CEL ANPR PCN Claimform - Tily Carpentry Yate Bristol ***Discontinued***

[FTMDave]

The work you're putting in to fight CEL is superb.  FWIW, the last three times CEL took Caggers to court, CEL got a good kicking, so they are eminently beatable.

 

However, a cautionary tale.  We recently had a member who was building up evidence to support his son-in-law, who was being sued (not a private parking matter, another type of legal dispute).  This Cagger put in a huge effort - but once the son-in-law found himself alone in a legal setting he was out of his depth and pretty much crumbled.

 

If CEL do take this to court, it will be your son who will have to appear.  There's no point you being brilliantly sussed about the matter, he needs to deal with his own case.

 

He's already scored an own goal by throwing away the paperwork.  CEL often can't be bothered to follow the law when they send out their demands, but we can't be sure because we haven't got the letters.  He also presumably ignored a Letter Before Claim and might well have been able to stop CEL at that stage.

[FTMDave]

Let's see what CPR comes up with.

 

If CEL don't reply then he can SAR them.

 

As Lookinforinfo says, they will have to include this documentation in their WS, but it would be useful to know before.

 

 

[FTMDave]

Simple fact is we don't know because your son has binned the documentation.

 

If you're uncomfortable with this clause, then just leave it out.

 

The more generic the defence is the better anyway.  Just use the standard short defence that is on most claimform threads here.

[FTMDave]

And a cautionary tale.

 

We recently had someone on the forum (not PPC, another section) who put masses of work in on behalf of his son-in-law, who was being sued.

 

Once the son-in-law found himself in a court setting, he got pretty much trounced.

 

This was because the father-in-law had educated himself about the legal position, but the actual person being sued hadn't.

 

If CEL do continue all the way to a court case it will be your son, not you, who will have to face them.  It would be much better if he dealt with his own case and educated himself about where he stands legally, sharpish.

[FTMDave]

Wooops!  Missed that, sorry.

 

It's debatable if they have complied with POFA.  They seem to have sent out the documentation in time, but then have hidden in miniscule writing that your son could name the driver if he wasn't driving.  Plus they haven't even said what he did wrong!

[FTMDave]

You need to file something like post 64 here

 

 

[FTMDave]

Certainly if your son could only see the sign when driving out it would make it impossible for him to enter a contract with CEL.

 

I've just reread the thread and seen the deadline for his defence was 16 April, so he needs to deal with this quickly.  How about -

 

 

1.  The Defendant is the recorded keeper of XXXXX.

 

2.  The Claimant was contracted by the landowner to provide car park management services and is not capable of entering into a contract with the Defendant on its own account, as the car park is owned by and the terms of entry set by the landowner.  Accordingly, it is denied that the Claimant has authority to bring this claim.  The proper Claimant is the landowner.

3.  In any case it is denied that the Claimant entered into a contract with the Defendant.

 

4. The Particulars of Claim is denied in its entirety.  It is denied that the Claimant is entitled to the relief claimed or any relief at all.

 

 

Point 3 is a catch all and covers the rubbish signage and any other reason a contract wasn't entered into.

 

See if anyone suggests tweaking this afternoon, then this evening file it via MCOL, if MCOL is working.

[FTMDave]

So to sum up the car park situation.

 

In their PCN the fleecers state your son parked in Grooms House car park, which is correct.

 

But in the POC they quote Tily Carpentry car park.

 

What a bunch of idiots!

 

This will be a laugh when it comes to WS stage, your son can just state he has never parked in Tily Carpentry car park in his life, and indeed the fleecers own photos show the car in a completely different car park.

[FTMDave]

Well done on your victory!