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    • Please see my comments in orange within your post.
    • no i meant the email from parcel2go which email address did they send it from and who signed it off (whos name is at the bottom)
    • I understand confusion with this thread.  I tried to keep threads separate because there have been so many angles.    But a team member merged them all.  This is why it's hard to keep track. This forum exists to help little people fight injustice - however big or small.  Im here to try get a decent resolution. Not to give in to the ' big boys'. My "matter' became complicated 'matters' simply because a lender refused to sell a property. What can I say?  I'll try in a nutshell to give an overview: There's a long lease property. I originally bought it short lease with a s.146 on it from original freeholder.  I had no concerns. So lender should have been able to sell a well-maintained lovely long lease property.  The property was great. The issue is not the property.  Economy, sdlt increases, elections, brexit, covid, interest hikes etc didn't help.  The issue is simple - the lender wanted to keep it.   House or Flat? Before repo I offered to clear my loan.  I was a bit short and lender refused.  They said (recorded) they thought the property was worth much more and they were happy to keep accruing interest (in their benefit) until it reached a point where they felt they could repo and still easily quickly sell to get their £s back.  This was a mistake.  The market was (and is) tough.   2y later the lender ceo bid the same sum to buy the property for himself. He'd rejected higher offers in the intervening period whilst accruing interest. Lenders have a legal obligation to sell the property for the best price they can get. If they feel the offer is low they won't sell it, because it's likely the borrower will say the same. I had the property under offer to a fantastic niche buyer but lender rushed to repo and buyer got spooked and walked.  It had taken a long time to find such a lucrative buyer.  A sale which would have resulted in £s and another asset for me. Post repo lender had 1 offer immediately.  But dragged out the process for >1y - allegedly trying to get other offers. But disclosure shows there was only one valid buyer. Again, points as above. Lender appointed receiver (after 4 months) - simply to try acquire the freehold.  He used his powers as receiver to use me, as leaseholder, to serve notice on freeholders.  Legally that failed. Meanwhile lender failed to secure property - and squatters got in (3 times).  And they failed to maintain it.  So freeholders served a dilapidations notice (external) - on me as leaseholder (cc-ed to lender).   (That's how it works legally) Why serve a delapidations notice? If it's in the terms of the lease to maintain the property to a good standard, then serve an S146 notice instead as it's a clear breach of the lease. I don't own the freehold.  But I am a trustee and have to do right by the freeholders.  This is where matters got/ get complicated.  And probably lose most caggers.   Lawyers got involved for the freeholders to firstly void the receiver enfranchisement notice. Secondly, to serve the dilapidations notice.  The lack of maintenance was in breach of lease and had to be served to protect fh asset. Enfranchisement isn't something that can be "voided", it's in the Leasehold Reform Act 1967 that leaseholders have the right to buy the freehold of the property. It's normal, whether it is a "normal" leaseholder or a repossession with a leasehold house, to claim this right of enfranchisement and sell the property with said rights attached and the purchase price of the freehold included in the final completion price. That's likely what the mortgage provider wished to do. The lender did no repairs. They said a buyer would undertake them. Which was probably correct. If they had sold. After 1y lender finally agreed to sell to the 1st offeror and contracts went with lawyers.  Within 1 month lender reneged.  Lender tried to suggest buyer walked. Evidence shows he/ his lawyers continued trying to exchange (cash) for 4 months.  Evidence shows lender and receiver strategy had been to renege and for ceo to take control.   I still think that's their plan. Redact and scan said evidence up for others to look at? Lender then stupidly chose to pretty much bulldoze the property.  Other stuff was going on in the background. After repo I was in touch by phone and email and lender knew post got to me.   Despite this, after about 10 months (before and then during covid), they deliberately sent SDs and eventually a B petition to an incorrect address and an obscure small court.  They never served me properly.  (In hindsight I understand they hoped to get a backdoor B - so they could keep the property that way.)  Eventually the random court told them to email me by way of service.  At this point their ruse to make me B failed.  I got a lawyer (friend paid). The B petition was struck out. They’d failed to include the property as an asset. They were in breach of insolvency rules. So this is dealt with then. Simultaneously the receiver again appointed lawyers to act on my behalf as leaseholder. This time to serve notice on the freeholders for a lease extension.  