Debts over 40k, Cant go bankrupt. What do we do?

[pengy666]

Thanks PGH

 

My cre dit file has templates to send out, I will take a look and see if there is one for that.

 

I have basically provided my name and address and date of birth.

 

Informed them my father and me have the same name and initials and they have linked me incorrectly. I have requested they provide ny informtion they hold about me under the freedom of information act. I also provided the addresses they have used and linked to me informing them this information is incorrect.

Edited January 2, 2011 by pengy666

[pengy666]

There has been a new plan.

 

To pay all my debts off we are moving out of our rented property and moving in to my mother in laws house.

 

We will have approx £1500 pcm to be able to pay off debts. We are aiming to have the large majority paid off within 12 months to be able to get a mortgage.

 

We are stuck in a vicious trap of debt and no credit, the CCJ just prevents any mortgage lenders accepting us without a minumum of 30% deposit up front.

 

Do you guys know the best way to handle companies and getting them to agree a lower amount? Does cold hard immediate cash do it?

[Tingy]

Pengy,

 

Great to hear you've got a plan together. Was going to pm you to say help is on its way on Weds. - will still let them have a look.

 

Are you looking to agree Full and Final Settlements. If you are, make sure you agree it with the creditor that owns the debt. Before you hand over a penny get in writing from them that this is in Full and Final settlement of xxxxx debt and that any remaining balance will be written off and not able to be sold to any third party for further collection. Also make sure that the debt will be marked as settled on your credit file, not partially settled or any of the other tricks they try.

 

Hard cash definitely helps. Offer a little and negotiate up. Any left over can go towards the deposit for your mortgage.

 

Finally, give your mum in law a BIG BIG hug! She's done you a big favour there!

 

Good news, well done.

[Undercover-Elsa]

Morning Pengy ,

Tingy pointed me to your most interesting thread, I can see it's moved on rapidly in the last day!

 

It's a wise decision to move in with your MIL, but you need to plan your strategy very carefully. Every creditor will want the most they can get out of you, regardless of the others, so obviously what we don't want is for them to each take a lump of the £1500 a month for 12 months then revert to demanding money each month.

 

Low Full and Final Settlements are far easier to negotiate on accounts with poor or no paperwork.

As you've sent off your CCA requests you'll need to tailor the offer to each depending on what they respond with.

Bear in mind that, where debts have been sold on, the DCA will only have paid around 10% of the amount owed.

Where there is a likelihood of a debt including missold Payment Protection Insurance or penalty charges (overlimit or late payment fees on credit cards) then this should be investigated and taken into account with your offer. Indeed they could owe you/your wife more than the balance they're claiming.

 

 

 

Please don't rush into this, F&F's can be tricky.

• They must be worded in a watertight way to ensure they are legally "estopped" from claiming the balance at a later date.
  
• Ideally they should include a clause that your credit file is marked as "fully satisfied".
  
• Payment should ideally be made via a third party, which makes the transaction more legally binding.
  
• All negotiations should be in writing and sent by recorded delivery. The resulting agreement should be clearly marked as a Full and Final offer.
  

Looking at your list of debts, the obvious starting point is the overdraft, as it's the one that isn't fully covered by the CCA, and the refund of bank charges issue is a mess at the moment.

What's the exact position with the OD at the moment..I see BC is involved. What's he threatening?

 

Littlewoods - bless em...I sent them a CCA for the CC and Catalogue for my neice 2 years ago. Never heard a thing since..no threats, no statements, nothing. 4 years to Statute Barred

 

This is just my opinion, but if you want to keep the offers low, nothing makes them more eager than stopping paying them on the basis of a genuine dispute. Hence, let's take these debts one at a time, see what each comes back with, and decide on that basis.

 

Obviously don't pass on your MIL's phone number when you move. Everything must be in writing, and your wife will be relieved of the stress of the constant phone calls.

 

You are doing great, just take your time in deciding how to deal with each one - they can be so devious, so run anything past us first.

When it comes to drafting an F&F template, I have a legal friend on here who will be happy to advise

 

All the very best,

 

Elsa x

Edited January 4, 2011 by Undercover-Elsa

[Undercover-Elsa]

Further thoughts..

You may well have done this already, but if not, while you're waiting for the responses, invest in a ring binder file for each account. Organise the letters already received and a copy of letters sent in chronological order. I also use plastic folders for the loose stuff, recorded delivery receipts etc.

At the start of each file put a couple of sheets of A4 card and use these to keep a diary, make notes etc.

That way it's easy to keep track and plan the next stage.

[Tingy]

Totally agree with Elsa - and she'r resolved the issue that was plaguing me of whether or not to place the accounts into dispute. I told you she was good!

 

Thanks Elsa!

[The Debt Star]

Good advice from Tingy there - as always

 

I'm not sure if anyone else m,entioned this above, but when you get the quarterly or annual DMP reviews, I suggest she doesn't speak to them on the phone but puts everything in writign and request - in writing - that you only want to be written to. This WILL take a lot of the distress out of the situation (although getting the threat-o-grams is not pleasant, it IS better than the bullying, high pressure phone calls).

