Egg/dryden lost dual CCJ Card+Loan - No REstons after CO.

[hungrybear]

 

Oh, I'll always accept your help and advice, you lot are Gods!!!!!!

 

 

just e-mailed my wife a link to this post, so that she knows just who she's dealing with.

[citizenB]

This shows what little I know about all this but, I thought they had a legal obligation to provide me with the relevant info within a certain timescale upon receipt of the cpr letter, is this not right?

 

Sadly, some solicitors will not provide information until so ordered by the Court.

 

What form or direction should my holding defence take shape please?

 

Should my holding defence be classed as just that? Do I need to supply this to the court with a covering note to explain that, as the other party hasn't supplied the relevant info, how can I prepare a case and at such short notice?

 

The holding defence will set out your case that you dont have sufficient information and will ask for permission to submit an amended defence when such information has been provided to you.

 

It seems that the system favours the banks as they are quick to pounce if we do something wrong (like not receive relevant papers) and don't have to comply with regulations.

 

Welcome to the world of litigation. Some solicitors have an uncanny knack of ignoring deadlines and getting away with it. I am surprised in the circumstances that your court has taken this attitude.. but.. we can deal with it.

 

AAaaaagggghhhhhhh!

 

just e-mailed my wife a link to this post, so that she knows just who she's dealing with.

 

Honoured to be in your presence:lol:

 

Can you let me know what the claim is for..

 

The exact wording from the Particulars of claim that you received from Northampton.. You will find the information on the left hand side of the front page.

 

When you got the claim form originally, did you ackowledge service and enter a defence of any kind at all ? If so, we need to know what you said back then.

[large boy]

There are two cases here, one for a loan the second for a credit card.

 

The wording on the claim form is as follows;

 

Case 1

 

The Claimant s claim is for monies due from the Defendant under a Credit Card agreement ("the agreement") regulated by the Consumer Credit Act 1974 ("the act")

 

Under the terms of the Agreement the Claimant opened an account, number **************** ("the account") on 14/08/2003 and issued a Credit Card to the Defendant. The Defendant agreed to repay the Claimant together with interest calculated monthly as provided for in the Agreement.

 

The Defendant breached the Agreement by failing to maintain payments in accordance with the Agreement and was served with a notice under section 87 (1) of the Act.

 

The Defendant has failed to comply with the Default Notice and the Claimant claims the sum of 16,103.43

 

Case 2

 

The Claimants claim is for monies due from the Defendant under a Loan Agreement ("the Agreement") number ********, issued on 23/02/2006 regulated by the Consumer Credit Act 1974 (the Act") made between the Claimant and Defendant.

 

The Defendant breached the Agreement by failing to maintain payments in accordance with the Agreement and was served with Notice under Section 87 (1) of the Act.

 

The Defendant has failed to comply with the Default Notice and the Claimant claims the sum of 14,234.41

 

I replied to both with the same reply, supplied to me by "an advisor"

 

 

I, ******* of *********, formally requested proof of debt as well as a true copy of the original Consumer Credit Agreement relating to this account.

 

On 15th Dec 2008 I made a formal request for a true signed agreement for the alleged account under consumer credit Act 1974 s77/8, copy enclosed. The claimant failed to comply with my request, and as such the account entered default on 1st Jan 2009.

 

The document that they are obliged to send me is a true copy of the executed agreement that contained all of the prescribed terms, all other required terms and statutory notices and should be signed by both the claimant and myself as defined in section 61(1) of CCA 74 and subsequent Statutory Instruments. If the executed agreement contained any reference to any other document, the claimant is also obliged to send me a copy of that document. In addition a full statement of this account should have been sent to me detailing all debits and credits to the account.

 

I requested a true copy of the credit agreement which I have failed to receive.

 

Furthermore

 

 

You are aware that the Consumer Credit Act allows 12 working days for a request for a true copy of a credit agreement to be carried out before your client enters into a default situation.

 

These limits have expired.

As you are no doubt aware section 77(6) states:

 

If the creditor fails to comply with Subsection (1)[

 

(a) He is not entitled , while the default continues, to enforce the agreement

Therefore this account has become unenforceable at law.

 

As the claimant has Failed to comply with a lawful request for a true, signed copy of the said agreement and other relevant documents mentioned in it, Failed to send a full statement of the account and Failed to provide any of the documentation requested.

