LLoyds Business OD - Unaware of Personal Guarantee ***Case Struck Out and awarded Costs !!***

[slick132]

This is good news but lets wait and see how the judge responds.

 

[peebeeh]

This is good news but lets wait and see how the judge responds.

 

 

Thank you - I agree. Fingers crossed!

[littlenonni2012]

hey Peebah Fingers crossed for you!

[peebeeh]

Just received notification from the County Court that the DJ wishes to deal with my application at a hearing.

This will be in early April.

 

Has anyone any advice? Should I be taking any action or shall I wait until nearer the time to gather my thoughts?

[peebeeh]

Good morning,

My application to Strike Out is being heard in the morning so I wish to pull my thoughts together:

1. the original claim was for a Credit Agreement

2. there is no Credit Agreement (post no #24 - this thread)

3. the Judge gave permission for the Claimant to amend the claim

4. the Claimant did not do this

5. I presume therefore that I am still answering the Claim as originally pleaded?

6. Also, that my origianl defence stands?

[peebeeh]

This is good news but lets wait and see how the judge responds.

 

 

Hello Slick132,

Ref the hearing tomorrow - do you have any thoughts?

Many thanks.

[littlenonni2012]

Hi Peebah,

I sincerely wish you the Very Best for tomorrow.

my personal thoughts are that you need to mention that for some the bankers seem to have this 'whiter than white' reputation. A kind of 'well you signed the agreement, so you must have known what you were signing' type attitude.

 

What I feel you must emphasise to the Judge is that the banks over many years have continued to 'Mislead the Modern day Consumer' Note the recent PPI claims, that they have had to refund and the noteably the biggest consumer revolt of the 20th Century was The Unfair Bank Charges,. So then, one needs to question, if it is possible for them to mislead and have unfair conditions and banking/business practices with these things. What other things can they mislead the modern day consumer with? Are we, the thousands of consumers all wrong? We cant all be wrong can we?

Good Luck!

[asokn]

Contrary to the above post, I would focus firmly on the facts of your case and how the law applies to them. You will get nowhere if you spend your time 'banker bashing' and the judge will frankly dismiss you as someone with nothing relevant to say.

[littlenonni2012]

Absolutely totally and utterly disagree. With all due respect, he isnt 'banker bashing'. But merely reminding the judge that the banks have and continue to make mistakes.

Peebah is presenting facts in court and some of those facts are that banks have made mistakes Peeebah could mention another notable one, which led to the consumer bailout of the banks. Although not relevant in his case are all relevant nevertheless when a judge is making an overall decision about how banks can mislead the consumer and conduct business on a dailly basis.

But lets agree, to disagree if you feel otherwise.

[asokn]

OK, a matter of opinion on which we will agree to disagree as you say

 

Good luck to the OP though, that's something we *can* agree on!

[peebeeh]

Hi Peebah,

I sincerely wish you the Very Best for tomorrow.

my personal thoughts are that you need to mention that for some the bankers seem to have this 'whiter than white' reputation. A kind of 'well you signed the agreement, so you must have known what you were signing' type attitude.

 

What I feel you must emphasise to the Judge is that the banks over many years have continued to 'Mislead the Modern day Consumer' Note the recent PPI claims, that they have had to refund and the noteably the biggest consumer revolt of the 20th Century was The Unfair Bank Charges,. So then, one needs to question, if it is possible for them to mislead and have unfair conditions and banking/business practices with these things. What other things can they mislead the modern day consumer with? Are we, the thousands of consumers all wrong? We cant all be wrong can we?

Good Luck!

 

Thank you for your good wishes nonni - but I am sure that the County Court though would not be the place for this kind of rhetoric! Even though it is difficult to disagree with your sentiments.

[BRIGADIER2JCS]

Thank you for your good wishes nonni - but I am sure that the County Court though would not be the place for this kind of rhetoric! Even though it is difficult to disagree with your sentiments.

 

You are correct it would be very unwise to bring any such

matters up, the judge is not there to rule or comment on

the general behaviour of the banks, you must be specific

in your approach otherwise the case will go quickly off

track and may well annoy the judge an get you a rebuke.

[slick132]

Hi Peebeeh,

 

Regarding LittleNonnie's suggestion on the last page, I too think it's important that you focus entirely on your own case.

 

The fact that the claimant bank have failed to File amended PoC's speaks volumes and must surely play in your favour.

 

Points 1 - 6 made by you in post #177 all make sense to me.

 

Are you going to seek costs from the last hearing and for tomorrows's.

 

Make sure you take everything with you, and that you know where to quickly find any items you need.

 

Good luck for tomorrow and let us know how it goes.

 

[andrew1]

Good luck peebeeh.

 

I went into court recently as a LIP with some pretty damning evidence in my bundle which the judge dismissed as being 'without merit' or just ignored it. I was confronted by a CCA top barrister who was well known in that court and TBH I didn't stand a cat in hells chance of pulling this through against him no matter how damning my evidence was.

 

All I did at the end when I'd lost was ask the judge for permission to appeal, which she refused so I asked her to provide me with the N460 which is the form the judge needs to complete giving the reasons for refusing permission which will save you jumping through hoops should you decide to go to appeal later. You don't have to take up the appeal, but this N460 obtained before the Order has been typed up and handed down will save you considerable time and trouble later. Even if you haven't asked as you're no doubt not going to read this before your hearing, phone the court and ask for it asap before the clerks type up the order, they usually take a day or so.

 

Sadly, my attitude towards the courts ease at dealing with a barrister rather than the LIP is compounded by the ease by which the LIP's arguments are ignored or seen as being without merit far too often. No matter how hard we try, the establishment is a mean machine very difficult to break through and many of these banks and finance companies know exactly how to work the system.

