MBNA - (Abbey & Virgin cards) CCA ??

[guzzleguts]

Here is the DN any coments appreciated.

 

 

Thanks GG

[Josie8]

Here is the DN any coments appreciated.

 

 

Thanks GG

 

 

What was the date it was issued?

[guzzleguts]

Hi josie

2/8/2006

 

GG

[Josie8]

Sorry didn'y see the date - I can't be eating enough carrots:)

 

Can you tell me if the arrears demanded was the amount you were actually in arrears at the time?

[guzzleguts]

It was arrears costs and expenses what ever they are?

 

GG

[banker_rhymes_with]

Hello GG!

 

I don't suppose you kept the Envelope the Default Notice came in?

 

Otherwise, they are OK on time, sadly.

 

DN = 02/08/2006 (Wednesday)

 

Assume Posted 1st Class, so Date of Service is +2 Working Days.

 

Date of Service = 04/08/2006 (Friday).

 

+7 Clear Days from then gives you a Deadline of 11/08/2006. They gave you until 12/08/2006, so OK on the 7 Clear Days that were then needed (it went to 14 Clear Days on 19/12/2006).

 

But if you have the Envelope and they Posted late or, better still, Posted 2nd Class, then you could still have them on the timescale issue.

 

Cheers,

BRW

[guzzleguts]

No i didnt, it was over two years ago. As they have added costs and expenses on just thought it might make it invalid.

 

GG

[creditcardmug]

GG im getting a bit confused, i thought the thread was about Mbna/Virgin cards, not Halifax personal loan?...or am i missing something? probably am:)

[guzzleguts]

Hi ccm

 

No your not missing anything, i was asking about DN's on this thread and wanted info on halifax as well, but you wanted me to post it up.

 

I know the agreement is good on the halifax just thought the dn was suspect?

 

GG

[creditcardmug]

Certain words must be in bold and underlined as in this below,

 

Also im pretty sure the sum must not include any fees/charges etc, just the arrears.

 

. Section 2 (5) and (6) of the Consumer Credit (Enforcement, Default and Termination Notices) Regulations 1983 sets out the following

(5) Where any statement is required to be in a form specified in a Schedule to these Regulations and is reproduced in the notice, then apart from any heading to the notice, trade names or names of parties to the agreement-

 

(a) the lettering in the statement shall be afforded more prominence (whether by capital letters, underlining, large or bold print or otherwise) than any other lettering in the notice; and

 

(b) where words are both shown in capital letters and underlined in any statement specified in a Schedule to these Regulations, they shall be afforded yet more prominence.

 

(6) The wording in any such statement shall be reproduced in the notice without any alteration or addition, and in relation to any statement to be contained in the notice the requirements of any note shall be complied with, except that the words "the creditor" may be replaced by the name of the creditor, by the expression by which he is referred to in the agreement or by an appropriate pronoun, and any consequential changes to pronouns and verbs may be used.

34. The notice fails to include the following statement in the form as shown

 

"IF THE ACTION REQUIRED BY THIS NOTICE IS TAKEN BEFORE THE DATE SHOWN NO FURTHER ENFORCEMENT ACTION WILL BE TAKEN IN RESPECT OF THE BREACH

 

35. Also the notice fails to set out the statement as set out below

 

"IF YOU DO NOT TAKE THE ACTION REQUIRED BY THIS NOTICE BEFORE THE DATE SHOWN THEN THE FURTHER ACTION SET OUT BELOW MAY BE TAKEN AGAINST YOU [OR A SURETY]"

 

[guzzleguts]

Thanks ccm

 

So costs and expenses are the same as fees and charges, not being thick just want to be sure ive got this right.

 

GG

[guzzleguts]

Just bumping, can anyone answer queston on above post.

 

Thanks GG

[guzzleguts]

Bump Again Please Can Anyone Look At My Queston On Post 111

 

Thanks Gg

[banker_rhymes_with]

Hello GG!

 

Just a quick one from your PM, if you read my Post below to SB100, that is about the same advice as I'd give to you when dealing with MBNA's failure to comply in full with your Subject Access Request:

 

========= Copied from SB100's Thread ==========

 

SB100 v CAP1 - Post #23

 

I'd send them a Letter Before Action (LBA) in relation to their failure to comply in full with your Statutory Subject Access Request. Maybe use and edit the CAG Template.

 

The main Library is below where you will find a few other letters that may also help:

 

Bank Templates Library

 

The S.A.R. LBA letter you want (edit to fit your own needs) is this one:

 

Data Protection Act - Non-Compliance - Template Letters

 

I'd add a line to say that when they have sent you absolutely everything, you want a letter from an Officer of the bank confirming they have let you have the lot. No letter, then they must send you whatever it is they are holding back that is preventing them from sending you that confirmation!

 

I'd also have a read of the following:

 

Re: Letters from DTI /Oft Regarding CCA1974 Issues - Post #49

 

...which is a letter from the Chief Executive of the OFT to the MP Sion Simon, regarding CCA Requests. This confirms the OFT think that a CCA Request response must include the Original Terms and the Current Terms (if varied). The OFT also feels that it would be likely that a Court would want to see the Original Agreement...

 

 

Quote:

...where the veracity of the Agreement produced could then be tested before the Court where the onus of proof is on the Creditor.