 

 

This legal action is both UNLAWFUL and VEXATIOUS.

 

Furthermore I Intend to counterclaim that any such action constitutes unlawful harassment.

 

The lack of a credit agreement is a very clear dispute and as such the following applies.

 

* The claimant may not demand any payment on the account, nor am I obliged to offer any payment to you.

 

* The claimant may not add further interest or any charges to the account

* The claimant may not pass the account to a third party.

 

* The claimant not register any information in respect of the account with any credit reference agency.

 

I request that this case be struck out with Immediate effect, as the claimant or their representatives have no chance of success.

 

Yours sincerely,

 

 

WITHOUT PREJUDICE

Edited December 10, 2009 by citizenB
removed font formatting

[citizenB]

There are two cases here, one for a loan the second for a credit card.

 

The wording on the claim form is as follows;

 

Case 1

 

The Claimant s claim is for monies due from the Defendant under a Credit Card agreement ("the agreement") regulated by the Consumer Credit Act 1974 ("the act")

 

Under the terms of the Agreement the Claimant opened an account, number **************** ("the account") on 14/08/2003 and issued a Credit Card to the Defendant. The Defendant agreed to repay the Claimant together with interest calculated monthly as provided for in the Agreement.

 

The Defendant breached the Agreement by failing to maintain payments in accordance with the Agreement and was served with a notice under section 87 (1) of the Act.

 

The Defendant has failed to comply with the Default Notice and the

 

Claimant

claims the sum of 16,103.43

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Case 2

 

The Claimants claim is for monies due from the Defendant under a Loan Agreement ("the Agreement") number ********, issued on 23/02/2006 regulated by the Consumer Credit Act 1974 (the Act") made between the Claimant and Defendant.

 

The Defendant breached the Agreement by failing to maintain payments in accordance with the Agreement and was served with Notice under Section 87 (1) of the Act.

 

The Defendant has failed to comply with the Default Notice and the Claimant claims the sum of 14,234.41

 

 

 

 

I replied to both with the same reply, supplied to me by "an advisor"

 

 

I, ******* of *********, formally requested proof of debt as well as a true copy of the original Consumer Credit Agreement relating to this account.

 

On 15th Dec 2008 I made a formal request for a true signed agreement for the alleged account under consumer credit Act 1974 s77/8, copy enclosed. The claimant failed to comply with my request, and as such the account entered default on 1st Jan 2009.

 

The document that they are obliged to send me is a true copy of the executed agreement that contained all of the prescribed terms, all other required terms and statutory notices and should be signed by both the claimant and myself as defined in section 61(1) of CCA 74 and subsequent Statutory Instruments. If the executed agreement contained any reference to any other document, the claimant is also obliged to send me a copy of that document. In addition a full statement of this account should have been sent to me detailing all debits and credits to the account.

 

I requested a true copy of the credit agreement which I have failed to receive.

 

Furthermore

 

 

You are aware that the Consumer Credit Act allows 12 working days for a request for a true copy of a credit agreement to be carried out before your client enters into a default situation.

 

These limits have expired.

As you are no doubt aware section 77(6) states:

 

If the creditor fails to comply with Subsection (1)[

 

(a) He is not entitled , while the default continues, to enforce the agreement

Therefore this account has become unenforceable at law.

 

As the claimant has Failed to comply with a lawful request for a true, signed copy of the said agreement and other relevant documents mentioned in it, Failed to send a full statement of the account and Failed to provide any of the documentation requested.

 

 

This legal action is both UNLAWFUL and VEXATIOUS.

 

Furthermore I Intend to counterclaim that any such action constitutes unlawful harassment.

 

The lack of a credit agreement is a very clear dispute and as such the following applies.

 

* The claimant may not demand any payment on the account, nor am I obliged to offer any payment to you.

 

* The claimant may not add further interest or any charges to the account

* The claimant may not pass the account to a third party.

 

* The claimant not register any information in respect of the account with any credit reference agency.

 

I request that this case be struck out with Immediate effect, as the claimant or their representatives have no chance of success.

