uk_joe v NatWest ***WON***

[Michael Browne]

Cobbetts have changed scare tactics slightly using a 'window of opportunity' between acknowledgement and allocation for a CPR part 18 request, but now with the added threat of being struck out.

 

The main thing is to reply and not to ignore the letter and inform the court, which is what you've done.

[uk_joe]

Thanks for the reply and for putting my mind at rest! I'm just glad we've got knowledgable folks like you in our corner

[Michael Browne]

This thread may be of interest:

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/royal-bank-scotland-bank/32948-cpr-18-requests-costs.html?highlight=Part+18

[uk_joe]

Thats a useful link, thanks. I've had a brief read and will read more thoroughly when home this evening.

 

I have noticed that Cobbetts had requested my CPR18 response by 22nd September, however I was ill for the latter half of last week and could not get out to post so they will have received it several days late (Today hopefully) - although better late than never I'm sure. Would it be worth phoning Cobbetts to explain why my response was several days late do you think?

 

In my letter to the court, I did say that I had previously sent a breakdown of the charges I am claiming to Cobbetts. I'll wait and see how both parties respond now - its out of my hands for now!

[caro]

Just so you know, Warwick Court are now 5 and a half weeks behind in Judges looking at AQ's and now mine has finally been looked at they have stayed it for 4 weeks to allow my bank time to settle, even though I did not give my consent to this. I hope for your sake that Nat West are better at settling than Yorkshire Bank.

[uk_joe]

Thanks for the update on the courts Caro and I hope your case gets resolved soon. Sounds like Yorkshire bank are pretty stubborn

 

Ouch, 5 & half weeks behind - they must be real busy! Well the final date for my AQ is this Friday, so hopefully going to have an (below par) offer from Cobbetts next week sometime. Although I'm not too fussed if it does take a while to resolve - I know I'm going to get my money back at some point, be it sooner or later.

 

I'll post here when I hear back from the court. I guess they'll contact me fairly soon even if just to say that my AQ won't be dealt with for 5 more weeks, or is it advisable to contact them in a couple of weeks if I haven't heard anything?

[caro]

I heard nothing at all. They just took their own sweet time despite a couple of phone calls.

[uk_joe]

Well, AQ due at the court today. I posted mine off earlier this week as well as a copy to Cobbetts, but I've yet to receive a a copy of their AQ. Are they obliged to send me a copy of their AQ?

 

Wonder how lenient the court will be if Cobbetts haven't sent their AQ through by the deadline...

[uk_joe]

Received completed AQ this morning, along with another letter from Cobbetts objecting to my claim that their CPR 18 request was intimidatory. They also kindly remind me that I haven't properly partcularised my claim, even though they have had several copies of the completed charges spreadsheet. I'd be quite happy explaining my claim in great detail to them in front of a judge, but doubt they'll let it get that far.

[caro]

I'd be quite happy explaining my claim in great detail to them in front of a judge

..and I would be there cheering you on!

[gailevans]

Nice to see they are following the same pattern! I too have had the "intimidation" letter from Cobbetts!! Those people are being paid a fortune for churning out the same stuff over and over! Makes you wonder why Natwest dont just cough up, their legal fees must be nearly as much as our claims put together! You'd have thought the penny would have dropped by now!

 

Good luck, I'll be watching your progress closely! I'm at the court in Tamworth, so I assume their timescales are about the same as Warwick - at least we know we will get our money back, its just this waiting game, its driving me CRAZY!!

[uk_joe]

Hi Gailevans, I agree - their legal costs must be getting close, if not beating, the amount they end up paying out anyway. I can only guess that their tactics are still scaring people away, otherwise they'd stop.

 

Like yourself, the AQ date for me was the 30th, and I got their AQ today with a letter dated 2nd October. I only wish a Judge would bring them up on this sort of behaviour, but can't see it happening. Ah well, when I get my money back it will be enough satisfaction for me

 

Glad to hear from someone else local too - hope all goes well & Keep us posted!

[Shelty]

I haven't got as far as a court location yet, but I'm in Nth Warwicks so might be Tamworth aswell.....will let you know ! Hope so, don't want to get stuck in the queue at Warwick !!

[uk_joe]

Well, my AQ was due in 5 days ago, so I was expecting a partial offer from Cobbetts and today one arrived! £2250 is the offer, and my claim is now £4560 (or there-abouts), so I'm sending the standard acceptance as in part letter, informing them that I will be pursuing for the rest.

 

I've seen it in others letters, but it still beggars belief that they can get away with this paragraph at the end:

 

Whilst this letter is written without predjudice save as to costs, in the event that you decline this offer, we will draw this letter to the Court's attention on the basis that we hold the firm view that this offer is entirely reasonable in the circumstances. This offer will remain open for 7 days blah blah.

 

Now thats cheeky! I've a good mind to tell them that I am informing the court of this addition to their letter, but we'll see.

 

Anyway, looks like I've got them on the run :grin: Will draft a suitable reply in a bit, or borrow one from the templates library, and see what happens next!

 

Cheers to all for advice and inspiration so far; I certainly wouldn't have got this far without you all

[gailevans]

Hi!!

 

I too have received the standard 50% offer letter! I too have drafted a letter saying I will accept it as PARTIAL payment and will still be recovering the rest (with interest!!) Copy went to my local court too.

 

Having looked at other threads at this stage, I think we should both be expecting our cheques before the end of the week!!

 

CANT WAIT!!!

[uk_joe]

Its been great to have even the partial offer from them - it only proves that they're running scared and has given me loads more confidence.

