Car returned from garage after repairs-lots faults,advice please.

[lambontheflag]

My understanding is that any advice I can glean from CAG would be completely null & void if I was ever anything less than completely open & honest

 

I feel I must clarify here that the garage has not been working under instruction from my insurance policy, nor were they ever asked merely to 'get me back on the road'

[lambontheflag]

as you can see in the op

 

the garage has not carried out really any of the repairs as authorised

 

the gearbox was allegedly - I have my doubts about this - it should have been replaced as per the agreement

 

the rear engine mount was welded - it should have been replaced as per the agreement

 

it says on the invoice 'exhaust weld' £45 for this money should have replaced the not welded, pasted flexi pipe section of the exhaust

 

helios In the invoice it says supplied & fitted ns driveshaft, my list of current faults says 'offside driveshaft leaking' this is because the new driveshaft isnt leaking, but the one on the other side is, I would have preferred two faulty driveshafts replaced rather than one

 

they have fitted a clutch @£56 which was never authorised

 

I have since taken the car to a reputable garage who may have resolved the gearbox oil leak by tightening up the big bolts that run through to make the seal as they were loose!

 

I think the problem with the steering may arise from the track rod ends since the steering arm itself does not seem to be broken... every time I get the front wheels paralell to point straight the steering wheel seems to be in a slighty different place ..

 

the horn not working is a blatant fault that should obviously have been notifed

 

the brakes servo is a blatant fault the hissing noise it emits is fully audible & braking efficiency is reduced

the manifold was allegedly repaired.. I have some questions about this - it should have been replaced as per the agreement

 

plainly everyone can see this garage has put their utmost effort into ripping me off, doing things 'cheaper' and then not passing the reduced cost onto the final bill in the slightest! Profiteering? Mugging!

 

when the car was towed to the garage I was well aware that the cost of almost any significant repair would be greater than the value of the car and I was fully aware that a repair of great significance was required

 

nonetheless I wanted to proceed as I wanted my car repaired which the garage has conspicuously failed to do.

 

Please advise : what are my rights when I ask can I expect to recieve a copy of the invoice for this supposed 3rd party repair to my gearbox? Isn't it legally wrong of the garage to do things to the car without my consent?

[lambontheflag]

the manifold was allegedly repaired.. I have some questions about this - it should have been replaced as per the agreement

 

In fact when I was informed the car was ready for collection it was a result of me telephoning them to ask if the new manifold & gasket had arrived? I was told it was ready and that they had repaired the manifold somehow.

 

I am not trying to make the garage liable for damage caused to my car in crash which they havent repaired indeed I will not attempt to make them liable for that which they are not liable

 

but they are liable for bodging the jobs they have done and if they have bodged something to the extent that it affects something else eg the gearbox affecting the steering and brakes then maybe they are liable for that as well

 

are they liable for the cost of an independent engineers report should I obtain one?

 

What I am trying to do is recoup the substantial losses made in this transaction such as exhaust weld £45 & gearbox repair £80 also if the gearbox is found to have been positioned incorrectly then I will attempt to recoup the charge for the welding of the mount which was never authorised anyway.

 

this is all besides the point though really it's not just about my finances and the fact I crashed my car I am just very unhappy that the garage has not stuck to the agreed work in any way really apart from the driveshaft and that the car was released in an unroadworthy condition which is a criminal offense

 

If the car is put on the jig and it is found that the garage has bent the floor of my vehicle to make the bodgy welding fit I will claim the £5k cost of a full repair from them in small claims -

 

if I can recoup the cost and the labour of the bad repairs that have been done that would offset the cost in budget of a complete repair of my vehicle which is what this garage should have advised me on in the first place

[sailor sam]

Ok this is all getting a bit silly now.

 

To the OP; how do you think you would be able to claim £5k? There is no way would you be able to because the car is no where near worth that much for a start. All you would be able to claim is the costs of the repair, interest and court costs. Before going down that avenue, you must give the garage to opportunity to rectify. This may include them agreeing for the work to be done elsewhere. If they say 'no', then you have the right then to take the car elsewhere and reclaim the repair costs. As far as paying for an inspection, yes you can reclaim this although it is likely you would have to do this in court.

 

To Helio; The OP is claiming that the car was returned to him in an unroadworthy condition. How would you think the best way of proving or dis-proving that would be other than putting the car through an MOT? If it is NOT roadworthy, then it will fail. I don't think I have said that an MOT will show (or prove) that it IS roadworthy. My suggestion of the MOT will provide undisputable eveidence should the OP have to take this to court (assuming it fails and that the OP is correct by claiming that the car is now unroadworthy). The other reason is that the OP can present the MOT failure sheet to the garage BEFORE taking the matter to court alond with an inspection report done bty the Fiat specialist which will show that the repairs need re-looking at.

