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    • He was one of four former top executives from Sam Bankman-Fried's firms to plead guilty to charges.View the full article
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    • further polished WS using above suggestions and also included couple of more modifications highlighted in orange are those ok to include?   Background   1.1  The Defendant received the Parking Charge Notice (PCN) on the 06th of January 2020 following the vehicle being parked at Arla Old Dairy, South Ruislip on the 05th of December 2019.   Unfair PCN   2.1  On 19th December 2023 the Defendant sent the Claimant's solicitors a CPR request.  As shown in Exhibit 1 (pages 7-13) sent by the solicitors the signage displayed in their evidence clearly shows a £60.00 parking charge notice (which will be reduced to £30 if paid within 14 days of issue).  2.2  Yet the PCN sent by the Claimant is for a £100.00 parking charge notice (reduced to £60 if paid within 30 days of issue).   2.3        The Claimant relies on signage to create a contract.  It is unlawful for the Claimant to write that the charge is £60 on their signs and then send demands for £100.    2.4        The unlawful £100 charge is also the basis for the Claimant's Particulars of Claim.  No Locus Standi  3.1  I do not believe a contract with the landowner, that is provided following the defendant’s CPR request, gives MET Parking Services a right to bring claims in their own name. Definition of “Relevant contract” from the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012, Schedule 4,  2 [1] means a contract Including a contract arising only when the vehicle was parked on the relevant land between the driver and a person who is-   (a) the owner or occupier of the land; or   (b) Authorised, under or by virtue of arrangements made by the owner or occupier of the land, to enter into a contract with the driver requiring the payment of parking charges in respect of the parking of the vehicle on the land. According to https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2006/46/section/44   For a contract to be valid, it requires a director from each company to sign and then two independent witnesses must confirm those signatures.   3.2  The Defendant requested to see such a contract in the CPR request.  The fact that no contract has been produced with the witness signatures present means the contract has not been validly executed. Therefore, there can be no contract established between MET Parking Services and the motorist. Even if “Parking in Electric Bay” could form a contract (which it cannot), it is immaterial. There is no valid contract.  Illegal Conduct – No Contract Formed   4.1 At the time of writing, the Claimant has failed to provide the following, in response to the CPR request from myself.   4.2        The legal contract between the Claimant and the landowner (which in this case is Standard Life Investments UK) to provide evidence that there is an agreement in place with landowner with the necessary authority to issue parking charge notices and to pursue payment by means of litigation.   4.3 Proof of planning permission granted for signage etc under the Town and country Planning Act 1990. Lack of planning permission is a criminal offence under this Act and no contract can be formed where criminality is involved.   4.4        I also do not believe the claimant possesses these documents.   No Keeper Liability   5.1        The defendant was not the driver at the time and date mentioned in the PCN and the claimant has not established keeper liability under schedule 4 of the PoFA 2012. In this matter, the defendant puts it to the claimant to produce strict proof as to who was driving at the time.   5.2 The claimant in their Notice To Keeper also failed to comply with PoFA 2012 Schedule 4 section 9[2][f] while mentioning “the right to recover from the keeper so much of that parking charge as remains unpaid” where they did not include statement “(if all the applicable conditions under this Schedule are met)”.     5.3         The claimant did not mention parking period, times on the photographs are separate from the PCN and in any case are that arrival and departure times not the parking period since their times include driving to and from the parking space as a minimum and can include extra time to allow pedestrians and other vehicles to pass in front.    Protection of Freedoms Act 2012   The notice must -   (a) specify the vehicle, the relevant land on which it was parked and the period of parking to which the notice relates;  22. In the persuasive judgement K4GF167G - Premier Park Ltd v Mr Mathur - Horsham County Court – 5 January 2024 it was on this very point that the judge dismissed this claim.  5.4  A the PCN does not comply with the Act the Defendant as keeper is not liable.  No Breach of Contract   6.1       No breach of contract occurred because the PCN and contract provided as part of the defendant’s CPR request shows different post code, PCN shows HA4 0EY while contract shows HA4 0FY. According to PCN defendant parked on HA4 0EY which does not appear to be subject to the postcode covered by the contract.  