 

Also as Tingy suggests, keep paying them SOMETHING, even if a tpklenm payment as this does make it harder for them.

 

Have you considered the CCCS at all? Ipersonally came off my CCCS DMP because I left the country for a while and needed to sell my house, which the CCCS were eyeing up for the creditors. Otherwise, we were okay with them for the most part and THEY correspond to the DCAs and creditors for you. Also it will have no impact on your wife's employment situation as no one will ever know or ever find out. There is no record of CCCS involvement.

[pengy666]

Further thoughts..

You may well have done this already, but if not, while you're waiting for the responses, invest in a ring binder file for each account. Organise the letters already received and a copy of letters sent in chronological order. I also use plastic folders for the loose stuff, recorded delivery receipts etc.

At the start of each file put a couple of sheets of A4 card and use these to keep a diary, make notes etc.

That way it's easy to keep track and plan the next stage.

 

Thanks Elsa for the Great advice.

 

Currently I have just stepped in to handle all calls. I don't mind talking to them as I won't take no pressure. I apply pressure I always take calls armed.

 

All corrospondence via ph one calls has stopped, It has only been capquest who recently got in touch. Thats when I tool over entirely.

 

 

 

My wife has always and still does organise all contact letters and amounts, She has a good method (she used to be an admin manager for a few high street companies) she has spreadsheets with all contact times, Copies of all the Expense sheets we send to all companies and all receipts and recorded postage stuff all with the relevant companies own folders etc (including PC documents to correspond)

Edited January 4, 2011 by pengy666

[pengy666]

Good advice from Tingy there - as always

 

I'm not sure if anyone else m,entioned this above, but when you get the quarterly or annual DMP reviews, I suggest she doesn't speak to them on the phone but puts everything in writign and request - in writing - that you only want to be written to. This WILL take a lot of the distress out of the situation (although getting the threat-o-grams is not pleasant, it IS better than the bullying, high pressure phone calls).

 

Also as Tingy suggests, keep paying them SOMETHING, even if a tpklenm payment as this does make it harder for them.

 

Have you considered the CCCS at all? Ipersonally came off my CCCS DMP because I left the country for a while and needed to sell my house, which the CCCS were eyeing up for the creditors. Otherwise, we were okay with them for the most part and THEY correspond to the DCAs and creditors for you. Also it will have no impact on your wife's employment situation as no one will ever know or ever find out. There is no record of CCCS involvement.

 

Sorry, should have said in OP. We have tried various options of Debt managment and advice including payplan. These types of managment companis are the reason we owe so much. We originally owed £13K. We contacted Eurodebt and they told us "max your cards, They won't get it back so make the most of it!" What a mistake. They completely ruined us. Managed to gain us a CC J!

 

No one can help reallly all recommend Bankruptcy, When told its not an option they then suggest IVA's.

 

We have not got enough Capital to do IVA's, or time. The major part in moving out of our house is we physically can't afford to pay debts and our rent. With rent increase due in february.

 

We have been paying then for nearly 7 years now. Enough is enough. Only real way to get any headway and be able to come out of it and have the oppurtunity to look at mortgage's is to pay them and have account settled.

Edited January 4, 2011 by pengy666

[pengy666]

Ok

 

So once I have received contact regarding C CA's, I can then look to find final settlements?

 

We are starting with the smallest and paying them off. Some can be paid the first month we have free capital. Some will take 2-3 months to pay. I intend in asking all creditors to reduce final figures, Which of course I will turn down and offer a ridiculous amount in the intention of them accepting if I paid immediatly. My ammunition will be accept or I will go to the next creditor and put them to back of queue. I think you know what I mean? Basically give them option to accept a figure or carry on receiving £1 and maybe another 12-24 months before I can offer any money again?

 

Now surely they would be stupid to not want to take something from me?

[pengy666]

I received a small compliments slip from Newman De bt collection Agency. (the HS BC over draft, This could be a loan that we are paying via a court judgment!)

 

It enclosed my Postal order and hand written on slip

 

"Please be advised that we have passed your request to our client.

 

Please find enclosed postal order

 

Thank you"

 

does this mean they don't own the debt and is un-enforcable by that company? Should they give me my money back they have been receiving, or provide information on my account and where my money has gone?

Edited January 4, 2011 by pengy666

[Tingy]

I received a small compliments slip from Newman Debt collection Agency. (the HS BC over draft)

 

It enclosed my Postal order and hand written on slip

 

"Please be advised that we have passed your request to our client.

 

Please find enclosed postal order

 

Thank you"

 

does this mean they don't own the debt and is un-enforcable by that company? Should they give me my money back they have been receiving, or provide information on my account and where my money has gone?

