rossendales/Council tax pain in the rear ***WON***

[hallowitch]

send him £24.50 1st visit fee tell him that under The council tax (administration and enforcement ) regulations 1992(amended )

regulation 45 charges connected with distress this is all you are legally entitled to pay

However if they want more fees to send you a screenshot of your account

after you have received this and depending on what it contains will depend on what further action you will take regarding the remainder of the fees they are trying to collect

you may have to pay a 2nd visit fee of £18

[hallowitch]

thanks for that.. I asked him for prof of visits to be sent to me and he declined saying he was under no obligation to do so.. So first off i get a visit but was not in, i pay c/tax in full then get a letter demanding £42.50.. As far as i see from letters no levy has been made just letter from bailiff saying i came round to.. second letter says same but with chasing 42.50 but increased to 177 now..

 

SO.. he is only entitled to 24.50 for 1 visit.. after which i paid c/tax.. Confused now as goalposts have been moved

 

 

If you pay a bailiff the bailiff take there charges first then they pay the council this way the bailiff makes sure he gets paid

 

if you pay the council

 

some councils add the bailiff fees on to the debt so when you pay the amount on the liability order then the council take of the bailiff fees you still owe some of the liability order

so it depends on the council if your debt to the council had a nil balance before the 2nd bailiff visit you owe him £24,50

 

bailiffs cant levy distress for there fees

Do as PT suggested and find out from the council the amount of the liability order and if the balance of the debt is Nil with the payment you made

[hallowitch]

it really depends on the council whether they pay the bailiffs or not

 

HomeYour accountOnline balances

Balance Outstanding: £0.00

 

All Account balances were last updated on: 18/02/2010 at 13:17 pm.

 

any bailiff visits before this date will have to be paid which can only be visit fees as there is no levy

[hallowitch]

the choice is yours

 

if it was me i would pay the £24.50 1st visit fee as the debt was paid before the 2nd visit

[hallowitch]

Feb 17 2010 Attendance/Van 110.00 110.00

Feb 17 2010 Levy fee 24.50 24.50

 

what did the bailiff levy

did he leave you a notice of seizure of goods and inventory

 

the bailiff has only levied on his fees that why your levy fee is only £24.50

bailiffs cant charge a van fee and a levy fee the same day

 

In my opinion the bailiff is allowed to levy for his fees others may disagree so you will have to make your own mind

 

I'm not saying that the bailiff has a valid levy it doesn't look as if he has

 

send them an e-mail and ask what goods were levied and why there was no notice of seizure of goods and inventory left at the time the alleged levy

the name of the baillif that caried out the levy what court he was certificated at on what date

The Council Tax (Administration and Enforcement) Regulations 1992

Distress

45.—(1) Where a liability order has been made, the authority which applied for the order may levy the appropriate amount by distress and sale of the goods of the debtor against whom the order was made.

 

 

(2) The appropriate amount for the purposes of paragraph (1) is the aggregate of—

• (a) an amount equal to any outstanding sum which is or forms part of the amount in respect of which the liability order was made, and
  

• (b) a sum determined in accordance with Schedule 5 in respect of charges connected with the distress.
  

(3) If, before any goods are seized, the appropriate amount (including charges arising up to the time of the payment or tender) is paid or tendered to the authority, the authority shall accept the amount and the levy shall not be proceeded with.

 

(4) Where an authority has seized goods of the debtor in pursuance of the distress, but before sale of those goods the appropriate amount (including charges arising up to the time of the payment or tender) is paid or tendered to the authority, the authority shall accept the amount, the sale shall not be proceeded with and the goods shall be made available for collection by the debtor.

 

(5) The person levying distress on behalf of an authority shall carry with him the written authorisation of the authority, which he shall show to the debtor if so requested; and he shall hand to the debtor or leave at the premises where the distress is levied a copy of this regulation and Schedule 5 and a memorandum setting out the appropriate amount, and shall hand to the debtor a copy of any close or walking possession agreement entered into.

[hallowitch]

usually when they cant get in the house they levy a car or things in the garden but they must leave a notice of seizure of goods and inventory at the time of the levy

 

 

send them an e-mail and ask what goods were levied and why there was no notice of seizure of goods and inventory left at the time the alleged levy

 

when you send the e-mail remind them they are legally bound by the

The Council Tax (Administration and Enforcement) Regulations 1992 Regulation 45 SCHEDULE 5

(5) The person levying distress on behalf of an authority shall carry with him the written authorisation of the authority, which he shall show to the debtor if so requested; and he shall hand to the debtor or leave at the premises where the distress is levied a copy of this regulation and Schedule 5 and a memorandum setting out the appropriate amount, and shall hand to the debtor a copy of any close or walking possession agreement entered into

[hallowitch]

Ok will do.. Would it be worth my while to send them £10 for a SAR ?

 

 

personally i don't think so it would be a waste of £10

 

they know they have no levy and i cant see them taking it any further after you question the levy

 

Ask for a copy of there complaints procedure in your e-mail

 

and put at the bottom of it

A copy of this e-mail will be sent to xxx council to be held on file and will be used should it be if necessary to take this matter further

[hallowitch]

post 151 has a copy of notice of seizure and you haven't got one

send the e-mail and see what comes back

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/bailiffs-sheriff-officers/241840-bailliff-seized-company-car-8.html#post2706407

[hallowitch]

Will this suffice ?

