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    • further polished WS using above suggestions and also included couple of more modifications highlighted in orange are those ok to include?   Background   1.1  The Defendant received the Parking Charge Notice (PCN) on the 06th of January 2020 following the vehicle being parked at Arla Old Dairy, South Ruislip on the 05th of December 2019.   Unfair PCN   2.1  On 19th December 2023 the Defendant sent the Claimant's solicitors a CPR request.  As shown in Exhibit 1 (pages 7-13) sent by the solicitors the signage displayed in their evidence clearly shows a £60.00 parking charge notice (which will be reduced to £30 if paid within 14 days of issue).  2.2  Yet the PCN sent by the Claimant is for a £100.00 parking charge notice (reduced to £60 if paid within 30 days of issue).   2.3        The Claimant relies on signage to create a contract.  It is unlawful for the Claimant to write that the charge is £60 on their signs and then send demands for £100.    2.4        The unlawful £100 charge is also the basis for the Claimant's Particulars of Claim.  No Locus Standi  3.1  I do not believe a contract with the landowner, that is provided following the defendant’s CPR request, gives MET Parking Services a right to bring claims in their own name. Definition of “Relevant contract” from the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012, Schedule 4,  2 [1] means a contract Including a contract arising only when the vehicle was parked on the relevant land between the driver and a person who is-   (a) the owner or occupier of the land; or   (b) Authorised, under or by virtue of arrangements made by the owner or occupier of the land, to enter into a contract with the driver requiring the payment of parking charges in respect of the parking of the vehicle on the land. According to https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2006/46/section/44   For a contract to be valid, it requires a director from each company to sign and then two independent witnesses must confirm those signatures.   3.2  The Defendant requested to see such a contract in the CPR request.  The fact that no contract has been produced with the witness signatures present means the contract has not been validly executed. Therefore, there can be no contract established between MET Parking Services and the motorist. Even if “Parking in Electric Bay” could form a contract (which it cannot), it is immaterial. There is no valid contract.  Illegal Conduct – No Contract Formed   4.1 At the time of writing, the Claimant has failed to provide the following, in response to the CPR request from myself.   4.2        The legal contract between the Claimant and the landowner (which in this case is Standard Life Investments UK) to provide evidence that there is an agreement in place with landowner with the necessary authority to issue parking charge notices and to pursue payment by means of litigation.   4.3 Proof of planning permission granted for signage etc under the Town and country Planning Act 1990. Lack of planning permission is a criminal offence under this Act and no contract can be formed where criminality is involved.   4.4        I also do not believe the claimant possesses these documents.   No Keeper Liability   5.1        The defendant was not the driver at the time and date mentioned in the PCN and the claimant has not established keeper liability under schedule 4 of the PoFA 2012. In this matter, the defendant puts it to the claimant to produce strict proof as to who was driving at the time.   5.2 The claimant in their Notice To Keeper also failed to comply with PoFA 2012 Schedule 4 section 9[2][f] while mentioning “the right to recover from the keeper so much of that parking charge as remains unpaid” where they did not include statement “(if all the applicable conditions under this Schedule are met)”.     5.3         The claimant did not mention parking period, times on the photographs are separate from the PCN and in any case are that arrival and departure times not the parking period since their times include driving to and from the parking space as a minimum and can include extra time to allow pedestrians and other vehicles to pass in front.    Protection of Freedoms Act 2012   The notice must -   (a) specify the vehicle, the relevant land on which it was parked and the period of parking to which the notice relates;  22. In the persuasive judgement K4GF167G - Premier Park Ltd v Mr Mathur - Horsham County Court – 5 January 2024 it was on this very point that the judge dismissed this claim.  5.4  A the PCN does not comply with the Act the Defendant as keeper is not liable.  No Breach of Contract   6.1       No breach of contract occurred because the PCN and contract provided as part of the defendant’s CPR request shows different post code, PCN shows HA4 0EY while contract shows HA4 0FY. According to PCN defendant parked on HA4 0EY which does not appear to be subject to the postcode covered by the contract.  6.2         The entrance sign does not mention anything about there being other terms inside the car park so does not offer a contract which makes it only an offer to treat,  Interest  7.1  It is unreasonable for the Claimant to delay litigation for  Double Recovery   7.2  The claim is littered with made-up charges.  7.3  As noted above, the Claimant's signs state a £60 charge yet their PCN is for £100.  7.4  As well as the £100 parking charge, the Claimant seeks recovery of an additional £70.  This is simply a poor attempt to circumvent the legal costs cap at small claims.  7.5 Since 2019, many County Courts have considered claims in excess of £100 to be an abuse of process leading to them being struck out ab initio. An example, in the Caernarfon Court in VCS v Davies, case No. FTQZ4W28 on 4th September 2019, District Judge Jones-Evans stated “Upon it being recorded that District Judge Jones- Evans has over a very significant period of time warned advocates (...) in many cases of this nature before this court that their claim for £60 is unenforceable in law and is an abuse of process and is nothing more than a poor attempt to go behind the decision of the Supreme Court v Beavis which inter alia decided that a figure of £160 as a global sum claimed in this case would be a penalty and not a genuine pre-estimate of loss and therefore unenforceable in law and if the practice continued, he would treat all cases as a claim for £160 and therefore a penalty and unenforceable in law it is hereby declared (…) the claim is struck out and declared to be wholly without merit and an abuse of process.”  7.6 In Claim Nos. F0DP806M and F0DP201T, District Judge Taylor echoed earlier General Judgment or Orders of District Judge Grand, stating ''It is ordered that the claim is struck out as an abuse of process. The claim contains a substantial charge additional to the parking charge which it is alleged the Defendant contracted to pay. This additional charge is not recoverabl15e under the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012, Schedule 4 nor with reference to the judgment in Parking Eye v Beavis. It is an abuse of process from the Claimant to issue a knowingly inflated claim for an additional sum which it is not entitled to recover. This order has been made by the court of its own initiative without a hearing pursuant to CPR Rule 3.3(4)) of the Civil Procedure Rules 1998...''  7.7 In the persuasive case of G4QZ465V - Excel Parking Services Ltd v Wilkinson – Bradford County Court -2 July 2020 (Exhibit 4) the judge had decided that Excel had won. However, due to Excel adding on the £60 the Judge dismissed the case.  7.8        The addition of costs not previously specified on signage are also in breach of the Consumer Rights Act 2015, Schedule 2, specifically paras 6, 10 and 14.   7.9        It is the Defendant’s position that the Claimant in this case has knowingly submitted inflated costs and thus the entire claim should be similarly struck out in accordance with Civil Procedure Rule 3.3(4).   In Conclusion   8.1        I invite the court to dismiss the claim.  Statement of Truth  I believe that the facts stated in this witness statement are true. I understand that proceedings for contempt of court may be brought against anyone who makes, or causes to be made, a false statement in a document verified by a statement of truth without an honest belief in its truth.   
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Have you asked NatWest for charges back and they said no?


