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    • Nick Wallis has written up the first day of Angela van den Bogerd's evidence to the inquiry. I thought she was awful. She's decided to go with being not bright enough to spot what was happening over Fujitsu altering entries on the Horizon system, rather than covering up important facts. She's there today as well. The First Lady of Flat Earth – Post Office Scandal WWW.POSTOFFICESCANDAL.UK Angela van den Bogerd, on oath once more It is possible that Angela van den Bogerd and her senior colleagues (Rodric Williams, Mark Davies, Susan...  
    • Thank-you dx, What you have written is certainly helpful to my understanding. The only thing I would say, what I found to be most worrying and led me to start this discussion is, I believe the judge did not merely admonish the defendant in the case in question, but used that point to dismiss the case in the claimants favour. To me, and I don't have your experience or knowledge, that is somewhat troubling. Again, the caveat being that we don't know exactly what went on but I think we can infer the reason for the judgement. Thank-you for your feedback. EDIT: I guess that the case I refer to is only one case and it may never happen again and the strategy not to appeal is still the best strategy even in this event, but I really did find the outcome of that case, not only extremely annoying but also worrying. Let's hope other judges are not quite so narrow minded and don't get fixated on one particular issue as FTMDave alluded to.
    • Indians, traditionally known as avid savers, are now stashing away less money and borrowing more.View the full article
    • the claimant in their WS can refer to whatever previous CC judgements they like, as we do in our WS's, but CC judgements do not set a legal precedence. however, they do often refer to judgements like Bevis, those cases do created a precedence as they were court of appeal rulings. as for if the defendant, prior to the raising of a claim, dobbed themselves in as the driver in writing during any appeal to the PPC, i don't think we've seen one case whereby the claimant referred to such in their WS.. ?? but they certainly typically include said appeal letters in their exhibits. i certainly dont think it's a good idea to 'remind' them of such at the defence stage, even if the defendant did admit such in a written appeal. i would further go as far to say, that could be even more damaging to the whole case than a judge admonishing a defendant for not appealing to the PPC in the 1st place. it sort of blows the defendant out the water before the judge reads anything else. dx  
    • Hi LFI, Your knowledge in this area is greater than I could possibly hope to have and as such I appreciate your feedback. I'm not sure that I agree the reason why a barrister would say that, only to get new customers, I'm sure he must have had professional experience in this area that qualifies him to make that point. 🙂 In your point 1 you mention: 1] there is a real danger that some part of the appeal will point out that the person appealing [the keeper ] is also the driver. I understand the point you are making but I was referring to when the keeper is also the driver and admits it later and only in this circumstance, but I understand what you are saying. I take on board the issues you raise in point 2. Is it possible that a PPC (claimant) could refer back to the case above as proof that the motorist should have appealed, like they refer back to other cases? Thanks once again for the feedback.
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    • If you are buying a used car – you need to read this survival guide.
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    • Hello,

      On 15/1/24 booked appointment with Big Motoring World (BMW) to view a mini on 17/1/24 at 8pm at their Enfield dealership.  

      Car was dirty and test drive was two circuits of roundabout on entry to the showroom.  Was p/x my car and rushed by sales exec and a manager into buying the mini and a 3yr warranty that night, sale all wrapped up by 10pm.  They strongly advised me taking warranty out on car that age (2017) and confirmed it was honoured at over 500 UK registered garages.

      The next day, 18/1/24 noticed amber engine warning light on dashboard , immediately phoned BMW aftercare team to ask for it to be investigated asap at nearest garage to me. After 15 mins on hold was told only their 5 service centres across the UK can deal with car issues with earliest date for inspection in March ! Said I’m not happy with that given what sales team advised or driving car. Told an amber warning light only advisory so to drive with caution and call back when light goes red.

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      Many thanks 
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    • Housing Association property flooding. https://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/topic/438641-housing-association-property-flooding/&do=findComment&comment=5124299
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    • We have finally managed to obtain the transcript of this case.