6.2         The entrance sign does not mention anything about there being other terms inside the car park so does not offer a contract which makes it only an offer to treat,  Interest  7.1  It is unreasonable for the Claimant to delay litigation for  Double Recovery   7.2  The claim is littered with made-up charges.  7.3  As noted above, the Claimant's signs state a £60 charge yet their PCN is for £100.  7.4  As well as the £100 parking charge, the Claimant seeks recovery of an additional £70.  This is simply a poor attempt to circumvent the legal costs cap at small claims.  7.5 Since 2019, many County Courts have considered claims in excess of £100 to be an abuse of process leading to them being struck out ab initio. An example, in the Caernarfon Court in VCS v Davies, case No. FTQZ4W28 on 4th September 2019, District Judge Jones-Evans stated “Upon it being recorded that District Judge Jones- Evans has over a very significant period of time warned advocates (...) in many cases of this nature before this court that their claim for £60 is unenforceable in law and is an abuse of process and is nothing more than a poor attempt to go behind the decision of the Supreme Court v Beavis which inter alia decided that a figure of £160 as a global sum claimed in this case would be a penalty and not a genuine pre-estimate of loss and therefore unenforceable in law and if the practice continued, he would treat all cases as a claim for £160 and therefore a penalty and unenforceable in law it is hereby declared (…) the claim is struck out and declared to be wholly without merit and an abuse of process.”  7.6 In Claim Nos. F0DP806M and F0DP201T, District Judge Taylor echoed earlier General Judgment or Orders of District Judge Grand, stating ''It is ordered that the claim is struck out as an abuse of process. The claim contains a substantial charge additional to the parking charge which it is alleged the Defendant contracted to pay. This additional charge is not recoverabl15e under the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012, Schedule 4 nor with reference to the judgment in Parking Eye v Beavis. It is an abuse of process from the Claimant to issue a knowingly inflated claim for an additional sum which it is not entitled to recover. This order has been made by the court of its own initiative without a hearing pursuant to CPR Rule 3.3(4)) of the Civil Procedure Rules 1998...''  7.7 In the persuasive case of G4QZ465V - Excel Parking Services Ltd v Wilkinson – Bradford County Court -2 July 2020 (Exhibit 4) the judge had decided that Excel had won. However, due to Excel adding on the £60 the Judge dismissed the case.  7.8        The addition of costs not previously specified on signage are also in breach of the Consumer Rights Act 2015, Schedule 2, specifically paras 6, 10 and 14.   7.9        It is the Defendant’s position that the Claimant in this case has knowingly submitted inflated costs and thus the entire claim should be similarly struck out in accordance with Civil Procedure Rule 3.3(4).   In Conclusion   8.1        I invite the court to dismiss the claim.  Statement of Truth  I believe that the facts stated in this witness statement are true. I understand that proceedings for contempt of court may be brought against anyone who makes, or causes to be made, a false statement in a document verified by a statement of truth without an honest belief in its truth.   
    • Well the difference is that in all our other cases It was Kev who was trying to entrap the motorist so sticking two fingers up to him and daring him to try court was from a position of strength. In your case, sorry, you made a mistake so you're not in the position of strength.  I've looked on Google Maps and the signs are few & far between as per Kev's MO, but there is an entrance sign saying "Pay & Display" (and you've admitted in writing that you knew you had to pay) and the signs by the payment machines do say "Sea View Car Park" (and you've admitted in writing you paid the wrong car park ... and maybe outed yourself as the driver). Something I missed in my previous post is that the LoC is only for one ticket, not two. Sorry, but it's impossible to definitively advise what to so. Personally I'd probably gamble on Kev being a serial bottler of court and reply with a snotty letter ridiculing the signage (given you mentioned the signage in your appeal) - but it is a gamble.  
    • No! What has happened is that your pix were up-to-date: 5 hours' maximum stay and £100 PCN. The lazy solicitors have sent ancient pictures: 4 hours' maximum stay and £60 PCN. Don't let on!  Let them be hoisted by their own lazy petard in the court hearing (if they don't bottle before).
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      On 15/1/24 booked appointment with Big Motoring World (BMW) to view a mini on 17/1/24 at 8pm at their Enfield dealership.  

