Penny18 -v- Ashbourne Management (Gym)

[penny18]

Hi I am also having problems with ashbourne membership management, approx 2 weeks ago i rang them to say that i could no longer use the gym due to health problems, they said that without a doctors letter they could not cancel my membership.As i was no longer using the gyms facilities i cancelled my direct debit and have an appt to see my Gp on the 16th June to ask for a letter. I put the info to them in writing. However since then i have recieved 3 letters each one becoming more threatening till the one i recieved today from thier Litigation Dept, saying that i neede to pay them32.50 immediately or if not "any steps taken to recover any outstanding amounts would damage your credit rating". Obviusly i did not want my credit rating affected so rang the company to explain again my situation and that as soon as i obtain the doctors letter i would send it to them, asking them please not to send anymore threatening letters! The lady i spoke to was very rude and unsympathetic and said that letters would still be sent to me untill yhey get my gp letter! this is making my health problems worse! What can i do to stop them keep writing to me? PS THEY WOULDNT EVEN LET ME SPEAK TO THE MANAGER AS THEY SAID HE DOESNT SPEAK TO ANYONE ON THE TELEPHONE!

[42man]

Make sure you notify the OFT !!!

[slick132]

Hi Penny and welcome to CAG.

 

I've started you a new thread to deal with your case, and moved it to the Gyms Forum. Read other threads here to see how others deal with gyms and their DCA's.

 

You'll see from other threads that the DCA's are often rude and aggresive but they have no real authority. They threaten by phone and by letter but there is little they can do.

 

Avoid speaking to them by phone and keep everything in writing. Keep copies of all correspondence. Send letters to them by Recorded Delivery or get a free Certificate of Posting from the PO when you send.

 

1. Do you have a copy of your m/ship contract.

2. When did you sign up.

3. How long is the initial contract period.

4. Have you checked to see what notice you must give if you are unable to use the facility due to medical conditions.

5. Have you checked to see what you must do (per the contract) to cancel - ie what documents have have to supply to them; whether you have to send to the gym or HO; whether you must use Recorded Delivery.

 

It may be that you cannot just stop your DD's, particularly if you are still in the initial contract period.

 

We'll help you sort this out, so try not to worry about it. Toughen up a bit and ignore their phone calls. Same with most of their letters - they may look threatening but their threats are often empty.

 

[pokinthruboxers]

Hello Penny, as you can see from my posts, I ( or rather my wife) have had exactly the same problem with AMM....

I wish I could tell you it will go away with a letter from your GP, but sadly, if our experience is any guage, it will not. They will still try and press you for ANY payment up until they actually acknowledge receipt of medical evidence and if you don't cough up for that, they then bill you for three years membership and will register a default against you....

First thing....get that letter from your GP...save yourself a copy and send one to them by recorded delivery. Make sure you save the receipt of postage. That way you can be certain when they receive it....It is up too you then if you decide to pay them up to when they receive said letter. ( Personally, they can go whistle for ours)

If you want to dispute payment, then follow the route of others who have gone before you...start with a request for a credit agreement/contract...send them a template letter (found by searching this site) and the statutory fee of £1.00 and ask them to produce this. Don't be fobbed off by a copy of their sign-up letter either...also tell them all correspondance must be in writing, no telephone conversations will be entered into!

 

 

Oh...One simple rule, make sure you keep copies of all correspondance and best to send everything by recorded delivery. Also contact OFT and get them on the case, as they are currently investigating this company.

 

Finally I stick my head in here a lot, so just ask if you need any info....

[slick132]

Just to clarify, if your membership involved a credit agreement, then a CCA request is appropriate and they must reply properly to it. Template is here - http://www.consumerforums.com/resources/templates-library/86-debt-collectors/581-cca-request-letter

 

If there was just a contract governing your m/ship and you pay monthly to the gym, then there is no credit agreement and a CCA request in not appropriate.

 

However, if you don't have a copy of your contract which you signed with the gym, you are entitled to it and can ask for this with a SAR - http://www.consumerforums.com/resources/templates-library/48-bank-templates/110--data-protection-act-1998-subject-access-request-

 

[Conniff]

This should give you some encouragement

 

Watchdog takes gym company Ashbourne Management to court

 

By Andrew Penman on March 11, 2010 12:46 PM in Health

 

The Office of Fair Trading has issued High Court proceedings against gym company Ashbourne Management Services Limited over its contract terms.

Ashbourne draws up membership agreements for a number of gyms and then collects members' payments. Under the terms of such agreements, consumers are tied in for minimum periods of up to three years and are unable to cancel their membership within these minimum periods.

Those who try to do so are presented with a bill for the full amount due for the minimum period - often a sum amounting to many hundreds of pounds.

 

--------------------------------------------------------

OFT seeks court order against gym management company

 

25/10 11 March 2010

The OFT has issued High Court proceedings against a gym management company, Ashbourne Management Services Limited ('Ashbourne'), following concerns about its compliance with consumer credit law and the fairness of its contract terms.

 

Ashbourne draws up membership agreements for a number of gyms and then collects members' payments. Under the terms of such agreements, consumers are tied in for minimum periods of up to three years, and are unable to cancel their membership within these minimum periods. Those who try to do so are presented with a bill for the full amount due for the minimum period - often a sum amounting to many hundreds of pounds. If the consumer does not then pay this amount, Ashbourne reports them to a credit reference agency for defaulting on their agreement.

