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    • The private submersible industry was shaken after the implosion of the OceanGate Titan sub last year.View the full article
    • further polished WS using above suggestions and also included couple of more modifications highlighted in orange are those ok to include?   Background   1.1  The Defendant received the Parking Charge Notice (PCN) on the 06th of January 2020 following the vehicle being parked at Arla Old Dairy, South Ruislip on the 05th of December 2019.   Unfair PCN   2.1  On 19th December 2023 the Defendant sent the Claimant's solicitors a CPR request.  As shown in Exhibit 1 (pages 7-13) sent by the solicitors the signage displayed in their evidence clearly shows a £60.00 parking charge notice (which will be reduced to £30 if paid within 14 days of issue).  2.2  Yet the PCN sent by the Claimant is for a £100.00 parking charge notice (reduced to £60 if paid within 30 days of issue).   2.3        The Claimant relies on signage to create a contract.  It is unlawful for the Claimant to write that the charge is £60 on their signs and then send demands for £100.    2.4        The unlawful £100 charge is also the basis for the Claimant's Particulars of Claim.  No Locus Standi  3.1  I do not believe a contract with the landowner, that is provided following the defendant’s CPR request, gives MET Parking Services a right to bring claims in their own name. Definition of “Relevant contract” from the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012, Schedule 4,  2 [1] means a contract Including a contract arising only when the vehicle was parked on the relevant land between the driver and a person who is-   (a) the owner or occupier of the land; or   (b) Authorised, under or by virtue of arrangements made by the owner or occupier of the land, to enter into a contract with the driver requiring the payment of parking charges in respect of the parking of the vehicle on the land. According to https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2006/46/section/44   For a contract to be valid, it requires a director from each company to sign and then two independent witnesses must confirm those signatures.   3.2  The Defendant requested to see such a contract in the CPR request.  The fact that no contract has been produced with the witness signatures present means the contract has not been validly executed. Therefore, there can be no contract established between MET Parking Services and the motorist. Even if “Parking in Electric Bay” could form a contract (which it cannot), it is immaterial. There is no valid contract.  Illegal Conduct – No Contract Formed   4.1 At the time of writing, the Claimant has failed to provide the following, in response to the CPR request from myself.   4.2        The legal contract between the Claimant and the landowner (which in this case is Standard Life Investments UK) to provide evidence that there is an agreement in place with landowner with the necessary authority to issue parking charge notices and to pursue payment by means of litigation.   4.3 Proof of planning permission granted for signage etc under the Town and country Planning Act 1990. Lack of planning permission is a criminal offence under this Act and no contract can be formed where criminality is involved.   4.4        I also do not believe the claimant possesses these documents.   No Keeper Liability   5.1        The defendant was not the driver at the time and date mentioned in the PCN and the claimant has not established keeper liability under schedule 4 of the PoFA 2012. In this matter, the defendant puts it to the claimant to produce strict proof as to who was driving at the time.   5.2 The claimant in their Notice To Keeper also failed to comply with PoFA 2012 Schedule 4 section 9[2][f] while mentioning “the right to recover from the keeper so much of that parking charge as remains unpaid” where they did not include statement “(if all the applicable conditions under this Schedule are met)”.     5.3         The claimant did not mention parking period, times on the photographs are separate from the PCN and in any case are that arrival and departure times not the parking period since their times include driving to and from the parking space as a minimum and can include extra time to allow pedestrians and other vehicles to pass in front.    Protection of Freedoms Act 2012   The notice must -   (a) specify the vehicle, the relevant land on which it was parked and the period of parking to which the notice relates;  22. In the persuasive judgement K4GF167G - Premier Park Ltd v Mr Mathur - Horsham County Court – 5 January 2024 it was on this very point that the judge dismissed this claim.  5.4  A the PCN does not comply with the Act the Defendant as keeper is not liable.  No Breach of Contract   6.1       No breach of contract occurred because the PCN and contract provided as part of the defendant’s CPR request shows different post code, PCN shows HA4 0EY while contract shows HA4 0FY. According to PCN defendant parked on HA4 0EY which does not appear to be subject to the postcode covered by the contract.  