 

John Fingleton

Chief executive

Office of Fair Trading

21/11/2008

In effect, that's what I and many others on CAG have been saying for ages: only the Original Agreement will do in Court. Before Court, it's entirely correct that in response to a s77-79 CCA Request, the Consumer should be given a true copy of the real Agreement, together with both the Original Terms and the Current Terms (if varied).

 

Maybe print a copy of the above OFT letter to shove under CrapOne's bugle? Just don't let them stray too far away from reality and into a little fluffy banking world of their own.

 

The Consumer Credit Act 1974 was created to protect Consumers, not the banks. They keep forgetting that. Sadly, so do many Judges too, so it's our job to keep reminding them at every opportunity.

 

========= End of Copy from SB100's Thread ==========

 

I would send them an LBA and I would push them to give you all that they have. You know they have more to give, so make sure you get what you know they have...all being well, they'll also send you anything else they have, and/or will be forced to send you a statement from the bank confirming they have sent everything.

 

Push them hard, and don't let them dictate what they can and can't do when answering your Subject Access Request. You are entitled to anything that is linked to you where you are the Data Subject.

 

Cheers,

BRW

[guzzleguts]

Thanks BRW

I just have one more queston, do they have to supply me everything they have on me by law?

 

And if you get a min coul you look at my DN above to see if you can answer my queston on post 111, much appreciated

 

GG

[banker_rhymes_with]

Hello GG!

 

I just have one more question, do they have to supply me everything they have on me by law?

 

I would say yes, as you are the Data Subject and they are holding Data about you. A Subject Access Request is a request to see all of the Data that they hold where you as the Data Subject are mentioned.

 

If you are mentioned, then they should show it to you, otherwise why are you mentioned?

 

This is the Data Protection Act 1998 maybe have a read to get a feel for what it is about. It may help to explain a few issues in terms of what and why they are holding data about you, and their responsibilities when holding such Data.

 

And if you get a min could you look at my DN above to see if you can answer my question on post 111, much appreciated:

 

So costs and expenses are the same as fees and charges, not being thick just want to be sure I've got this right.

 

I think they just mean whatever was added to your Monthly Statements that therefore became Payable. If any Monthly Payment went unpaid, i.e. when it fell due, then it would turn into Arrears.

 

For example, it could mean an Annual Fees of £40, or Credit Card Cheque Fee if you paid anyone via Credit Card Cheque. Routine Fees that the Agreement allowed.

 

If the Agreement did not allow them, then you can regard them as unlawful charges. Then you need to see how they may have affected whatever Arrears were stated on the Default Notice.

 

Cheers,

BRW

[creditcardmug]

I meant things like late payment fees and unspecified charges etc, some of them even have the cheek to add late payment fees when the payment is not late, merely less than the min payment.

 

These are unlawful penalty charges.

 

Although if the "agreement" doesn't have them in it, ALL charges are unlawful!, including all the interest you ever paid them IMO.

[guzzleguts]

Right reverting back to my MBNA issue an update, MBNA have nearly supplied all of the doc's and papers that i wanted to see, in two separate deliveries the second one which was delivered on the 5th feb was just phone records, but i asked in the last letter i sent if they had any other doc's with my name on and they have said they have sent me everything.

 

So no default notice for the virgin account, and the best bit is when they confirm that the copies of the agreements that have been sent are the best that they could get, because the originals were unavailable?

 

If someone could answer me this if they dont send me DN after many requests for them to do so, and they cant produce the original agreements, how are they going to proceed to court? or more threats?

 

GG

[guzzleguts]

Could someone tell me are late default sums allowed to be included in a default notice amount to remedy by?

 

Thanks GG

[guzzleguts]

could anyone answer queston in above post, please

 

thanks GG

[guzzleguts]

Could anyone tell me please, the answer to post 119 and can a late letter fee of £25 be added to a default notice amount to remedy.

 

Thanks GG

[guzzleguts]

Thanks CCM

 

Hopefully BRW or DOCH will have a look and confirm

 

GG

[banker_rhymes_with]

Hello GG!

 

Could anyone tell me please, the answer to post 119 and can a late letter fee of £25 be added to a default notice amount to remedy.

 

Post 119:

 

Could someone tell me are late default sums allowed to be included in a default notice amount to remedy by?

 

I'm not sure, but it may be possible if, say, the Terms say they will charge £x if they issue a Default Notice.

 

IOW, it then becomes a Payment that is due.

 

However, that doesn't make it overdue until it becomes overdue, so I don't see why it should be included in a default sum.

 

The default sum should only be, as the name suggests, a total of the defaults, i.e. Payments that have been missed so are overdue and in default.

 

Read the small print, because it may say what they can add, but I have a sneaky feeling this may be covered by the OFT Debt Collection Guidelines so may not be allowed. I can't think of the exact reason, but possibly something to do with charging a fee to collect a Debt, something along those lines.

 

Have a read of the OFT Debt Collection Guidelines and see if you can tell me?

 

Sorry to pass the buck, just off to watch some TV as need to chill out from a long session with a defence I'm busy with for myself!

 

Cheers,

BRW

[Muffintop]

I dont understand your q, gg. you said they there was no mention of default notices on your sar or credit file...you will have late payments though on your credit file? AND 12.00 amounts on your statements for late or rather non payments....

[guzzleguts]

Sorry m

 

Default notice came yesterday not with the SAR

 

Its getting a little complicated

 

GG