 

According to numerous complaints received by the OFT and Trading Standards, many consumers were not aware of the full extent of their liability, or that they could not cancel at all within the minimum period. As of July 2009 Ashbourne had registered just under 17,000 defaults with credit reference agencies.

 

In the OFT's view, the agreements Ashbourne recommends are credit agreements within the meaning of the Consumer Credit Act 1974, because they immediately oblige the consumer to pay a fixed sum and allow them to pay this over a set period of time. As such the agreements should set out clearly and upfront the total amount the consumer is liable to pay, and comply in all other respects with the rules under the Act. In the absence of this, the OFT considers the agreements cannot be enforced without a court order.

 

Where gym contracts do not fall under the Consumer Credit Act 1974, the OFT believes they should allow consumers to cancel their membership on reasonable terms. Making consumers always pay the full amount for the minimum period is, in the OFT's view, unfair under the Unfair Terms in Consumer Contracts Regulations 1999.

 

The OFT also objects to Ashbourne's practice of reporting consumers to credit reference agencies, and considers its conduct to be both misleading and aggressive under the Consumer Protection from Unfair Trading Regulations 2008.

Jason Freeman, Legal Director in the OFT's Consumer Group, said:

'It is important that consumers are able to understand the nature and extent of their liabilities before entering into contracts. The Consumer Credit Act sets out rules to ensure this, and we expect traders offering credit to comply with these.

 

'Likewise, traders should not use unfair contracts or misleading or aggressive practices in order to put pressure on consumers to pay money that the trader may not otherwise be entitled to.

'We have concerns about Ashbourne's practices, but as the company disputes our interpretation of the law we have asked the High Court to rule on this.'

 

No date has yet been scheduled for the High Court hearing.

 

 

 

NOTES

1. Ashbourne Management Services Ltd has a registered office at 29 Warwick Road, Coventry, West Midlands, CV1 2ES
   
2. It is for the High Court to decide whether the OFT's view is correct and that Ashbourne are offering credit or in the alternative whether the disputed terms are unfair under the Unfair Terms in Consumer Contracts Regulations 1999. No date has yet been scheduled for the High Court hearing.
   
3. Download the OFT's Guidance on unfair terms in health and fitness club agreements (pdf 525kb).
   

So register a complaint with the OFT even though they are already taking action. And let Ashbourne Management know what that you are.

Take heart from the above and start taking charge of your account and tell them in no uncertain terms, that if they register a cra default, you will take them to court for it's removal.

Don't be the underdog, let them know that you are aware of the pending court case.

[fatdog]

Hi

 

I had the pleasure last year of taking Ashbourne Management Company Ltd to court.

 

After cancelling my contract with the gym, Ashbourne gave the usual heavy approach of demanding that the contract of 3 years is fulfilled.

 

In short I told them that the contract I signed was on Ashbourne headed paper and it described they provided me access to a specific gym.

 

In court, I argued that as Ashbourne do not own or run any gyms themselves they are merely acting as an agent on behalf of the gym of which I am a member.

 

After a couple of minutes thinking about this, the Judge agreed that Ashbourne were no part of the contract and threw the case out. As they had put a mark on my credit file they were judged to remove it within 7 days, and compensate me for the damages this caused.

 

I ended up with a nice fat cheque from Ashbournes solicitors.

 

Oh and the point of me making this comment on here was that I argued to the court that Ashbourne should be made to write to all of its "customers" and inform them that they have no legal agreement as they are simply a payment management company whose contractual relationship is with their real customers (the gyms!) and not the gym users. The court agreed but said it could not be enforced as part of my hearing.

 

Of course Ashbourne decided not to take the courts advice on this matter and is still trying fob people off saying they have a legal agreement!

 

My advice - go to court - argue this case. I'm happy to provide the court details I have on this if required.

[pokinthruboxers]

Cheers Fatdog, that is great news. As our case stands, I have disputed the 'existence' of a contract/ credit agreement with Ashbourne and so has my local TSO. They STILL have not responded to several requests YET I still receive demands for payment!!

 

I would be delighted and extremely grateful for details of your court hearing, as I intend to take them to court myself......

[Conniff]

As there are cases that have gone against them and also the OFT investigation into their methods and unfair contracts, I doubt it will get as far as court. They will probably cave in when they receive the summons.

 

Have you read some of the other threads? they are all relevent especially the Ashbourne ones.

[pokinthruboxers]

Indeed. i have looked at any thread deemed relevant to AMM. Sadly many just fizzle out without any conclusive outcome....

I am trying to document mine step by step and will keep others posted as and when.....

 

Good luck to all who have a run in with this bunch of grasping, incompetent edits.......

Edited June 13, 2010 by slick132
language

[slick132]

Hi PTB,

 

This case here didn't fizzle out - http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/general-debt-issues/138109-ashbourne-management-services-ltd.html

 

[fatdog]

pokinthruboxers I'll dig out what I have on it and post it here in the next couple of days. I would say that the OFT court claim against Ashbourne will probably go in your favour .... I very much doubt they'd want to be fighting all of their 'customers' and the OFT. In any case, they were clearly told in my hearing that their 'contracts' were worthless by my Judge.

[pokinthruboxers]

Cheers Fatdog, I look forward to reading it...thanks. Seems very encouraging. I can't wait for a ruling regarding OFT's case. Should make it far clearer for those in dispute and those that follow.....