Chimera v First Direct

[Chimera]

Well, I'm off till tuesday so I thought I'd dig my old accounts out and phone round a few people... and I feel empowered. Phoned Dirst Direct, but had closed my account two years ago, so they ahve asked me to write to them so that they can confirm my signature. Here's the letter I am sending, obviously with the standard stuff on the top. ANy feedback would be great as I am well know for tiny little errors which could make things sound silly!

 

Please supply me with a complete list of transactions and charges relating to both my bank accounts since the date that I started banking with First Direct This includes a list of what the charges were in monetary terms, what the charge was for, and the amount involved (i.e. £10 charge for return of a Direct Debit that was for £23.99). Alternatively a complete set of bank statements for that period will also be acceptable.

 

 

Additionally where there has been any event in my account history over this period which has required manual intervention by any member of your staff or any other person, I require disclosure of any indication or notes which have either caused or resulted in that manual intervention or other evidence of that manual intervention in relation to my banking business with you.

 

As per my conversation with a telephone advisor from First Direct of Thursday 18th May 2006, at around 1230hrs, I have been informed to write to you personally so that you can verify my signature. I have been informed during the conversation that this is all you require in order to satisfy yourself as to my identity.

You are kindly reminded that transactional and statement information is covered by the Data Protection Act as has been in court (Durant Vs Financial Services Authority – 2003).

 

If you are unable to supply data relating to manual intervention because there has been no such manual intervention then please be kind as to confirm this in your response to this request.

 

You have 40 days in which to comply. Please note that I no longer reside at the property from which I held the account & be advised of my current address stated at the top of this letter.

Nicola Chapman

[bram stoker]

Good. Be careful where it comes to the fact that you've moved. They may want to seek further ID from you. You can pre-emt this response by including a copy of your driving licence or passport, and a copy of a recent utility bill, and state in the letter that you are attaching them for identification purposes.

 

Good luck.

[Chimera]

Update - Letter dayted 24th May, in reply to my leeter dated 18th May. They are sending all my details for free ;D

[bram stoker]

Cool.

[Chimera]

Not been around for a while... have just put in my small claims for cahoot.. so now gonna tackle first direct. They sent me all the statements for FREE!!! I thought there wouldn't be many charges.. but there are:

 

£851.50 plus £157.18 interest.. Totalling £1,008.68

 

THought it would be about £200.. very surprised.. paying off a big chunk of debts is suddenly looking more realistic!!! WHich makes getting a mortgage easier.. and living each month easier!!! and maybe - Financial freedom... I could give up the second job... fingers crossed!!

[Chimera]

Update; I am not claiming back interest as I believe I have worked this out wrong with my cahoot claim (I used the spread sheet but gave the 8% figure). So I am asking for just my charges back, which total £851.50. Which is enough anyway. I do not mind that they keep the interest as I am prepared to pay a token amount for charges, just not a silly amount!!

 

So Prelim letter sent today.. My account was closed a few years ago, so I need not worry about them closing my account..

[Chimera]

So I looked at another FD post and apparently the 'Overdraft Fees' are actually penalties. Which makes sense - they just appeared so much on my account that I thought it was a standard charge for services - but have checked and there are some months I wasn't charged. Though I would like someone to confirm these are charges and I can claim back?? I will send them another letter then - I forgot to send the first one Recorded Delivery anyway..

 

Amazingly - on calculation it almost doubles my charges..

 

From £851.50 to ... wait for it...£1656.50

 

WOW!!!

 

Even more money to pay back my credit cards...

 

As I say.. if someone could just confirm the 'overdraft fee' thing I will get prelim letter sent out RD on saturday!!

[katielshaw]

hi there, I sent off my pre lim request yesterday . . . ive copied this for you from their website . . . . I too originally didnt include the £30 per month as it was on every month so i assumed it was a pre agreed service charge but i found this on their site

"Unauthorised overdraft interest rate 19.9% (EAR) variable, and incurs a charge of £30 on day one, and £25 for each subsequent day that the debit balance increases in any statement month."

so i have included all of the £30 charges which also doubled my claim. hope this helps, good luck x

[Chimera]

cheers mate.. can't believe how much it added - I suppose it makes sense if I had added up the excess O/D fees - I must have been charged the Overdraft fee first..lol

 

I can't believ how much it is... in fact it is a couple of hunded pounds more from when they closed my accounts - I owed about £1350 on two accounts, so they put them together and I paid them off monthly till I sold my house and paid them back (straight away - good customer that I am - infact I overpaid them - so they had to send me a cheque .lol)

 

Really annoyed me that - they compounded my situation.. realised as well that I only went overdrawn by pounds.. and mostly due to interest and fees being added.. tried to put enough in each month to cover it - but under-estimated by a few pounds - so charegs every month - where was the customer services there - I mean it was happening every month - it was obvious I was transferring money to try and cover it - in fact I think it was on S/O - no phone call to say - if you just add £5 into you account the charges will stop you silly woman!!

[Chimera]

Just had to post this.. JUst worker out... I had the account for about 18 months - and was charged lots... and taking into consideration my wages at the time, they were taking about 10% of my wage each year in charges.. and that's gross...

 

Would be an interesting calculation to work out what percentage of my wages was paid out in charges - was probably working half the month to pay the banks these charges.. but one saving grace.. my ex would have only have spent it if it had been there - so now at least I am having the benefit of the money to be claimed back. Still doesn't make up for the stress and arguments thought!!