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I handed 2 DPA letters into my local branch on Saturday, the few bank statements I have which is for Mar 2000 - Dec 2000 I have calculated at least £1k.

 

This was at a time we both myself and hubby were both lost of jobs because of company moves etc, so having all these additional charges placed upon us was not what we needed.

 

Thankfully we are now in a position where we don't have any charges, I cancelled all my dd's and only pay bills when there is free money, it takes time but the savings on charges is worth the effort.

 

Because we are no longer receiving charges will this effect our claim?

 

Also I cannot see any where in the FAQ section if the 40 days are banking days or just 40 days if someone could advise this would be good.

 

I wish everyone else luck with their claims.

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40 days is just like Lent - neve stops.

 

Go ahead and claim your charges.

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  • 2 weeks later...

Nat West Letter rcvd today:-

 

Thank you for your letter dated 10th March requesting copy statements since March 2000.

 

You refer to account number xxxx but this was closed in December 2000. The account presently open in you name is numbered xxxxx and this has been opened since prior to March 2000. I therefore assume that you require copies of the statements relation to this account. These have been ordered and I should be in a position to forward them to you within the next 10 working days.

 

Please do not hesitate to contact this office if you should have any queries concerning my letter.

 

Yours sincerely

 

David Forshew

Senior Business Associate.

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I called and checked that statements had been ordered for both accounts, as I knew the one account was closed!

 

Also how much would they charge me for statments they said they would be free

:lol:

 

 

 

Abbey also returned my cheque today and said there would be not charge something funny going on I think?

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  • 2 weeks later...

I have done a search and cannot find an answer to this if it's been mentioned before sorry but I have searched before posting

 

QUOTE From letter requesting payment

 

Additionally you have entered a default notice against my credit record. This default occurred merely in respect of unlawful charges levied by you or was the result of impecuniosity caused directly by he taking by you of penalty charges which you had applied unlawfully to my account.

 

Can anyone advise me how long a default notice stays on your file?

 

I have a couple going back to 2004, which I don't know if they would still show on my credit score, so should I add the above comment or leave it out.

 

So what I am asking is will they still effect on my credit rating?

 

Thanks

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There are too many credit ref agencies in my opinion.

 

One should be enough. Why do we need three?

 

Tighter regulation of this arena is needed methinks.

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Totally agreed Dave, maybe this could be the next challenge?

If you find this post useful, please click the Scales of 'Justice' in the top right corner. Thanks ;)

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How worried should I be about this?

 

I have no credit cards all my bills are now paid, apart from the NatWest account being overdrawn by £400 (which I could pay back if I needed to I don't use this anymore and I pay £5 in every week to reduce the balance I could pay more but it's a principal thing),

 

I have just got a mobile phone on contract which I was refused a few years ago, I guess my credit score now is ok, am I wrong to assume this?

 

The dates on the defauls were 2004 if it makes any difference

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As someone has already said, they will remain on your file for six years after they were issued. If they have been satisfied (ie paid off) then they will probably not stop you getting a mortgage. However, even now they might stop you opening a business bank account, make it more difficult to get a personal current account or a credit card and mean that you would be charged a slightly higher rate on your mortgage.