 

Now i'm spending too much time on this un-neceassirily. I have given my advice to the OP and it is his decission whether he wants to take it or not. If in doubt, please refer to my signature but do keep us posted.

[lambontheflag]

The car will go back sometime this week for the second time

[lambontheflag]

What is my position with the unauthorised work that has been done. I verbally agreed the initial estimate but never signed the job cards

at any stage, I am disappointed that the engine mount has been welded as it is my firm belief that this is a one time fit component.

[lambontheflag]

Legal eagle to the thread please.

 

I am due to get an engineers report for tomorrow, my dad has booked the car for a geometry test at vauxhall dealer

 

will this tell me anything that an engineers report wouldnt?

[lambontheflag]

Legal eagle to the thread please

 

My dad has booked the car in for a geometry test today, anyone know if this will tell me something an engineers report wouldnt cover? It's not going on the jig, just the wheel alignment...

 

Thanks again

[heliosuk]

As have previously pointed out, this car has suffered a significant amount of damage and the reality is to break the parts listed, for a proper repair the quote will be far in excess of that quoted. To break what has been described will more than likely lead to some body distortion so steering geometry will probably not be adjustable. The quote given admittadly has not been met properley nor has the repair it self so the most you could go for is what you have been charged. An MOT will only be valid at the time of test yet the garage could well defend that at the time of inspection when quoting for the accident damage that is all they could see. You could in no way prove that they have created the problems carried out and any expert/engineer who inspects will tell you exactly the same.

 

The reality is that this car has had a major smash, though you might not realise it or appreciate it and I cannot see where you are going with this. I am pretty sure that had the garage concerned carried out the repairs to the letter of the quote you would still be left with an unroadworthy car, in fact I am that sure I'd put £100 at Ladbrookes on it.

 

I also don't understand either how tightening the bolts on a drive shaft cures an oil leak as all bolts associated with a drive shaft are not oil seal related. It just can't be. All mountings are one time fit. You cannot repair them and no repair will be sanctioned as safe by any manufactuer.

 

Perhaps, or though it's probably too late, you ought to be going through your insurer as it seems to me you are getting further and further into an already big pile of trouble.

[lambontheflag]

Helios are you there?

[heliosuk]

At times but am abroad on business for a week with limited access from Friday lunchtime.

[lambontheflag]

Just to update: car is back with garage now ..

[sailor sam]

Ok, let us know what happens. Hopefully they will get their act together.

[lambontheflag]

I am going to the garage very shortly - next 5 minutes

 

The car was left there last Wednesday on the basis that they would phone that afternoon

 

We have since emailed them with no response

 

The car has been there a week

 

we are going to see them now

 

not sure what to do or what the position is

 

I do know that the car would not have passed any MOT in the condition it was collected

 

any advices?

[Guest nez69]

Were you advised of any work required before they started, if so what and what did you authorise them to repair?

 

Were you then advised of any further work required and if so what was authorised or what was your response?

 

Why are they fitting second hand parts? Did you ask for this?

[lambontheflag]

I am in urgent need ofyour advice

 

I am to go to the garage to speak with the owner at 1oclock

 

yesterday they claim that

 

1:they had stopped gearbox oil leak

2: they had "made the engine management light go off"

3: an auto elctrician was coming to look at the horn

 

easy bits...

 

then they claim that

 

4 : yes the bodywork is bent where the gearbox fits but it was damaged caused in the accident not something that we did..

and 5: they did not mention how this pertains to their incorrect positioning of the gearbox so that it rubs on the steering arm and fatigues and melts the gaiter ---

 

the steering no longer self centres and there is free play and clicking in it last i checked

 

6 : they did not mention the leaking brake servo at all

 

bear in mind this garage the only they were was authorised to strip the car & check the fulll extent of the damage whereas they told us that the car was ok apart from a few things they told us where broken which apparently were not broken anyway & did not tell us about these things which are broken and would cause the car to be dangerous and to fail it's MOT

[lambontheflag]

we are going to 'walk around the car' ........ :L

[sailor sam]

Sorry but did not get to see your post until now as i've been extemely busy.

