Sales of Goods letter to Brighthouse & OSC Reclaiming

[pinkfloydianuk]

A GIUDE TO FILING A CLAIM......

 

Anyone filing a County Court Small Claim should find the following guide VERY helpfull,

 

First, find out were your local County Court is. This information can easily be found on any Search Engine, eg 'Google'

 

Go along and ask at the Enquiries desk for '3 claim forms', a 'Notes for claimant on completing a claim form' and any advice leaflets they deem appropriate (eg 'EX302 How To Make A Claim')

 

On the front of the claim form(s), in the top right hand corner, there is a box in which the name of the Court and the claim number are inserted, the Court will do this for you so you should start with:-

 

(Use Black Ink and write in Block Capitals)

 

Claimant

 

- this is where your details go.

 

- If you are a private individual then enter your full name and title followed by your address.

 

Defendants

 

- This is where your opponent's details go.

 

-The full Postal address of the company. Don't forget to include the postcode, failing to include it can delay your claim.

 

-It is also important to include 'LTD' or any other appropriate suffix.

 

Brief details of claim

 

Give a summary of the type of claim it is and if possible the remedy you seek e.g. "Breach of Contract - return of money", "Claim for mis sold Optional Service Cover (OSC) and unreasonable Late Payment Charges - return of money" etc.

 

Value

 

Please refer to the 'Notes for claimant on completing a form'.

 

There are clear instructions under the 'Value' section on how to add the relevant information.

 

The Court fee you have to pay will be based upon the amount specified.

 

Don't panic, depending on your personal circumstances you may not have to pay a fee. Details of whether or not you will have to pay or not can be found in leaflet EX160A, which is also available from the County Court.

 

Defendant's Name and Address

 

Repeat the Defendant's name and give the correct address for service of the Claim Form.

 

If your opponent is a limited company then you can choose between the company's "usual" place of business, its principal office or, if different, its registered office.

 

Should your opponent have retained a firm of solicitors to represent them don't be put off! You should only insert that firm's details here if they have specifically confirmed in writing that they are instructed to "accept service".

 

Amount Claimed

 

Simply insert the basic amount of money you are claiming. Or leave blank if you are not able to put a value on your claim.

 

Court Fee

 

A Court fee will be payable when you issue a Claim Form unless you are on a low income and qualify for an exemption.

The fee is calculated on a sliding scale; the higher the claim, the higher the fee.

 

Solicitor's Costs

 

This box should only be completed if a solicitor is issuing the proceedings.

 

Total Amount

 

Add up the sums in the previous 3 boxes and insert the total amount.

 

Issue Date

 

There is no need to complete this, the Court will do it for you when the Claim is issued.

 

We turn now to the reverse side of the Claim Form.

 

Does, or will, your claim include any issues under the Human Rights Act 1998?

 

Unless you know for certain whether or not your claim involves a Human Rights Act issue you can safely ignore this part of the form.

 

Particulars of Claim (attached) (to follow)

 

This is where you should include a summary of the facts you intend to rely upon. If the facts of the claim are simple and can be stated concisely then include them on the form here, otherwise use a separate piece(s) of paper.

 

Set out your claim as clearly as possible. Keep to the point and include all relevant facts.

 

Remember to include details of any misrepresentation (untrue statement) fraud or illegality. If you are relying on the terms of a contract then refer to that contract and attach a copy. The same goes for conditions of sale.

 

If you are claiming interest then your claim must be specified in clear and precise terms.

 

Finally remember to delete the "(attached)" "(to follow)" options unless they are applicable. Be careful about using the "to follow" option. If you decide to issue the Claim Form without Particulars and fail to follow up with Particulars of Claim within 14 days then the claim could be struck out. You will also be required to prepare a Certificate of Service and file it with the Court within 7 days together with a copy of the Particulars.

 

Statement of Truth

 

The rules require various documents such as the Claim Form to be verified by a Statement of Truth.

