CCA and time limit

[Cornucopia]

Bubbles,

 

Let me go back to your first post.

 

I think you are letting the various DCAs and the Credit Card company confuse and deceive you.

 

As I said before I am in exact same situation and I am doing what I describe below.

 

Let me spell it out in clear terms:

 

This is not conjecture this is fact.

 

They have an uneforceable agreement because they cannot produce the agreement. I assume that you have that in writing from them. Make sure you do not lose it.

They cannot take you to court without the agreement, if they tried they would fail. You are within your rights to not pay any money until they could produce a fully executed agreement - dont worry about the detail for now. Furthermore, because they had no basis to enforce the alleged agreement, then they have no basis to share your data with ANYONE nor default you on this alleged agreement.

 

It has taken me 8 months to get the DCA and creditor to understand they have defaulted but now they finally have agreed to walk away wiping out £6k of debt.

 

Here is my letter - USE IT - don't take any more bulls##t

 

Send it to the DCA and the Credit Card company and send it recorded to both:

 

Account number: xxxxxxx

 

 

I refer to my letter dated xxxxxxx in which I made a formal request under the Consumer credit act 1974 sec 77-79 for a true copy of the regulated credit agreement refered to in the above account number. There is no time limitation as you allege and you are reminded that you are obliged to supply these under sec.189 whether you are the original creditor or not.

To date you have failed to comply with my statutory request and have defaulted in respect of this account. This means that under the CCA you have now committed an offence punishable upon conviction, by a fine of £2,500 or 3 months imprisonment. It is my intention to report this breach and request your prosecution.

 

Additionally this alleged agreement is unenforceable until such time as this default is removed or enforced by a court of law. It is a further offence to attempt to enforce this alleged agreement until such time as the default is removed.

 

Consequently I am ceasing all payments with respect to this alleged agreement until such time as this matter is resolved.

Finally, since you are unable to provide me with a fully executed agreement then you have an obligation to remove all default notices you have placed with credit agencies and other parties which relate to this alleged agreement.

 

 

 

You have 7 days to comply with my request before I procede with litigation against you,

 

 

 

 

 

Hello Zubo,

 

Thank you for a very informative (and comforting) post. I am hoping to be able to steal your letter myself (although not counting chickens just yet). May I ask which Bank/DCA you had this particular battle with?

 

Many thanks.

 

Cornucopia

[M.Willows]

Confused by DCA as to who I should request CCA from as have requested from original creditor Citi but they havent complied but the DCA(DLC) say they aquired debt and I should be requesting from them, as far as I know they are only managing debt and do not own the debt.Need some advice please .Have now requested SAR for agreement from Citi to clarify this matter of who owns debt,who should I be requesting CCA from as now confused but thought it was clear that the creditor had to comply.

[zubo]

Hello Zubo,

 

Thank you for a very informative (and comforting) post. I am hoping to be able to steal your letter myself (although not counting chickens just yet). May I ask which Bank/DCA you had this particular battle with?

 

Many thanks.

 

Cornucopia

 

Cornucopia

 

Feel free to do so - it proved succesful enough for 20 days later the DCA or Solicitor to recieve instruction to write off £6k debt. D G Solicitors - it was 3 loans, about 10+ years old with originally Forward Trust..

 

thanks

[Cornucopia]

Cornucopia

 

Feel free to do so - it proved succesful enough for 20 days later the DCA or Solicitor to recieve instruction to write off £6k debt. D G Solicitors - it was 3 loans, about 10+ years old with originally Forward Trust..

 

thanks

 

I hope you don't mind Zubo, but I am going to PM you!

[zubo]

Confused by DCA as to who I should request CCA from as have requested from original creditor Citi but they havent complied but the DCA(DLC) say they aquired debt and I should be requesting from them, as far as I know they are only managing debt and do not own the debt.Need some advice please .Have now requested S.A.R - (Subject Access Request) for agreement from Citi to clarify this matter of who owns debt,who should I be requesting CCA from as now confused but thought it was clear that the creditor had to comply.