 

I would imagine that this means they have an equitable assignment not an absolute assignment, so they have the right to try and collect the debt from you, but no duties or ownership of the debt. From what they say it appears the OC still own the debt. You need to find out now if monies paid to Newman have been passed on to offset your debt. In this case it's always best to pay the OC direct - often they refuse money as they've assigned the debt to the DCA to collect, but usually there is an on line payment facility where you can pay.

 

The overdraft is an unfortunate one to come back first as it's debateable whether or not an overdraft is covered by the CCA.

 

It does not mean the debt is unenforceable - sorry!

[pengy666]

Ok, Now as I havent been dealing from the beggining I spoke to wife. Court judgement is for overdraft. the newman one is from same bank for a loan.

 

I thought they were trying to collect same thing twice.

 

This is my second largest debt, nearly 9k

[Undercover-Elsa]

Hi Pengy,

As the Overdraft is subject to a CCJ, I'd be inclined to sort this out first. It can be tricky arranging F&F's on a CCJ, so needs to be done verrrry carefully and correctly. I can get someone to help you with that.

I'd then prioritise depending on responses to CCA Requests..ie pay those with enforceable agreements first, rather than prioritising based on amount owed.

Your call though...

 

Elsa x

[sequenci]

Hi Pengy,

As the Overdraft is subject to a CCJ, I'd be inclined to sort this out first. It can be tricky arranging F&F's on a CCJ, so needs to be done verrrry carefully and correctly. I can get someone to help you with that.

I'd then prioritise depending on responses to CCA Requests..ie pay those with enforceable agreements first, rather than prioritising based on amount owed.

Your call though...

 

Elsa x

 

I agree with everything Elsa Says

[Undercover-Elsa]

Sequenci! The very person I had in mind for help with the F&F on a CCJ!

 

Are you psychic???

[sequenci]

Are you psychic???

 

I'm usually floating around Having busy couple of weeks so being a little bit more invisible than normal at the mo!

[Undercover-Elsa]

LOL, I hope you'll be able float back when the time comes, to help word an F&F letter which takes account of a CCJ?

Am I right in thinking it's done by direct negotiation with the creditor initially, with a clause that they mark the CCJ as satisfied with a certain time from recept of funds?

 

Elsa x

[sequenci]

It's pretty identical to the CCJ although you need to seek clarification from the judgment creditor that the debt has been settled so that you can make an application to the court for a certificate of satisfaction

[The Debt Star]

Tingy, overdrafts are not covered by the CCA(regardless of what others tell you, they are not). I discovered this at great cost in my HSBC battle. They are running credit and can be recalled whenever the bank likes.

 

Pengy, are you saying you have the capital available to make F&Fs on debt of £40K? In my experience (and only in my experience) creditors and their threat monkey DCAs only seriously look at F&Fs of 50% and higher. I know that a chorus of voices will shout that they got F&Fs agreed for a thruppeny bit and half a bob, but I never managed it. Take for instance my £6500 with Egg. C-rapQuest were managing this and I was paying a very low repayment as it was ex-CCCS. They still wanted 75% F&F and simply would not budge, even when i offerdd them 50% it was still refused.

 

I mention this so you don't set your heart too much on resolving matters this way.

 

Also, don't forget to investigate if there was any PPI sold on the credit cards and loans. 10 bucks and my left nut says that with £40K of debt there WILL be some juicy PPI claims waiting for you somewhere

[sequenci]

Tingy, overdrafts are not covered by the CCA(regardless of what others tell you, they are not). I discovered this at great cost in my HSBC battle. They are running credit and can be recalled whenever the bank likes.

 

Hey there, current account overdrafts are regulated. They are exempt from part V of the Act, which covers the form and content of agreements - which means that you don't have to sign the same sort of credit agreement as a credit card or a loan.

[The Debt Star]

Hey there, current account overdrafts are regulated. They are exempt from part V of the Act, which covers the form and content of agreements - which means that you don't have to sign the same sort of credit agreement as a credit card or a loan.

 

I'm not having a pop at you sequenci, but what irritates me is that I read posts persuading me that banks have to evidence thwir opt out under Part V and unless they do so ODs are regulated by the CCA. But, in truth, that means Diddly Sqwat. In capitals. And thats because banks do what they jolly well like and won't ever send proof of their compliance and therefore over drafts are not regulated by the CCA and there is none of the (so-called) protection of the CCA to overdraft customers.

 

I've been through all of this in my dispute with HSBC and can assure anyone willing to give it a try that it is a waste of time, printer ink and paper arguing any differently.

[pengy666]

If you could put together a little guide on what to do about settling the CCJ that would be great.

 

I expected to pay a minimum of 50%. Of course I will offer way below 50% to at least try my luck. you never know.

 

Its great to have so much advice. This has been way more helpful than any of the goverment regulated companies that ry to offer me loans to pay it!

 

Currently reading Seq's blog now

 

[sequenci]

It's much more difficult to deal with overdrafts for sure. Sure is frustrating.

 

Grr @ http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/1974/39/section/74

[pengy666]

Black and white that is.