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    • further polished WS using above suggestions and also included couple of more modifications highlighted in orange are those ok to include?   Background   1.1  The Defendant received the Parking Charge Notice (PCN) on the 06th of January 2020 following the vehicle being parked at Arla Old Dairy, South Ruislip on the 05th of December 2019.   Unfair PCN   2.1  On 19th December 2023 the Defendant sent the Claimant's solicitors a CPR request.  As shown in Exhibit 1 (pages 7-13) sent by the solicitors the signage displayed in their evidence clearly shows a £60.00 parking charge notice (which will be reduced to £30 if paid within 14 days of issue).  2.2  Yet the PCN sent by the Claimant is for a £100.00 parking charge notice (reduced to £60 if paid within 30 days of issue).   2.3        The Claimant relies on signage to create a contract.  It is unlawful for the Claimant to write that the charge is £60 on their signs and then send demands for £100.    2.4        The unlawful £100 charge is also the basis for the Claimant's Particulars of Claim.  No Locus Standi  3.1  I do not believe a contract with the landowner, that is provided following the defendant’s CPR request, gives MET Parking Services a right to bring claims in their own name. Definition of “Relevant contract” from the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012, Schedule 4,  2 [1] means a contract Including a contract arising only when the vehicle was parked on the relevant land between the driver and a person who is-   (a) the owner or occupier of the land; or   (b) Authorised, under or by virtue of arrangements made by the owner or occupier of the land, to enter into a contract with the driver requiring the payment of parking charges in respect of the parking of the vehicle on the land. According to https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2006/46/section/44   For a contract to be valid, it requires a director from each company to sign and then two independent witnesses must confirm those signatures.   3.2  The Defendant requested to see such a contract in the CPR request.  The fact that no contract has been produced with the witness signatures present means the contract has not been validly executed. Therefore, there can be no contract established between MET Parking Services and the motorist. Even if “Parking in Electric Bay” could form a contract (which it cannot), it is immaterial. There is no valid contract.  Illegal Conduct – No Contract Formed   4.1 At the time of writing, the Claimant has failed to provide the following, in response to the CPR request from myself.   4.2        The legal contract between the Claimant and the landowner (which in this case is Standard Life Investments UK) to provide evidence that there is an agreement in place with landowner with the necessary authority to issue parking charge notices and to pursue payment by means of litigation.   4.3 Proof of planning permission granted for signage etc under the Town and country Planning Act 1990. Lack of planning permission is a criminal offence under this Act and no contract can be formed where criminality is involved.   4.4        I also do not believe the claimant possesses these documents.   No Keeper Liability   5.1        The defendant was not the driver at the time and date mentioned in the PCN and the claimant has not established keeper liability under schedule 4 of the PoFA 2012. In this matter, the defendant puts it to the claimant to produce strict proof as to who was driving at the time.   5.2 The claimant in their Notice To Keeper also failed to comply with PoFA 2012 Schedule 4 section 9[2][f] while mentioning “the right to recover from the keeper so much of that parking charge as remains unpaid” where they did not include statement “(if all the applicable conditions under this Schedule are met)”.     5.3         The claimant did not mention parking period, times on the photographs are separate from the PCN and in any case are that arrival and departure times not the parking period since their times include driving to and from the parking space as a minimum and can include extra time to allow pedestrians and other vehicles to pass in front.    Protection of Freedoms Act 2012   The notice must -   (a) specify the vehicle, the relevant land on which it was parked and the period of parking to which the notice relates;  22. In the persuasive judgement K4GF167G - Premier Park Ltd v Mr Mathur - Horsham County Court – 5 January 2024 it was on this very point that the judge dismissed this claim.  5.4  A the PCN does not comply with the Act the Defendant as keeper is not liable.  No Breach of Contract   6.1       No breach of contract occurred because the PCN and contract provided as part of the defendant’s CPR request shows different post code, PCN shows HA4 0EY while contract shows HA4 0FY. According to PCN defendant parked on HA4 0EY which does not appear to be subject to the postcode covered by the contract.  