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    • With Farage back in the news, here's a reminder of his interview with Claire Byrne on Irish TV a few years ago.  
    • So, why do DVLA (via that leaflet) say 1) that S.88 MAY allow a driver to be treated as if they have a valid licence (after an application that discloses a medical condition) AND   2) before DVLA have reached their licensing decision ? (Since S.88 ceases to apply once they have reached a decision to grant or refuse a licence)
    • Thanks for that, Bazza. It sheds some more light on things but I’m still by no means sure of the OP’s father’s likelihood of successfully defending the charge. This in particular from the guidance stands out me: He does not meet all the s88 criteria. S88 is clear and unambiguous: It makes no provision for either the driver or a medical professional to make a judgement on his fitness to drive under s88. S92(4) and the June 2013 guidance you mention defines in what circumstances the SoS must issue a licence. It does no modify s88 in any way. However, delving further I have noticed that the DVLA provides a service where the driver can enter a relevant medical condition to obtain the correct documentation to apply for a licence: https://www.gov.uk/health-conditions-and-driving/find-condition-online I haven’t followed this through because I don’ have the answers that the OP’s father would give to the questions they will ask and in any case it requires the input of personal information and I don’t want to cause complications with my driving licence. It is possible, however, that the end result (apart from providing the necessary forms) is a “Yes/No” answer to whether the driver can continue to drive (courtesy of s88). With that in mind, I should think at  the very least the OP’s father should have completed that process but there is no mention that he has. The Sleep Apnoea Trust gives some useful guidance on driving and SA: https://sleep-apnoea-trust.org/driving-and-sleep-apnoea/detailed-guidance-to-uk-drivers-with-sleep-apnoea/ I know nothing about SA at all and found It interesting to learn that there are various “grades” of the condition. But the significant thing which struck me is that it is only the least trivial version that does not require a driver to report his condition to the DVLA. But more significant than that is that the SA Trust makes no mention of continuing to drive once the condition has been reported. The danger here is that the court will simply deconstruct s88 and reach the same conclusion that I have. I accept, having looked at the DVLA guidance, that there may be (as far as they are concerned) scope for s88 to apply contrary to the conditions stated in the legislation. Firstly, we don’ know whether there is and secondly we don’t know whether the OP’s father would qualify to take advantage of it. Of course he could argue that he need no have reported his condition. The SA trust certainly emphasises that the condition should not be reported until a formal detailed diagnosis is obtained. But the fact is he did report it. As soon as he does that, as far as I can see,  s88 is no longer available to him. Certainly as it stands I maintain my opinion that he was not allowed to continue driving under s88. The only way I would change this is to see the end result of the DVLA exercise I mentioned above. If that said he could continue driving he would have a defence to the charge. Without it I am not confident.  
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Business Account


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Hey, I'm starting a new claim for bank charges on a Limited Comany.

 

I have a copy of bank statements and the bank charges are made up of:

 

14 direct debits @ 40p = £5.60

Cash paid in at branches =£46,540 @ 49p per £100= £228.04

Standing orders 11 @ 40 =£4.40

 

There are a few other charges and the total charge for one month is £401.43.

 

Can these charges also be claimed back? Are they unlawful or just a price you pay for having a business bank account. Please help.

 

Thanks.

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Guest Lueeze

Surely you are paying for a service with these charges?

 

If so (because it is business account) I would say you cant claim this back, as 40p and 49p/£100 seem much more reasonable fee's

 

If not then yes claim them....

 

Lou x

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Ok im getting slightly confused. I have a personal bank account and i am just waiting for the Halifax to pay up. With regards to my business bank i am just a little unsure as to what is 'unlawful'. If those items, as you say, are a service then surely the referral charges i have been charged each month of £150 are also service charges to increase or decrease my overdraft?

 

Thanks.

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I agree with Lou here. The charges you state are not unlawful. 40p is not an unreasonable cost to charge the company for the servicing of a direct debit.