 

Yours sincerely,

 

 

WITHOUT PREJUDICE

 

 

Ok, right well the letter/defence you were "advised" to send is not a defence at all but a letter. The fact that they also advised you to mark it WITHOUT PREJUDICE may have caused problems because this type of letter you cant produce in court until the issues of costs arrive. So I think you need to start from scratch.

 

 

You can use the letter you have already as the basis of a Witness statement. Which should be laid out chronologically. Your aim is to prove to the court that you should be allowed to proceed to trial as your defence will have chance of success.

Your amended defences should proceed on the basis that you are still embarrassed as no documents have been provided.

Which leads to the problem you are going to have with the disclosure list. All you can list is those documents that you are going to refer to in your witness statement ie letters you have sent to the opposition and any they might have sent to you.

Your witness statement, should I think refer to the fact that it would appear that paperwork giving directions from the court had not been received by you and the date by which you did receive them.

I cant help right this minute as I have to go out for a couple of hours.. but if you can at least make a start then I can help you tidy it up when I get back about 4pmish

 

 

 

[large boy]

OK, how does thios sound?

 

Witness Statement

I, *********** of ********************, formally requested proof of debt as well as a true copy of the original Consumer Credit Agreement relating to this account.

On 15th Dec 2008 I made a formal request for a true signed agreement for the alleged account under consumer credit Act 1974 s77/8, copy enclosed. The claimant failed to comply with my request, and as such the account entered default on 1st Jan 2008.

The document that they are obliged to send me is a true copy of the executed agreement that contained all of the prescribed terms, all other required terms and statutory notices and should be signed by both the claimant and myself as defined in section 61(1) of CCA 74 and subsequent Statutory Instruments. If the executed agreement contained any reference to any other document, the claimant is also obliged to send me a copy of that document. In addition a full statement of this account should have been sent to me detailing all debits and credits to the account.

Furthermore

You are aware that the Consumer Credit Act allows 12 working days for a request for a true copy of a credit agreement to be carried out before your client enters into a default situation.

These limits have expired.

As you are no doubt aware section 77(6) states:

If the creditor fails to comply with Subsection (1)

(a) He is not entitled , while the default continues, to enforce the agreement.

Therefore this account has become unenforceable at law.

As the claimant has Failed to comply with a lawful request for a true, signed copy of the said agreement and other relevant documents mentioned in it, Failed to send a full statement of the account and Failed to provide any of the documentation requested.

This legal action is both UNLAWFUL and VEXATIOUS.

Furthermore I Intend to counterclaim that any such action constitutes unlawful harassment.

The lack of a credit agreement is a very clear dispute and as such the following applies.

* The claimant may not demand any payment on the account, nor am I obliged to offer any payment to you.

* The claimant may not add further interest or any charges to the account.

* The claimant may not pass the account to a third party.

* The claimant not register any information in respect of the account with any credit reference agency.

I request that this case be struck out with Immediate effect, as the claimant or their representatives have no chance of success.

I also wish to add that the paperwork giving directions from the court were not received by me and, when they were resent, they were dated 1st December allowing me no time to formally raise my defence.

It would be my suggestion that, the court allows me a reasonable amount of time to draw up my defence and that the court orders the Claimant to provide me with the documents I requested, without which my defence will be limited unfairly.

 

And the defence;

 

1 I xxxxxxxxx of xxxxxxxxxxxxx am the defendant in this action and make the following statement as my defence to the claim made by xxxxxxxxxxxx

2. Except where otherwise mentioned in this defence, I neither admit nor deny any allegation made in the claimants Particulars of Claim and put the claimant to strict proof thereof.

3. It is denied that the Claimant served upon the Defendant a default notice pursuant to section 87(1) of The Act and which was in prescribed form and compliant with the provisions of section 88 of the Act.

4. Notwithstanding point 3, the Claimants' Particulars of Claim do not appear to disclose any legal cause of action and they are embarrassing to the defendant as the Claimant's statement of case is insufficiently particularised and does not comply with CPR part 16. In this regard I wish to draw the courts attention to the following matters:

a) A copy of the purported written Agreement that the Claimant cites in the Particulars of Claim and which appears to form the basis upon which these proceedings have been brought, has not been served;

b) A copy of the purported Default Notice cited in the Particulars of Claim, and as required by s87(1) Consumer Credit Act (1974), has not been received;

c) No copies of statements relating to the Agreement have been included with the claim form and no particulars have been offered supporting the Claimants claims of my indebtedness to them.

