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    • I understand confusion with this thread.  I tried to keep threads separate because there have been so many angles.    But a team member merged them all.  This is why it's hard to keep track. This forum exists to help little people fight injustice - however big or small.  Im here to try get a decent resolution. Not to give in to the ' big boys'. My "matter' became complicated 'matters' simply because a lender refused to sell a property. What can I say?  I'll try in a nutshell to give an overview: There's a long lease property. I originally bought it short lease with a s.146 on it from original freeholder.  I had no concerns. So lender should have been able to sell a well-maintained lovely long lease property.  The property was great. The issue is not the property.  Economy, sdlt increases, elections, brexit, covid, interest hikes etc didn't help.  The issue is simple - the lender wanted to keep it.    Before repo I offered to clear my loan.  I was a bit short and lender refused.  They said (recorded) they thought the property was worth much more and they were happy to keep accruing interest (in their benefit) until it reached a point where they felt they could repo and still easily quickly sell to get their £s back.  This was a mistake.  The market was (and is) tough.   2y later the lender ceo bid the same sum to buy the property for himself. He'd rejected higher offers in the intervening period whilst accruing interest. I had the property under offer to a fantastic niche buyer but lender rushed to repo and buyer got spooked and walked.  It had taken a long time to find such a lucrative buyer.  A sale which would have resulted in £s and another asset for me. Post repo lender had 1 offer immediately.  But dragged out the process for >1y - allegedly trying to get other offers. But disclosure shows there was only one valid buyer. Lender appointed receiver (after 4 months) - simply to try acquire the freehold.  He used his powers as receiver to use me, as leaseholder, to serve notice on freeholders.  Legally that failed. Meanwhile lender failed to secure property - and squatters got in (3 times).  And they failed to maintain it.  So freeholders served a dilapidations notice (external) - on me as leaseholder (cc-ed to lender).   (That's how it works legally) I don't own the freehold.  But I am a trustee and have to do right by the freeholders.  This is where matters got/ get complicated.  And probably lose most caggers.   Lawyers got involved for the freeholders to firstly void the receiver enfranchisement notice. Secondly, to serve the dilapidations notice.  The lack of maintenance was in breach of lease and had to be served to protect fh asset. The lender did no repairs. They said a buyer would undertake them. Which was probably correct. If they had sold. After 1y lender finally agreed to sell to the 1st offeror and contracts went with lawyers.  Within 1 month lender reneged.  Lender tried to suggest buyer walked. Evidence shows he/ his lawyers continued trying to exchange (cash) for 4 months.  Evidence shows lender and receiver strategy had been to renege and for ceo to take control.   I still think that's their plan. Lender then stupidly chose to pretty much bulldoze the property.  Other stuff was going on in the background. After repo I was in touch by phone and email and lender knew post got to me.   Despite this, after about 10 months (before and then during covid), they deliberately sent SDs and eventually a B petition to an incorrect address and an obscure small court.  They never served me properly.  (In hindsight I understand they hoped to get a backdoor B - so they could keep the property that way.)  Eventually the random court told them to email me by way of service.  At this point their ruse to make me B failed.  I got a lawyer (friend paid). The B petition was struck out. They’d failed to include the property as an asset. They were in breach of insolvency rules. Simultaneously the receiver again appointed lawyers to act on my behalf as leaseholder. This time to serve notice on the freeholders for a lease extension.  He had hoped to try and vary the strict lease. Evidence shows the already long length of lease wasn't an issue.  The lender obviously hoped to get round their lack of permission to do works (which they were already doing) by hoping to remove the strict clauses that prevent leaseholder doing alterations.   