 

The argument with referal fees is that we all know it doesn't cost £30 etc to bounce a direct debit. These arguments and others are in the FAQ section of the forum. If you are going as far as court action you must be fully aware of these arguments.

 

Good luck.

[

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Thanks for answering that question about my first post. The referral charge is my confusion now though. I do agree that the other charges on bankings and direct debits etc is ok and not unlawful but what about the referral fees. I am charged £150 each month for this and dont really know what it is for. The overdraft is not updated that much. As for going to court, i havent even issed my first letter regarding the business accounts as i am not to sure i have a case. The court issue is with my personal bank account and i have read all the faqs and understand them completely. It is the business side i am now researching, so i was just enquiring as to whether 'referral charges' are lawful.

 

Thanks.

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Guest Lueeze

£150 EVERY month?

 

Most Business users have a annual review and then it costs them a %. Like I say Im surprised you are charged these fee's of 40p ect then another £150 on top of this....

 

What bank are you with? I will look into it for you...

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Guest Lueeze

Rates and fees

 

 

Banking method Standard menu tariff Auto free tariff

Payments out:

manual 67p each 75p each

Payments out:

standing order 40p each 0p each

Payments out:

Direct Debits 38p each 0p each

Payments out:

other automated debits 40p each 0p each

Receipt in:

manual/automated 70p/20p each 75p/0p each

Cash in - branch 57p per £100 90p per £100

Cash out - branch 57p per £100 90p per £100

Cash exchange £1.60 per £100 £1.50 per £100

Cheques paid in - branch 28p 30p

Autopay payments 28p each1 0p each1

Night safe deposits £1 each £1 each

Account maintenance charges £5.75 per month £3.50 per month

 

Current Credit Interest Rates* Gross per year AER

Business Current Account 2% 2.02%

Charges are applied monthly calculated on the services you've used. You'll be given around 14 days' notice of amounts to be charged, along with details of our calculations.

 

 

Charges for additional services

Management time, statements, returned cheques and letters about your loans or overdraft no charge

Stopping payment instructions (eg. cheque2) £10

Obtaining a special cheque clearance £15

Credit opened £12 to set up

Duplicate records (eg. copy of statement) £5

Certificates of balance £8 each

Business audit certificates £27.50 ex VAT (free for clubs, societies and charities)

Banker's opinion £8.50

CHAPS £23 (to pay into another UK bank)

£21 (to pay into another NatWest branch)

Obtaining a banker's draft £12 each

Returned items 'outwards' £35 each

Paid referral fee £25 each day an item is referred prior to payment

 

 

 

 

 

Sorry it seems muddled, but i copied this from their website, can you identify which charges you have had?

 

Lou xxx

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Hey, and thanks for your help already

 

Here is a typical months charges (and how its written on the bank statement):

 

The charge is calculated as a per price item as detailed below: £400.32

Plus an account maintenance charge/fixed fee of: £5.75

 

Account charge to be deducted: £406.07

 

Activity Charge

 

BACS Direct Debits 11 @ 0.38 = £4.18

Other automated debits 5 @ 0.40 = £2.00

Standing orders 7 @ 0.40 £2.80

Cheques and other debits 27 @ 0.67 = £18.09

Manual Credits 18 @0.70 = £12.60

Cheques paid in - branches 5 @ 0.28 = £1.40

Cash paid in at branches £37,051 @ 0.57 (per £100) = £211.13

Cash exchanged at branches £8,470 @ £1.60 (per £100) = £135.52

Autopay payments 45 @ 0.28 = 12.60

 

Total Item Charge £400.32

 

That amount is then taken from bank about 14 days after notice. I am then charged a 'referral charge for the month of xxxxx' of £150 every month. THEN I am charged interest on the account of £406.07!!!!!

 

Im not necessarily disputing the charges as discussed previously, but the other items are surely just lining the big wigs pockets?

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Guest Lueeze

WOW! thats alot of cash! Isnt there a cheaper alternative? Or do you have big borrowing?