5. Further to the case, on 13 March 2009, 29 June 2009, 28 October 2009 & 7 December 2009, I requested the disclosure of information pursuant to the Civil Procedure Rules, which is vital to this case from the Claimant. The information requested amounted to copies of the Credit Agreement referred to in the particulars of claim and any default or termination notices.

6. The claimant has failed to comply with my request for disclosure entirely and it is suggested that such failure highlights that there is no case for me to answer.

7. Since the claimant has failed to comply with the request for disclosure as outlined in point 5, it is requested the court consider striking out the claimant statement of claim as failing to disclose reasonable grounds for bringing the claim and there is no case to answer.

8. In view of the matters pleaded above, the Defendant respectfully requests that the Court gives consideration as to whether the Claimant’s Particulars of Claim should be struck out as disclosing no reasonable grounds for bringing the claim, and/or that it fails to comply with CPR Part 16.

9. In the alternative if the Court decides not to strike out the Claimant’s case, in order for the Defendant to determine that the documents the Claimant claims to be relying upon are properly executed and contain the required prescribed terms and correct figures as to make such an Agreement enforceable by virtue of s.87 Consumer Credit Act (1974), the Defendant respectfully requests that the Court orders full disclosure of the following documents pursuant to the Civil Procedure Rules:

a) A copy of the executed Agreement as referred to in the Particulars of Claim, containing the prescribed terms under Consumer Credit (Agreements) Regulations 1983 (SI 1983/1553) and signed in the prescribed manner by both the debtor and creditor;

b) A copy of the terms & conditions as referred to in, and in force at the time of, any such executed Agreement;

c) A full breakdown of how the sum claimed has been calculated;

d) A copy of any Default Notice as referred to in the Particulars of Claim and issued under the terms of any such executed Agreement;

e) Any other documents the Claimant seeks to rely on.

10. Alternatively, if the Court is not in agreement with point 8, I respectfully request a stay in proceedings until such time as the Claimant complies with the requests outlined in point 9 above or until the Court orders its compliance with the same. I will then be in a position to file a fully particularised Defence and Counterclaim and will seek the Courts permission to amend my statement of case accordingly.

 

Statement of Truth

 

I xxxxxxxxxxx, The Defendant, believe the above statement to be true and factual

 

Signed:

Dated:

Edited December 10, 2009 by large boy
removing fonts

[hungrybear]

add in 'in accordance with cpr 3.4.2' where you ask for a strike out. looks pretty good

[large boy]

Thank you, to be honest, I've taken most of it from here so, I hope it should read OK!!!!!

 

should that be in point 8 of the defence? 'in accordance with cpr 3.4.2'

[hungrybear]

Thank you, to be honest, I've taken most of it from here so, I hope it should read OK!!!!!

 

should that be in point 8 of the defence? 'in accordance with cpr 3.4.2'

 

 

I would slap it in wherever you've asked for a strikeout.

3.4.2(a) = no cause for action in poc

3.4.2© = no documents to support poc

[large boy]

Thank you!!!!!

 

so, with my listing questionaire (pre trial checklist) that has to be filled by 18 Dec 2009, is that when I also file my defence and witness statement too?

 

Is there anything I need to do with this form in particular?

 

I assume its straight forward, even to the layman who has absolutly no knowledge of the legal system?

[citizenB]

OK, how does thios sound?

 

Witness Statement

 

I, *********** of ********************, make this statement in respect of the General order dated (the date on the letter from the court)

 

On 15th Dec 2008 I made a formal request for a true signed agreement for the alleged account under consumer credit Act 1974 s77/8, copy enclosed. The claimant failed to comply with my request, and as such the account entered default on 1st Jan 2008.

The document that they are obliged to send me is a true copy of the executed agreement that contained all of the prescribed terms, all other required terms and statutory notices and should be signed by both the claimant and myself as defined in section 61(1) of CCA 74 and subsequent Statutory Instruments. If the executed agreement contained any reference to any other document, the claimant is also obliged to send me a copy of that document. In addition a full statement of this account should have been sent to me detailing all debits and credits to the account.

Furthermore

You are aware that the Consumer Credit Act allows 12 working days for a request for a true copy of a credit agreement to be carried out before your client enters into a default situation.

