PRA claimform Fast Track - old Barclays Loans

[dx100uk]

so your name was not there at all.

i'm just checking you didn't munge it as you should before posting it on an open forum.

 

 

[johnbomo]

Sorry, must have missed your reply. No, no name added (or removed) they had just used the stupid signed thing.

 

 

 

I've just come on to look into pretrial checklists and it seems this is something I'll be sent by the court. Nothing has turned up yet. What should I do?

 

It's due 25/03, and that approaching pretty fast.

[dx100uk]

no you create it

 

dx

 

[AndyOrch]

N170 is predominantly for the claimant but there a few parts you have to complete.

 

 https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/form-n170-listing-questionnaire-pre-trial-checklist

 

[johnbomo]

Hopefully, I've done this correctly. Now I just need to start reading up on how to do the actual trial. Any good threads to follow, or things I should know before entering??

N170 - Redact.pdf

[AndyOrch]

Yes that's fine...we don't tend to get many Fast Track money claims based on credit agreements john far to costly and risky for DCAs to pursue litigation however the process is not too dissimilar to SCT and there are plenty of  successful topics in the  Financial Legal Success Forum that have concluded.

[johnbomo]

Thanks Andy. I will start reading.

 

I have sent my checklist in and have received the checklist from PRA. Nothing much to show on it, so I've not uploaded.

 

[johnbomo]

I'm going to assume SCT means Small Claims Track?

 

I've read through a lot and it's making me feel a lot more confident.

 

I think I'll start a document to have the relevant CCA / CPR sections and highlight the Claimant's WS to show were I feel the issues are.

 

They do state 3 times that no default notice has been provided to them, let alone me, but Barclays promises it was sent and was correct

[AndyOrch]

Correct Small Claims Track

 

Quote

They do state 3 times that no default notice has been provided to them, let alone me, but Barclays promises it was sent and was correct

 

I'm afraid hearsay wont cut it...hence the CCA1974 and section 87/88

[johnbomo]

So, after reading 100s of threads and branching out onto the wider web looking for info, I've got a stupid question. 

 

Is the defence that the DCA has no evidence of a DN solid? They haven't reconstituted one, or made one up, they have just said they were never given one. 

 

I did find this case which had a missing DN too and that was dismissed. 

SegalArt.pdf

[dx100uk]

there have been numerous successful wins here also regarding dn issues

 

dx

[johnbomo]

As long as it's a solid defence I'm happy. Just need a bit of reminding that I can win this as it's high stakes for me. 

 

Thanks dx100uk

[johnbomo]

I have a few questions if you can indulge me a little.

 

1. My witness statement says that I have had dealings with Barclays, but don't recognise this debt. If the judge forwardly asks if the debt is min, should I admit to the original debt at all, or just stick to the same line?

 

2. Will the judge try to trip me up or act with hostility to my type of defence? - An odd question, I know, but I'm not sure what may come at me, so want to steel oneself a little.

 

3. Can I bring up the Claimant's WS directly and ask them questions? Their 4. says that a default notice has not been sent to me, but will be once they receive a copy. I feel this need to be really discussed

 

4. Would it hold water with the judge if I finished speaking by saying that I stand by my WS and that the claimant has failed to prove any money is owed. That I have tried to deal with these people openly and frankly, but they haven't once offered the details I needed to agree to the debt.

 

My session is 10:00AM Friday 8th April, so I'm just trying to get all my ducks in a row.

I have my "evidence pack", a document with the CCA parts I might want to read and all of the Claimant docs.

 

Am I missing anything obvious??

 

[dx100uk]

1.stick with your defence and WS.

 

2.no unless you are really really  unlucky and suffer what we call judge lottery and nothing can protect or change those types.

 

3/4. thats what you did in your WS so yes..

 

speak only when invited too by the judge .

 

[johnbomo]

Cheers dx100uk

 

I've received the claimants bundle today. I checked the court documents and it doesn't mention me uploading one. Should I create one regardless??