He had hoped to try and vary the strict lease. Evidence shows the already long length of lease wasn't an issue.  The lender obviously hoped to get round their lack of permission to do works (which they were already doing) by hoping to remove the strict clauses that prevent leaseholder doing alterations.  You wouldn't vary a lease through a lease extension. You'd need a Deed of Variation for that. This may be done at the same time but the lease has already been extended once and that's all they have a right to. The extension created a new legal angle for me to deal with.  I had to act as trustee for freeholders against me as leaseholder/ the receiver.  Inconsistencies and incompetence by receiver lawyers dragged this out 3y.  It still isn't properly resolved. The lease has already been extended once so they have no right to another extension. It seems pretty easy to just get the lawyer to say no and stick by those terms as the law is on your side there. Meanwhile - going back to the the works the lender undertook. The works were consciously in breach of lease.  The lender hadn't remedied the breaches listed in the dilapidations notice.  They destroyed the property.  The trustees compiled all evidence.  The freeholders lawyers then served a forfeiture notice. This notice started a different legal battle. I was acting for the freeholders against what the lender had done on my behalf as leaseholder.  This legal battle took 3y to resolve. Again, order them to revert it as they didn't have permission to do the works, or else serve an S146 notice for breach of the lease. The simple exit would have been for lender to sell. A simple agreement to remedy the breaches and recompense the freeholders in compensation - and there's have been clean title to sell.  That option was proposed to them.   This happened by way of mediation for all parties 2y ago.  A resolution option was put forward and in principle agreed.  But immediately after the lender lawyers failed to engage.  A hard lesson to learn - mediation cannot be referred to in court. It's considered w/o prejudice. The steps they took have made no difference to their ability to sell the property.  Almost 3y since they finished works they still haven't sold. ** ** I followed up some leads myself.  A qualified cash buyer offered me a substantial sum.  The lender and receiver both refused it.   I found another offer in disclosure.  6 months later someone had apparently offered a substantial sum via an agent.  The receiver again rejected it.  The problem of course was that the agent had inflated the market price to get the business. But no-one was or is ever going to offer their list price.  Yet the receiver wanted/wants to hold out for the list price.  Which means 1y later not only has it not sold - disclosure shows few viewings and zero interest.  It's transparently over-priced.  And tarnished. For those asking why I don't give up - I couldn't/ can't.  Firstly I have fiduciary duties as a trustee. Secondly, legal advice indicates I (as leaseholder) could succeed with a large compensation claim v the lender.  Also - I started a claim v my old lawyer and the firm immediately reimbursed some £s. That was encouraging.  And a sign to continue.  So I'm going for compensation.  I had finance in place (via friend) to do a deal and take the property back off the lender - and that lawyer messed up bad.   He should have done a deal.  Instead further years have been wasted.   Maybe I only get back my lost savings - but that will be a result.   If I can add some kind of complaint/ claim v the receiver's conscious impropriety I will do so.   I have been left with nothing - so fighting for something is worth it. The lender wants to talk re a form of settlement.  Similar to my proposal 2y ago.  I have a pretty clear idea of what that means to me.  This is exactly why I do not give up.  And why I continue to ask for snippets of advice/ pointers on cag.  
    • It was all my own work based on my previous emails to P2G which Bank has seen.
    • I was referring to #415 where you wrote "I was forced to try to sell - and couldn't." . And nearer the start in #79 .. "I couldn't sell.  I had an incredibly valuable asset. Huge equity.  But the interest accrued / the property market suffered and I couldn't find a buyer even at a level just to clear the debt." In #194 you said you'd tried to sell for four years.  The reason for these points is that a lot of the claims against for example your surveyor, solicitor, broker, the lender and now the receiver are mainly founded in a belief that they should have been able to do something but did not. Things that might seem self evident to you but not necessarily to others. Pressing these claims may well need a bit more hard evidence, rather than an appeal to common sense. Can you show evidence of similar properties, with similar freehold issues, selling readily? And solid reasons why the lender should have been able to sell when you couldn't.
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Monument PBP refund - want to offset to a DCA & debt is SB'd too! (scotland) help please!