These limits have expired.

As you are no doubt aware section 77(6) states:

If the creditor fails to comply with Subsection (1)

(a) He is not entitled , while the default continues, to enforce the agreement.

Therefore this account has become unenforceable at law.

As the claimant has Failed to comply with a lawful request for a true, signed copy of the said agreement and other relevant documents mentioned in it, Failed to send a full statement of the account and Failed to provide any of the documentation requested.

This legal action is both UNLAWFUL and VEXATIOUS.

Furthermore I Intend to counterclaim that any such action constitutes unlawful harassment.

The lack of a credit agreement is a very clear dispute and as such the following applies.

* The claimant may not demand any payment on the account, nor am I obliged to offer any payment to you.

* The claimant may not add further interest or any charges to the account.

* The claimant may not pass the account to a third party.

* The claimant not register any information in respect of the account with any credit reference agency.

I request that this case be struck out with Immediate effect, as the claimant or their representatives have no chance of success.

I also wish to add that the paperwork giving directions from the court were not received by me and, when they were resent, they were dated 1st December allowing me no time to formally raise my defence.

I respectfully request the court allows me a reasonable amount of time to draw up my defence and that the court orders the Claimant to provide me with the documents I requested, without which my defence will be limited unfairly. (I have amended the start of this paragraph)

 

And the defence;

 

1 I xxxxxxxxx of xxxxxxxxxxxxx am the defendant in this action and make the following statement as my defence to the claim made by xxxxxxxxxxxx

2. Except where otherwise mentioned in this defence, I neither admit nor deny any allegation made in the claimants Particulars of Claim and put the claimant to strict proof thereof.

3. It is denied that the Claimant served upon the Defendant a default notice pursuant to section 87(1) of The Act and which was in prescribed form and compliant with the provisions of section 88 of the Act.

4. Notwithstanding point 3, the Claimants' Particulars of Claim do not appear to disclose any legal cause of action and they are embarrassing to the defendant as the Claimant's statement of case is insufficiently particularised and does not comply with CPR part 16. In this regard I wish to draw the courts attention to the following matters:

a) A copy of the purported written Agreement that the Claimant cites in the Particulars of Claim and which appears to form the basis upon which these proceedings have been brought, has not been served;

b) A copy of the purported Default Notice cited in the Particulars of Claim, and as required by s87(1) Consumer Credit Act (1974), has not been received;

c) No copies of statements relating to the Agreement have been included with the claim form and no particulars have been offered supporting the Claimants claims of my indebtedness to them.

5. Further to the case, on 13 March 2009, 29 June 2009, 28 October 2009 & 7 December 2009, I requested the disclosure of information pursuant to the Civil Procedure Rules, which is vital to this case from the Claimant. The information requested amounted to copies of the Credit Agreement referred to in the particulars of claim and any default or termination notices.

6. The claimant has failed to comply with my request for disclosure entirely and it is suggested that such failure highlights that there is no case for me to answer.

7. Since the claimant has failed to comply with the request for disclosure as outlined in point 5, it is requested the court consider striking out the claimant statement of claim as failing to disclose reasonable grounds for bringing the claim and there is no case to answer.

8. In view of the matters pleaded above, the Defendant respectfully requests that the Court gives consideration as to whether the Claimant’s Particulars of Claim should be struck out as disclosing no reasonable grounds for bringing the claim, and/or that it fails to comply with CPR Part 16.

9. In the alternative if the Court decides not to strike out the Claimant’s case, in order for the Defendant to determine that the documents the Claimant claims to be relying upon are properly executed and contain the required prescribed terms and correct figures as to make such an Agreement enforceable by virtue of s.87 Consumer Credit Act (1974), the Defendant respectfully requests that the Court orders full disclosure of the following documents pursuant to the Civil Procedure Rules:

a) A copy of the executed Agreement as referred to in the Particulars of Claim, containing the prescribed terms under Consumer Credit (Agreements) Regulations 1983 (SI 1983/1553) and signed in the prescribed manner by both the debtor and creditor;

b) A copy of the terms & conditions as referred to in, and in force at the time of, any such executed Agreement;

c) A full breakdown of how the sum claimed has been calculated;

d) A copy of any Default Notice as referred to in the Particulars of Claim and issued under the terms of any such executed Agreement;

e) Any other documents the Claimant seeks to rely on.

