Advice on defence required. *** Balance written off ***

[stew1981]

About two years ago i recieved a letter asking me two pay a debt of roughly £2000 for a littlewoods catologue. I rang them straight away and informed them they must have the wrong person as this was not my debt. To which they apologised and i thought that was the end of it. ( i had dealings with littlewoods some years earlier but didnt remember leaving and debt,) I checked call credit and credit expert just to be sure and nothing showed on either so i left it at that.

 

About 6 weeks ago i recived a letter from wescot solicitors asking me to make payment on this same debt. I checked my credit score again and still nothing showing. So sent them the statue barred/prove it letter.

 

Then on the 1.1.11 i recieved a court claim form. So as i am now in a much better financial situation than i have been in my whole life. And finally seeing the back of the mess i got my self in when i was young (ccj expires next year then i will be debt fee.).

 

I rang wescot and asked why they havent responded to my prove it letter. There answer was that they didnt recive it and the address i sent it to was there solicitors adress. I then asked them to confirm the adress it came from which was a previous address of mine. So i then asked when last payment or contact from myself was to which she replied 17th december 2005. which makes it statue barred next month.

I still did not admit it was my debt to her on the phone.

 

 

I have Filled in the acknowledgement and that i am are defending in full. (i know nothing of the alleged debt).

 

I then sent this letter as advised from money saving expert.

 

 

Re: (Claimant's name) v (Your name) Case No:

CPR 31.14 Request

 

On (date) I received the Claim Form in this case issued by you out of the (Name) county court.

 

I confirm having returned my acknowledgement of service to the court in which I indicate my intention to contest all of your claim.

 

Please treat this letter as my request made under CPR 31.14 for the disclosure and the production of a verified and legible copy of each of the following documents

 

1 the agreement. You will appreciate that in an ordinary case and by reason of the provisions of CPR PD 16 para 7.3, where a claim is based upon a written agreement, a copy of the contract or documents constituting the agreement should be attached to or served with the particulars of claim and the original(s) should be available at the hearing. Further, that any general conditions incorporated in the contract should also be attached.

 

2 the assignment*

 

3 the default notice*

 

4 the termination notice*

 

Although your claim is for a sum which is not more than £5,000.00 and will in all likelihood be allocated to the small claims track for determination upon my delivering a defence, at this moment in time I have not delivered my defence and the case has not been allocated to a track. In consequence the provisions of CPR 27(2) are of no effect and you should not seek to avoid compliance with your CPR 31 duties by claiming otherwise.

 

You should ensure compliance with your CPR 31 duties and ensure that the document(s) I have requested are copied to and received by me within 7 days of receiving this letter. Your CPR 31 duties extend to making a reasonable and proportionate search for the originals of the documents I have requested, the better for you to be able to verify the document's authenticity and to provide me with a legible copy. Further, where I have requested a copy of a document, the original of which is now in the possession of another person, you will have a right to possession of that document if you have mentioned it in your case. You must take immediate steps to recover and preserve it for the purpose of this case.

 

Where I have mentioned a document and there is in your possession more than one version of that same document owing to a modification, obliteration or other marking or feature, each version will be a separate document and you must provide a copy of each version of it to me. Your obligations extend to making a reasonable and proportionate search for any version(s) to include an obligation to recover and preserve such version(s) which are now in the possession of a third party.

 

In accordance with CPR 31.14, I undertake to be responsible for your reasonable copying costs incurred in complying with this CPR 31.14 request.

 

If you require more time in which to comply with this request you must tell me in writing. You must tell me before the time for compliance with this request has expired. In telling me you require more time you must tell me what steps you have taken and propose to take in order to comply with this request and also state a date by when you will comply with this request. In addition your statement must be accompanied with a statement that you agree to an extension of the time for me to file my defence. Your extension of time must be not less than 14 days from the date when you say you will have complied with my request and you must state the new date for filing my defence.

 

If you are unable to comply with this request and believe that you will never be able to comply with this request you must tell me in writing.

 

Please note that if you should fail to comply with this request, fail to request more time or fail to agree to an extension of time for the filing of my defence, I will make an application to the court for an order that the proceedings be struck out or stayed for non-compliance and a summary costs order.

 

I do hope this will not be necessary and look forward to hearing from you.

 

Yours faithfully

 

This was sent about 10 days ago and still no reply.

 

My defence has to be in by Monday 5.12.11 and i have no idea where to start. Any help would be very appreciated.