6.2         The entrance sign does not mention anything about there being other terms inside the car park so does not offer a contract which makes it only an offer to treat,  Interest  7.1  It is unreasonable for the Claimant to delay litigation for  Double Recovery   7.2  The claim is littered with made-up charges.  7.3  As noted above, the Claimant's signs state a £60 charge yet their PCN is for £100.  7.4  As well as the £100 parking charge, the Claimant seeks recovery of an additional £70.  This is simply a poor attempt to circumvent the legal costs cap at small claims.  7.5 Since 2019, many County Courts have considered claims in excess of £100 to be an abuse of process leading to them being struck out ab initio. An example, in the Caernarfon Court in VCS v Davies, case No. FTQZ4W28 on 4th September 2019, District Judge Jones-Evans stated “Upon it being recorded that District Judge Jones- Evans has over a very significant period of time warned advocates (...) in many cases of this nature before this court that their claim for £60 is unenforceable in law and is an abuse of process and is nothing more than a poor attempt to go behind the decision of the Supreme Court v Beavis which inter alia decided that a figure of £160 as a global sum claimed in this case would be a penalty and not a genuine pre-estimate of loss and therefore unenforceable in law and if the practice continued, he would treat all cases as a claim for £160 and therefore a penalty and unenforceable in law it is hereby declared (…) the claim is struck out and declared to be wholly without merit and an abuse of process.”  7.6 In Claim Nos. F0DP806M and F0DP201T, District Judge Taylor echoed earlier General Judgment or Orders of District Judge Grand, stating ''It is ordered that the claim is struck out as an abuse of process. The claim contains a substantial charge additional to the parking charge which it is alleged the Defendant contracted to pay. This additional charge is not recoverabl15e under the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012, Schedule 4 nor with reference to the judgment in Parking Eye v Beavis. It is an abuse of process from the Claimant to issue a knowingly inflated claim for an additional sum which it is not entitled to recover. This order has been made by the court of its own initiative without a hearing pursuant to CPR Rule 3.3(4)) of the Civil Procedure Rules 1998...''  7.7 In the persuasive case of G4QZ465V - Excel Parking Services Ltd v Wilkinson – Bradford County Court -2 July 2020 (Exhibit 4) the judge had decided that Excel had won. However, due to Excel adding on the £60 the Judge dismissed the case.  7.8        The addition of costs not previously specified on signage are also in breach of the Consumer Rights Act 2015, Schedule 2, specifically paras 6, 10 and 14.   7.9        It is the Defendant’s position that the Claimant in this case has knowingly submitted inflated costs and thus the entire claim should be similarly struck out in accordance with Civil Procedure Rule 3.3(4).   In Conclusion   8.1        I invite the court to dismiss the claim.  Statement of Truth  I believe that the facts stated in this witness statement are true. I understand that proceedings for contempt of court may be brought against anyone who makes, or causes to be made, a false statement in a document verified by a statement of truth without an honest belief in its truth.   
    • Well the difference is that in all our other cases It was Kev who was trying to entrap the motorist so sticking two fingers up to him and daring him to try court was from a position of strength. In your case, sorry, you made a mistake so you're not in the position of strength.  I've looked on Google Maps and the signs are few & far between as per Kev's MO, but there is an entrance sign saying "Pay & Display" (and you've admitted in writing that you knew you had to pay) and the signs by the payment machines do say "Sea View Car Park" (and you've admitted in writing you paid the wrong car park ... and maybe outed yourself as the driver). Something I missed in my previous post is that the LoC is only for one ticket, not two. Sorry, but it's impossible to definitively advise what to so. Personally I'd probably gamble on Kev being a serial bottler of court and reply with a snotty letter ridiculing the signage (given you mentioned the signage in your appeal) - but it is a gamble.  
    • No! What has happened is that your pix were up-to-date: 5 hours' maximum stay and £100 PCN. The lazy solicitors have sent ancient pictures: 4 hours' maximum stay and £60 PCN. Don't let on!  Let them be hoisted by their own lazy petard in the court hearing (if they don't bottle before).
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      The judge's reasoning is very useful and will certainly be helpful in any other cases relating to third-party rights where the customer has contracted with the courier company by using a broker.
      This is generally speaking the problem with using PackLink who are domiciled in Spain and very conveniently out of reach of the British justice system.