 

If you are issuing your own claim then the appropriate statement will be "I believe that the facts stated in these Particulars of Claim are true". Delete as appropriate, sign the form as Claimant and remember that deliberately lying can amount to contempt of Court!

 

I hope you have found this information helpfull.

 

pinkfloydianuk

Edited March 13, 2012 by pinkfloydianuk

[Hacked_Off]

Sub

[pinkfloydianuk]

Sub

 

What does this mean?

[dx100uk]

joining your thread

 

dx

[pinkfloydianuk]

Rant begins,

 

I will not be disheartened by any one. I even think that some of my family and friends think i've 'lost the plot' and that i'm wasting my time.

 

I firmly believe in what i'm fighting for and that is justice for the Consumer, not money, glory or any other personal reason as some people are probably thinking.

 

Getting an end result won't be the end of the matter for me, on the contrary, it will be the beginning. Whether i get the result i'm aiming for or not, someone needs to take a stand against this company and others like it. I WILL do anything i can to help with public awareness.

 

The attitude i have received from a few people on the internet has been quite frankly as disgusting as these company's ethics.

 

One particular person said things along the lines of 'If you are late then you are late!, If you are late with your payments then they are entitled to charge you a reasonable fee' and 'If you did'nt have bad credit then you wouldn't have to go to BrightHouse'.

 

So the fact my financial circumstances aren't great at the moment and i have bad credit makes it okay for BrightHouse to treat me like some sort of idiot?

 

I think not!

 

Infact let's all face it, BrightHouse aim at people lower down the economic scale. They believe that because we can't manage our finance's that makes us easy targets.

 

They don't take in to account that people may have come in to financial hardship in the past due to personal circumstances resulting in their credit being affected.

 

Thus not leaving us much choice but to go with these company's if we require/desire something normaly outside of our financial capabilities.

 

The way in which this company conduct's is business is 'shocking' to say the least, everything from thier bully boy tactics to their blatant disregard for the law.

 

Surely all this needs to be addressed and stopped by somebody who has the powers to do so!

 

Rant over.

Edited March 15, 2012 by pinkfloydianuk

[pinkfloydianuk]

ANY GOOD ADVICE APPRECIATED.......

 

Has any one got any strong suggestions, on how i can suggest to the courts in our evidence, that BrightHouse's Late Payment Charges are an 'unreasonable contract term'?

 

I have a couple of things in our evidence that i feel make a good argument but i would love to have something concrete.

 

I would prefer any suggestions via PM just incase BrightHouse are watching. I don't want to give them a heads up on whats to come.

 

Don't worry about advice on the OSC, BrightHouse haven't got a leg to stand on with that one.

[dx100uk]

well make sure you include the OFT/FSA line on PENALTY charges

 

they DIDN'T say £12 was ok or any PENALTY charges

just that it should reflect the TRUE cost in adim

not some arbitury figure - which IS a penalty.

 

and unlawfull

 

dx

[pinkfloydianuk]

well make sure you include the OFT/FSA line on PENALTY charges

 

they DIDN'T say £12 was ok or any PENALTY charges

just that it should reflect the TRUE cost in adim

not some arbitury figure - which IS a penalty.

 

and unlawfull

 

dx

 

Group 5: Financial penalties – paragraph 1(e) of Schedule 2

Schedule 2, paragraph 1, states that terms may be unfair if

they have the object or effect of:

 

(e) requiring any consumer who fails to fulfill his obligation to

pay a disproportionately high sum in compensation.

 

5.1 It is unfair to impose disproportionate sanctions for breach of contract.

 

A requirement to pay more in compensation for a breach than a reasonable pre-estimate of the loss caused to the supplier is one kind of excessive

penalty.

 

Such a requirement will, in any case, normally be void to the extent that it amounts to a penalty under English common law.

 

Other types of disproportionate sanction are considered below – Part III, Group 18©.

 

Nice one DX!!