      The judge's reasoning is very useful and will certainly be helpful in any other cases relating to third-party rights where the customer has contracted with the courier company by using a broker.
      This is generally speaking the problem with using PackLink who are domiciled in Spain and very conveniently out of reach of the British justice system.

      Frankly I don't think that is any accident.

      One of the points that the judge made was that the customers contract with the broker specifically refers to the courier – and it is clear that the courier knows that they are acting for a third party. There is no need to name the third party. They just have to be recognisably part of a class of person – such as a sender or a recipient of the parcel.

      Please note that a recent case against UPS failed on exactly the same issue with the judge held that the Contracts (Rights of Third Parties) Act 1999 did not apply.

      We will be getting that transcript very soon. We will look at it and we will understand how the judge made such catastrophic mistakes. It was a very poor judgement.
      We will be recommending that people do include this adverse judgement in their bundle so that when they go to county court the judge will see both sides and see the arguments against this adverse judgement.
      Also, we will be to demonstrate to the judge that we are fair-minded and that we don't mind bringing everything to the attention of the judge even if it is against our own interests.
      This is good ethical practice.

      It would be very nice if the parcel delivery companies – including EVRi – practised this kind of thing as well.

       

      OT APPROVED, 365MC637, FAROOQ, EVRi, 12.07.23 (BRENT) - J v4.pdf
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TD v YB ***WON***


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Yeah, good luck mate, not that you'll need it of course cos you will retrieve your money . I'm posting mine off tomorrow so will probably be a week behind you and watching your thread very closely.

My YB account: S.A.R. 11/10/06: Prelim 09/02/07: LBA 17/02/07

Wifes YB account: S.A.R. 11/10/06: Prelim 23/11/06: LBA 27/11/06: Offer Rejection 17/12/06: MCOL 09/02/07

Joint YB account: S.A.R. 11/10/06: Prelim 09/02/07: LBA 17/02/07

My FD account: Settled

Wifes FD account: Settled

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Good luck and welcome to you both. Use the waiting time wisely familiarising yourself with the FAQ's, and read the threads in this forum and the libraries, including the successes. YB are one of the worst to deal with so don't expect an easy ride, but the more you understand about the process and the legal side of it, the easier it will be for you to shrug off their bullying tactics and respond positively. I don't want to put you off, but the more you understand the better.

The Consumer Action Group is a free help site.

Should you be offered help that requires payment please report it to site team.

Advice & opinions given by Caro are personal, are not endorsed by Consumer Action Group or Bank Action Group, and are offered informally, without prejudice & without liability. Your decisions and actions are your own, and should you be in any doubt, you are advised to seek the opinion of a qualified professional.

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Received this letter today from Network Support YB Glasgow

 

We refer to your recent letter requesting information held by the Bank under the terms of the Data Protection Act and note that you have paid the £10 fee. We confirm that we shall be able to provide you with copies of your bank statements from September 2000 under the right of access under the Data Protection Act 1998. Within the terms of the act we have 40 days in which to provide you with the information we hold. With regard to your request for information relating to manual intervention on your account, there is no specific mention of manual intervention within the Data Protection Act and as such we are under no statutory obligation to record or provide this information. We will forward the information to you as soon as possible, should you require any further assistance please contact your branch.

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Thanks to you all for taking the trouble to reply. Since I posted the letter I see on another thread that this seems to be the standard reply now. Don't know what the manual intervention paragraph is about but again on another thread someone says YB are wrong on this but not to worry.

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Bank statements have arrived this morning - that was quick. So highlighter pen at the ready this weekend. Am I correct in thinking that I can only reclaim when I have a penalty for going over od limit and not for monthly interest and charges please? Also I'm not good at spreadsheets (showing my age) so which is the easiest to use please? Could someone point me in the right direction. Thanks.

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  • 2 weeks later...

Well done for taking the first step. Let's hope the journey isn't too long.