6.2         The entrance sign does not mention anything about there being other terms inside the car park so does not offer a contract which makes it only an offer to treat,  Interest  7.1  It is unreasonable for the Claimant to delay litigation for  Double Recovery   7.2  The claim is littered with made-up charges.  7.3  As noted above, the Claimant's signs state a £60 charge yet their PCN is for £100.  7.4  As well as the £100 parking charge, the Claimant seeks recovery of an additional £70.  This is simply a poor attempt to circumvent the legal costs cap at small claims.  7.5 Since 2019, many County Courts have considered claims in excess of £100 to be an abuse of process leading to them being struck out ab initio. An example, in the Caernarfon Court in VCS v Davies, case No. FTQZ4W28 on 4th September 2019, District Judge Jones-Evans stated “Upon it being recorded that District Judge Jones- Evans has over a very significant period of time warned advocates (...) in many cases of this nature before this court that their claim for £60 is unenforceable in law and is an abuse of process and is nothing more than a poor attempt to go behind the decision of the Supreme Court v Beavis which inter alia decided that a figure of £160 as a global sum claimed in this case would be a penalty and not a genuine pre-estimate of loss and therefore unenforceable in law and if the practice continued, he would treat all cases as a claim for £160 and therefore a penalty and unenforceable in law it is hereby declared (…) the claim is struck out and declared to be wholly without merit and an abuse of process.”  7.6 In Claim Nos. F0DP806M and F0DP201T, District Judge Taylor echoed earlier General Judgment or Orders of District Judge Grand, stating ''It is ordered that the claim is struck out as an abuse of process. The claim contains a substantial charge additional to the parking charge which it is alleged the Defendant contracted to pay. This additional charge is not recoverabl15e under the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012, Schedule 4 nor with reference to the judgment in Parking Eye v Beavis. It is an abuse of process from the Claimant to issue a knowingly inflated claim for an additional sum which it is not entitled to recover. This order has been made by the court of its own initiative without a hearing pursuant to CPR Rule 3.3(4)) of the Civil Procedure Rules 1998...''  7.7 In the persuasive case of G4QZ465V - Excel Parking Services Ltd v Wilkinson – Bradford County Court -2 July 2020 (Exhibit 4) the judge had decided that Excel had won. However, due to Excel adding on the £60 the Judge dismissed the case.  7.8        The addition of costs not previously specified on signage are also in breach of the Consumer Rights Act 2015, Schedule 2, specifically paras 6, 10 and 14.   7.9        It is the Defendant’s position that the Claimant in this case has knowingly submitted inflated costs and thus the entire claim should be similarly struck out in accordance with Civil Procedure Rule 3.3(4).   In Conclusion   8.1        I invite the court to dismiss the claim.  Statement of Truth  I believe that the facts stated in this witness statement are true. I understand that proceedings for contempt of court may be brought against anyone who makes, or causes to be made, a false statement in a document verified by a statement of truth without an honest belief in its truth.   
    • Well the difference is that in all our other cases It was Kev who was trying to entrap the motorist so sticking two fingers up to him and daring him to try court was from a position of strength. In your case, sorry, you made a mistake so you're not in the position of strength.  I've looked on Google Maps and the signs are few & far between as per Kev's MO, but there is an entrance sign saying "Pay & Display" (and you've admitted in writing that you knew you had to pay) and the signs by the payment machines do say "Sea View Car Park" (and you've admitted in writing you paid the wrong car park ... and maybe outed yourself as the driver). Something I missed in my previous post is that the LoC is only for one ticket, not two. Sorry, but it's impossible to definitively advise what to so. Personally I'd probably gamble on Kev being a serial bottler of court and reply with a snotty letter ridiculing the signage (given you mentioned the signage in your appeal) - but it is a gamble.  
    • No! What has happened is that your pix were up-to-date: 5 hours' maximum stay and £100 PCN. The lazy solicitors have sent ancient pictures: 4 hours' maximum stay and £60 PCN. Don't let on!  Let them be hoisted by their own lazy petard in the court hearing (if they don't bottle before).
    • Thanks for all the suggestions so far I will amend original WS and send again for review.  While looking at my post at very beginning when I submitted photos of signs around the car park I noticed that it says 5 hours maximum stay while the signage sent by solicitor shows 4 hours maximum stay but mine is related to electric bay abuse not sure if this can be of any use in WS.
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Mackenzie Hall / Welcome Finance


