***Ell-en*** please help urgent advice needed

[web2005]

Thanks Ell-en. Its interest only in joint names with my sister who is married with children but living in rented property.

[caro]

Hi Web.

 

As Ell-enn isn't around at the moment I hope you don't mind me throwing in my 2p worth.

 

Forgive me for my bluntness here but I don't think I'm pointing out anything that your lender or the court won't see.

 

1. You can't afford to pay off any arrears.

 

2. You don't know when or if you will be able to afford full payments.

 

3. In the current economic climate, realistically, what are the chances of getting a job which will allow you to pay not only the payments, but the arrears ordered by the court, AND the arrears that are continuing to build?

 

4. When your fixed rate ends how much are your payments likely to be, bearing in mind that with this on your credit history you aren't going to get a good deal.

 

5. How will you pay off the mortgage as I see you aren't paying for any endowment?

 

6. By the time your fixed rate ends you will owe many more thousands. Should a responsible lender allow this to happen?

 

From a personal point of view, because you aren't paying anything off the capital it seems to me that you are paying a hell of a high rent to hang on to a property that you can't afford. Is it really worth the stress to do this? What is it about this house that is worth putting yourself and your family through this anguish?

 

IMHO your best bet would be to put your house on the market and ask the court for the opportunity to sell it yourself so that:-

 

a. You can realise the best price possible.

 

b. It gives you time to organise where you will live yourself.

 

This (rather long) thread has a lot of information and links which you may find helpful and may provide you with some food for thought.

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/mortgages-secured-loans/142793-tilly-mortgage-express-repo.html#post1499490

[web2005]

Hi Web.

 

As Ell-enn isn't around at the moment I hope you don't mind me throwing in my 2p worth.

 

Forgive me for my bluntness here but I don't think I'm pointing out anything that your lender or the court won't see.

 

1. You can't afford to pay off any arrears.

 

2. You don't know when or if you will be able to afford full payments.

 

3. In the current economic climate, realistically, what are the chances of getting a job which will allow you to pay not only the payments, but the arrears ordered by the court, AND the arrears that are continuing to build?

 

4. When your fixed rate ends how much are your payments likely to be, bearing in mind that with this on your credit history you aren't going to get a good deal.

 

5. How will you pay off the mortgage as I see you aren't paying for any endowment?

 

6. By the time your fixed rate ends you will owe many more thousands. Should a responsible lender allow this to happen?

 

From a personal point of view, because you aren't paying anything off the capital it seems to me that you are paying a hell of a high rent to hang on to a property that you can't afford. Is it really worth the stress to do this? What is it about this house that is worth putting yourself and your family through this anguish?

 

IMHO your best bet would be to put your house on the market and ask the court for the opportunity to sell it yourself so that:-

 

a. You can realise the best price possible.

 

b. It gives you time to organise where you will live yourself.

 

This (rather long) thread has a lot of information and links which you may find helpful and may provide you with some food for thought.

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/mortgages-secured-loans/142793-tilly-mortgage-express-repo.html#post1499490

 

Thanks for all your advice but my situation is short term. As soon as I get a job paying me same as I have been earning in the past I will be ok to pay normal monthly payments. I think thats why government introduced HMS scheme otherwise everyone struggling with mortgage payments should have been advised to sale off their houses to come out of the situation.

 

I don't want to loose my home. I still have 20 years on this mortgage and I will manage to do something to pay it off after 20 years.

 

Ell-en please help. I am waiting for your advice.

[Ell-enn]

The court can only consider your current ability to pay the monthly mortgage and something towards the arrears each month. If you don't have a job offer when you go to court you are going to have to rely on the HMS application to buy you time. If Shelter agree you meet the criteria then you need to get them to accompany you to the hearing and confirm this, or at the very least write you a statement confirming it.

 

As it is unlikely that the lender will apply for an eviction notice until after the 27th May (when they realise you haven't made the payment they expected), we have some time to get a statement together for the N244 application.