The Consumer Action Group is a free help site.

Should you be offered help that requires payment please report it to site team.

Advice & opinions given by Caro are personal, are not endorsed by Consumer Action Group or Bank Action Group, and are offered informally, without prejudice & without liability. Your decisions and actions are your own, and should you be in any doubt, you are advised to seek the opinion of a qualified professional.

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Update - Letter received today from Manager S****horpe Branch but not on headed paper just the Customer Relations Glasgow bank address typed on. Basically quoting standard terms and conditions and enclosing a copy of their "Addressing your complaint" leaflet. Also stating that if they don't hear back from me within 8 weeks they will consider my complaint closed. Final paragraph states that if I go straight to court action they reserve the right to counterclaim. LBA letter typed ready to post just changed the first line to " disappointed that you have failed to respond positively to my letter of 26th October 2006".

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Been passed over to Neil McKirdy and received a letter telling me he has reopened my complaint and a further review is being taken. He apologises for the delay but hopes to respond to my complain shortly and in any event in due course. He assures me that every effort is being made to bring my complaint to a satisfactory conclusion.

 

Poor man must be very tired of all these complaints he hadn't the strength to sign the letter himself!

 

I think they will take this to the wire with me as I changed accounts to A&L but told them I would close the YB account myself. I received a phone call from YB to say they had a letter from A&L to close my account so would I send back my switch cards and any unused cheques. They did send me an sae probably thought I'd add the postage costs on to my claim!!

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Alternatively this site has it's own spreadsheets that also do the job. The link for these can be found in my sig.

The Consumer Action Group is a free help site.

Should you be offered help that requires payment please report it to site team.

Advice & opinions given by Caro are personal, are not endorsed by Consumer Action Group or Bank Action Group, and are offered informally, without prejudice & without liability. Your decisions and actions are your own, and should you be in any doubt, you are advised to seek the opinion of a qualified professional.

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Received the following letter plus cheque for 50% of claim and Ombudsman leaflet from Neil McKirdy. Gist as follows:-

 

The Bank's position remains as outlined in our letter of 26.10.06.

 

Responsibility to maintain account in credit or within agreed o/d limit is solely yours. Your spending habits have taken you overdrawn/over agreed o/d limit resulting in the Bank incurring costs which are passed on to you.

 

The bank charges debited reflect the operation of the account. Our charges are documented within our tariffs and a copy would have been provided when account opened and updated inserts from time to time.

 

Further, even if you were successful in your arguments the Bank would have a claim against you for damages suffered as a result of your breach of contract in failing to adhere to the terms and conditions of the account. Such a claim would incur court costs and interest for which you would be held liable.

 

However, the Bank would like to resolve this matter without the disproportionate expense of a court action. Cheque is tendered without admission of liability and is in full and final settlement of your claim and your encashment of it will be taken as your acceptance of this.

 

Please note that as this letter is written in an attempt to resolve this matter without the need for court action it is without prejudice to the Bank's whole rights and pleas and may not be founded on in any action to follow without the Bank's written consent.

 

Then bit about Ombudsman.

 

So in light of the paragraph about without prejudice am I right in thinking that I should cut the cheque in two and return it to Neil McKirdy? Could anyone please point me in the direction of a letter to say this plus I'll still be taking court action. MCOL will start next week.

 

Finally thanks to all of you who have helped me this far.

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Hiya, you don't need to send anything special back.

 

Just address it from where the letter came and write something along the lines of you decline the offer and will be continuing action to reclaim the full amount owed.

Pop the cheque in with the letter (cut in half) and send it back.

Just get a proof of posting so you can prove you sent the offer back and carry on with your claim as outlined on this most helpfull site :D

Yorkshire Bank:

LPA sent 21/08/06

LBA sent 05/09/06

Received and rejected offer to settle (half £amount) 18/09/06

MCOL started 21/09/06

Bank acknowledged claim 27/09/06

Defence received 21/10/06

Sent AQ Form 25/10/06

Court Date 16/02/2007

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Hiya, you don't need to send anything special back.