 

I hope you do well.

 

A1

[peebeeh]

.Drafts are fine just try to understand that CPR 3.4/5 will attain judgment without the need to request CPR 24

Andy

 

 

Hi Andy,

I am delighted to report that my application has been successful and that the Claim is struck out, and costs awarded to me.

I have one query (hopefully my last!) - I don't know if CPR 3.5 judgement will be entered automatically or do I have to request it?

Should I await the order from the Court to arrive?

Many thanks for your patience and loads of help.

Peebeeh

[peebeeh]

Hi Peebeeh,

 

Regarding LittleNonnie's suggestion on the last page, I too think it's important that you focus entirely on your own case.

 

The fact that the claimant bank have failed to File amended PoC's speaks volumes and must surely play in your favour.

 

Points 1 - 6 made by you in post #177 all make sense to me.

 

Are you going to seek costs from the last hearing and for tomorrows's.

 

Make sure you take everything with you, and that you know where to quickly find any items you need.

 

Good luck for tomorrow and let us know how it goes.

 

 

Hi Slick132,

I am delighted to report that my application has been successful and that the Claim is struck out, and costs awarded to me.

I have one query (hopefully my last!) - I don't know if CPR3.5 judgement will be entered automatically or do I have to request it?

Should I await the order from the Court to arrive?

[slick132]

Hi Peebeeh and I'm delighted to hear your news.

 

BIG CONGRATS to all those who have helped you achieve this result.

 

From what I understand of CPR 3.5, as you're not the claimant you can't, and don't need to, file for judgement. The case against you has simply been Struck Out.

 

Perhaps someone better versed in such matters can clarify further if necessary but, in any event, wait for the court's Order.

 

Thread title changed to reflect your win.

 

[littlenonni2012]

HI PEEBAH, BIG CONGRATULATIONS:razz:

i have sent you a pm as I am going through the same process with HSBC and obviously any help would be appreciated.

[BRIGADIER2JCS]

Well Done.

[AndyOrch]

Excellent news Peebee,

 

With regards to judgment in your favour, the claim as been struck out, the only time judgment would go in favour of the Defendant is if you had made application for SJ or a Counter Claim.

 

Strike out against a claimant

Strike out is an order by the court that either all or parts of the claimant's statement of case are deleted. The deleted material can then no longer be relied upon. A court would need to find that either the statement of case discloses no reasonable grounds for making a claim, or that it is an abuse of process, or that it is likely to obstruct the court’s just disposal of the proceedings, or that the defendant has failed to comply with the CPR or a court order. Civil restraint orders may also be used to prevent a claimant bringing proceedings at all.

 

A good result all round.

 

Well done!!!

 

Regards

 

Andy

[peebeeh]

Judgment without trial after striking out

 

CPR 3.5

 

(1) This rule applies where –

(a) the court makes an order which includes a term that the statement of case of a party shall be struck out if the party does not comply with the order; and

 

(b) the party against whom the order was made does not comply with it.

 

 

(2) A party may obtain judgment with costs by filing a request for judgment if –

(a) the order referred to in paragraph (1)(a) relates to the whole of a statement of case

 

Hi Andy,

Thanks for your latest post.

 

I am keen that the Claimant does not try and resurrect his claim or start a new one - I believe that a Judgement would do this??

Can I do this under CPR 3.5? What would be the procedure?

 

Many thanks,

peebeeh

[AndyOrch]

3.5

(1) This rule applies where –

(a) the court makes an order which includes a term that the statement of case of a party shall be struck out if the party does not comply with the order; and

(b) the party against whom the order was made does not comply with it.

(2) A party may obtain judgment with costs by filing a request for judgment if –

(a) the order referred to in paragraph (1)(a) relates to the whole of a statement of case; and

(b) where the party wishing to obtain judgment is the claimant, the claim is for –

(i) a specified amount of money;

(ii) an amount of money to be decided by the court;

(iii) delivery of goods where the claim form gives the defendant the alternative of paying their value; or

(iv) any combination of these remedies.

(3) Where judgment is obtained under this rule in a case to which paragraph (2)(b)(iii) applies, it will be judgment requiring the defendant to deliver goods, or (if he does not do so) pay the value of the goods as decided by the court (less any payments made).

(4) The request must state that the right to enter judgment has arisen because the court’s order has not been complied with.

(5) A party must make an application in accordance with Part 23 if he wishes to obtain judgment under this rule in a case to which paragraph (2) does not apply.

 

Having never done it Peebeeh and re reading the above then it would appear to me that it 3.5 is more aimed at the claimant, rather than you the defendant, unless as I stated above if you had made application for Summary Judgment or was a Part 20 Counter Claimant.You can check with your Court?

 

Regards

 

Andy

Edited April 4, 2012 by Andyorch

[peebeeh]

.Drafts are fine just try to understand that CPR 3.4/5 will attain judgment without the need to request CPR 24

Andy

 

 

 

Looking back at our previous posts we looked at this issue.

 

On my application form q.3 for yesterday's hearing I requested 'the Defendant repectfully requests that judgement be entered in his favour'

[AndyOrch]

You will have to wait until you get the order/ judgment ? through and see if the Courts actioned that point Peebeeh, I would be very interested to see if they have.

 

Andy

[peebeeh]

You will have to wait until you get the order/ judgment ? through and see if the Courts actioned that point Peebeeh, I would be very interested to see if they have.

 

Andy

 

I think that is best and we can react if we need to.

Thanks