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    • Hi, the vehicle went to Audi Chingford on Thursday 13th May. I did state beforehand that I only wanted a diagnostic. The technician out of courtesy opened the drain letting huge deposits of water escape the seals. Video evidence was provided via AUDI cam. The link for the audi cam has been forwarded to BMW and Motonovo. I spoke to branch manager explained the situation and he stated he would sent me an email outlining the issue. Audi state this is not really an issue and more of a design flaw. However, the seals still have water ingress. I purchased the vehicle with £0 deposit on a 60 months HP plan for £520.00. The vehicle total was £21000. I did not go for any extended warranty. I live almost 70 miles away from the aftersales centre in Peterborough. I have previously uploaded the document I forwarded to BMW however it was in word format. I have had to buy a new tyre almost three days after purchasing vehicle. BMW still have not compensated me for the v62 cost as they said they would. 
    • I would suggest that you stop trying to rely on legal theory – as you understand it. Firstly, because we are dealing with practical/pragmatic situations and at a low value level where these arguments tend not to work. Secondly, because you clearly have misunderstood the assessment of quantum where there are breaches of obligations. The formula that you have cited above is the method of loss calculation in torts. In contract it is entirely different. The law of obligations generally attempts to remedy the breach. This means that in tort, damages seek to put you into the position you would have been in had the breach not occurred. In other words it returns you to your starting position – point zero. Contract damages attend put you into the position that you would have been had the breach not occurred but this is not your starting position, contract damages assume that the agreement in dispute had actually been carried out. This puts you into your final position. You sold an item for £XXX. Your expectation was that you your item would be correctly delivered and that you would be the beneficiary of £XXX. Your expectation loss is the amount that you sold the item for and that is all you are entitled to recover. If you want, you can try to sue for the larger sum – and we will help you. But if they ask for evidence of the value of the item as it was sold then I can almost guarantee that either you will be obliged to settle for the lesser sum – or else a judge will give you judgement but for the lesser sum. This will put you to the position that you would have been had there been no breach of contract. I understand from you now that when you dispatch the item you declared the retail cost to you and not your expected benefit of £XXX. To claim for the retail value in the circumstances would offend the rules relating to betterment. If you want to do it then we will help you – but don't be surprised if you take a tumble.  
    • I was caught speeding 3 times in the same week, on the same road. All times were 8-12mph higher than the limit. I was offered the course for the first offense and I now need to accept the other 2 offenses. I just want to be ready for what might come. Will I get the £100 fine and 3 points for each of them or do I face something more severe?  These are my only offenses in 8 years of driving.
    • I'll get my letter drafted this evening. Its an item I sold, which I'm also concerned about, as whilst I don't have my original purchase receipt (the best I have is my credit card statement showing a purchase from Car Audio Centre), I do unfortunately have the eBay listing where I sold it for much less. But as I said before this is now a question of compensation: true compensation would seek to put me back into the position I was in before the loss ie: that title would remain with me until my buyer has accepted this, and so compensation should be that which would be needed to replace the lost item. But in the world of instant electronic payment, it could be argued that as I had already been paid, the title to the goods had already transferred, and I was required to refund the buyer after the loss. And so, despite my declared value being the retail price - that which is needed to return me to my pre-sales position, the compensatory value should be the value I sold it for, which being a second-hand item from a private seller is lower. I still believe that I should be claiming for the item's full value, rather than how much I sold it for, as this is the same for insurance: we don't insure the value we paid, but rather the value of the item to put us back into the position we would be in if we ever needed to claim. Its for the loss adjuster to argue the toss
    • amusing that 'bad economic judgement on behalf of prior party ISN'T a major reason to wingers to move to deform yet immigration is, where record levels of such has been driven by the right wings terrible brexit and the later incompetent dog whistle 'proposals largely driven to whistle to the right wingnuts Just seems to confirm the are clueless numpties 'wetting their own shoes   Has farage bought a property in Clacton yet?   yet concern for the NHS is listed as a major issue even by those saying they are moving to deform  
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    • If you are buying a used car – you need to read this survival guide.
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    • Hello,

      On 15/1/24 booked appointment with Big Motoring World (BMW) to view a mini on 17/1/24 at 8pm at their Enfield dealership.  

      Car was dirty and test drive was two circuits of roundabout on entry to the showroom.  Was p/x my car and rushed by sales exec and a manager into buying the mini and a 3yr warranty that night, sale all wrapped up by 10pm.  They strongly advised me taking warranty out on car that age (2017) and confirmed it was honoured at over 500 UK registered garages.