      Car was dirty and test drive was two circuits of roundabout on entry to the showroom.  Was p/x my car and rushed by sales exec and a manager into buying the mini and a 3yr warranty that night, sale all wrapped up by 10pm.  They strongly advised me taking warranty out on car that age (2017) and confirmed it was honoured at over 500 UK registered garages.

      The next day, 18/1/24 noticed amber engine warning light on dashboard , immediately phoned BMW aftercare team to ask for it to be investigated asap at nearest garage to me. After 15 mins on hold was told only their 5 service centres across the UK can deal with car issues with earliest date for inspection in March ! Said I’m not happy with that given what sales team advised or driving car. Told an amber warning light only advisory so to drive with caution and call back when light goes red.

      I’m not happy to do this, drive the car or with the after care experience (a sign of further stresses to come) so want a refund and to return the car asap.

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    • We have finally managed to obtain the transcript of this case.

      The judge's reasoning is very useful and will certainly be helpful in any other cases relating to third-party rights where the customer has contracted with the courier company by using a broker.
      This is generally speaking the problem with using PackLink who are domiciled in Spain and very conveniently out of reach of the British justice system.

      Frankly I don't think that is any accident.

      One of the points that the judge made was that the customers contract with the broker specifically refers to the courier – and it is clear that the courier knows that they are acting for a third party. There is no need to name the third party. They just have to be recognisably part of a class of person – such as a sender or a recipient of the parcel.

      Please note that a recent case against UPS failed on exactly the same issue with the judge held that the Contracts (Rights of Third Parties) Act 1999 did not apply.

      We will be getting that transcript very soon. We will look at it and we will understand how the judge made such catastrophic mistakes. It was a very poor judgement.
      We will be recommending that people do include this adverse judgement in their bundle so that when they go to county court the judge will see both sides and see the arguments against this adverse judgement.
      Also, we will be to demonstrate to the judge that we are fair-minded and that we don't mind bringing everything to the attention of the judge even if it is against our own interests.
      This is good ethical practice.

      It would be very nice if the parcel delivery companies – including EVRi – practised this kind of thing as well.

       

      OT APPROVED, 365MC637, FAROOQ, EVRi, 12.07.23 (BRENT) - J v4.pdf
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I Beat LBL last night!


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I can relate to wanting to just 'put it to bed' but in accepting these type of agreements you are strengthening LBL's hand by keeping it 'out of court', and therefore if everyone was to do they will just keep on doing what they are doing and gaining more and more victims, most of whom will simply accept their car getting swiped and/or staggeringly high interest and charges. Most of their loans are for relatively small amounts anyway, so the cost to them isn't that great.

Those who have the strength to keep fighting will be rewarded.

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I know what your saying fleeced, but keeping my car was number one priority, they gave me an option, settle (which didn’t cost me a penny), or they will take my car, not much of a choice. Not overly concerned about making money on top or having payments back as I DID take out a loan. In my opinion attempts to challenge the agreement when not under threat are merely people jumping on the bandwagon and trying to avoid paying.

I had paid my loan without a problem until a change of circumstances and they refused to help, that is when I sought legal help, primarily to keep my car.

Everyones situation is different, and I sympathise for the folk that have been wronged by LBL. I also think they should be brought to task and regulated properly so that there interest rates aren’t so ludicrous, but at the end of the day, we all walked into taking a secured loan on a car with our eyes open.

My case is over, and I wish everyone else luck who is having problems with LBL.

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As for what you said about “strengthening LBL’s hand” while keeping it out of court, unfortunately I had to be selfish and think about myself as I have children and require a car. I wouldn’t feel particularly noble if I had to walk everywhere.