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Had a letter off them demanding £1400+ for a alleged Welcome finance loan – I’m not saying I have never had a loan with WF (thought a few years ago I got in such a state I would have taken money off anyone…wish I knew then what I do now!)

Anyway IF I do owe WF anything I have had no correspondence off them and the Mackenzie Hall letter states that WF have made numerous attempts to collect the debt (non of which I have seen), also I have never borrowed anything in that figure…either much lower (say £500) or much higher (£3000+) so I’m guessing the figure is charges and interest etc etc.

With this in mind I have sent the CCA request + £1 on the 22nd August – the cheque was chased yesterday so just waiting to see their response!

Does anyone who has encountered Mackenzie Hall know what they are like with response times etc? - I know they have 12/30days but in my experience DCA don’t like keeping to them!

Will keep you posted.

People who haven't made mistakes, haven't made anything!

 

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It has been argued in these threads and on other forums that a CCA request should not be sent to the collector but to the company that owns the debt, in this case it would appear to be Welcome. Having said that Mackenzie Hall have cashed your cheque so they appear to be taking responsibility for this matter.

 

Mackenzie Hall have an aversion to responding to letters demanding information you are legally entitled to. I would set your calendar to the 12 working day rule in which time they must provide you with the CCA details you have asked for and the 30 calendar days after which they default on your request - technically committing a criminal offence but the OFT are useless and will do nothing about it.

 

That isn't to say that you should not report Mackenzie Hall to the OFT, your local trading standards department and the East Ayrshire trading standards about their behaviour.

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It has been argued in these threads and on other forums that a CCA request should not be sent to the collector but to the company that owns the debt, in this case it would appear to be Welcome. Having said that Mackenzie Hall have cashed your cheque so they appear to be taking responsibility for this matter.

 

i'm going along the theory that the debt is sold then so is the responsibility - after all isnt that the point in selling it? - i dont think this is a debt to do with me tbh, however i'll wait and see what MH come back with - it maybe i have to chase Welcome afterall - will keep this post updated as and when i hear anything.

People who haven't made mistakes, haven't made anything!

 

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The letters normally sent by Mackenzie Hall are "on behalf of clients" and they act simply as collectors. This less than reputable company have yet to officially take over as debt buyers - they have created a company called Acquire Debt and the belief is that they make start buying debts as well as collecting them.

 

If you owe Welcome Finance then they are the owners of the debt and they would have the information you require. You may have to CCA them if you want to get to the bottom of this. Having said that I still believe that if Mackenzie Hall have cashed your cheque they should send you the details. If they don't, and they later say they can't, ask for your money back! Sue them in the county court for it and see where that leads!

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  • 3 weeks later...

Well Makenzie cashed my cheque ages ago - 12 days was up on the 3ed of Sept...rolll on the 3ed of October when i can report them - having said that there is a deafult been added to my account by a Hillesmen Securities today?

 

The figures are the same but i have never heard of them or had anything off them!

 

think i will have to write to the CRA and see who they are!

People who haven't made mistakes, haven't made anything!

 

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You need to find out more information about this new default. A default cannot be re-registered. It is lodged once, has a life of six years on your crf and then automatically drops off. Find out what it is and if it is related to the matter you have raised with MH get it removed. Tell them it is defamatory and you will sue for libel. This will cost money but there have been instances reported recently of banks paying out cash sums after defaults etc were wrongly registered.

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I have a similar issue with Mackenzie Hall "acting" on behalf of Cabot Finance, I have hounded them by sending follow up faxes everyweek requesting the data, they have got so p'ssd off with me now, they have given the debt back to Cabot to deal with, so no more Mackenzie Hall for me.... just need to kill of Cabot now.:-x

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/debt-bailiffs-advice/25238-barclaycard-cabot-mackenzie-hall.html

 

Mackenzie Hall don't have a leg to stand on, don't awknowledge the debt and dont pay them a penny.....

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Guest The Terminator
I have a similar issue with Mackenzie Hall "acting" on behalf of Cabot Finance, I have hounded them by sending follow up faxes everyweek requesting the data, they have got so p'ssd off with me now, they have given the debt back to Cabot to deal with, so no more Mackenzie Hall for me.... just need to kill of Cabot now.:-x

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/debt-bailiffs-advice/25238-barclaycard-cabot-mackenzie-hall.html

 

Mackenzie Hall don't have a leg to stand on, don't awknowledge the debt and dont pay them a penny.....

 

Throughly agree with you there.One question that comes to mind is that if the banks are using DCA's or selling debts for a fraction of the value then why not wipe the losses off the person's account.Am I missing the plot here or is this some tax [problem].Perhaps HMRC should start investigating the banks and DCA's.

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