 

Sorry M got waylaid,

 

I always issue the CCA request (recorded) to both DCA and the original creditor adding a footnote that regardless of who the Creditor is, you are entitled to a copy of the fully executed agreement within the specfied timescales and remind them that the act specifies consequences of failing to supply within those timescales.

[bubbles99]

hi Zubo,

 

I'll get that letter sent out this weekend. Thanks for all your help.

[M.Willows]

Thanks Zubo

Have got a reply from Hillisden that if they cannot forward the original agreement they will supply a true copy of the document which will comply with section 78 of th C.C.A 1974.I will let you know what they send:)

[zubo]

Thanks Zubo

Have got a reply from Hillisden that if they cannot forward the original agreement they will supply a true copy of the document which will comply with section 78 of th C.C.A 1974.I will let you know what they send:)

 

that would be interesting - the Act specifically covers the fact that a reconstructed agreement is not enough....

 

now let us see how they intend to wriggle out of this one... also watch the time - let me know how it progresses

[tifo]

they'll probably send a photocopy of the application form, which is what they sent me and said they had now complied with my CCA s.78 request.

 

i replied back that this is not so but they haven't answered as yet, many weeks have gone by.

[zubo]

they'll probably send a photocopy of the application form, which is what they sent me and said they had now complied with my CCA s.78 request.

 

i replied back that this is not so but they haven't answered as yet, many weeks have gone by.

 

yes me too, we all seem to be in a who-will-blink-first scenario. Amex even wrote to me saying that they were sending me a copy of my Application... all helpful evidence.

[Cornucopia]

they'll probably send a photocopy of the application form, which is what they sent me and said they had now complied with my CCA s.78 request.

 

i replied back that this is not so but they haven't answered as yet, many weeks have gone by.

 

I too got a copy of my husband's application form (MBNA) after issuing a CCA request and get this, it also has his former wife's job, salary, bank account details etc, as an additional cardholder. Hmmm, illegal data sharing I think! Naughty MBNA!!

[M.Willows]

Just an update

Nothing received from Hillisden from CCA request as yet , gone past the 12 days:)

[M.Willows]

Hi Zubo

Nothing from Hillisden past all dates required for CCA, received a letter in reply from Citi stating that hilleden should hold copy of agreement, but do Citi have to send me a copy of my alleged agreement as requested from my SAR even though they have assigned my alleged debt over as they have taken charges on this and I want to claim back ,I also will be sending incomplete data form if they need to produce . Will look in resources for suitable letter for Hillesden and will now commence a SAR for agreement from them.Is this correct.

[M.Willows]

Hi Also missed out the bit where the Citi letter states .We have enclosed a copy of the information provided from your application .Please note that the Data Protection Act 1998 does not require a data controller to provie an actual copy of the document requested , only the 'information constituting any personal data of which that individual is the data subject', (Section 7(1) © (ii) ).

Anyone ?

[zubo]

Hi Also missed out the bit where the Citi letter states .We have enclosed a copy of the information provided from your application .Please note that the Data Protection Act 1998 does not require a data controller to provie an actual copy of the document requested , only the 'information constituting any personal data of which that individual is the data subject', (Section 7(1) © (ii) ).

Anyone ?

 

Sorry, bit busy, they are misleading you and incorrectly quoting the Data Protection Act - your reference should be against the Consumer Credit Act 1974.

 

Remind me what you sent - should be the CCA letter AND the SAR letter.

What is the account - loan or credit card? when did you take it out?

 

thanks

 

Z

 

ps be aware I am on hols 18-25April

[Cornucopia]

Hi Also missed out the bit where the Citi letter states .We have enclosed a copy of the information provided from your application .Please note that the Data Protection Act 1998 does not require a data controller to provie an actual copy of the document requested , only the 'information constituting any personal data of which that individual is the data subject', (Section 7(1) © (ii) ).

Anyone ?