 

Just address it from where the letter came and write something along the lines of you decline the offer and will be continuing action to reclaim the full amount owed.

Pop the cheque in with the letter (cut in half) and send it back.

Just get a proof of posting so you can prove you sent the offer back and carry on with your claim as outlined on this most helpfull site :D

 

Thanks I'll do that. I have been sending everything by recorded delivery to the branch. So I'll send the cheque back to Neil McKirdy and MCOL next week to the branch.

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I believe they have to put 'Without Prejudice' at the top of the letter, not somewhere in the middle. I would send the cheque back with this letter http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/bank-templates-library/25716-rejection-settlement-offer.html

 

Thanks. That's the letter I was looking for but couldn't find. I have been reading up as much as I can but there is now so much on this site that by the time the next letter arrives from YB I have forgotten where I have seen things!!!!!!

 

I also thought the Without Prejudice had to be at the top of a letter naughty of them to hide this towards the end of the letter.

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Guest Mumofthreeboys
I also thought the Without Prejudice had to be at the top of a letter naughty of them to hide this towards the end of the letter.

 

It is a bit naughty of them, they are trying to frighten you into accepting their offer and trying to make you think that a court claim will be costly.

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It is a bit naughty of them, they are trying to frighten you into accepting their offer and trying to make you think that a court claim will be costly.

 

When I first started this it was the court bit that frightened me but after reading about all your experiences it's not as daunting.

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Without Prejudice save as to costs is not the same as Without Prejudice. Without Prejudice cannot be shown in court. End of story.

Without Prejudice save as to costs can be shown after the case has been settled and costs are being considered.

 

It's more bullying.

 

Before you accept the cheque as part settlement, just bear in mind that YB attempted to have JulesTools case struck out because he kept the cheque, but as he hadn't banked it the application was rejected. BankFodder advised another person to write and say they are willing to accept the cheque as partial settlement only, but that you should get their agreement to removing the conditions they have imposed. Most banks will accept keeping partial payments, but most banks are not as difficult as Yorkshire/Clydesdale.

 

Have a look at this thread.

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/yorkshire-bank-clydesdale-bank/33125-huge-claim-need-help-2.html?highlight=bankfodder

The Consumer Action Group is a free help site.

Should you be offered help that requires payment please report it to site team.

Advice & opinions given by Caro are personal, are not endorsed by Consumer Action Group or Bank Action Group, and are offered informally, without prejudice & without liability. Your decisions and actions are your own, and should you be in any doubt, you are advised to seek the opinion of a qualified professional.

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Without Prejudice save as to costs is not the same as Without Prejudice. Without Prejudice cannot be shown in court. End of story.

Without Prejudice save as to costs can be shown after the case has been settled and costs are being considered.

 

It's more bullying.

 

Before you accept the cheque as part settlement, just bear in mind that YB attempted to have JulesTools case struck out because he kept the cheque, but as he hadn't banked it the application was rejected. BankFodder advised another person to write and say they are willing to accept the cheque as partial settlement only, but that you should get their agreement to removing the conditions they have imposed. Most banks will accept keeping partial payments, but most banks are not as difficult as Yorkshire/Clydesdale.

 

Have a look at this thread.

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/yorkshire-bank-clydesdale-bank/33125-huge-claim-need-help-2.html?highlight=bankfodder

 

Thanks Caro. I'd already read that thread which is why I was searching for the correct letter to send the cheque back torn in two rather than trying to get them to remove their conditions.

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  • 3 weeks later...

I want to complete the MCOL form tonight and have downloaded the template but don't have the date the account was opened nor the year it must be at least 20 years ago so what can I enter please? In the template it says that 3. Defendat is aware of all the details as a list of charges has already been supplied. Another copy will be sent. Does this mean that I have to send a letter to YB stating that I have started MCOL and enclose a copy of charges etc.

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