 

Thanks in advance

[Guest]

i think the statute bar clock stops on issue of a claim?

as your time is practically up, then maybe submit a holding type defence in time. unless you can arrange an extension to the defence deadline over the phone on monday in time (by fax/email - would need them to confirm an agreed extension date in writing (up to 28 days, (but give them a lesser deadline in which to send the docs so as to allow time for you to assess the docs), and then for you to send their agreed extension to the court)?

[stew1981]

Yes the statue barred clock has stopped now, but they failed to respond producing documents requested. how does a holding type defence work?

[Guest]

basically saying that you're unable to plead either way etc, they have failed to comply with your reasonable request under cpr 31.14. there are eg's around cag. can you type up their particulars of claim? perhaps pm andyorch to ask for his input?

Edited December 3, 2011 by Ford

[stew1981]

The claim is 2000.16 being monies owing to the claimant in respect of goods provided by littlewoods to the defendant under account number .......... The agreement was terminated due to the defendant failed to maintain the agreed terms. In accordance with the pre-action protocols the claimant has attempted to contact the defendant and agree a repayment plan.The defendant has failed to respond or maintain a suitable arrangement. Littlewoods has sold and assigned all rights, title and interest,under this agreement to wescot SPV limited.

 

And the Claimant claims interest pursuant to section 69 of the county court act 1984 at the rate of 8% per annum from 20/02/2009 to 27/10/2011 totalling 503.13 and thereafter a daily rate of 0.48 to date of judgement or sooner.

Edited December 3, 2011 by stew1981

[Guest]

stew

delete your account number! and round up the claim amount (just in case they look in)

[stew1981]

Thanks didnt realise i put that.

 

Cheers

[AndyOrch]

Hi Stew responding to Fords PM.

 

Is the account number yours Stew? Im sure i would remember if I had racked up 2K with littlewoods and not paid them.

 

Regards

 

Andy

[stew1981]

Hi Andy

 

I do not remember the account and agree with you if it was my account surely i would remember. Wescott refused to give me any proof of account, But when i originally told them they had the wrong person in 2009 they said ok on the phone and left it at that till about two months ago. Very strange if you ask me.

 

Cheers

 

Stew

[AndyOrch]

Well a simple defence of " I have not got a clue what debt they are on about and they will have to disclose all the paperwork to prove it " is the order of the day.

 

 

o I, ********** of ************** make this statement as my defence to the claim brought by **************

o The claimants particulars of claim are vague and fail to disclose any cause of action, they appear to be an abuse of the process in that they fail to deal with the basic rules of pleading in accordance with the CPR even allowing for the constraints of the bulk issue system

o No documents supporting the claims in the particulars have been offeredand despite a CPR31.14 request to the claimant for further information none has been forth coming and as a result I cannot plead in defence to the claim

o The claimant pleads that the claim is brought under a regulated creditagreement regulated by the Consumer Credit Act 1974, yet the claimant claims statutory interest which the claimants hould surely know it is not entitled to by virtue of the County Courts(Interest on Judgment Debts) Order 1991 (No. 1184 (L. 12)) in particular section 2 (3) which expressly prohibits such an award.

o The defendant contends that this claim amounts to a clear abuse of the process as the claimant would know the law and is trying to bring a claim for monies which it is not entitled to and knows that this is the case

o Without clarification of the claimants claim, the defendant is extremely disadvantaged and the claimants claim appears without merit

o Further to that above 6 paragraphs, the defendant is unable to plead effectively or at all. The defendant is embarrassed.

 

Edit to suit

 

Regards

Andy

Edited December 3, 2011 by Andyorch

[stew1981]

Thank you very much for your help Andy.

 

Kind Regards

 

Stew

[AndyOrch]

Thank you very much for your help Andy.

 

Kind Regards

 

Stew

 

No problem Stew hope it does the trick for you.

 

Andy

[stew1981]

I have also today discussed this with a family member who is a barrister, And she agrees with what you have said. Would have spoken to her sooner but she so busy. Its finally feeling better. My head no longer feels like its going to explode!!

 

Thanks again for your help.

 

You guys restore my faith in humanity. You should be proud of yourself.

 

Cheers

[AndyOrch]

[hatesdebt]

I have also today discussed this with a family member who is a barrister, And she agrees with what you have said. Would have spoken to her sooner but she so busy. Its finally feeling better. My head no longer feels like its going to explode!!

 

Thanks again for your help.

 

You guys restore my faith in humanity. You should be proud of yourself.