[dx100uk]

http://www.oft.gov.uk/news-and-updates/press/2006/68-06

[SURFBOY]

Just ask them outright to prove that your late payment has cost them £12.

Which they wont be able to do.

[pinkfloydianuk]

A GIUDE TO FILING A CLAIM......

 

Anyone filing a County Court Small Claim should find the following guide VERY helpfull,

 

First, find out were your local County Court is. This information can easily be found on any Search Engine, eg 'Google'

 

Go along and ask at the Enquiries desk for '3 claim forms', a 'Notes for claimant on completing a claim form' and any advice leaflets they deem appropriate (eg 'EX302 How To Make A Claim')

 

On the front of the claim form(s), in the top right hand corner, there is a box in which the name of the Court and the claim number are inserted, the Court will do this for you so you should start with:-

 

(Use Black Ink and write in Block Capitals)

 

Claimant

 

- this is where your details go.

 

- If you are a private individual then enter your full name and title followed by your address.

 

Defendants

 

- This is where your opponent's details go.

 

-The full Postal address of the company. Don't forget to include the postcode, failing to include it can delay your claim.

 

-It is also important to include 'LTD' or any other appropriate suffix.

 

Brief details of claim

 

Give a summary of the type of claim it is and if possible the remedy you seek e.g. "Breach of Contract - return of money", "Claim for mis sold Optional Service Cover (OSC) and unreasonable Late Payment Charges - return of money" etc.

 

Value

 

Please refer to the 'Notes for claimant on completing a form'.

 

There are clear instructions under the 'Value' section on how to add the relevant information.

 

The Court fee you have to pay will be based upon the amount specified.

 

Don't panic, depending on your personal circumstances you may not have to pay a fee. Details of whether or not you will have to pay or not can be found in leaflet EX160A, which is also available from the County Court.

 

Defendant's Name and Address

 

Repeat the Defendant's name and give the correct address for service of the Claim Form.

 

If your opponent is a limited company then you can choose between the company's "usual" place of business, its principal office or, if different, its registered office.

 

Should your opponent have retained a firm of solicitors to represent them don't be put off! You should only insert that firm's details here if they have specifically confirmed in writing that they are instructed to "accept service".

 

Amount Claimed

 

Simply insert the basic amount of money you are claiming. Or leave blank if you are not able to put a value on your claim.

 

Court Fee

 

A Court fee will be payable when you issue a Claim Form unless you are on a low income and qualify for an exemption.

The fee is calculated on a sliding scale; the higher the claim, the higher the fee.

 

Solicitor's Costs

 

This box should only be completed if a solicitor is issuing the proceedings.

 

Total Amount

 

Add up the sums in the previous 3 boxes and insert the total amount.

 

Issue Date

 

There is no need to complete this, the Court will do it for you when the Claim is issued.

 

We turn now to the reverse side of the Claim Form.

 

Does, or will, your claim include any issues under the Human Rights Act 1998?

 

Unless you know for certain whether or not your claim involves a Human Rights Act issue you can safely ignore this part of the form.

 

Particulars of Claim (attached) (to follow)

 

This is where you should include a summary of the facts you intend to rely upon. If the facts of the claim are simple and can be stated concisely then include them on the form here, otherwise use a separate piece(s) of paper.

 

Set out your claim as clearly as possible. Keep to the point and include all relevant facts.

 

Remember to include details of any misrepresentation (untrue statement) fraud or illegality. If you are relying on the terms of a contract then refer to that contract and attach a copy. The same goes for conditions of sale.

 

If you are claiming interest then your claim must be specified in clear and precise terms.

 

Finally remember to delete the "(attached)" "(to follow)" options unless they are applicable. Be careful about using the "to follow" option. If you decide to issue the Claim Form without Particulars and fail to follow up with Particulars of Claim within 14 days then the claim could be struck out. You will also be required to prepare a Certificate of Service and file it with the Court within 7 days together with a copy of the Particulars.