 

I sent my partial acceptance off last Friday, and I think (hope!) you're right about recieving a cheque this week. Good luck and hopefully we'll both be posting success stories very soon!

[uk_joe]

Well, I got home today to find a letter from the court:

 

Please find enclosed defence and request for further information as filed with the court.

And enclosed was a copy of the original defence and CPR 18 request from Cobbetts.

 

I have already told them that I consider the request intimidatory, but as a goodwill gesture sent them a copy of my statement of charges, all dated and referenced. I also sent this same info to the court.

 

Am I under any obligation to respond to this request? Although the cover letter came from the court, it merely states that the documents are enclosed and makes no mention of forcing me to comply. Rather than ignore it, I'm tempted to draft a reply, sending it to both Cobbetts and the court, stating that I would be more than happy to respond to each of the 5 points raised in their CPR 18 request, if requested to by the court.

 

I wasn't expecting this, especially as they've only just sent me a partial offer!

[uk_joe]

Quick follow up question re: above. If Cobbetts have filed the CPR 18 request and defence at the court, is there any mileage in me filing a reqest for a breakdown of their bank charges, in order that I can properly detail my response to them?

[caro]

I really think that it is in your best interest to comply with this. You must do all you can to appear reasonable and to have co-operated in full. Is there an explanation of what exactly is required of you? If you are not clear on anything phone the court. Don't worry how many times you supply the same information, because at the end of the day if they claim not to have it, they simply look inept, especially if you get as far as having to produce a bundle which will include copies of all the letters that you have sent.

 

I do think though, that it is vital that you point out that it will settle your claim very quickly if they disclose how their costs are calculated. If they can prove that it really cost them the amount of the claim due to your breaches, then you will withdraw your claim, as they will have proved that the charges are lawful, or amend it so that you deduct the actual (in bold) cost to the bank, and just reclaim the balance.

 

You will look reasonable and put the onus on Nat West to prove the amount it cost them. Somehow I doubt you will need to either amend or withdraw your claim, but you will show what a reasonable fella you are by making this generous offer.

 

This are just my thoughts, but I hope it helps.

[uk_joe]

Hi Caro,

 

Thanks very much for your reply. The request for more information is the infamous CPR 18, which I had previously received at the same time as their defence. I then replied stating that I thought that the claim would be allocated to the small claims court, and as such the CPR18 request was inapplicable in this case. I did still enclose a schedule of charges, and copy the court in on all this correspondence.

 

I'm thinking of sending the below reply:

I would like to advise you that I am a litigant in person in this matter, and so do not feel that I am adequately qualified to understand or respond to the points you raise in your letter. Consequently, I have decided that I will await the direction of the court, at which I will ask the Judge for guidance on the best way to respond to you.

 

In the interests of settling this case quickly, I would request that the defendant discloses how costs are calculated with respect to the charges incurred by the claimant. If the defendant is able to prove that the costs incurred to them, due to my breaches of contract, accurately reflect the cost of my claim, then I will withdraw my claim, as they will have proved that the charges are lawful, or amend my claim and deduct the actual cost to the bank, and only claim for the balance.

As before, I anticipate that the claim would be allocated to the small claims track and would not then expect to have to deal with a Part 18 request since these are specifically excluded under Part 27 unless the court specifically orders me to do so of its own initiative, at which point I will be happy to do so.

 

For clarity, I enclose a schedule of charges and I confirm the charges I am claiming were applied to the following account:

Account Name: xxxxxxxx

Account numbers: xxxxxxxx

Sort Code: xx-xx-xx

Amount: £3629

 

I was considering using the very detailed letter by Joncris here: http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/royal-bank-scotland-bank/32948-cpr-18-requests-costs-2.html?highlight=Part+18#post258262

 

But don't want to shoot myself in the foot by providing any incorrect information which may later come back and bite me. I am somewhat concerned that seeing as, strictly speaking, the case has not not been allocated (I phoned the court and they said to wait for a letter, but gave no timeframe), I am obligated to respond to the CPR 18 request, and that my above reply may be considered inadequate. In my defence, the request is littered with legal jargon, and is obviously composed for those of a legal bent, not someone like myself!

 

 

Any tips or comments on above are appreciated

[gailevans]

Just wanted to let you know that I received my cheque today! So yours should be very close behind (even waiting for you on the door mat when you get home)!!

 

Usual things, dont disclose to third party, full and final settlement etc!! Will wait for it to clear before I stop the court proceedings!!

 

Good luck kidda, keep us posted!!

[MARTIN3030]

CONGRATULATIONS

Round of applause for Lynsey and Co.........see sense at last !!

 

Am moviong your thread as requested well done....now a JD to celebrate !

[uk_joe]

Well I took my first driving test yesterday (practical) and passed by the skin of my teeth, go me! I had a sneaking suspicion that I would be hearing from Cobbetts on the same day, alas nothing. This morning, however, I receive a cheque for the whole amount With my run of luck this week I should get a lottery ticket! (Actually, I know its not luck that got me this far ;-) )

 

Mods - please move to successes forum (Been waiting to say that)

I shall complete questionnaire and donation will fe forthcoming as soon as cheque clears!

[caro]

I am so pleased for you Joe. Congratulations of getting your money, and on passing your test. Is a car the next step with this windfall in your pocket now.

 

Thanks for the donation by the way.

[katesage]

CONGRATULATIONS UK JOE!

Well done on your perseverance. I'm expecting the same result any day now.

 

Also really well done on passing your driving test. Go buy that car!

 

 

xxxxx:D