caro v YB - defence & counterclaim ***WON***

[caro]

Yes you're right PJ. I don't know why I am dithering like this.

 

I have got one worry though. I only sent LBA to Neil Mc who is in Scotland where I believe the process is different. I was going to do a copy for the branch but got my very definitely sod off letter from him first. Can I do the moneyclaim to the branch or should I do it to Neil McKirdy. Despite my good intentions I haven't got round to checking MC out, so I am relying on you and Trunny and anyone else who can help to hold my hand.:-|

 

You can be as fluffy as you like!

 

PS Tell me to sod off and look at the FAQ's and don't expect everyone else do the work for me!!:grin:

[pjdudley69]

Sod off, read the FAQs and don't expect anyone else to do the work for you just kidding hun lol

 

When I sent my LBA letter I sent it to my local branch, with a copy to Neil at Scotland. Neil replied to my letter, telling me to go away basically, then my branch obviously forwarded their copy of the letter and Neil replied again [telling me he'd replied once and was sticking to his guns basically!]. I've now issued my claim to my local branch, and I believe Trun's done the same - it won't make a difference to your case [they'll probably send it Neil to respond to anyway lol]

 

PJ

[caro]

So even though the branch haven't had the LBA you think I will be OK to send the claim stuff there?

[pjdudley69]

Yes, I think so Caro, as basically it is your branch that you have the issue with - Neil McKirdy is just the customer relations bloke [plus he's based in Scotland so it may cause probs]

[caro]

Thanks PJ. I'm beginning to understand why it took a while to complete your Moneyclaim, but I will get there. There's no turning back now.

[rachel2609]

Hey Caro,

 

The bloke in Scotland is who has sent the recent letter to my Mum offering 25% in settlement - yeah right!!!

 

Now that I have had my fisrt success on behalf of my Mum with Citibank I am a bit more relaxed about it all, and will be happy to hand hold and offer advice on MC if you need it.

 

If I was you I would continue to send original letters to your branch and copies to Scotland if you want to. When I was at this stage I was just dealing solely with some Customer Services people in Leeds, the recent letter from Scotland is the first contact from them.

 

Rachel

[caro]

Cheers for that Rachel. Very much appreciated I will do one to the branch and one to McKirdy then so they can't say I sent to the wrong place. I will keep posting as I go.

 

Bet your Mum is chuffed with how it's going.

[caro]

Had a good read of all the info on the MCOL website today, and it's beginning to make sense. I think I will try and get it sorted tomorrow. I must confess that with YB apparently defending when they get court papers it does make it a bit scary. They won't intimidate me though, as this is now on my terms. It is really useful having a few people who are just that bit further along so I know what I can expect.

 

When I went over my original figures I found I had put the wrong figure down for my interest by about £30, but I will just put the correct amount. It is in their favour, so I will just be honest and say I made a mistake if they query it, and check and recheck it before putting it on MCOL. Better than them picking up on it and trying to make me look stupid. I am even beginning to understand some of the legalese. I am quite pleased about that because I was worried about that if I had to go to court, but the more I read in the FAQ's etc, the more I understand.

[pjdudley69]

Best of luck with your claim in the morning. You'll be fine. Don't worry about them intending to defend [says me who text trunny as soon as I opened the letter lol], it's most probably another stalling tactic, trying to intimidate us into backing off. If they do take me to court, well so be it, I'll be the guinea pig and let everyone else know here what to expect lol

 

It'll be fine hun, you know we're all here to help

[caro]

Ah thanks PJ. Does the defence being entered affect your court date or does it still stand?

 

Scrub that, I've just noticed the date was for them to defend the claim, which they have done. I guess trunny should get her defence in the next day or two as well.

[pjdudley69]

At a guess, I'd say she'll get her intention to defend letter on Tuesday, because she was just two days behind me. Knowing my luck, they'll not bother defending her claim and just go for me lol

[hilaryfrances]

I wish you all the luck in the world with your court case...I bet/hope they wont turn up anyway they are just calling your bluff. I would love them to turn up to court if I have to go.I would be a bit scared but if they have put me and hundreds of u=others through the mill for nothing it will be worth it

[caro]

What a day I am having! Those of you who know me well may notice something different about me today. I am tickled pink. Don't know if you will suss out what I am talking about. Babbling as usual.

 

More to the point, did my MCOL claim last night. The £120 to do it hurt, but with a bit of luck I will get it back soon. My claim request has been issued and YB has 14 days from the date they are served with the claim, to reply.

 

I checked out the bits of legislation I was referring to in the claim, as I didn't really understand what I was talking about, and I didn't want to sign something so important without fulling understanding it. It made perfect sense so I am ready to take on the world.

 

Bring it on Yorkshire Bank, bring it on!

[caro]

Just a quick update for my friends on the YB forum. Got YB's defence today, AQ and a counterclaim. New one on me from this bank. Not looked at it properly but from a quick glance they are saying that if I win my claim they claim it back again, because that is what my errant ways have cost them.

 

If I win it is because my errant ways have not cost them that much because it is made up of penalties. Is that really the best they can come up with. Pleeeease. Also a court date around August 7th I think so things are moving on.

 

I will try and post later when I have a bit more time and studied in more detail, but YB/Clydesdales solicitors really do seem to be coming up with a load of twaddle today.