      The next day, 18/1/24 noticed amber engine warning light on dashboard , immediately phoned BMW aftercare team to ask for it to be investigated asap at nearest garage to me. After 15 mins on hold was told only their 5 service centres across the UK can deal with car issues with earliest date for inspection in March ! Said I’m not happy with that given what sales team advised or driving car. Told an amber warning light only advisory so to drive with caution and call back when light goes red.

      I’m not happy to do this, drive the car or with the after care experience (a sign of further stresses to come) so want a refund and to return the car asap.

      Please can you advise what I need to do today to get this done. 
       

      Many thanks 
      • 81 replies
    • Housing Association property flooding. https://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/topic/438641-housing-association-property-flooding/&do=findComment&comment=5124299
      • 161 replies
    • We have finally managed to obtain the transcript of this case.

      The judge's reasoning is very useful and will certainly be helpful in any other cases relating to third-party rights where the customer has contracted with the courier company by using a broker.
      This is generally speaking the problem with using PackLink who are domiciled in Spain and very conveniently out of reach of the British justice system.

      Frankly I don't think that is any accident.

      One of the points that the judge made was that the customers contract with the broker specifically refers to the courier – and it is clear that the courier knows that they are acting for a third party. There is no need to name the third party. They just have to be recognisably part of a class of person – such as a sender or a recipient of the parcel.

      Please note that a recent case against UPS failed on exactly the same issue with the judge held that the Contracts (Rights of Third Parties) Act 1999 did not apply.

      We will be getting that transcript very soon. We will look at it and we will understand how the judge made such catastrophic mistakes. It was a very poor judgement.
      We will be recommending that people do include this adverse judgement in their bundle so that when they go to county court the judge will see both sides and see the arguments against this adverse judgement.
      Also, we will be to demonstrate to the judge that we are fair-minded and that we don't mind bringing everything to the attention of the judge even if it is against our own interests.
      This is good ethical practice.

      It would be very nice if the parcel delivery companies – including EVRi – practised this kind of thing as well.

       

      OT APPROVED, 365MC637, FAROOQ, EVRi, 12.07.23 (BRENT) - J v4.pdf
        • Like

@curryspcworld @TeamKnowhowUK refused to honour purchase


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So far as the eBay voucher code concerned, that is between yourself and eBay. The value which Currys received is the amount which is relevant for these purposes. Presumably you will be able to recover the value of the eBay promotion from eBay? The important thing is that the figures in your claim stack up. I haven't done the maths – but does the full price less the £1808 which you were refunded equal £641?

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Fits in until the word ‘refunded’.

The underlined sentence - do you meant ‘refuse to supply the promotional computer agreed and paid for in contract’

 

if I can’t include the eBay voucher code then I will be claiming £541 instead.  The amount covered by the voucher code wasn’t refunded and cannot be claimed in monetary value according to ebay terms.

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Try that and then come back here if it doesn't fit.

Please post up the new corrected draft.  Ta

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Quote

 

The Defendant advertised a laptop computer 
MacBook Pro 15”, with Touchbar,256GB SSD,Space 
Grey(2019)on an eBay auction order 
no.05-03481-54910,Currys PC World 
ref.EBY1000248637,invoice no.1342689.The full 
RRP is £2349 but the defendant offered it for 
a promotional price of £1808.Claimant
succeeded at the auction and paid the asking 
promotional price of £1708 plus £100 voucher, now expired.Defendant sent a 
lower spec model computer.Defendant refuses 
to supply the contractual goods.Claimant has
returned the incorrect item and been refunded 
£1708 but defendant continues to refuse to supply the 
promotional computer agreed and paid for in 
the contract.Claimant seeks £ 641: being the 
difference between the sum refunded and the 
full value contracted-for item or else  
specific performance of the contract.

 

 

 

Fits nicely. Thanks.

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Cool. When is day 15?

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It's your responsibility to do the maths and to make sure that what you eventually claim put you back into the position that you expected to be if the contract to go ahead. This means that you are entitled to be in possession of a contract value – the RRP.

If you claim even £1 too much, this will undermine the credibility of what you are doing and just make life more complicated.

Do you still have the benefit of the eBay voucher? If you do then clearly you won't be able to claim for its value from Currys because that would put you £100 ahead.