 

Get in touch with Shelter and see if they can provide confirmation of your eligibility for the HMS.

 

[newstarter]

Web2005,just as a matter intrest how much are you in arrears?

[newstarter]

Can you post some details of the account,reason being that there just might be a way out of this without loosing your home.

[Ell-enn]

Web2005,just as a matter intrest how much are you in arrears?

 

 

As my arrears continually grew while HMS application was in proces, total arrears on the mortgage accrding to BM is £24000. I know its very high!!! I am sure this includes charges as I have been paying at least something every month so it can't be so high.

 

..

[newstarter]

Thanks Ell enn,Iam with B.M and they do add on charge after charge when in arrears.Its only a thought but im just wondering whether B.M would agree to extending the term of the mortgage to bring down the monthly payments,also web2005 could go before the judge disputing the arrears which may buy time to reach an agreement with B.M if the case were to be ajourned.

[newstarter]

I know this is clutching at straws but this tack worked for me.

[Ell-enn]

If there are statements to show arrears charges then that could certainly be used to show the arrears amount they are claiming is incorrect and hope that the judge will adjourn awaiting correct information.

 

However, we could use the following case law:

 

Royal Bank of Scotland –v- Elmes April 1998 Legal Action 11, Clerkenwell County Court

Issue – suspended possession order on payments less than current instalments

A district judge suspended a warrant for possession for three months on terms that the defendant pay £250 one month and thereafter £500 per month for two months, thereafter the case would further considered. The defendant had good prospect of obtaining employment within the period. The lender appealed in the basis the court had no power to suspend on terms of payment less than current instalments.

Assistant Recorder Thomas Q.C dismissed the appeal, and held that s.36 of the Administration of Justice Act 1970 enables the court to impose any terms about payment so long as the borrower would, within a reasonable period, be able to clear the arrears and pay the current instalments.

 

Worth a try....

[newstarter]

Brilliant, s.36 i hadn,t thought of that,would at least buy some time and yes your right it is worth a try. web2005 would need to find employment pretty quickly but a possible 3 month breathing space can sometimes be enough .Lets hope web2005 gets a sympathetic judge,but thats the way i would go.Thanks Ell en.

[Ell-enn]

It worked a couple of years ago for someone I was helping, they did have a lot of evidence of good job prospects so I think Web will need to get working on that to bolster the case law.

 

I use S.36 in all eviction defences, but the Elmes case law is an "added extra" in this particular case.

[newstarter]

Just a note to web2005 when you read this i would go with s.36 Ell en is spot on here because i know from past experience you are always taken more seriously by a judge and your defence is looked at more closely if you can back up your defence with case law.Its worth a shot and if i were you i would seriously consider this way forward,just might,and i mean might give you some space to get yourself back on track.

[newstarter]

Thanks Ell en and thanks again for that info of course im no expert in repo.s but like all others on this site,im just trying to give something back to consumer forum as it helped me so much,so any knowledge anyone may offer is much appreciated,thanks again.

[Ell-enn]

Your help and support is very much appreciated Newstarter, as is everyone's who contributes to the site. No matter how long we've been here, we are all learning every day which is great for us - but extremely bad news for aggressive creditors

[web2005]

Ell-en and Newstarter, thanks very much for all above suggestions but I am still not sure what the conclusion is? As Ell-enn usggested I need to go back to shelter UK and ask them for written statement for HMS eligibility. I will contact them again today to check if they can help.

 

Apart from this, how do I start the whole process? What I need is:

 

1) BM to approve me on HMS so that I can make lower payments till I find a better paying job. I must make clear that I am currently working full-time in permanent role but not earning as much as I was when I took out this mortgage. Looking at current economic conditions I can't say for sure if in 2/3 months time I will manage to find better job. Thats why I want to be on HMS initially for 1 year. I am not asking to make lowest payemtns under this scheme. I can afford £1700 per month and thats what I want BM to accept as payment offer for next few monts.