 

Cheers

 

Agreed.......

[Guest]

.....The claimant pleads that the claim is brought under a regulated creditagreement regulated by the Consumer Credit Act 1974, yet the claimant claims statutory interest which the claimants hould surely know it is not entitled to by virtue of the County Courts(Interest on Judgment Debts) Order 1991 (No. 1184 (L. 12)) in particular section 2 (3) which expressly prohibits such an awardRegards

Andy

 

just to say re statutory interest. s69 statutory interest (ie up to judgment) is generally claimable. subject to s69(4) and the claim being properly pleaded and 'reasonable' (would be for the J to decide in the circumstances on representation, but up to a years worth would generally be regarded as reasonable)). the Cty Ct Int on Judgment Order relates to post judgment statutory interest only (s74) (not allowed re a cca regulated debt).

worth a try though!

Edited December 6, 2011 by Ford

[stew1981]

TODAY I`VE RECEIVED THIS LETTER

 

Dear Sirs

 

We acknowledge safe receipt of your letter dated 17th November 2011 requesting further documents in accordance with CRP.31.14

 

CPR 31.1 (2) states:-

 

This part applies to all claims except a claim on the small claims track.

 

And it further confirms in CPR 27 (2) (b) that part 31 does not apply to small claims.

 

We accept that as at todays date this matter has not as yet been allocated to the small claims track,however,in our opinion and having considered CPR 27 it is clear that upon your defence being submitted that this matter will be allocated to the small claims track,indeed it seems to us that the small claims track is there to deal with these kinds of cases. You may disagree and the court has discretion in respect of the track allocation, but based on the financial value alone it is difficult to envisage anything other than allocation to small claims track.

 

The overriding objectives as set in CRP1.1 (1) list s a number of rules that we always seek to follow, with this in mind, I can confirm that in accordance with your request we have approached the original lender and requested all available documentation.

 

However, having particular regard to CRP1.1 (1) we will confirm at this early stage that all the information you have requested will not be forthcoming and you should therefore take the necessary action that you believe is appropriate you may also wish to take independent legal advice from a solicitor or approach the citizens advice bureau who should be able to assist you free of charge.

 

it is our opinion that all the information you have requested will not be necessary to prove our case. A court will consider the facts and evidence and make a fair and reasonable judgement, which in our opinion will be that the funds claimed are due and owing. Again, you may disagree, and it isn't really our place to second guess a decision that will be made by the trial judge following the appropriate submissions of evidence by both parties.

 

We hope we have set out our position clearly and fairly and would once again encourage you to take out independent advice.

 

Should you have further queries, please do not hesitate to contact our offices.

 

We confirm our file has been placed on hold for a period of 14 days.

[Guest]

stew

did you submit a defence, or get an extension, in time?

[stew1981]

TODAY I`VE RECEIVED THIS LETTER

 

Dear Sirs

 

We acknowledge safe receipt of your letter dated 17th November 2011 requesting further documents in accordance with CRP.31.14

 

CPR 31.1 (2) states:-

 

This part applies to all claims except a claim on the small claims track.

 

And it further confirms in CPR 27 (2) (b) that part 31 does not apply to small claims.

 

We accept that as at todays date this matter has not as yet been allocated to the small claims track,however,in our opinion and having considered CPR 27 it is clear that upon your defence being submitted that this matter will be allocated to the small claims track,indeed it seems to us that the small claims track is there to deal with these kinds of cases. You may disagree and the court has discretion in respect of the track allocation, but based on the financial value alone it is difficult to envisage anything other than allocation to small claims track.

 

The overriding objectives as set in CRP1.1 (1) list s a number of rules that we always seek to follow, with this in mind, I can confirm that in accordance with your request we have approached the original lender and requested all available documentation.

 

However, having particular regard to CRP1.1 (1) we will confirm at this early stage that all the information you have requested will not be forthcoming and you should therefore take the necessary action that you believe is appropriate you may also wish to take independent legal advice from a solicitor or approach the citizens advice bureau who should be able to assist you free of charge.

 

it is our opinion that all the information you have requested will not be necessary to prove our case. A court will consider the facts and evidence and make a fair and reasonable judgement, which in our opinion will be that the funds claimed are due and owing. Again, you may disagree, and it isn't really our place to second guess a decision that will be made by the trial judge following the appropriate submissions of evidence by both parties.

 

We hope we have set out our position clearly and fairly and would once again encourage you to take out independent advice.

 

Should you have further queries, please do not hesitate to contact our offices.

