marbles card/Restons court claim form - help new to this!!!

[AndyOrch]

JFK

 

On the T&Cs that they have supplied what does it state with regards to defaulting and interest applied until judgment?

 

Regards

 

Andy

[caro]

Don't admit to the full amount if you don't believe you owe it. I'm not the best person to advise you on this but I'm sure others will help you

[jfk_8]

hi andy , I cant see anything that states interest until judgement and to be honest the document is pretty illegible , where they state "charges " the line below it looks like it has had a different piece of paper overlayed over it as appendix 1 is not visible , i can just make out that it says " card or cheques and all interest , fees charges and costs refered to in this agreement and then it goes onto appendix ii) our costs of enforcing our rights or remedies under this agreement including tracing costs , collection agency costs and legal costs incurred .

[jfk_8]

hi again , i believe i owe the amount specified at default less the charges that i got back and the payments i have made since defaulting on the original amount before pestons got involved

[AndyOrch]

Ok

 

Before you decide how to plea and complete, you need to make sure that they can charge interest and that if so they have charged the correct amount.

Forget verbal agreements and interest freezes, verbal stands for nothing and any DJ will consider the T&Cs at the time of the agreement.

Most agreements when defaulted are subject to some breakdown and in a lot of cases the creditor will freeze interest as a gesture of goodwill.

Even better if you have it in writing.

As you have stated the T&Cs are incorrect and not from the time the agreement was signed and as such until time the Claimant can disclose the correct T&Cs

and prove what they state in their P.o.C to be fact and applied then I would be either defending the matter whole or at the least disagreeing with the amount.

I assume you have a copy of the CCA, is there any reference on that to default and pre judgment interest within the key financial details?

 

Due to amendments to the CCA1974 (CCA2006) introduced Oct 2008 all creditors must comply by issuing aa Notice of Arrears (frequently) failure to

notify or issue this results in the Creditor not being able to enforce any agreement whilst in default of this duty or add interest.

 

£2K is £2K you need to be sure before you agree to any payment that you do lawfully owe it and if they cant prove you do then you have to disagree or defend.

 

Regards

 

Andy

[jfk_8]

Hi Andy , cant see any reference to default or pre judgement interest with key financials . there is a section in the T and C s .. point 8 variations that states the following (we may at our discretion change any of the terms of this agreement , including interest rate(s)( and the apr ) ( either generally or on specific promotions )the repayment date , the statement date .default charges , fees and other charges or introduce new terms . where any change id to your benefit we will give you notice of at least 7 days written notice of the change .

 

 

I have just checked the date of the terms and conditions supplied and they are dated june 2006 , the card was taken out in november 2000

 

I need to respond to the court by tomorrow night latest as the 14 days plus 5 expires on monday the 18th

 

I cant find anything that says they can add the interest unless i am totally missing something , so perhaps the best thing to do is either contest the amount they are claiming or accept with more time required to pay

 

thanks

 

Jfk

[AndyOrch]

Assuming this is a Northampton Claim (CCBC) you will have until Mon 4.00pm to submit your plea and acknowledgment.

Putting the incorrect T&Cs to one side for the moment and just to reiterate my last post:-

 

Failure to give notice of sums in arrears

 

The Consumer Credit Act and its amendments affect all those who use credit to buy goods and or services, for example, on hire-purchase agreements or using a store credit card. The Act governs the licensing of, and other controls, on traders who supply credit, or goods and services on credit. It is therefore a valuable tool to have knowledge of how it works at your fingertips.

 

This article explains a recent change to Consumer Credit law – the CCA 2006. Specifically, it explains what a creditor may do if the debtor breaches the agreement.

 

Arrears notice penalty:

Of course when a trader provides credit, the debtor may default, perhaps knowingly, perhaps unknowingly. Either way, the creditor is under a duty to provide the debtor with a notice stating that they are in arrears and owe ‘x’ amount of money.

 

A new amendment has been made in case of failure to give notice of sums in arrears in CCA 1974. Section 11 CCA 2006 inserts a new section - 86D - that sets out the consequences for a creditor or owner if he fails to give a notice as required by sections 86B or 86C.