 

Statement of Truth

 

The rules require various documents such as the Claim Form to be verified by a Statement of Truth.

 

If you are issuing your own claim then the appropriate statement will be "I believe that the facts stated in these Particulars of Claim are true". Delete as appropriate, sign the form as Claimant and remember that deliberately lying can amount to contempt of Court!

 

I hope you have found this information helpfull.

 

pinkfloydianuk

 

 

PLEASE NOTE,

 

We have just been to hand in our Claim/Evidence to the court.

 

While there we were informed that if you do not put an amount on the Application and you lose the case, you WILL be liable for the defendants costs.

 

We have been informed that it is best to put an approximate figure.

 

I'll add more detail after I've done some research, unless any of you reading this can shed more light.

Edited March 15, 2012 by pinkfloydianuk

[Anus Horribilis]

Infact let's all face it, BrightHouse aim at people lower down the economic scale. They believe that because we can't manage our finance's that makes us easy targets.

 

They don't take in to account that people may have come in to financial hardship in the past due to personal circumstances resulting in their credit being affected.

 

Thus not leaving us much choice but to go with these company's if we require/desire something normaly outside of our financial capabilities.

 

Agree with you completely. It is morally disgraceful to tout 50" 3D Plasma TV's and other premium goods to people on baseline incomes, and then to triple the price with disguised charges and interest. They are taking advantage of the[EDIT] naivety of their customers.

Edited March 17, 2012 by seanamarts
inappropriate comment!

[pinkfloydianuk]

After a weekend of resting my brain, today i will be adding the finishing touches to our County Court Small Claim (with regards to the Amount we expect to recover). I will be making a post later today to let everyone know how i got on with that.

 

I am also going to write to the FSA, FOS, OFT, Trading Standards and the Information Commisioner.

 

We have recieved some paperwork from Caversham Finance which i'm presuming is supposed to be the payment history information etc, which i requested from them on the 5th March.

 

The information is FALSE and DOES NOT match up with any of the payment records that we have!

 

This company totally disgusts me, however i would like to thank Caversham Finance for supplying me with even more evidence of what they deem to be acceptable.

 

Needless to say a copy of this information will be being forwarded to the Information Commisioner and others accordingly.

 

More to follow...............

Edited March 19, 2012 by pinkfloydianuk

[pinkfloydianuk]

After a weekend of resting my brain, today i will be adding the finishing touches to our County Court Small Claim (with regards to the Amount we expect to recover). I will be making a post later today to let everyone know how i got on with that.

 

I am also going to write to the FSA, FOS, OFT, Trading Standards and the Information Commisioner.

 

We have recieved some paperwork from Caversham Finance which i'm presuming is supposed to be the payment history information etc, which i requested from them on the 5th March.

 

The information is FALSE and DOES NOT match up with any of the payment records that we have!

 

This company totally disgusts me, however i would like to thank Caversham Finance for supplying me with even more evidence of what they deem to be acceptable.

 

Needless to say a copy of this information will be being forwarded to the Information Commisioner and others accordingly.

 

More to follow...............

 

Unfortunately my Daughter has been unwell today so my attention has been on her, I'm at college tomorrow so next opportunity to get back on with this will be Wednesday.

 

Apologies

 

pinkfloydianuk

Edited March 19, 2012 by pinkfloydianuk

[pinkfloydianuk]

well you wont be the first to get them reclaimed and the other one they charge

 

dont forget their interest on them too.

 

dx

 

QUESTION...

You say 'their Interest'.

 

Do you mean the 29.9% APR?

 

If so on what grounds do you suggest i could argue the amount of Interest paid?

 

I've been having a think about it and discussing it with my Girlfriend and we have come to this conclusion.

 

Due to our financial circumstances, we new when we took out the Agreements how much we were going to pay in Interest (with regards to 29.9% APR not the total monies paid on Agreements). We accepted this as something we would have to deal with due to our poor credit.