 

We confirm our file has been placed on hold for a period of 14 days.

[stew1981]

Yes i submitted my defence ontime.

[Guest]

as you have submitted defence before, not much to do atm re their letter as court may make an appropriate order in the circumstances. wait for that. (also, they have said that there is no documentation!)

Edited December 6, 2011 by Ford

[stew1981]

Is there a time limit for the court to respond?

 

Cheers

[Guest]

no specific time limit afaik.

claimant will be notified of your defence. they then have 28 days to respond to court whether to continue or not. if no response, it will be stayed.

but, court may in the meantime make any appropriate order following your defence.

Edited December 6, 2011 by Ford

[Guest]

ps

could consider writing to them reminding them that you have no idea what their claim relates to and they have failed to comply with your legitimate cpr request for the relevant documentation as mentioned and that without any documentation (as they confirm) then there can be no enforcement, and invite them to discontinue? see what andyorrch suggests? who are the acting solicitors?

[AndyOrch]

TODAY I`VE RECEIVED THIS LETTER

 

Dear Sirs

 

We acknowledge safe receipt of your letter dated 17th November 2011 requesting further documents in accordance with CRP.31.14 Excellent

 

CPR 31.1 (2) states:-

 

This part applies to all claims except a claim on the small claims track. Yes correct but not allocated as yet

 

And it further confirms in CPR 27 (2) (b) that part 31 does not apply to small claims. Actually 27.2 1 but lets not be pedantic

 

We accept that as at todays date this matter has not as yet been allocated to the small claims track,however,in our opinion and having considered CPR 27 it is clear that upon your defence being submitted that this matter will be allocated to the small claims track,indeed it seems to us that the small claims track is there to deal with these kinds of cases. You may disagree and the court has discretion in respect of the track allocation, but based on the financial value alone it is difficult to envisage anything other than allocation to small claims track. mmm yes agree

 

The overriding objectives as set in CRP1.1 (1) list s a number of rules that we always seek to follow, with this in mind, I can confirm that in accordance with your request we have approached the original lender and requested all available documentation. Excellent looking good then

 

However, having particular regard to CRP1.1 (1) we will confirm at this early stage that all the information you have requested will not be forthcoming ??? Hold on what happened to the overriding objective above??? and you should therefore take the necessary action that you believe is appropriate you may also wish to take independent legal advice from a solicitor or approach the citizens advice bureau who should be able to assist you free of charge.

 

But what about this part of the CPR you have failed to list:-

Court’s power to grant a final remedy

 

27.3

 

The court may grant any final remedy in relation to a small claim which it could grant if the proceedings were on the fast track or the multi-track.

 

 

 

it is our opinion that all the information you have requested will not be necessary to prove our case.Really how does that work then? A court will consider the facts and evidence and make a fair and reasonable judgement, which in our opinion will be that the funds claimed are due and owing.With no paperwork ? Again, you may disagree, totally and it isn't really our place to second guess a decision that will be made by the trial judge following the appropriate submissions of evidence by both parties. You have not got any or just don't want to disclose it?

 

We hope we have set out our position clearly and fairly and would once again encourage you to take out independent advice.

 

Should you have further queries, please do not hesitate to contact our offices.

 

We confirm our file has been placed on hold for a period of 14 days.

Its 28 actually if you fail to respond.

 

 

See how they respond to this then Stew.

 

Preliminary request for further information

 

Before making an application to the court for an order under part 18, you need to write to the Claimant asking for the relevant information or clarification.

The request should be concise and confine itself to what is necessary to enable you to understand the Claim and state a date by which a response is required. If the request is brief apply by letter: otherwise attach a separate document.

 

The request, in whatever format, must

• be headed with the name of the court and the title and number of the claim
  
• state in its heading that it is a request made under Part 18, identify the claimant and state the date on which it is made
  
• set out in a separate numbered paragraph each specific query
  
• identify the document clearly where the query relates to a document
  
• state the date by which you expect a response
  
• allow the Claimant a reasonable time (at least 14 days) in which to respond.
  

Claimants response

 

The Claimants reply must be in writing, and be signed and dated by the Claimant or his legal representative. It must be in the same format as the request, identify itself as a response to the request and answer all the points raised. The Claimant should verify the response with a statement of truth.

The defendant should file a copy of the response together with the original request with the court.

If the Claimants objects to complying with the request or any part of it, or is unable to do so within the time stated in the request, they must inform the Defendant within that time.

 

 

Regards

Andy