 

Ok, The 1st fee's seem legal

 

Claim the 2nd and see what happens.

 

Like i said before most people pay an OD review fee each year and its like 1% or 2% or something. Can you actually call them and ask what this is for?? Its not listed ANYWHERE???

 

Claim it if in doubt, they can then explain what it is cant they!

 

Hope im helping and not hindering...

 

Lou xxx

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You're being a great help. Here is the story.. i am the company accountant of 6 Limited companies. I have started looking through the bank statements, hence the reasons for all my posts today.

 

Basically, 5 of the companies are bars or clubs and the other one is a magazine company. That is the reason for all the transactions. I have skimmed through the bank statements of the other companies and again the normal charges are paid out (d/ds and s/os etc) then they also have referral charges each month. They vary in amounts, two being £80 per month and one being £12 per week. I havent been through the last two companies but im assuming they will be the same. They are all Natwest accounts too.

 

I will get one of the Directors to call the Natwest tomorrow to ask the question as to what the 'referral charge' is for. If he doesnt have any luck then I will just try and get those amounts back. I will also look into the interest charges as to when and what they are for.

 

Im getting soooo confused!! lol

 

The amounts in the accounts for bank charges and interest are just so excessive its unreal!

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Guest Lueeze

I would say they are excessive, christ they make a fortune from you!

 

Like i said you really should look at changing banks, now I know this is not easy, but i bet theres a few banks out there who would like to have your business and can offer you a better deal.

 

Unless you feel the service is good enough to justify the charges of course....Call them and bloody complain, after all they earn enough from you!

 

Lou xxx

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I have just checked one of the other bank statements online and they also have referral charges of £125 each month as well as the normal bank charges and interest!

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Guest Lueeze

Right go get em! GRRRR!!!!

 

Like i say you have the upper hand, you pay their wages effectively!

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Thanks!

 

We are currently looking into changing banks, hence the reason for me looking into getting the charges back as it wont matter if they close the account or not.

 

I will let you know tomorrow their reasons for the 'referral charge', if indeed there is one!! lol

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Want FREE BANKING? - This is not an advert just a recommendation. Why not join the FSB Federation of Small Business? It costs about £70 a year. You get free 24 hour legal help line on any matter at all. Cover against tax and vat investigations AND as a member of the FSB you get FREE BANKING from the Co-operative bank. No cheque charges, no DD charges nothing. All you pay are £10 per day over the limint charges ( which I am claiming back! ) and any lending you have. But the FSB deal is a damn good deal. http://www.fsb.co.uk you'll never look back!

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Hey Lueeze

 

I spoke to the Directors and they arent sure what the referral charge is for. First they said it was for natwest online banking thingy bob to pay the wages. I told them that it cant be for that as only one company uses it and every company is being charged.

 

OK... Just spoke to a different Director, the referral fee is for going overdrawn. Yes, the companies do go overdrawn but £150 quid charge is way too excessive. He also told me that the interest charges is also for going overdrawn and recently they have been charged up to 29% for this!

 

Thanks for the reply about FSB, i'll have a look into that but i believe that they are already in discussions with another bank.

 

Thanks

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Guest Lueeze

Blimey just as well you chekced cos thats alot to be taking out of your wages!

 

Good Luck!

 

Lou xx

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Checked it out and it looks good, thanks for the info Andrew, are you a member?

 

Lou

 

 

Yes Lou I am. It's only for Self employed and businesses I have a Limited Company but it's the person who is the member. It also covers family and employees too so it's the best £70 I've ever spent and you don't have to go through a credit check to become a member either! The legal helpline is brilliant. I've spent hours talking to them on some issues and it costs you zilch! I do all my banking online and they have a reasonably good site.

 

I have read on a couple of threads that transfer of DD's & St/Orders etc have been a little shakey from one bank to Co-op but i have never had trouble with them. They are a good bank all be it not the most glamorous when it comes to branches but they get things done and seem a cheerful bunch. I've banked in business since 1980 and have tried most of them, Co-op I like.

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