 

Newstarter, regarding charges on arrears, I am sure BM must have added charges to arrears as since July last year I didn't miss any payment. I have been paying regularly though not full monthly payment.

 

I have no idea how to fill N244 can you please help with this and statement for the grounds to make this application? Thanks.

[Ell-enn]

I can help you with the N244 and the statement, but it would be best to get the info from Shelter to go with it. We still have time before they realise you haven't made the payment they're expecting on the 27th.

[web2005]

I have spoken to Shelters regarding how they can help me with HMS review application through court. They said they can only give me advise but not able to confirm this in writing or come to court for representation.

 

I find this little odd. I thought any advise they give on the phone can also be confirmed in writing by them. Do you think I should ask them again?

 

Ell-en, you think we still have time before next payment is due? Do you suggest to somehow make full payment this month. As I don't want to loose house, I will try to seek help from friends and family members for this month to pay full payment. I am worried that if I dont make full payment this month they will immediately apply for bailiffs appointment and may be then it will be too late for me to save my house. Thanks.

[web2005]

Ell-en/Newstarter, I tried to get help from family and friends to pay this month's payment in full but no success. I am very much worried now as if no full payment made, BM will start proceedings.

 

So far all my conversation with BM has been on the phone. I made them reduced payment offer on phone and they advised the possible eviction on phone. Nothing in writing. You suggest I should send payment proposal in writing? May be this time they accept this. This will buy me time to srtart with N244 for HMS scheme?

 

Can you please help with payment proposal letter? I apprecite all your help. Thanks.

[web2005]

Ell-en please please help me with N244. I just spoke to lender again but they are not willing to accept any proposals and advised I have to pay as much as I can on the due date and if its not full payment they will apply for bailiffs appointment but will consider any proposals then.

 

I know they will not accept my proposal. I spoke to shelter England again and they said I should fill N244. I am very much worried. Please help me with the satement and N244 form. I want to submit the form before the due payment date. PLEASE HELP. Looks like I have almost lost my home.

 

 

Anyone who reads this knows how to alert Ell-en, pls do so. I need urgent help. Thanks.

[newstarter]

Web2005 hi there,thought we had lost you.

[newstarter]

Right,first things first calm down we can all help you here.Im sure Ell en will be along soon to help with the paperwork,if for some reason she is busy i will help you.First of all you cannot make the full payment to B.M on the 27 of this month so pay off as much as you can,its a shame you cannot make the full payment but we can get round this,so if you can find the 1700 then pay that on the 27th.

[newstarter]

What you need to do then is wait for B.Ms next move you cannot go to court and appeal action by B.M which has not started yet,however you can prepare.First see what they say after you have made this months payment it might not be too late to put a payment plan in place although knowing B.M as i do i wouldnt hold my breath.So we need to put together a defence in case of any eviction application by B.M.

[web2005]

Right,first things first calm down we can all help you here.Im sure Ell en will be along soon to help with the paperwork,if for some reason she is busy i will help you.First of all you cannot make the full payment to B.M on the 27 of this month so pay off as much as you can,its a shame you cannot make the full payment but we can get round this,so if you can find the 1700 then pay that on the 27th.

 

Thanks. I will pay £1700 on 27th. My worry is BM told me that first thing in the morning of 28th their team will find out I haven't paid full and immedialtely they will apply for the bailiffs appointment. They are only holdin this account till then. I wish before then I can apply for N244.

[newstarter]

I remember ELL en bringing up s.36 of the administration for justice act 1970,this had slipped my mind at the time,in the case of B.O.S V Elmes in 98.You see s.36 allows a judge impose a payment plan in which the borrower can underpay as long as normal payments and arrears can be paid off in a reasonable period.If i were you i would use this case law as the central pillar of your n244 defence,along with your own circumstances.