 

[dx100uk]

is it just their documents they listed in the n170?

 

i'm not sure TBH?

 

dx

 

[johnbomo]

It is the same as their WS with the court documents added. I have gone through it and it all looks the same.

The court notice only says the claimant needs to upload one 48 hours before the court date, so I'm guessing I'm okay to not bother. It would only be a resubmission of my WS with evidence.

[AndyOrch]

On 05/04/2022 at 00:35, johnbomo said:

I have a few questions if you can indulge me a little.

 

1. My witness statement says that I have had dealings with Barclays, but don't recognise this debt. If the judge forwardly asks if the debt is min, should I admit to the original debt at all, or just stick to the same line? Better to state you do not recall rather than recognise hence the need to sought clarity by way of your legal requests (CCA/CPR 31.14)

 

2. Will the judge try to trip me up or act with hostility to my type of defence? - An odd question, I know, but I'm not sure what may come at me, so want to steel oneself a little. Shouldn't think so if you do not recall and seek clarity you are fully justified in questioning the claim and if the claimant has followed due legal process.

 

3. Can I bring up the Claimant's WS directly and ask them questions? No but you can ask the judge to raise it. Their 4. says that a default notice has not been sent to me, but will be once they receive a copy. I feel this need to be really discussed. Covered this in depth already you cant enforce an agreement unless they can prove and/or disclose that a Default Notice was served pursuant to section 87(1) no use sating we will get it after judgment.

 

4. Would it hold water with the judge if I finished speaking by saying that I stand by my WS and that the claimant has failed to prove any money is owed. That I have tried to deal with these people openly and frankly, but they haven't once offered the details I needed to agree to the debt. That's for the judge to conclude and how good you state your argument.

 

My session is 10:00AM Friday 8th April, so I'm just trying to get all my ducks in a row.

I have my "evidence pack", a document with the CCA parts I might want to read and all of the Claimant docs.

 

Am I missing anything obvious??

May be prudent to draft a skeleton argument with bullet points of the main arguments in support of your defence simply for quick reference for you to refer to......you should serve a copy on the court and the claimant not less than 48 hours pre hearing..but if you don't wish to serve it you can use it personally to assist you during questioning.

On 05/04/2022 at 00:35, johnbomo said:

 

 

[AndyOrch]

11 hours ago, johnbomo said:

It is the same as their WS with the court documents added. I have gone through it and it all looks the same.

The court notice only says the claimant needs to upload one 48 hours before the court date, so I'm guessing I'm okay to not bother. It would only be a resubmission of my WS with evidence.

 

If your Notice of allocation (N154) does not direct you to submit a bundle then dont......but its usually normal for both parties.

[johnbomo]

A quick update. Sadly my defence was unsuccessful and the judge sided with the claimant.

They have been award judgment and cost equalling 13000+, so overall a bit of a doodoo day tbh.

 

The judge seemed keen on the default notice defence and in the summary sided with me regarding it, but since the debt was due to a loan, a loan that ended in the mid 2021s it was judged that this was then outside the scope of whichever CCA (87 or 88) section said it was necessary.

 

I've been given 21 days to pay. I can't, so no ideas what to do with that, but I'll work it out. Thanks for all the assistance.

[AndyOrch]

 Sorry to hear this John...another one of those judges ?...loans still require a default notice pursuant to sections 87(1) 88 whether it has matured or not to be able to enforce an agreement.

 

(1)Service of a notice on the debtor or hirer in accordance with section 88 (a “default notice ”) is necessary before the creditor or owner can become entitled, by reason of any breach by the debtor or hirer of a regulated agreement.

 

Wait for the notice of judgment (see if its forthwith or monthly) then submit an N245 (fee£14) and offer an affordable monthly amount.

 

 

[dx100uk]

probably n245 time.

 

ah the old the agreement has ended dodge so the Consumer Credit Act rules don't apply.., bad judge there!!

if the CCa doesn't apply, then what makes your sig valid then? same arguement...