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As for what you said about “strengthening LBL’s hand” while keeping it out of court, unfortunately I had to be selfish and think about myself as I have children and require a car. I wouldn’t feel particularly noble if I had to walk everywhere.

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The whole point of 'pro-bono' work is 'for the greater public good', and in the case of LBL the aim is not just absolving individuals of their debt or keeping the cars it has to be bringing the company to account within the law and hopefully cease trading. I agree we all went into the agreements with our eyes open to a degree but I haven't heard yet of a case where the 'bill of sale' was explained accurately nor of the company's eagerness to repossess at the drop of a hat - in fact most loans were sold as the company being 'great' and 'helpful' and that repo's happen very rarely etc. It is one thing offering extortionate finance, but LBL take it too far - and the horror stories abound of people who paid far more than they borrowed and still lost their cars, cars that were taken despite loans being satisfied etc, all point to a company deliberately taking advantage of their already desperate customers. In that respect none of us really understood what we getting tangled up in, and it is that more than anything that needs a judgement in court

 

As for these agreements, what would you do if, say in two months time, you awake to find some tallywacker clamping your car and who won't accept your unwitnessed agreement as evidence of your absolving of debt to LBL? The police won't be interested ('civil matter, sorry miss'), LBL will probably fob you off and you will be left having to kick everything off again. Sorry for the negativity but nobody connected to that company (certainly not their solicitor) has any scruples whatsoever, and this is a situation that could so easily happen.

Edited by Fleeced73
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hi all just having a quick read

i feel log book loans have done a dirty on stephensons

before accepting, should you have phoned stephensons to let them know the situation

 

after all, they are the pros

 

it looks to me that stephensons have them on some thing, that is why they ditched for cover

dont think stephensons will be to happy

 

just putting a valid point

 

nothing personel

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I can relate to wanting to just 'put it to bed' but in accepting these type of agreements you are strengthening LBL's hand by keeping it 'out of court', and therefore if everyone was to do they will just keep on doing what they are doing and gaining more and more victims, most of whom will simply accept their car getting swiped and/or staggeringly high interest and charges. Most of their loans are for relatively small amounts anyway, so the cost to them isn't that great.

Those who have the strength to keep fighting will be rewarded.

 

Fleeced...I am unaware if you have read any of my previous threads...But I have been fighting for the last 5 months and Log Book Loans is only one fraction of my problems I cant speak for anyone else...I am so desperate to have my life back you have no idea it's not about strength there just comes a time when you are tired of fighting as that's all you ever seem to do and I have neglected so much of my time with the kids because I have been busy fighting one case after another.

I'm fighting back and ready to go :D who will be my first victim? LBL, Brighthouse.

 

..."If you have no confidence in self, you are twice defeated in the race of life."

 

I am not here to insult or offend...just to offer advice and seek advice as all this is a learning experience, such is the cycle of life...for those that would wish to insult me for my thoughts or deeds...Stay Blessed for I know my heart is pure with no ill thought towards YOU. :cool:

Nationwide Won:D Benefits returned £577

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The whole point of 'pro-bono' work is 'for the greater public good', and in the case of LBL the aim is not just absolving individuals of their debt or keeping the cars it has to be bringing the company to account within the law and hopefully cease trading. I agree we all went into the agreements with our eyes open to a degree but I haven't heard yet of a case where the 'bill of sale' was explained accurately nor of the company's eagerness to repossess at the drop of a hat - in fact most loans were sold as the company being 'great' and 'helpful' and that repo's happen very rarely etc. It is one thing offering extortionate finance, but LBL take it too far - and the horror stories abound of people who paid far more than they borrowed and still lost their cars, cars that were taken despite loans being satisfied etc, all point to a company deliberately taking advantage of their already desperate customers. In that respect none of us really understood what we getting tangled up in, and it is that more than anything that needs a judgement in court

 

As for these agreements, what would you do if, say in two months time, you awake to find some tallywacker clamping your car and who won't accept your unwitnessed agreement as evidence of your absolving of debt to LBL? The police won't be interested ('civil matter, sorry miss'), LBL will probably fob you off and you will be left having to kick everything off again. Sorry for the negativity but nobody connected to that company (certainly not their solicitor) has any scruples whatsoever, and this is a situation that could so easily happen.

