used car advice

[thatsmega]

Hi

 

Two weeks ago I spent £2250 on my credit card and bought a used car from

a dealer (don't know if credit card is relevant)

 

I initially viewed the car at the dealers house but when I paid for it, we

went to a garage that he is in partner-ship with. I paid for the car using

the garage payment facilities.

 

Now, who sold me the car? The garage or him?

 

Was it a private sale? Or am I covered under the sale of goods act?

 

After a week i discovered a problem with the air-conditioning. I phoned the

man and he asked me to take it to him.

 

I took it to him and the next day it was fixed - free of charge. Brilliant.

 

Another week on and I have discovered several faults:

 

Brakes squeek

Rear windows heater doesn't work

Air-Con has broken again

Rear car squeeks (suspension perhaps)

Horn doesn't work (MOT failure?)

 

He gave me a 12 month MOT with the car.

 

The car was described as:

 

FORD Ka 3 1.3i, 99, T reg. unmarked black, genuine 43k, fsh, air con,

e/windows, c/locking, alloys, superb condition, very special little car,

v/essential. £2,250. px/warranty available.

 

I did not pay extra for any warranty of any kind.

 

However, what are my rights, where do I stand? Someone told me that the car

should be as described - Therefore "superb condition" would imply no faults

or very minor.

 

I haven't approached the man again yet, I want to know where I stand before

I do that.

 

any help appreciated.

Thanks

Darren

[rosiecotton]

Straight away, this looks like a trade sale to me. Did it say trade in the advertisement? Such as (T) at the end etc? If it didn't state that it was trade, this can constitute a criminal offence under the Business Advertisements (Disclosure) Order 1977 and you should inform your local Trading Standards department.

 

As the chap is clearly in business selling cars (he works with a garage, offers part exchange etc) and you completed the transaction on these trade premises, then in my mind there is no doubt that this is a trade sale.

 

There is case law to back this up, but you'll have to take my word for it for now, as I'm at work and don't have time to trawl around for it!

 

So, that establishes that you have rights under the Sale of Goods Act. But what rights will you have?

 

Normally, you have to allow for wear and tear when buying second hand cars, and minor faults may well not be covered if a car is of a certain age and mileage. Example: if you buy a car that's one year old and has done 5k miles, your rights will be a lot stronger than if you buy an old banger that's 12 years old and has done 125k miles. You'd be amazed at how many people don't grasp this

 

In this case, though, it was clearly described as superb condition and one of the features advertised was "air con". Therefore, at the very least, the air conditioning should be in good working order.

 

Now, I'm not a mechanic and even if I were I can't see the car from here, so it's hard to say how strong your case is. You might want to get a report done on the car to see exactly what sort of condition it's in - be warned, though, this will cost. But you will know exactly what you're dealing with, and if there are any suspension (or other) issues.

 

If you choose not to do this, you can still pursue this against the trader. You can write to him stating that the car is not of satisfactory quality or as described because [and detail as much information as you can about the faults]. Therefore it does not comply with the terms of the Sale of Goods Act 1979 (as amended) and you are seeking repairs to put the car into the advertised condition.

 

Be reasonable and be prepared to negotiate with the trader, as you don't have a cut-and-dried case here, with the exception of the air conditioning which was specifically described in the advert. The quality issue is subjective and depends on how a reasonable person would interpret it.

 

Ultimately if he doesn't budge you need to decide whether you're prepared to take it to the Small Claims Court, and of course there will be the risk that the judge will see the faults you have detailed as reasonably minor and normal wear and tear for a car of that age and mileage. Alternatively, he could go the other way and decide that the advertisement was so positive that the car should have been pristine - I can't predict that, though.

 

As you have paid by credit card, you would also be able to argue the same case against your credit card company for damages, as under Section 75 of the Consumer Credit Act 1974 they are equally liable for breaches of contract by the seller, such as faulty goods. Copy any letters to your credit card company with a covering note stating that you will also be looking to pursue them under Section 75 of the Consumer Credit Act.

 

You undoubtedly do have a case, based on the descriptions given, but I couldn't predict a result with any confidence.

[thatsmega]

thanks very much

 

i will pursue with the air-conditioning fault at least.

[debt_mountain]

If they are a trader then all functions of the car should be working, horn, rear demister and air con. As for squeeky brakes and suspension I think that would be wear and tear and solong as it is roadworthy then they are probably a bit unrealistic to claim any cash back.

 

A cheap way to get a simple report is to take the car for an MOT and see what it fails for, tell them about the squeeky brakes and suspension and get them to look at them in detail.

[Jimbo44]

I agree with what's already been said that this looks very much like a Trade Sale and I think further comment along those lines from me is superfluous. Except, perhaps, to say I would copy everything to your credit card company.

 

I am somewhat curious about two things though.

 

Firstly, how did he invoice the car to you? Was it a company name, or his own? If the invoice had a box you had to sign for VAT purposes then it was definitely a sale through a VAT registered person. If not, then a 'dropped hint' of a letter to the VAT-man might not come amiss.

 

Secondly, the garage you went to to pay via your credit card sounds somewhat suspicious to me. Does the name on the confirmation slip for the payment match the seller's name on the invoice? If 'yes' then all could be well. However, if 'no' then my suspicions grow apace as it sounds as though he was using a 'mate' to clear the credit card and I wouldn't like to speculate who sold you the car in law.

 

Just a few more things to 'impress' your trader with if things don't look as though they're going your way might help you too.

 

If the man is selling second-hand cars from his home he will still need to be registered for VAT in exactly the same way as if he had a garage business of his own. VAT is charged on used cars, but not in the same way as for other goods and services. The amount of VAT included in the sale price is not seperately itemised as it is with other sales as used cars sold through a VAT registered business are deemed to be 'VAT inclusive'. Also, the VAT-man requires that very precise records have to be kept in a special 'VAT book' of all transactions.

 

If the seller is trading in used cars from his home then, as far as I am aware, he needs planning permission from the local authority to do so. I'm assuming he's got it!

 

Finally, if all is really going badly for you and no acceptable resolution seems possible, threaten him with Trading Standards. You have already got legitimate grounds as your credit card will almost certainly be subject to the Consumer Credit Act and Trading Standards are the legitimate authority for administering this.

[rosiecotton]

Finally, if all is really going badly for you and no acceptable resolution seems possible, threaten him with Trading Standards. You have already got legitimate grounds as your credit card will almost certainly be subject to the Consumer Credit Act and Trading Standards are the legitimate authority for administering this.

 

Trading Standards don't enforce Section 75, which is the section which gives consumers redress. They mainly deal with credit advertisements and agreements etc.

 

However, what they WILL be interested in is if he is selling cars as a trade (which I believe is the case) and not declaring it in his advertisements (often a T in brackets at the end of the ad). This is a criminal offence and something they will investigate.

 

Unfortunately this is a separate issue from your civil matter under the Sale of Goods Act (/Consumer Credit Act) and you'd still need to pursue this yourself, as Trading Standards don't unfortunately have powers in the civil courts.