 

If the creditor or owner fails to provide a notice of sums in arrears when required to do so, then during the period of his failure to provide the notice (i.e. from the date that it was required to be given until the end of the day on which it is eventually provided), he is not entitled to enforce the agreement. In addition,

 

The debtor or hirer is not liable to pay any interest that relates to the period of the creditor or owner’s failure,

 

Notice of default sums

Section 12 of CCA 2006 applies to situations where a debtor or hirer under a regulated agreement incurs a default sum.

 

A creditor or owner must give the debtor or hirer a notice in the specified form when a default sum becomes payable as a consequence of a breach of the agreement. For example, you hire a car for the duration of your holiday. There will often be a penalty sum payable if you incur a fine from using the car. The car-hire company might say this is to cover, for example, administration charges. Either way, certain sums are payable if you breach the agreement. Where this applies, the creditor must provide notice to the debtor, of the amount they must pay. This only applies where the default sum exceeds a specified amount.

 

Additionally, a creditor may only require a debtor to pay interest (in connection with a default sum) 28 days after the day the notice was given to the debtor. So if the creditor fails to give notice to the debtor then he can not enforce the agreement until notice is given.

 

Default sum

The term ‘default sum’ has been redefined in s.18 CCA 2006. “Default sum” now means: a sum payable by a debtor or hirer in connection with his breach of a regulated agreement (e.g. a charge imposed for late payment of an instalment due under the agreement or a fee imposed for exceeding a credit limit on a credit card). A default sum does not include sums that, as a consequence of a breach of the agreement, become payable earlier than they otherwise would have done. Nor does it include interest.

 

Interest on default sums

Section 13 has been amended so that a creditor or owner may only require simple interest to be paid in respect of default sums payable by the debtor or hirer. This includes sums payable under non-commercial or small agreements.

 

Minimum 14 days after Default notices

The new minimum period after which a creditor or owner may take action (in respect of the agreement after having issued a default notice) is now 14 days. It used to be only 7 days. Section 14 CCA 2006 amends section 88 of the 1974 Act to create this extension.

Additionally, under s87, a creditor or owner must give the debtor or hirer a default notice in the prescribed form if he wishes to:

• Terminate the agreement;
  
• Demand earlier payment of a sum;
  
• Recover possession of any goods or land;
  
• Treat any right conferred on the debtor or hirer by the agreement as terminated, restricted or deferred; or to;
  
• Enforce any security.
  

Section 88 is also amended to allow the Secretary of State to prescribe information in the default notice to include any matters relating to the agreement (e.g. information about whether the agreement includes a term providing for the charging of post-judgment interest).

 

 

Something to consider.

 

Regards

 

Andy

[jfk_8]

Hi Andy , The last letter I recieved from restons was on may 5th and was entitled first and final demand for enstalment arrears , paymet must reach them no later than 12th may 2011 , to avoid legal action or enforcement proceedings commencing for the entire balance , cheques must be sent within the next 2 days to allow for clearance . you must now bring your account upto date immediately , please make all future payments in accordance with your installment arrangement , no further warning will be given .

 

any future breach of this agreement will result in legal /enforcement action .

yours faithfully blah blah blah

perhaps I should ask them for a signed copy of the installment agreement ?

 

not actually sure that they have sent me a default letter as stated the letter above was the last one recieved .

 

Please advise what you think I should do next bearing in mind i have to submit to the court by monday 4pm

 

cheers

Jfk

[AndyOrch]

Hi JFK

 

A Default Notice is one document a Notice of Arrears is another, completely different.

Jf if you want me to be brutally honest you seem fixated on the deadline date and what to plead,and yet doing little preparation. Caro as stated I have stated if you dont agree with the summons amount ( and I have give you enough pointers to research as to how it may /could be wrong) then you must defend (all of it)..There is only one option

on a summons response to give a slither of hope of avoiding a CCJ = Defend all. Part admittance gets you a CCJ, yes you can try to argue why the amount is wrong but you will get a CCJ for the correct amount.When you defend all you lengthen the process and gives you opportunity to mediate/bargain with the claimant.