delilahsahb
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Hi folks

Just want to make sure i am right before i send off statute barred letter to Monument.

 

I had a Monument Credit Card in 2003.

 

in December 2004 i got into financial difficulty and ended up going through debt management.

 

After i realised how little was going to my creditors i got rid of the debt management company and dealt with most of my debts myself.

 

Monument was a relatively small debt at that time of around £1100 so i left it and didnt pay anything.

 

Last payment through debt management was in May 2006.

 

I have received a monthly statement from Monument, they have a minimum payment of £2.36 a month

( which hasnt been paid) and ppi being added continuously.

Debt now stands at around £2000.

 

As i am in Scotland and its the 5 year statute barred rule that would apply

 

should i just send them the statute barred letter now so they can save some trees by not sending me statements?

 

Also, i know its greedy coz i havent paid them but where would i stand with a ppi claim and charges?

 

Not too bothered about claiming but if its there to be had so to speak.

Thanks

Delilah

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Hi Delilah and sorry you went unanswered for so long.

 

Two things matter in deciding if a debt is Statute Barred :-

 

1. When you last paid anything towards the debt. Each payment resets the SB time clock.

 

2. When you last acknowledged the debt in writing - eg promising to pay something when you next got paid, saying you'll resume payments when things get better for you, etc.

 

If you've done neither of these, a debt becomes Statute Barred after 5 years in Scotland and 6 years in England and Wales.

 

Whether they sent you anything (demands, statements, etc) is immaterial.

 

You could reclaim the PPI on the a/c but the refund would most likely be used to reduce the debt. Any balance left over would be repaid to you.

 

:-)

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Hi Slick,

Thank you for your reply.

 

I just wanted to check and make sure before i sent them the Statute Barred letter.

 

It is definately statute barred, its now over 6 years since the last payment was made and ive not had any personal contact with them since 2005.

 

I think i will send the statute barred letter next week and see what i get back from them before i decide on the ppi.

 

Most of the outstanding balance in 2004 was made up of late payment charges and the ppi would be worth more than the balance

so i am tempted to go for it

but i dont want to push my luck.

 

Im in the middle of a barclaycard ppi and they arent playing nicely with the FOS,

 

im now at over18 weeks waiting on their figures and they have made excuse after excuse to the FOS manager thats dealing with it

and its put me off claiming on other claims i might have as well as driving me nuts.

Thanks again

 

Delilah

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the monument payment break plan is ppi.

 

the debt is SB'ed.

 

reclaim the PBP and the money is yours

 

the debt is extinguished after 5yrs in scotland

 

they cant take the money

 

its yours

 

dx

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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If there are penalty charges on the a/c and you have statements showing them, you can reclaim the penalty charges too, plus compound contractual interest.

 

Read more about this in the Barclays Successes forum. Look for threads showing **WON with compound interest** - http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/forumdisplay.php?97-Barclays-BCard-and-Woolwich-successes

 

If the debt is Statute Barred (which you confirm it is), you should be able to get the penalty charges plus interest refunded to you direct but you will have to take court action to get it. But this really depends on whether you still have the a/c statements. BC are not likely to supply any that are over 6 years old unless you ALSO take court action to force disclosure of a/c data.

 

Re the PPI refund, if this is being d/w by the FOS, they will probably agree with BC that they'll refund the PPI and related interest to clear the debt before repaying anything direct to you. That seems to be the FOS's policy. This may alter is they debt was sold to a DCA.

 

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Thank you dx,

you have made an old woman very happy this morning.

Should i send the Statute Barred letter to Monument 1st

and then claim the ppi and charges back from them?

 

Thanks Slick for your reply.

I have a post on my Barclaycard ppi fight (i shouldnt have mentioned the Barclaycard one on here it might confuse the Monument issue),

Barclaycard sold the account to Cabot and Cabot took me to court last year and the case was dismissed at the beginning of this year.