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I understand that. No I don’t have the benefit of the eBay voucher any longer as it was time limited but eBay does run promotion like this occasionally. 

I am not trying to change the amount claimed. £541 is fine. What I meant was the part in claim particulars where I mentioned I was ‘refunded £1808’ but it was actually £1708 and I didn’t want inaccurate figure to affect my claim. I don’t know if the detail matters. 

 

Day 15 is 9/7/19. Another thing that I’m unsure of is if I should tick the box to send detailed particulars direct to the defendant?

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Okay I've made some further edits because there is no reason why you should be £100 down on the deal. The promotional voucher is expired and that is their fault.

There is no reason why you should give even a millimetre of ground here.

See if my edited draft will fit the word limit and if not post the corrected version here and we will try culling some more

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I'm trying to fit it all in so that we can avoid having to send separate particulars of claim – which would be a nuisance given the very small amount of detail which needs to be added

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Quote

 

Defendant advertised a computer MacBook Pro
15” Touchbar,256GB SSD,Space Grey(2019)on
eBay auction order no.05-03481-54910,Currys
PC World ref.EBY1000248637,invoice
1342689.The full RRP is £2349 but the
defendant offered it for a promotional price
of £1808.Claima nt succeeded at the auction
and paid the asking promotional price of
£1708 plus £100 voucher,now expired.Defendant
sent a lower spec model computer.Defendant
refuses to supply the contractual
goods.Claimant has returned the incorrect
item and been refunded £1708 but continues to
refuse to supply the promotional computer
agreed and paid for in the contract.Claimant
seeks £ 641:the difference between the sum
refunded and the full value contracted- for
item or specific performance of the contract.


 

It fits. 

The second last draft claiming £541 is actually fine. The eBay code was a 10% discount code (max amount £100) which gave me £100 off £1808. It was non refundable. Obviously it was time limited and I have missed out on it, but eBay has done a similar promotion again today, albeit only for 6 hours. 

 

What you said earlier about claiming too much and putting myself £100 ahead does worry me. I will follow your advice on this and if you think I should claim £641 then I will, but I am more than happy with £541.

 

there are still 11 days till Day 15 so plenty of time to make amendments.

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If you have evidence that you used a time critical voucher which is now expired – and you are now unable to use it because of the contractual breach of the defendant, then I think that it is entirely reasonable to claim it. If it becomes an issue then you can give it up later – and it might even be something that you can give ground on if you want as part of a negotiated settlement.

However, on a strict interpretation I would say that you had the benefit of £100, they cause you to lose it and therefore they are responsible for it. As I may already have said, even if there is mediation, I don't think you need to give an inch.

Frankly I don't think there's anything to mediate about.

Claim the £641. As long as it is explained in the POC then I don't think there's any problem. You will have to sign a digital statement of truth and as long as you're happy that what you are saying is the truth and there's no problem.

It's excellent news that they have refunded you so quickly because it reduces your court fee and also it makes even less worth their while defending. As I've already said, these people are stupid and brutish. Actually I may not have said that they are brutish. I should have done

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Ok then. Looks like this will be the final draft but I will double check with you again before I submit it on D15. Really appreciate the time you have taken to help. Thanks. 

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Yup. Send them the good news

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I would add a date to the particulars.

 

Andy

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Quote

Defendant advertised a computer MacBook Pro
15” Touchbar,256GB SSD,Space Grey(2019)on
eBay auction order no.05-03481-54910,Currys
PC World ref.EBY1000248637,invoice
1342689 date XX.XX.2019.The full RRP is £2349 but the
D offered it for a promotional price
of £1808.Claimant succeeded at the auction
and paid the asking promotional price of
£1708 + £100 voucher,now expired. D
sent a lower spec model laptop.D
refuses to supply the contractual
goods.C. has returned the wrongly supplied 
item and been refunded £1708 but D.continues to
refuse to supply the promotional computer
agreed and paid for in the contract.C
seeks £ 641:the difference between the sum
refunded and the full value contracted- for
item or specific performance of the contract.

 

 

The invoice date.

 

I have now used D and C for defendant and claimant which is perfectly acceptable and understandable

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Incidentally, the court won't award specific performance but at least the defendant knows what they have to do to stop the action.

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Ok great , that’s fits with one line remaining.

Do I tick the box to send particulars to the defendant? ‘ If you wish, you may also send detailed particulars direct to the defendant. If you need to do this, please tick here ‘

Edited by Irt8787
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no.  You don't need to now

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no.  

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