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judi24 v Yorkshire Bank **settled**


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Update -

Got a 'lovely' letter from Neil McKirdy 1 week after LBA to say that he will respond to my compalint within the next 4 weeks. Am I obliged to wait these 4 weeks or should I continue with next step after the initial 14 days are up? If I continue with the next step should I let him know? Any advice please.

 

If you gave him the 4 weeks,you would probably hear nothing or at least nothing positive from him.Just a delaying tactic.Carry on as normal

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Just wanted to confirm Is this the address to put on the moneyclaim form:

REGISTERED ADDRESS: -

YORKSHIRE BANK PLC

20 MERRION WAY

LEEDS

LS2 8NZ

I've not used this address before - always either the branch or the Glasgow address.

Yorkshire Bank: Claim for £4777.85! :o MCOL sent 03/10/06

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I would use the branch address as they will know about it, and you should avoid the Scottish one.

The Consumer Action Group is a free help site.

Should you be offered help that requires payment please report it to site team.

Advice & opinions given by Caro are personal, are not endorsed by Consumer Action Group or Bank Action Group, and are offered informally, without prejudice & without liability. Your decisions and actions are your own, and should you be in any doubt, you are advised to seek the opinion of a qualified professional.

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It will all get sent to the same place in the end.

The Consumer Action Group is a free help site.

Should you be offered help that requires payment please report it to site team.

Advice & opinions given by Caro are personal, are not endorsed by Consumer Action Group or Bank Action Group, and are offered informally, without prejudice & without liability. Your decisions and actions are your own, and should you be in any doubt, you are advised to seek the opinion of a qualified professional.

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Notice of issue recieved from mcol today. I take it that the yb hs 28 days to resopnd from the date of issue - 8th oct. I take it I just sit tight and wait and see what the YB come up with.

Yorkshire Bank: Claim for £4777.85! :o MCOL sent 03/10/06

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They have 14 days to respond, and if they state that they intend to defend they will have an extra 14 days to submit their defence. The process is clearly explained on the MCOL website.

The Consumer Action Group is a free help site.

Should you be offered help that requires payment please report it to site team.

Advice & opinions given by Caro are personal, are not endorsed by Consumer Action Group or Bank Action Group, and are offered informally, without prejudice & without liability. Your decisions and actions are your own, and should you be in any doubt, you are advised to seek the opinion of a qualified professional.

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Judi,

 

Keep me updated can you, as I too received the same letter from Neil today. Filing MCOL on Monday.

What address did you eventually send the MCOL too? Was it your branch?

Yorkshire Bank Plc £3553.77 Prelim letter sent 14/9/06 LBA sent 22/9/06, MCOL Sent 10/10/06 MCOL Notice of Issue Rcvd 12/10/06, MCOL Acknowledged 17/10/06, £929.00 Offer Rcvd, 03/11/06 - Rejected, 09/11/06 YB Defended, 10/11/06 Transferred to Local Court, AQ Returned;) 30/11/06 Copy of Banks AQ Received, 1 month extra asked for by Clydesdale, 09/01/07 £2140.00 Offer Rcvd, 09/01/07 - Rejected, 11/11/07 Allocation To Small Claims Track, Court Date Set - 05/03/07, 15/01/07 £2590.00 Offer Rcvd, 15/11/07 - Rejected, 07/02/07 £3773.77 Offer Rcvd (FULL), 12/02/07 - Accepted, 21/02/07 - Chq Received for FULL AMOUNT. :)

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Recieved notification of intention to defend today from MCOL. Also recieved a letter from YB's legal department asking for a schedule of charges saying I have failed to supply this withe MCOL. They write

 

'should you fail to provide such details, we will apply to the court to have your calim struck out pursuant to CPR Part 3.4 (2) © '

 

they have given me til the 12th Oct to comply. I have already sent them this twice with my initial request and LBA.