 

How you proceed is your decision and whilst it doesn't sound as if you suffered any loss, you may, as a matter of principal, want to chase the bank about this. Why should they be allowed to put defamatory information on your credit file for not paying their unlawful charges?

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I have today posted my preliminary letter through the door of my local branch

 

I estimate they owe me:-

 

£2194.77 for one account

 

£650.93 for another.

 

One think I have noticed going through my statement the amount of interest you get charged by them compared to the pennies they pay you in interest, these banks must be making a small fortune

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Thanks I have included it in my letter but was curious to see what effects it could have.

 

I have opened bank accounts recently and have a business account so I don't think it has effected me to much, but it's good to know what damage it could do.

 

Thanks for your answers

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I have now rcvd the standard letter in reply to my preliminary letter I sent to the bank

 

"We believe that our charges are fair., reasonable and transparent etc and charges must stand.

 

I also raised the matter ref the defaults I have been charged for and this was the response:-

 

Turning your question of the default letters issued to you, your account was not transfered to our Credit Management Services Dep and therefore your debt was unlikely to have been registered. The only way this can be confirmed is by obtaining a copy of the Equifax report, as this will detail all registrations. I cannot obtain this inforamtion on your behalf, but you could do so by completing the enclosed application form and sending it to Equifax. There is a £2 fee for the service, but if you were to obtain the copy fo the report and forward it to me, then I wil refund the £2 to your account. In addition, if the default has been registered I will arrange for the relevant entry to be removed.

 

 

 

 

 

So if they are saying they have not transfered my account to the Credit management services why did they keep charging me for defaults on my account, the other thing that I have also just remembered it they arrange for me to take a loan out at some stupid rate to repay the overdraft, so it must have been passed on.

 

Do they know what they are doing? As they are saying in one statement the charges are fair and in the other if they have put a default on my account they will remove it?

 

I guess it's now a case of sending the letter before action, any comments on the above would be appreciated.

 

Before I send for the Equifax report I have just applied for a zero % credit card, if I ask for my credit before I get the card will this count as a search?

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  • 2 weeks later...
  • 4 months later...
  • 4 months later...

Hi everyone and Happy New Year to you all.

 

I have a problem with Natwest again so I will try and keep it short and hopefully someone will be able to offer me some advice.

 

I applied to Nat West back in April regarding my charges on two accounts got letter back on both accounts saying would not pay up, at the time I had rather more pressing stuff going on to worry about following this on.

 

So in December I wrote to them again asking for my money back to my surprise I got a letter in the new year offering me £850.93 I checked my records and I had put a claim in for £650 and £2194.77

 

The first letter I received late December was advising that they would refund all unarranged borrowing card misuse paid referal fees accrued and as a gesture of good will and without admission of liability or error and the charges are fair reasonable and transparent etc, total £850.93 there was no mention of account number on my letter, so I called them and was told it was an error and the letter was wrong they were paying £2194.77 if I went into the branch they could fax the department for me so I could accept the correct amount.

 

So off I go into my branch explained the whole story and the customer service lady made some calls and advised that the £850 offered in the letter was for my account which I had closed, I was only asking for £650 she said they have given you more as a gesture of good will! so I accepted the £850 and made a point of writing on the letter and ensuring that their computer was updated to what she told me, that this was for the closed account.

 

This left me then waiting for the payment and an answer to my second claim which on Friday I got another letter offering me £1904.00 which was a bit short of what I had asked but I thought I would accept it and fax it back.

 

I have just called Natwest to confirm they have received my acceptance only to be advised that the letter offering me £1904.00 was an error as they had not realised they had already paid me £850.00 so all I am now getting is £1300.00 can they do this? the letter I got on Friday did not mention any deductions I explained they were two seperate claims, so now they have given me the snr customer relations managers direct line to call him but I woukd like some info before I call can they do this legally?

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Update, I have just called Nat West and asked why have they changed their offer anyhow to cut a long story short they have agreed to pay the £1900.00:-)

 

So I would suggest that if you have applied and they have said no send them another letter asking for the charges you may be successful second time around.

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As the title say's Have you asked NatWest for charges back and they said no and then not taken your claim any further?

 

 

If this relates to you then I would suggest that you write to them again:?

 

I sent my origianal letter to them in April and got a reply charges fair etc at the time I did not have enought hours in the day to continue with it so I did nothing.

 

Early December I decided to start again so I pulled out my original letter and changed the dates and sent them off again, and they have just agreed to pay up:) :) :) (Yes on two accounts and on the first letter)

 

So I would suggest that you do the same

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Congratulations, but please be aware that they've still won in a way - they've not paid you every pound and pence that you were owed.

 

A lot of users on here have been offered settlements, but have refused and got every penny back.

 

However, the offers do seem like the best settlement offers I've seen on here, particularly from NatWest, so well done indeed!

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