 

My solicitor never offered or mentioned any pro-bono and I am with stephensons, and unable to pay as I am only in receipt of child benefit and child tax credit...and am a single parent with 3 children.

 

Your last statement tho I do totally agree with, as my three letters where just A4 poorly printed letters, which the person who came round admitted they were printed at home and the ink was running out. The letters had no company letter head and Mr Foster's signature looks like a faint (very faint as you have to look real hard to see the paper had a something that should resemble a signature which you cant even see on the scanned image) this is why I made her sign it, to which she stated she was told not to sign anything but in order to obtain my signature she had to. And even then as I do not know her from adam or her position within the company I dont even know if the signature counts for jack as over the weekend I have been considering all sorts... and just by looking at the one letter I was provided with you can imagine what the other two looked like.

 

 

LBL00022.gif

 

I am good at computers and a dab hand at altering documents, who's to say when we supplied the signature on the piece of unofficial A4 that our signature and the date we signed it in our own hand is not going to be copied onto a document that we did not sign... There are possibilities for anything but then does that mean that we should be suspicious of everything? I did forward mine directly to the solicitors so they too have a copy and I guess even he has some doubt with the papers I signed as today I have received notification for injunction and this letter was dated yesterday I actually signed LBL's thing Friday. So maybe there is more to Fleeced argument to be considered.

 

 

hi all just having a quick read

i feel log book loans have done a dirty on stephensons

before accepting, should you have phoned stephensons to let them know the situation

 

after all, they are the pros

 

it looks to me that stephensons have them on some thing, that is why they ditched for cover

dont think stephensons will be to happy

 

just putting a valid point

 

nothing personel

 

And in reply ...faced with them at your door little after 7am I doubt the solicitors would be able to help at that point in time, which is probably one reason why many would sign, me personally my need for a nights sleep without watching my car all night, and the fact the person actually woke me all ready feeling quite exhausted. However I had not even expected such a speedily reply from my solicitor to my email's which weren't sent till after 8am.

I'm fighting back and ready to go :D who will be my first victim? LBL, Brighthouse.

 

..."If you have no confidence in self, you are twice defeated in the race of life."

 

I am not here to insult or offend...just to offer advice and seek advice as all this is a learning experience, such is the cycle of life...for those that would wish to insult me for my thoughts or deeds...Stay Blessed for I know my heart is pure with no ill thought towards YOU. :cool:

Nationwide Won:D Benefits returned £577

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  • 2 weeks later...
a chap from LB collections knocked on door at 8 o'clock saying he knows I am with astephensons. He gave me a letter from LBL to sign absolving me from tv debt and waiving their rights to ownership of the car if I cease my legal action!

 

Happy days. Call me if you need info. {Edit} Phone number removed please do not post personal details on the open forum

Hi

i am new to this forum and need help with resolving this problem. Can you possibly let me know, what your circumstances were and what argument you used by your solicitors in order to obtain this settlement.

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In all honesty, LBL knew that my solicitors were involved, they just sent out the letters t LBL stating that the loan was in dispute and so on. Nothing ever went to court, the chap coming round was completely out of the blue.

 

Apart from telling you my story, I cant really give any advice as I dont really know why they did it. Speak to your solicitors on the matter and see what they recommend.

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The matter of LBL has & is in court & HAS BEEN FOR SOME TIME. I understand that claims have been issued & early court dates arranged

 

So h775 I ask again STOP misleading people

 

 

I said I CAN'T give and advice JonCris, stop being an arse.