 

It is not unusual to pay a higher rate of Interest when you have poor credit in my opinion.

 

So, if we understood the APR was 29.9%, we wouldn't be able to testify otherwise. We are honest people and we want to do everything correctly.

 

I'm sure BrightHouse would also be able to argue, the APR is a higher rate to protect the business from customers who fail to settle their Accounts etc.

 

 

 

To all following the thread, I know I've been quiet lately but please don't think I've given up.

 

It all has been a bit mind boggling, from the TV saga back in February, to now filing county court claims. So I have been giving my self a well deserved break from the whole thing.

 

Now I have two weeks off college, I can focus some of my energy's back on this.

 

 

Unfortunately as of the 17th March the County Court Small Claims Application forms/processes have changed slightly. Due to this change and the fact we dated our Application's the 15th March we are going to have to go back to the court on Monday and get a 3 copy's of the new Application Form.

 

A bit of a pain to have to fill in 3 Application forms again but if it has to be done, it has to be done.

 

 

We have done a bit calculating today and we have come up with a figure around £800ish.

 

From the Information we have this is the sum we believe due back to us in OSC and Late Payment Charges.

 

This is on 2 Items, one paid in full and one half way through Agreement. We would like all reading this who have Items from BrightHouse to bare in mind, the more items you have had, the more you should be able to claim back from them.

 

Once we have parused the new County Court Small Claims forms on Monday and filled them in I'll be back to give you all an update.

 

Apologies to all who have been wondering why the thread has not been updated for a couple of weeks.

 

pinkfloydianuk

[ims21]

Hi

 

Responding to PM

 

If I've read this right then the rate of interest on your agreement is 29.9%. When they charge a late payment fee or other charge it is generally added to the account balance and attracts interest at that rate so you end up paying interest on teh charges they have added to the account.

 

If the charges are unlawful then so is the interest they have charged on those charges. So you want that interest back off your account as well.

 

It doesn't necessarily stop there though because they will have made money on those unlawful charges and the interest on them. So they have made money on unlawful items charged to you. This is called "Unjust Enrichment" so if you want to get that back off them as well then you have to increase the rate that you are going to charge in your claim. It is generally referred to as "interest in restitution"

 

Have a read of the interest tutorial link in my signature for more information.

 

ims

[pinkfloydianuk]

Hi

 

Responding to PM

 

If I've read this right then the rate of interest on your agreement is 29.9%. When they charge a late payment fee or other charge it is generally added to the account balance and attracts interest at that rate so you end up paying interest on teh charges they have added to the account.

 

ims

 

 

As far as i aware, this isnt how it works with BrightHouse.

 

 

Using the figures from our TV Agreement i will give an example of how it is worded and my interpretation of this,

 

In the Key Financial Information section it states

 

A - Total amount of credit £1055.48 (this amount is the cash price of the TV)

 

B - APR 29.9%

 

C - Duration of the Agreement 156 weeks

 

D - Total Amount Payable £1519.44, to be paid by 156 Weekly payments of £9.74 commencing on 19-Aug-2008

 

E,F and G are details of the product and the cash price

 

H - Total Charge for Credit (all of which is interest) £463.96

 

I and J are the rate of Annual Interst and cost of Charges

 

 

In the bottom box on the Agreeement it states,

 

The figures set out above do not include the financial details for Optional Service Cover or Damage Liability Cover.

 

Please tick the following box(es) if you wish to apply for

 

K - Optional Service Cover (Weekly payment) £5.25

 

L - Damage Liability Cover (Weekly payment) £N/A

 

The following information is then relevant:

 

M - Total Weekly Payment (the total weekly payments set out in D,K and L) £14.99

 

N - Total Amount Payable (156 payments of £14.99) £2338.44

 

 

So the way i see it is, the Interest is calculated at 29.9% on the Cash price of the Item and is added straight away.

 

As far as i am aware we have never paid 'Interest ' on charges, be it Late Payment or OSC.