 

My question is where do I send this to? Do I send it to the court or dirctly to thier Legal office? or both? Can I fax it to them as they have put a fax number on thier correspondance?

 

Please help as I don't want to make a mistake at this stage and get this claim thown out.

Yorkshire Bank: Claim for £4777.85! :o MCOL sent 03/10/06

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They are really trying it on here. When I started the process it did not include a schedule of charges until the MCOL stage and I didn't supply one until I submitted my Allocation Questionnaire, by which time I had a copy of their defence and counterclaim. As you have already supplied it twice you are not required to supply it when you submit your claim according to the Patricia Pearl Small Claims book that I have just been reading. We all know that it is not possible to attach the schedule when you claim on MCOL.

 

I think this is what they are referring to:

 

While many applications under rule 3.4(2) can be made without evidence in support, the applicant should consider whether facts need to be proved and, if so, whether evidence in support should be filed and served.

 

I suggest you send them a copy to the YB legal office (I assume that is where the letter came from) and one to MCOL. I would send Yorkshire Bank a covering letter sweetly pointing out that you have already supplied YB with this twice, but will do all you can to bring this action to a speedy resolution.

 

I would send a copy to MCOL with a covering letter, including your claim number and say that you have already sent YB their copy of the schedule as you were concerned as they intended to apply for the claim to be struck out. You could also send a copy of their letter and your response to show that you have complied with their request. I believe that will all get forwarded to your local court and with a bit of luck the judge will not be impressed by YB's actions.

The Consumer Action Group is a free help site.

Should you be offered help that requires payment please report it to site team.

Advice & opinions given by Caro are personal, are not endorsed by Consumer Action Group or Bank Action Group, and are offered informally, without prejudice & without liability. Your decisions and actions are your own, and should you be in any doubt, you are advised to seek the opinion of a qualified professional.

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caro thanks very much for this advice. It seems I am getting the hang of this cos I have already done most of what you have suggested this evening. I have written to both the YB legal dept and MCOL with another schedule of charges attached. What I didn't think about was including the letter from the YB with the letter to MCOL, this is a great idea as it may help the court see just how difficult the YB are being. Will add this on before posting.

I am also going to fax the schedule of charges directly to the legal dept. tommorow aswell as posting incase they argue that the letter doesn't get there before the 12th. Want to cover all bases if you know what I mean.

 

Thanks again

 

J

Yorkshire Bank: Claim for £4777.85! :o MCOL sent 03/10/06

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I do know what you mean but I very nearly advised you to ignore the request and let them try and get it struck out, and then write to the court and tell them what a load of bullpoo this was cos they have already had the info twice. It pays to appear reasonable to the court though.

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Should you be offered help that requires payment please report it to site team.

Advice & opinions given by Caro are personal, are not endorsed by Consumer Action Group or Bank Action Group, and are offered informally, without prejudice & without liability. Your decisions and actions are your own, and should you be in any doubt, you are advised to seek the opinion of a qualified professional.

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Yeah I thought I was better to appear helpful and reasonable It might help to highlight how obstructive and awkward the YB are being. It is difficult to know how to play it. Half of me want's to be as difficult as them but at the end of the day what I'm after is my money back not just prove a point and win an arguement although taht would be nice too!

Yorkshire Bank: Claim for £4777.85! :o MCOL sent 03/10/06

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I think both you will get your money and prove your point. Softly softly catchy monkey!