 

 

When i claimed back the charges on the Barclaycard account they paid it direct to Cabot despite my protests

but due to Cabots court action they supplied me with all account info.

 

 

I know i have the risk of the ppi being paid to Cabot on that account and im prepared to fight them all the way if necessary.

It was just the waiting that put me off trying the same with Monument but after dx's reply and yours i will go for it.

 

Delilah

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  • 2 years later...

Need someone to confirm this for me.

 

Last payment made by me to Monument was in 2006,

however they had me on a payment break plan which finished in January 2015.

 

I am in Scotland this debt has now been passed to Capquest.

 

Does the payment break plan mean that the debt is not statute barred

or because I have not personally made any payments to it that it is statute barred??

 

Cheers folks

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SB'd

 

 

refund of PBP or PENALTY charges to the old account does not reset the SB date.

 

 

dx

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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  • 5 months later...

Received a letter from Monument today (Final Response) stating the adjustment to the account is £2607.05.

Next line states: They will apply the adjustment value to any outstanding debt on the account. Should there be a surplus they will send me out a cheque within 28 days.

 

 

Can they do that on a statute barred debt?? I thought if it was Statute Barred (Scotland) the debt doesn't exist after 5 years so how can they apply a refund to a debt that doesn't exist?? Will I have to contact the Financial Ombudsman??

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IMHO you are correct

 

You need to point out to monument that the agreement was taken out in Scotland and you are still resident in Scotland

 

So under Scottish law the debt is extinguished and does not exist

 

I suspect they have sent you a STD letter and do not realise this

 

You of course also need to point out that they sold the debt on and all their rights to so they cannot exercise their right offset

And that they can't buy back a debt that legally does no even exist anymore in Scottish law

 

Dx

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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I have just sent them the following by email

 

 

I received a letter from you today regarding the claim.

Just emailing to remind you that this agreement was taken out in Scotland and I still reside in Scotland.

The debt is Statute Barred and under Scottish Law is extinguished and does not exist.

If you sold the debt and all your rights to Capquest you cannot exercise your right to offset.

You can't buy back a debt that legally does no even exist anymore in Scottish law.

 

 

I look forward to hearing from you

Regards

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Just found the Notice of Assignment,

 

 

the respective rights, title and interest in your Monument Account, the details of which are set out below,

(including the right to receive payment of the outstanding balance)

were assigned by Raphael & Sons PLC to Compucredit International Servicing LLC.

 

Letter is dated the 22/12/2014, sent by Arrow Global and using Capquest as the dca.

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Hi D,

 

An Adjudicator at the FOS may agree with the bank, that it is fair and reasonable for the bank to set off the debt against an unpaid balance, even though the debt was sold on.

 

However, an Ombudsman may agree with you, that the bank has no right to set off any balance to a 3rd party.

 

I think this may be as useful as the SB argument.

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the crux here is the debt no longer exists its Scotland.

 

 

dx

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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Share on other sites

The woman I spoke to today seemed interested enough. Its a weird one with it being a Scottish statute barred, the debt no longer exists so technically they cant offset to a zero debt and especially not to a 3rd party.

I have to wait for their response and see what they hit me with then take it from there I suppose.

I will let you all know though

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I have received a letter from Monument today

 

I am sorry you have had to contact us about your Monument account. Thank you for taking the time and trouble to do so.

I am looking into your concerns regarding your Payment Break Plan claim and will let you have a response or update as quickly as i can but no later than 15 December 2015. This date is set in accordance with the Financial Conduct Authority handbook........bla bla bla

 

I am presuming this is their response to the email i sent them pointing out that it is Scottish Statute Barred

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Hi Delilah,

 

Just update us when they respond further.

 

:-)

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  • 2 weeks later...

Hi Delilah,

 

If there's no explanation for the amount received, I'd bank the cheque and write back to Monument saying :-

 

I refer to your cheque for £215.77 which I will bank as a payment on account of the final amount due to me.

 

Please provide me with your calculations showing how this amount is made up.

 

:-)

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