The extension created a new legal angle for me to deal with.  I had to act as trustee for freeholders against me as leaseholder/ the receiver.  Inconsistencies and incompetence by receiver lawyers dragged this out 3y.  It still isn't properly resolved.  Meanwhile - going back to the the works the lender undertook. The works were consciously in breach of lease.  The lender hadn't remedied the breaches listed in the dilapidations notice.  They destroyed the property.  The trustees compiled all evidence.  The freeholders lawyers then served a forfeiture notice. This notice started a different legal battle. I was acting for the freeholders against what the lender had done on my behalf as leaseholder.  This legal battle took 3y to resolve. The simple exit would have been for lender to sell. A simple agreement to remedy the breaches and recompense the freeholders in compensation - and there's have been clean title to sell.  That option was proposed to them.   This happened by way of mediation for all parties 2y ago.  A resolution option was put forward and in principle agreed.  But immediately after the lender lawyers failed to engage.  A hard lesson to learn - mediation cannot be referred to in court. It's considered w/o prejudice. The steps they took have made no difference to their ability to sell the property.  Almost 3y since they finished works they still haven't sold. ** ** I followed up some leads myself.  A qualified cash buyer offered me a substantial sum.  The lender and receiver both refused it.   I found another offer in disclosure.  6 months later someone had apparently offered a substantial sum via an agent.  The receiver again rejected it.  The problem of course was that the agent had inflated the market price to get the business. But no-one was or is ever going to offer their list price.  Yet the receiver wanted/wants to hold out for the list price.  Which means 1y later not only has it not sold - disclosure shows few viewings and zero interest.  It's transparently over-priced.  And tarnished. For those asking why I don't give up - I couldn't/ can't.  Firstly I have fiduciary duties as a trustee. Secondly, legal advice indicates I (as leaseholder) could succeed with a large compensation claim v the lender.  Also - I started a claim v my old lawyer and the firm immediately reimbursed some £s. That was encouraging.  And a sign to continue.  So I'm going for compensation.  I had finance in place (via friend) to do a deal and take the property back off the lender - and that lawyer messed up bad.   He should have done a deal.  Instead further years have been wasted.   Maybe I only get back my lost savings - but that will be a result.   If I can add some kind of complaint/ claim v the receiver's conscious impropriety I will do so.   I have been left with nothing - so fighting for something is worth it. The lender wants to talk re a form of settlement.  Similar to my proposal 2y ago.  I have a pretty clear idea of what that means to me.  This is exactly why I do not give up.  And why I continue to ask for snippets of advice/ pointers on cag.  
    • It was all my own work based on my previous emails to P2G which Bank has seen.
    • I was referring to #415 where you wrote "I was forced to try to sell - and couldn't." . And nearer the start in #79 .. "I couldn't sell.  I had an incredibly valuable asset. Huge equity.  But the interest accrued / the property market suffered and I couldn't find a buyer even at a level just to clear the debt." In #194 you said you'd tried to sell for four years.  The reason for these points is that a lot of the claims against for example your surveyor, solicitor, broker, the lender and now the receiver are mainly founded in a belief that they should have been able to do something but did not. Things that might seem self evident to you but not necessarily to others. Pressing these claims may well need a bit more hard evidence, rather than an appeal to common sense. Can you show evidence of similar properties, with similar freehold issues, selling readily? And solid reasons why the lender should have been able to sell when you couldn't.
    • You can use a family's address.   The only caveat is for the final hearing you'd need to be there in person   HOWEVER i'd expect them to pay if its only £200 because costs of attending will be higher than that
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HSBC Mortgage PPI **** SUCCESS ****