True you could still lose and still get a CCJ but you will have had opportunity to air you disagreement and who knows they may even throw the towel in along the way.

 

Its your choice in the end and we are not here to persuade you either way but if I overcharged you for a car by £2K would you ask me for more to pay it???

A summons is no different, forget all the legalities and think clearly then you will make your decision.

 

Regards

 

Andy

[jfk_8]

Hi Again , I just looked at the interest they are proposing adding to the balance and it is not correct ,they are overcharging by nearly £200 , I have also found a letter from previous correspondence with pestons when Iasked them to supply original agreement and terms and conditions , they stated please find enclosed 1. executed credit agreement , 2.latest applicable terms and conditions 3.signed statement of account .

 

I have also sent the acknowledgement of service after reading other posts on here if I just pleaded that I dont agree with the charges then I would get a ccj anyway so I intend to defend so that I can at least say that the interest is wrong and that the original terms were not supplied and also that the document I signed was a priority application the copy of which they supplied is illegible , should they not after the priority application has been sent back to them supply you with a proper credit agreement to be signed and returned and titled credit card agreement ?

 

I am probably clutching at straws here but at least I get to put the above to the judge

 

thanks

 

Jfk

 

Is it right that they can supply the latest terms and conditions rather than the ones applicable at thetime of application ?

[AndyOrch]

Good to here you defending all JFK, with regards to your last point, they simply state that the current T&Cs supersede the previous.

But you will be arguing the original T&Cs at the the time the agreement was signed and what you had agreed to.

 

Regards

 

Andy

[jfk_8]

Thanks Andy , Yes exactly how do I know that the terms and conditions at the time I applied were not different from the current ones , also shoud they not send you new terms at the point they issue new ones , I dont believe I have ever recieved any new terms and conditions from them

 

Jfk

[AndyOrch]

From the OCs yes from these lot mmmmmm lucky if you get a statement for your payments.One way to check is the date of your agreement and there is usually a print date on the T&Cs booklet also check over limit fee late fees if they are over £25 they are old ones if £12 they are new ones since their run in with the OFT.

[jfk_8]

hi andy , when I did a SAR , I pretty much got a whole ream full of papers from them which had statements ,late payments and overlimit fees on them , I claimed all these back already as you can see at the beginning of this post on the POC that pestons sent to the court .

 

the card was taken out in 2000 and the T and Cs supplied were 2006 , it wouls be interesting to know if they have issued T and Cs after 2006 ... does anyone have a copy ?

 

Jfk

[AndyOrch]

No didnt mean with regards to reclaiming but to identify the correct year of the T&Cs then you can establish the interest conditions.

[jfk_8]

Andy I have just took another look at the T and C,s that pestons have supplied , there is a front page that appears to have a date on of Feb 2001 on this one and only page supplied there is a section called "Charges for services " it goes on to say we will charge you £20 for an unpaid credit or direct debit , a collection admin fee of £20 when the account is one or more payments overdue ,

£20 if your account is over limit and £25 if they have to serve a default notice .they also supplied a set of terms which appear to be from october 2008 which has no menntion of "Charges for services " just a section called "charges " and they dont mention any values like in the old terms from feb 2001

 

as the card was taken out in Nov 2000 both sets of terms thay have supplied are not the ones at the time of application .

 

This is turning into a can of worms

 

Jfk

[caro]

They need to prove that they are claiming the correct amount. If you can prove it's wrong, then the POC are wrong and (in theory) they should lose. The more arguments that you can make in your defence the better, but there are no guarantees of what might or might not happen in court. You must prepare thoroughly.

 

That said, don't try and over-complicate your defence. Put it in your own words and make sure that you understand what you put because you may well be asked questions and the opposition will try and trip you up, so don't give them any ammunition to use against you.

[jfk_8]

I have been over the interest they are claiming 4 times and I still get the same answer for it between the two dates they have said on the POC . perhaps someone else could check it and confirm ?

[AndyOrch]

JFK forget their interest applied figure, whats on the Default Notice how much have you paid since the default?

How much did these numpties ask you for in their very first letter threatening litigation?

[tosh1]

subbing