10. Alternatively, if the Court is not in agreement with point 8, I respectfully request a stay in proceedings until such time as the Claimant complies with the requests outlined in point 9 above or until the Court orders its compliance with the same. I will then be in a position to file a fully particularised Defence and Counterclaim and will seek the Courts permission to amend my statement of case accordingly.

 

Statement of Truth

 

I xxxxxxxxxxx, The Defendant, believe the above statement to be true and factual

 

Signed:

Dated:

 

Your witness statement needs to have numbered paragraphs. I have made a couple of amendments in red.

 

What does the General order state for submitting your paperwork, I think you said the above needs to be in by tomorrow ?.

 

I am not quite sure what a pretrial check list is. I will alert the site team for you.

 

Your disclosure list, should list all of the documents you are intending to rely on in court. If you dont list it, you wont be able to refer to it at a later date.

 

Yours I think will be pretty minimal if you havent got copies of default notices etc. But anythng you might think you will need ie letters you have sent requesting information, etc. YOu should list.

 

Did you receive a copy of the other side's paperwork, ie Defence/witness statement/disclosure list ?

 

The idea is that you can request sight of documents on the lists from one another.

[supasnooper]

As Citizen B has pointed out, your Witness Statement needs to be formatted correctly.

 

Have a look at the link below - http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/legal-issues/210585-claim-struck-out-can-12.html#post2583068

 

and any exhibits should have a cover sheet as shown below

Defendant

 

Number: [1st] [2nd]

Exhibits: [“DEF1”]

Date:

 

IN THE XXX COUNTY COURT

Claim No:

 

 

 

BETWEEN

 

 

[________]

 

 

Claimant

 

 

and

 

[________]

 

 

Defendant

 

 

 

 

EXHIBIT “DEF1”

 

 

 

This is the exhibit marked “DEF1” referred to in the witness statement of large boy dated

 

 

 

 

 

 

Have a read of this thread as well.

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/show-post/post-2592204.html

 

You should be able to fax your WS and defence to the court.

Some courts do accept submission by e-mail; give them a call to check.

[large boy]

Thanks again!

 

So, do I need this cover sheet for every document I am filling?

 

ie; my defence and witness statement or, is this what I need for the trial itself?

 

Also, as the court has condensed two cases into one hearing, do I need one for each case or just one document covering the two combined cases and, if the latter is used, which case number do I refer to or should I put both in the title?

 

About to call the court and find out when these need to be filled!!!!!

 

I've just spoken to the court and I need to have this pre trial questionairre in for next friday, the 18th so I still have time to prepare!!!!!

 

I was also told that this is an allocations and directions hearing so, I will be able to ask the judge where all the documents are that I have requested a number of times and, although the trial date was set for January, the court thought that it would be put back as they are too busy to cope so I will push for that too!!!!!!

[kurvaface]

nice

[supasnooper]

 

So, do I need this cover sheet for every document I am filling?

 

ie; my defence and witness statement or, is this what I need for the trial itself?

 

You only use the cover sheet for any exhibited document ( Default Notice, purported agreement, case law, acts of law )

Your defence should just be titled Defence.

The Witness Statement should be titled Witness Statement.

 

Also, as the court has condensed two cases into one hearing, do I need one for each case or just one document covering the two combined cases and, if the latter is used, which case number do I refer to or should I put both in the title?

 

I'm getting confused here - you say that two cases have been combined.

 

 

 

Please can you put up a short summary of what cases are going to trial, what paperwork you hold for each case and the amounts being below or above £5000.00; so you can be sure that you will be asking for the necessary documents and which track allocation.

[large boy]

Hi Supasnooper

 

Yes, there are two cases against me brought by Egg.

 

One for a loan the other for a credit card.

 

I have asked for copies of signed agreements for both cases from the solicitors and bank but never received anything!

 

The judge has now said that, at the request of the solicitors (Drydens), both cases will be heard at the same time, in effect, merging them?

 

The court has told me to put both case numbers on the top of each document and they will automatically count for both cases.

 

Hi Guys

 

I'm about to do my disclosure list, should this take any particular format or is it just a list ie;

 

Letter to Egg dated 12.12.08

letter to Egg dated 13.12.08

 

etc?