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All,

 

After a successful battle with Barclays Partner Finance over charges and a PPI reclaim with Aqua that proved successful (thanks to the great people on here and MSE) I have gone through the little paperwork I still have, to see what else I could look at. I have placed claims with HFC on another thread for some retail loans on electrical goods but also found the policy number of my Mortgage PPI through HSBC

 

As a background I opened my old student account with Midland in 94 and did all my banking with them for years including all loans, my credit card and then mortgage when I got married in 2000. I do not have the detail for this policy, but rather for my single policy that was opened when I bought my house in 2003 after my divorce.

 

My mortgage was in my name only and the paperwork was made out with a "sign here, here and here" attitude in the bank.

 

Mortgage PPI was set up, which I just thought was the norm - exactly as had happed 3 years earlier. At the time I had 6 months full and 6 months half pay, working for a company I had been with for 3 years and are the biggest brand in the world (not much chance of losing my job). I had life and critical income cover and an income protection policy - all through HSBC Life.

 

If I'm honest, looking back I think it is far too much cover, but I have been told that it sounds about right from some people. After changing mortgage in 2006 I discovered that MPPI is not a necessary part of buying a mortgage, nor does it have to be with the organisation that sells the mortgage either if chosen.

 

The policy ran through till 2007 when I cancelled it (stupidly presumed that it would be cancelled at the time my mortgage with them ended) and I've not had MPPI now for 4 1/2 years and I've never had it questioned by my mortgage provider (changed again in 2008)

 

I suppose i'm asking if people think I have a valid argument for complaining to HSBC that the MPPI wasn't necesserily in my best interests based on the cover I already had with them?

 

Thanks

Edited by ims21
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Hi

 

I have formatted the post for you to make it easier to read.

 

Yes you can claim. I guess the premiums were a fixed amount eacc month?

 

Do you have the statements showing the amounts and the dates of payment.

 

Short answer is yes you can reclaim this.

 

ims

 

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Hi IMS, most appreciated (again!!) No idea, why it wont format when I post, even after I edit. Might be due to work internet? Anyway all I have was a letter than showed the policy account number and the payment owed when I cancelled the DD in December 2007. I had no paperwork for the policy, couldn't get any sense out of anyone at HSBC Life, so cancelled the DD with a view to getting a reponse. It showed the premium that was outstanding - £29.72, so I'm guessing that the monthly payment wont be too different to that figure each month previosuly from 2003. The premium was obviously paid each month.

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I was thinking the same. Based on a figure between £25-£30 per month then i'm pretty sure I paid over £1k for this cover, that wasn't necessary in my opinion. I'd like any redress (if there is one) to be acurate. Based on the sums and time frame then there should be a hefty chunk of interest to go on top of that too. Do you think my claim is a valid one and my opinion of a miss-sell is correct? I was already covered, no option to go somewhere else for cover if required, paperwork drawn up at same time and told to sign (i'm aware this is very hard to prove) hence the fact I had so many other insurances through HSBC at the same time is what I would rather focus on

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Well it looks like I haven't needed to SAR them. I'd actually posted the FOS form in Nov to them, and was expecting a wait. Thought i'd get some info from the SAR in anticipation for an intial rejection, as seems to be the case with MPPI.

 

However a letter arrived yesterday with an offer that was almost double what I was expecting with 8% stat on top. This would be a massive help in paying off a loan and paying off an overdraft. Would put me around £200 a month better off, which is perfect timing as I am about to move back into my home (after 2 years in different parts of the UK and my house rented out). I don't have a breakdown of payment unfortunately but it looks like it covers payment back to 2000 on the old MPPI I had with my ex wife. I've just run my almost £30 payment back to 2003 then the same back to Feb 2000 (but at half the rate) and its near as damn it to what they have offered. Shame the tax man gets £500 but can't complain too much!

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Hi IMS

 

Yes i've put into a spreadsheet going back to 2000 when i bought my first house. For the first bit i've guessed at around £13 (half of what I expect the premium would have been) and then put in the £29 from June 2003 through till Nov 2007. It seems to work out pretty much what they have offered and the interest works out about right too. I only paid MPPI with HSBC in that time, so don't see how it could be wrong. Maybe a couple of £'s wrong at the most. Very happy indeed, and all for the cost of 5min to fill in and a stamp. At least i'm vindicated in the belief HSBC tried to sell me so many thing I didn't need, and being young(er) at the time, bought it!

 

Good luck to anyone in a similar position. Lets hope HFC are as generous, as i have exactly the same reasons in place - Income protection policy with HSBC covered me :-)

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Thanks IMS, although I feel guilty about a well done, when I didn't really do anything, lol. As soon as money is banked (they took bank details so wont get cheque thank god!) i'll let you know. For the first time in a few years i will have some breathing space each month. Can't wait!!!!

 

 

Cheers :-)

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  • 2 weeks later...

All,Money landed in account today. 2 weeks after they received my acceptance. I did check my account at 9:30 this morning and it wasn't there, however after spending 30min on the phone (The 2 tel numbers on the letter didn't work!) and eventually speaking to someone in the relevant department, he told me that my payment had been made on the 3rd and had I checked my account. Low and behold the money was there now! Very pleased. Loads of bills paid this afternoon

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  • 4 months later...

Hi joncow75

 

I am in the process of trying to claim PPI from HSBC and noticed that you have had success from a very similar start date. Would you be willing to share the process you went through / letters you sent? Was your policy charged to your account as HSBC life? The basic scenario in my case is that I was sold this as compulsory in order to get my mortgage and the cover provided was offered through my employer!

 

Thank you for any help or advice you can give

 

Naith

 

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