[pjdudley69]

You've got a court date pretty quick Caro! I sent my AQ back over a week ago and still not heard anything. Just a thought with the counterclaim thing, because they didn't say they were making a counterclaim against me or Trunny when they submitted their defence, would they still be able to turn round and do that?

[caro]

Oops it wasn't a court date, it was the date for the AQ to be returned. I was trying to read, get the tea and post all at once. Not sure if they could do a counterclaim or not at this stage in your claim PJ, but it really is a joke. I think it is the first time Yorkshire Bank have made me laugh, so don't worry PJ. I will try and explain.

 

The defence is the usual denials that the charges are unfair, and refers to the terms and conditions that they will refer to from time to time "at trial". Ooh I'm quaking in my boots (not;) ). Deny they are unreasonable blah de blah de blah. Nothing I haven't seen or heard about on this forum before. The amount they mention is also slightly different to the one I mentioned . They say £2941.00 (like PJ's I believe, out by a few pounds). No problem, I will check my figures and send in a spreadsheet with my Allocation Questionnaire.

 

Bear with me now while I state the blindingly obvious but hopefully you will see why. Now if I win it will be because the charges are penalties and do not reflect the true costs to the bank. I am convinced that this is correct, so would win if it got to court.

 

Quote:

"COUNTERCLAIM

 

If, which is denied, the charges imposed by the Bank constitute a penalty or an unfair contract Term within the meaning of the Unfair Terms in Consumer Contracts Regulations 1999, then the Bank counterclaims for the actual costs and expenses incurred by it in dealing with the Claimant and Part 20 Defendant's breach of contract in allowing her account to become over drawn or exceed her overdraft limit".

 

Then a few more paras about how I let myself become overdrawn (no mention that it was usually due to their charges).

 

Then and I quote:-

 

"The costs and expenses incurred by the Defendant and Part 20 Claimant resulting from the Customers' failure to keep within the agreed overdraft limit on the account amount to £2941.00".

 

Now correct me if I am reading this wrong but this is what I am reading. If I win £2941 because they are penalty charges, then they counterclaim £2941 because that is the amount of their costs and expenses.

 

Bear with me again please because I cannot quite believe the stupidity of this so need to be clear. If their costs and expenses are £2941 and they can prove it, then I will not win because it is not a penalty. Help me out here. Is that what is being said?

 

YB's Senior Corporate Lawyer is not earning her money. One more little gem, is on the covering letter from the court.

 

Quote

"The defendant has filed a counterclaim, a copy of which is enclosed with this notice. The counterclaim has not been paid, and the defendant has been advised that they must pay this within 10 days of the date of this letter, or the counterclaim will be struck out".

 

PMSL Times must be hard for YB.

 

Over to you lot. What do you think?

[turt77]

They're in complete disarray.

 

Fantastic. That's the most hillarious thing I've read in ages.

[barracad]

That's really made me chuckle.

 

Never mind having the counterclaim struck out for not being paid, they should strike it out for being complete and utter nonsense!

[Robertxc]

I got a response from Clydesdale to my LBA today. Two entire pages of what I would call 'legal vitriol' about Terms & Conditions, and about how "fair" their charges are.

 

Clydesdale have alsways been one of the most difficult about handing over Data Protection Act stuff, so there are not too many cases of people actually getting their dosh back. Unfortunately for them, as far as I can tell, three of the people who will iminently be challenging them in court are Mods of the CAG! (Jmio, Caro and me).

 

I'll post the contents of their letter to me for your edification when I get to work tomorrow.

[trundlecat]

Edit: Cos I was talking rubbish

[trundlecat]

I'm actually pretty insulted at this new approach YB are taking.

 

To simplify things they are [edit] Eh?? Am I missing something? Or am I just not as daft as YB think I should be?

 

They must really think we're all so feeble we can be scared off by threats that just don't make sense & obviously won't be carried through. They are practicing intimidation (all be it very badly) & abusing the court system, surely something can be done about this?

 

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[jonni2bad]

Well Caro, I thought that the Halifax legal team were dire, but these lot make them look incredibly professional.

[JMio]

 

I've sat and read that 3 times, and I STILL cannot work out what their angle of defence is.!?!

 

So, if you go to court, and win (which you will) because the rate at which they have been charging you has been too high, then they will counter-claim to recover this same amount because they believe they're not too high.!?

 

But, b' but.!? (hard to re-create a bemused stammer in writing!!) if (when!) the Judge rules that their charges ARE penalties, and therefore Unlawful, and they can't prove otherwise in the original case, HOW THE HELL ARE THEY PLANNING TO SUDDENLY CHANGE ALL THAT IN THE NEXT CASE.!?!??!??!

 

 

It's the kind of argument you'd give a person a slap for if it was down the pub!

 

Oh well!

[turt77]

It's not a serious defence. If it was they'd have paid for the counterclaim.

 

Its the most pathetic, barefaced, desparate attempt to intimidate. Nothing more.

[pjdudley69]

Well, it made me laugh Caro lol If they want to put a counterclaim in and prove to the judge what it actually costs them for us going overdrawn I have absolutely no problems with that. It probably wouldn't even hit the £100 mark for the charges I've had, so I'd still be over £500 better off! But we all know that aint ever gonna happen, don't we! It's so obvious that they've upped their intimidatory tactics, for what use it is with us stubborn lot