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Should you be offered help that requires payment please report it to site team.

Advice & opinions given by Caro are personal, are not endorsed by Consumer Action Group or Bank Action Group, and are offered informally, without prejudice & without liability. Your decisions and actions are your own, and should you be in any doubt, you are advised to seek the opinion of a qualified professional.

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  • 2 weeks later...

Judi

 

Whats the latest with you? - Ive just received the same letter as you.

Yorkshire Bank Plc £3553.77 Prelim letter sent 14/9/06 LBA sent 22/9/06, MCOL Sent 10/10/06 MCOL Notice of Issue Rcvd 12/10/06, MCOL Acknowledged 17/10/06, £929.00 Offer Rcvd, 03/11/06 - Rejected, 09/11/06 YB Defended, 10/11/06 Transferred to Local Court, AQ Returned;) 30/11/06 Copy of Banks AQ Received, 1 month extra asked for by Clydesdale, 09/01/07 £2140.00 Offer Rcvd, 09/01/07 - Rejected, 11/11/07 Allocation To Small Claims Track, Court Date Set - 05/03/07, 15/01/07 £2590.00 Offer Rcvd, 15/11/07 - Rejected, 07/02/07 £3773.77 Offer Rcvd (FULL), 12/02/07 - Accepted, 21/02/07 - Chq Received for FULL AMOUNT. :)

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Not much happening at the moment. Waiting for YB to defend/counteclaim at the moment. Have complied with everything they have asked me to do. They still have 2 weeks to do this so just biding my time at the moment - thanks for asking.

I am spending time reading through threads that are a bit further on to see what to expect next - I'm trying to be patient - not my strongest point but you need it with this lot!

Yorkshire Bank: Claim for £4777.85! :o MCOL sent 03/10/06

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Thanks for the update - read your pm too.

Yorkshire Bank Plc £3553.77 Prelim letter sent 14/9/06 LBA sent 22/9/06, MCOL Sent 10/10/06 MCOL Notice of Issue Rcvd 12/10/06, MCOL Acknowledged 17/10/06, £929.00 Offer Rcvd, 03/11/06 - Rejected, 09/11/06 YB Defended, 10/11/06 Transferred to Local Court, AQ Returned;) 30/11/06 Copy of Banks AQ Received, 1 month extra asked for by Clydesdale, 09/01/07 £2140.00 Offer Rcvd, 09/01/07 - Rejected, 11/11/07 Allocation To Small Claims Track, Court Date Set - 05/03/07, 15/01/07 £2590.00 Offer Rcvd, 15/11/07 - Rejected, 07/02/07 £3773.77 Offer Rcvd (FULL), 12/02/07 - Accepted, 21/02/07 - Chq Received for FULL AMOUNT. :)

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  • 2 weeks later...

YB have till 5th Nov to defend - that is 28 days from when the claim was deemed to be served. This is a Sunday! If there defence is not logged by Fri will they still be able to submit it by sunday - or will they have till monday 6th to defend - I wish they would hurry up! so we can get to the next round of stalling waiting!!

Yorkshire Bank: Claim for £4777.85! :o MCOL sent 03/10/06

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I didn't think that claims could be served at weekends. I am pretty sure they would have until Monday, and I am not sure that anything would happen at MCOL's end on a Sunday TBH.

The Consumer Action Group is a free help site.

Should you be offered help that requires payment please report it to site team.

Advice & opinions given by Caro are personal, are not endorsed by Consumer Action Group or Bank Action Group, and are offered informally, without prejudice & without liability. Your decisions and actions are your own, and should you be in any doubt, you are advised to seek the opinion of a qualified professional.

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I didn't think so either. But the claim was deemed to be served on the 8th of Oct so 28 days is the 5th of Nov which is also a Sunday so it doesn't make sense.

Yorkshire Bank: Claim for £4777.85! :o MCOL sent 03/10/06

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