[supasnooper]

A numbered list that is in chronological order will suffice.

 

Pease do take care that you do not merge the disclosure lists as it will put you at a severe disadvantage.

 

Make sure you also let the judge know you will be a Litigant In Person,as merging two cases will put you at a disadvantage.

[large boy]

Supasnooper

 

Thank you for that info as I would have merged the two lists, thinking they were the same case!

 

What do you mean by "Make sure you also let the judge know you will be a Litigant In Person,as merging two cases will put you at a disadvantage" please?

[supasnooper]

As you will be dealing with two seperate cases at one hearing; it will put you at a disadvantage that if you get a duffer of a Deputy District Judge who is not conversant in Consumer Law then you could be looking at getting two CCJ's slapped on you.

 

So, you're then shafted for two CCJ's, even though your seperate cases maybe strong enough if they were dealt with another Judge.

Edited December 14, 2009 by supasnooper
corected word

[large boy]

OK, point taken!

 

The first hearing, next week, is a directions and allocations hearing, this just means that we discuss papers, times etc doesnt it?

[supasnooper]

It should; but do not get drawn into any legal arguments.

 

By the way, what are the amounts ?

 

Are they over or under £5,000

[large boy]

They are both over £5,000.00

 

So, as I've asked for all the relevant documents four times from both the solicitors and bank, at what point do they actually have to abide with my request and provide them?

 

Also, I did wonder if I should request to see the original contracts with my signatues, and that of the bank, on to see if they exist, is this a good idea?

 

If it is, do I ask the solicitors or bank for them and, I'm assuming another £1.00 postal order will be needed?

[supasnooper]

As they are both over £5000, the odds are that a Judge will allocate the cases to Fast Track where costs can be claimed but you'll get a better Judge (at least a District Judge) and better rules on disclosure of documents.

 

However, Egg may elect to persuade you to go to the Small Claims track.

 

Here the rules are poor on disclosure of documents and the case could end up in front of a duffer of a Deputy District Judge who is not conversent in Consumer Law.....although the costs are very limited.

 

You need to start reading some threads researching for your defence as it will be you who has to appear in front of a Judge and convince him as to why you think Egg's legal arguments are poor.

 

I would also suggest you read this thread which may help you on the enforceabilty of Egg Credit Card agreements - http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/legal-issues/188093-egg-credit-agreements-what.html

 

Do a search for Civil Procedure Rules Practice Direction 16.7.3 .

You may wish to ask the Judge to order Egg to comply with this

 

I do trust have you sent CCA requests to Egg for the agreements on both accounts ?

[large boy]

Hi Supasnooper

 

Thanks again, all this info is fantastic and, I have started to read the Egg agrement thread a few times and will study all 75 pages over the next few days!

 

I'm hoping my agreement is the same as the early ones where there are plenty of faults!

 

As for me using CCA requests to Egg for the agreements on both accounts, I have done this at least four times for each acount and, the last three times were recorded delivery and contained the £1 postal order and, still I have heard nothing.

 

I have also written to the solicitors asking them to release any documents they intend to rely on in court, again, the last twice were recorded delivery, and, surprise surprise, I have received nothing!

 

This is why I wondered if, as asked in one of my last posts, I should write to both parties, Egg and Drydens, and ask to see the original signed contracts.

 

I did subscribe to the tamper proof signature so, the last few letters have had this as a signature as previously, it was a written name and not signed, again on advice received elsewhere.

 

Also, sorry to go on but, when I submit my disclosere list, witness statement and defence later this week, do I also need to attach a copy of all the letters and documents I wish to use in my defence?

[supasnooper]

have a read of this thread from post 103 -

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/dca-legal-successes/124572-hfc-no-agreement-amended-6.html#post1347693

[large boy]

WOW!

 

What a list of documents!

 

What cases should I be quoting and taking along with me, as a complete layman, I'm getting confused by all this paperwork!

 

I've been thinking about this long and hard and wondered if this might be the case;

 

I've been asked to provide my Disclosure list, witness statement and defence but only in one case, the second case was added after the court sent out the request for my documents so, as I have still to receive anything from either the bank or solicitors, can I add these docs to my list, plus any additional docs I might require due to the claimant using delaying and "keeping me in the dark" tactics?