 

I can only basically reiterate my previous comments in respect of them attempting to repair the vehicle in the first place, and by doing so they are (in my opinion) providing some 'expert' view that the car is repairable when in fact I would consider it to be a total loss. The fact that the body has been 'bent' would back that assumption. Being a 'garage' which repairs cars as a business, would surely compell them to have a responsibility in making sure that any car they repair is in fact able to be repaired to a roadworthy condition. It seems that i your case, this has not happened. At the very least, you ought to be able to obtain a refund on the repair which they attempted. No garage worth their salt should even attempt a repair that they wern't confident of carrying out to a standard where the car will pass an MOT. If it DOES pass an MOT, then they have fulfilled their obligation otherwise they A) get it to a standard where it will pass an MOT or B) give you your money back. If they don't do one or the other, then trading standards will be your next port of call along with VOSA.

[lambontheflag]

belated update:

 

the car was taken back to the garage

 

the owner at the car with us and following this he

agreed to repair the gearbox where it was leaking and make the casing fit flush over the clutch

make the brakes system adequate - stop servo hissing

 

make steering self centre and align

 

make horn work

 

resolve issues causing engine management light to be activated

 

and was adamant that the gearbox is positioned correctly so agreed to replace the piece of melted & displaced steering rack with new .

 

also pointed out to him they had tried to get me to buy a part which i indisputably didn't need

 

pointed out that the centre flexi joint weld needed more exhaust paste on it where he could have replaced this part for the price he charged for the welding - owner agreed to re-weld..

 

 

they agreed to fix this was over a month ago now for no extra money from us

 

however i have been struggling without my car and although they offered me a courtesy car i feel that this is taking an inordinate amount of time unreasonably

 

last tuesday they emailed me and said all issues are sorted apart from brake servo which they are trying to source second hand - i saw they had a compatible brekaer in the yard but when i spoke to them about this verbally that day the manager & assitant manager informed me that this rubbish looking car was actually their courtesy car/ and that the owner who is dealing with my car is not here ... again

 

this place is a limited company does this mean i cannot take them to small claims for a full refund?

[heliosuk]

I will go to Ladbrookes tomorrow and place a bet that when this car is back with the items supposedly fixed it will still not self centre, will handle like a pig and frankly will be an absolute nightmare.

 

Why wasn't this dealt with by an insurance company as my feel is that that this car is a total write off. It is far from economic repair.

 

Again..........from the damage described, this car has a seriously bent front end and cannot be fixed properly without a serious amount of cash thrown at it.

[sailor sam]

No, it dosn't mean that you cannot take them to court.

 

If I was you, I would WRITE a letter saying that unless the car is reapired to a complete roadworthy and satifactory standard where it would pass an MOT within the next 7 days, then you will require a full refund. If that fails to produce, then i'm afraid court is going to be your only option. My opinions in my eralier post (#43) still stand and I think they have commenced a repair that cannot be sucessfully economically completed and they are finding it difficult to admit this.

[lambontheflag]

Thankyou Sailor Sam & Helios thankyou both so much for all your help & advice in all of this you really have made a world of difference.

 

OK so I'm going to write an email now saying that if they can't give the car the full repair within 7 days I am going to require a refund ...

 

and if they refuse then what are my options?

 

.. with many thanks & kind regards one love

[lambontheflag]

OK guys difficult question

 

but how could the garage have known that the front end was bent? I have a feeling that this is what the court case would rest on

[heliosuk]

Sorry for the delay in replying lambon. Just the shear amount of damage to mountings. The mountings would generally be expected to cope with input loads of upto 40Kn plus a safety margin and that is some load so to break them means one hell of a thump.

 

To get some idea of the damage done watch some crash test videos and bare in mind that the chassis legs are designed to deform taking energy out of the collision. Then think of what happened in your case where no deformation is designed in. The only place for it to go in order to dissapate is through the mountings which is why they probably broke and residual force will then bend the legs transfering through the body to other mountings and pushing them out of alignment.

 

Any competent garage would realise this.

 

The physics of it all are far more complex than I describe but should give you an idea as to what happens and why the fron will be bent.

[lambontheflag]

Hello there helios and thanks be for this important information

 

We have the car back and the steering self centres :L my dad picked it up whilst I have been away & paid this nefarious garage £100 for a secondhand servo & they have put MOT on it.

 

I am not quite sure where I stand now, I haven't taken the car on any ramps, although perhaps I should as it appears the left driveshaft which they replaced is leaking oil :L

 

Sadly my grandmother who the car belonged to originally passed away last week and I am somewhat attached to this vehicle,

 

is there any prospect of bending the car back?