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No one objects to you telling people what happened to you or even you advising them to follow your example but what gets stuck in my craw are your statements which have absolutely no founding in fact & can only be designed to encourage victims to settle which makes me wonder why!

 

If you are genuine former customer of LBL then for some reason you have no idea what's going on so don't pretend you do & mislead those who are

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H755BPX : you would do well to not rise to Jon Cris's bate, I have said it before and I will say it again, feel free to correct me if I am incorrect but the comments about advise....erm this is a forum and if I remember correctly the discussion on this thread took place between H775 and myself, the PRIVATE conversation that took place which Jon Cris incorrectly chose to bring to the moderators attention (mentioned in his important thread that had nothing of importance other than a personal dig at another forum user) with no solid facts of what the discussion between H755 and myself involved.

 

I can confirm I am a grown woman and the discussion and advice offered by H755 or anyone else on the forum I may or may not take on board everyone is entitled to an opinion, and I read his comment to the person that requested advice and I do not see where H755 put a foot wrong to require Jon Cris to again monitor his conversations in order to find fault. Why am I so bothered??? Because I am annoyed that Jon Cris believes he has the right to censor people, he acts like he is the only one to have genuine dealings with LBL that even I have been on the receiving end of his rudeness when I myself believe I have been polite to every member of the forum I have ever come across whether I agree with them or not.

 

I do not know what personal interest LBL is to Jon Cris but dont for one second assume that gives you the inside knowledge and only you and you alone can comment, advise etc. Advice is to be given and it is an individuals choice whether or not to accept the given advice or obtain further information so as to make an informed choice, and as this is a forum where Jon has previously lowered the tone to insult me because I stated what a forum is used for I doubt I should need to remind him although he will probably take offence and resort to the type of mentality I have already witnessed.

 

Life is too short but this is getting to be ridiculously petty.

I'm fighting back and ready to go :D who will be my first victim? LBL, Brighthouse.

 

..."If you have no confidence in self, you are twice defeated in the race of life."

 

I am not here to insult or offend...just to offer advice and seek advice as all this is a learning experience, such is the cycle of life...for those that would wish to insult me for my thoughts or deeds...Stay Blessed for I know my heart is pure with no ill thought towards YOU. :cool:

Nationwide Won:D Benefits returned £577

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Hi again! I completely agree. I had signed two lots of Legal Aid forms with said company, the first ones signed about 5 months ago were never actioned as when an injunction was mentioned I was asked to sign them again as the others were out of date.

 

The way I see it, I havent signed anything to the effect that I accept any charges, and if there are any, then they knew about them and should've sent my leal aid forms in for authorisation months ago. They certainly will not get any of my money.

 

Throughout this whole process, to be fair, I have gone it alone. I have had to take measures to ensure my car remains in my posession, all the solicitors have done in a nutshell is advise LBL that I will take them to court.

 

As for the granting of legal aid not free you from cost liability - what a load of old twaddle, yes it does, that's why it is LEGAL AID, as long as it is only upto and not over the value on the certificate.

 

For me, there has been a lot of scaremongering, but in all fairness when LB Collections popped round to see me, they were perfectly civil and no means threatening.

 

Just my two penneth.

they took my car yesterday from dublin ireland i wonder whether your solicitor can still help me.

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Assuming an agreement was signed by the claimant & the solicitor & if legal costs are NOT included as part of any settlement then the client will become liable for said costs hence the reason for renegotiating a settlement to INCLUDE costs

 

If nothing was signed or agreed between parties then no liability for costs is incurred

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The granting of legal aid does not free a litigant from liability.

 

If it did there would be no requirement in law for the losing party to pay the said costs & the burden would fall on the taxpayer rather than the none legal aid party

 

It's known as the indemnity principal

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Hi

I too was offered this deal...but the catch was i had to pay the solicitors fees which was more than the orignal loan, of £3000.

I was tempted to sign, just to get them off my back, but it would be a catch 22....i would have the solicitors on my back instead of LbL.

However l am glad if this has worked out for all you LbL loaners.

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