 

It is not stated any where in the Agreement, that any other Interest other than the 29.9% APR, calculated on the cash price of the goods would have to be paid.

 

 

Therefore my question regarding APR still stands.

 

 

(AMMENDED)

 

Just after posting this i noticed a little sentence in the Charges section it reads,

 

If you are late in payment then you must pay Interest on the late payment (to the extent that the interest exceeds the late payment charge) at the rate of 4% per annum over the Royal Bank of Scotland base rate - see clause 9(d) of this agreement.

 

Interesting!

 

There is nothing in the OSC section regarding interest.

Edited April 1, 2012 by pinkfloydianuk

[dx100uk]

unless you have the account running statements you cant tell eitherway

 

however i bet they do charge int on it all.

 

SAR time?

 

dx

[ims21]

unless you have the account running statements you cant tell eitherway

 

however i bet they do charge int on it all.

 

SAR time?

 

dx

 

 

I think so too

[pinkfloydianuk]

unless you have the account running statements you cant tell eitherway

 

however i bet they do charge int on it all.

 

SAR time?

 

dx

 

In essence i have already applied for a 'subject access request', on the 5th March i emailed them requesting all Account info quoting the Data Protection Act 1988 Section 7(1).

 

They sent me incomplete account details, not showing Late Payment Charges, OSC or any Interest etc.

 

As i am applying to take them to Small Claims Court i need to specify an amount that i aim to reclaim, these amounts vary from £500 to £1500, £1500 to £3000 and so on.

 

I have been informed by the court that if i make an application and i don't specify an amount i aim to claim back then Caversham Finanace should win the case (doubtfull but i want to cover my back) i would be liable for their legal costs etc.

 

This is not something i want to take a chance on for obvious reasons.

 

So, do i just make an approximation on the figures i have then wait for my day in court and go for the maximum in that range?

 

The thing I am worried about is are BrightHouse withholding the information we have requested because there is even more to this than meets the eye, if they are then who knows how much we have paid over the last 4 and half years.

 

In an ideal world i would like some one to force Caversham Finance to come forward with this info.

 

Infact, one thinks its time to write to the Information Commisioner.

 

I'll be back later with a copy of the draught letter.

[ims21]

Did you pay them the £10 for SAR

 

If not you won't get what you want

[pinkfloydianuk]

This following statement(s) can be found at consumerwiki,

 

'It is becoming clear that the office of the Information Commissioner is becoming snowed under with complaints'.

 

'This means that delays caused by the bank(s) in not complying, are being compounded by delays in follow-up action from the Information Commissioners Office'.

 

I would add that should you be in a position to send an estimate Request for Refund, then there is no reason why you cannot start that process at the same time. If you find later that you should have claimed more - then simply commence a second action against the company when the first one is settled.

 

 

So it would appear that this route may be best first,

 

 

Section 7 – Data Protection Act 1998

 

Dear Sir/Madam

 

Account: xxxxxxxx

 

I am in receipt of the documents that you have supplied in response to my Data Protection Act information request dated 5th March 2012. The disclosure of personal data is incomplete in that at least the following documentsare missing.

 

 

1) You have failed to provide a complete list of transactions and charges.

 

This is not an exhaustive request by any means.

 

Accordingly, I have to tell you that you have not yet complied with your obligations under the Data Protection Act 1998.

You have a further 12days to comply.

 

Yours faithfully,

 

Mr M. XXXXXXX

 

 

 

I'll give them a chance to respond then if they are not forthcoming I shall apply to the County Court for an order to enforce compliance, together with damages at the discretion of the court.

[ims21]

As in my previous post.....did you give them a payment of £10 for an official SAR?

[pinkfloydianuk]

Did you pay them the £10 for SAR

 

If not you won't get what you want

 

Does the £10 fee apply to all company's or just banks?

[ims21]

It applies to any data controller you send a SAR to.

 

Time to do it properly I think