 

I would have said that was rubbish Willows. It does have to be a true copy of the executed agreement that was taken out on inception, be signed by both parties and include all the prescribed terms.

 

I wonder if they are confusing themselves, the quote regarding "information constituting blah blah....." would seem to me to refer to an SAR and any personal data held in that regard.

 

Somebody correct me if they think I am wrong about this!

[zubo]

I would have said that was rubbish Willows. It does have to be a true copy of the executed agreement that was taken out on inception, be signed by both parties and include all the prescribed terms.

 

I wonder if they are confusing themselves, the quote regarding "information constituting blah blah....." would seem to me to refer to an SAR and any personal data held in that regard.

 

Somebody correct me if they think I am wrong about this!

 

no Corn you are correct, that is why my previous post tried to work out what letters were sent.

 

Z

[M.Willows]

Hi Z and C

I sent Citi a SAR in Feb 2007 for the agreement , but they haven't sent an agreement as they quoted to me a section 7 as posted before they only resent statements , .I did also send them a CCA back in Nov and understand now that Hillisden have to comply to the CCA as they were assigned but they haven't complied to my CCA so have sent them a non compliance letter today. My main question is do they have to send me a copy of my agreement witha SAR as requested as they have confused me with quoting they don't in Section 7 of the DPA.

Thanks for all your patience with me

[zubo]

Hi Z and C

I sent Citi a SAR in Feb 2007 for the agreement , but they haven't sent an agreement as they quoted to me a section 7 as posted before they only resent statements , .I did also send them a CCA back in Nov and understand now that Hillisden have to comply to the CCA as they were assigned but they haven't complied to my CCA so have sent them a non compliance letter today. My main question is do they have to send me a copy of my agreement witha SAR as requested as they have confused me with quoting they don't in Section 7 of the DPA.

Thanks for all your patience with me

 

The short answer is yes they should provided you worded it correctly. You will find that any DCA or Creditor will wriggle given the choice.

 

You should REALLY use the CCA to obtain the agreement and seperately use a SAR to get the financials and any related documented info. Read my strategy here:

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/general-debt/57839-newman-debt-collection-agents-3.html

#49

 

Then I suggest that you send in a CCA request again with £1 recorded to Hillisden. The standard letter N i think is in the templates.

 

Z

[M.Willows]

Thanks Zubo

Will start reading

[The Phantom]

Don't know if this is of any help or interest, but have read in a different thread that DCAs (not being the original lender) do not have to comply with a CCA, resp. do NOT have to send a copy of the true signed agreement

I refer to this thread

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/general-debt/43409-link-financial-cca-request.html?highlight=Link

[zubo]

Don't know if this is of any help or interest, but have read in a different thread that DCAs (not being the original lender) do not have to comply with a CCA, resp. do NOT have to send a copy of the true signed agreement

I refer to this thread

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/general-debt/43409-link-financial-cca-request.html?highlight=Link

 

There is confusion usually re a DCA. IF he has been assigned the debt then yes he is obliged to respond, if he is acting for his client then you could argue that he should send the request to the client.

 

What I tend to do is CCA the original Creditor and copy the DCA.

Its messy but better than nothing or the Creditor saying he never got the request....

 

z

[M.Willows]

Hi Zubo

 

I have proof that hillesden received my CCA request on the 22/02/07 by royal mail and a letter from them so do I need to send another CCA ? I will SAR them now though for all transactions.

Thanks

[M.Willows]

Hi Nicole (like your angry face )

 

My alleged debt has been assigned and confirmed by both parties so I am now quite confident I should be chasing the DCA for the agreement and they haven't complied, have sent them a non compliance letter today from resources ,

Thanks for your help:)

[zubo]

Hi Nicole (like your angry face )

 

My alleged debt has been assigned and confirmed by both parties so I am now quite confident I should be chasing the DCA for the agreement and they haven't complied, have sent them a non compliance letter today from resources ,

Thanks for your help:)

 

exactly right - use Pams last one

 

z