[Chimera]

Got a letter from first direct today.. offerening total amount as full and final settlement. Unfortunately, if you hvae read the thread, you will realise that I asked for only half the amount as I had not added the 'overlimit fees' to my account.

I was going to send them a revised letter today. What do I do?

 

Do I send them another prelim giving them another 14 days to respond as the first amount was wrong? plus a polite lettter declining their offer as I had calculated the fees wrong? I thought they would just fob me off, so was just going to send a revised letter within that time frame - don't know what to do now that they have offered me the amount? HELP!!!

[Chimera]

Also, have just notice that the agreement they sent me to sign, is for myself and my ex to sign on the joint account. I really don't want my ex involved in this as he owes me money- which I will never get back and he is always skint... is there any way of me just signing any future forms?? I mean, we did not have to sign together to take money out or anything - or do I just put his signature on there??? oh, I don't know what to do...

[Chimera]

can anyone help please? I want to get letter off to them toady?

[DazNorthants]

Try pm a mod. Can't advise on joint accounts sorry

[Chimera]

Cheers - it's the letter back to them aout the settlement I am concerned about. I asked for half the amount not realising 'overdraft fee' was a penalty. They have offered the full amount - do I just decline and start a completely fresh case? - send them the new letter with it, and give them another 14 days?

[DazNorthants]

Yes! well back to request with schedule

[Chimera]

I have sent them off a letter today, giving them another 7 days to respond to the change.. as someone pointed out to me... they were probably well aware that my fees amounted to twice as much, and that is why they were offering me the money. Now, let's see how this letter goes...

[katielshaw]

So can I just confirm that First direct replied to your pre lim letter with a full offer of the amount you were requesting? I know that you have since amended that amount, but i have to say im pretty impressed, what was it within a 10 day timescale and no objections? lets see if they are as quick to cough up the real amount owed to you x

[Chimera]

Yep.. they did indeed.. though I do think it was because they realised I had miscalculated it.. we'll see!!!

[Chimera]

As I thought.. letter back from them this morning saying that the offer was their full and final offer. LBA goes out on Saturday!!! See what they say to that - I think I will address it to same fella, as I seem to be getting swift replies form him. Think it will end up in another money claim though!!!

[Chimera]

No response to LBA... DEadline is up for them now... I have to decide whether to file claim now, or wait till monday.. hmmmm... was hoping to have some money back by now... All the money claims are going on my business credit card.. and I don't have a huge limit...

[Chimera]

I am going to Fill in claim for now, so it is ready to submit. Does this sound ok?

 

I have a contract with the defendant bank from 2003 to 2005, and which is conducted on their standard terms and conditions. I am claiming the return of money taken by the defendant in the way of charges over the last 4 years. The bank's charges are a disproportionate penalty and therefore unenforceable as they are contrary to common law. Further, as a disproportionate penalty they are invalid under the Unfair (Contracts) Terms Act 1977 s.4 and under the Unfair Terms in Consumer Contracts Regulations 1999. Para.8 and sch.2(1)(e). In the event that the charges are not a penalty then they are unreasonable within the meaning of the Supply of Goods and Services Act 1982 s.15. I have repeatedly asked the bank to justify their charges but they have declined to do so. I also claim interest under

section 69 of the County Courts Act 1984 at the rate of 8% a year. The charges amount

to £1,656.50 with 8% interest of £307.41, totalling £1,963.91.

[Chimera]

ahhhh.. apparently I have to put this statement in:

The claimant claims interest under section 69 of the County Courts Act 1984 at the rate of 8% a year from {date when the money became owed to you} to {the date you are issuing the claim} of £ {put the amount} and also interest at the same rate up to the date of judgment or earlier payment at a daily rate of {enter the daily rate of interest}.

 

So:

The claimant claims interest under section 69 of the County Courts Act 1984 at the rate of 8% a year from 15/06/03 (date of first claim?) to 12/08/06 of £ {put the amount} and also interest at the same rate up to the date of judgment or earlier payment at a daily rate of (How do I work this out???).

[Chimera]

can anyone help?

[Chimera]

Ok.. found the daily rate of interest thing... 0.00022 x total amount of charges? yes?

 

So:

I have a contract with the defendant bank from 2003 to 2005, and which is conducted on their standard terms and conditions. I am claiming the return of money taken by the defendant in the way of charges over the last 4 years. The bank's charges are a disproportionate penalty and therefore unenforceable as they are contrary to common law. Further, as a disproportionate penalty they are invalid under the Unfair (Contracts) Terms Act 1977 s.4 and under the Unfair Terms in Consumer Contracts Regulations 1999. Para.8 and sch.2(1)(e). In the event that the charges are not a penalty then they are unreasonable within the meaning of the Supply of Goods and Services Act 1982 s.15. I have repeatedly asked the bank to justify their charges but they have declined to do so.

The charges amount to £1,656.50. The claimant claims interest under section 69 of the County Courts Act 1984 at the rate of 8% a year from 15/06/03 to 12/08/06 of £308.14, totalling £1,964.64. I also claim interest at the same rate up to the date of judgment or earlier payment at a daily rate of £0.36.

 

Can someone please just give me the nod that this is ok?