no AQ and another says yes you do need one!

[GuidoT]

Phone the court where it has been transferred to and explain. It is likely you will have to pay the AQ fee anyway, but again check with the court.

[Bev77]

Thanks will do. Just ringing them now. Just out of interest, I've got an N150 instead of an N149. My claim is for under £5k, (only just), so dunno why I've got the N150? Maybe it's just a mistake?

 

Edit: Yeah sorry I meant N150