 

After receiving your reply to my request for a charges breakdown and screenshot of my account,

The breakdown of charges includes a levy fee there was no notice of seizure of goods and inventory left at the time of the alleged levy. this must be left at the time of the levy

For your convenience i have copied the relevant part of the regulations

The Council Tax (Administration and Enforcement) Regulations 1992 Regulation 45 SCHEDULE 5

5) The person levying distress on behalf of an authority shall carry with him the written authorisation of the authority, which he shall show to the debtor if so requested; and he shall hand to the debtor or leave at the premises where the distress is levied a copy of this regulation and Schedule 5 and a memorandum setting out the appropriate amount, and shall hand to the debtor a copy of any close or walking possession agreement entered into.

 

I therefore require a copy of this or at the very least a list of goods levied

I now also require the name of the bailiff that carried out the levy and what court he was certificated at on what date.

 

I also ask for a copy of your complaints procedure as

I note from your records I have paid for 2 visits when in fact the Liability order was paid 'In Full' after the first visit and before the second and I am awaiting a refund for £18 due to myself for your mis-handling of this case along with an offer of compensation for my "Distress".

 

A copy of this e-mail will be sent to XXXXX Borough Council to be held on file and will be used should it be if necessary to take this matter further.

 

Eggy12[/quote

 

 

that makes it a bit shorter but leave in the relevant part of the regulations

[hallowitch]

In my opinion the bailiff is allowed to levy for his fees others may disagree so you will have to make your own mind

this statement of mine has been bugging me cant believe i wrote it must be needing a holiday (eggy12 please accept my apologies for my mistake )

 

the bailiff was entitled to his first visit fee but he cant levy goods against it as they can only levy against the amount of the liability order outstanding at the time of the levy

 

it wont make a difference to the outcome of this post as you owe the bailiff nothing thats why he has been on the phone to you asking if we can sort this out

[hallowitch]

Not a prob HW.. We all have bad days Bailiff's was yesterday pmsl

 

17th February 2010, 20:32 #3 (permalink)

hallowitch

Classic Account Holder

 

send him £24.50 1st visit fee tell him that under The council tax (administration and enforcement ) regulations 1992(amended )

regulation 45 charges connected with distress this is all you are legally entitled to pay

However if they want more fees to send you a screenshot of your account

after you have received this and depending on what it contains will depend on what further action you will take regarding the remainder of the fees they are trying to collect

you may have to pay a 2nd visit fee of £18

 

 

 

I listened to you .. Thanks for your help and have a beer/wine on me

 

Eggy12

 

 

I'm glad you found that post

 

I read the whole thread loads of times and it was bugging me i new it was wrong but i couldn't figure out why it was wrong

 

then it dawned on me they can only levy on the amount of the liability order

 

must be the vodi and irn-bru

[hallowitch]

LOL Just had a call from bailiff and left message on phone, lost count of the times he said "we just want to resolve this matter" and his now... Going to reduce the bill to £84 as a gesture of good will !!!! How nice of him, and could i ring him back to make a payment to resolve this matter..

 

I will ring back when ive got the info i requested thanks

 

[hallowitch]

you may want to ask the council why the bailiff didn't levy the car on his first visit as the car was on your drive at the time

after all thats why the bailiffs is there to levy distress

 

 

A For making a visit to premises with a view to

Levying distress (where no levy is made) -

 

 

http://www.herefordshire.gov.uk/docs/Enforcement_Agent_Charges.pdf

[hallowitch]

the point I'm making is when the bailiff came to your house Oct 20 2009

he was there to levy distress or collect payment

 

as your car was on the drive at the time of this visit he should have levied it then

if he had levied on the 1st visit there would have no reason for the second visit and the only fees he would have been able to charge would have been the levy fee and walking possession fee (cant charge visit fee WPA fee levy fee on same visit)

 

there are only 2 reasons why the bailiff didn't levy on the first visit

 

1 to gain more fees

2 he new the car had no value at auction

 

 

because he didn't levy on the 1st visit he expected to come back at a later date to gain a 2nd visit fee and levy fee

Edited March 11, 2010 by hallowitch

[hallowitch]

hopefully a cheque for £18 on its way to you shortly

[hallowitch]

I said why did they do a van visit and levy charge the same day she said they are allowed to !!

OH no they are NOT is she going to send you this in writing

[hallowitch]

Oct 20 2009 Visit 1 24.50 0.00

Oct 26 2009 Visit 2 18.00 0.00

 

do you have a copy of these letters

 

can you remember how much the bailiffs wanted from you on his first visit

[hallowitch]

http://www.herefordshire.gov.uk/docs/Enforcement_Agent_Charges.pdf

 

C For one attendance with a vehicle with a view to the removal of goods Reasonable costs and fees incurred.

(where, following the levy, goods are not removed):

 

[hallowitch]

eggy 12 having a good read of your thread before i add my 2 pence worth

 

this letter clearly states thats the council have given there permission to proceed for costs of £42.50

 

 

the levy post 59 (i know it was backdated thats not the point at the moment )

so in effect regardless of the date of the levy the bailiff has levied goods against there costs only

 

councils don't make the rules legislation does

 

http://i259.photobucket.com/albums/hh289/eggytwelve/scan0001-1.jpg

[hallowitch]

no what I'm saying is that there are no fees to pay as the bailiff levied goods for there fees

 

we must inform you that we have now received instructions from xxx council to proceed for outstanding costs only (confirms they are looking for costs)

 

please forward £42.50 within the next 7 days to enable us to close our file failing which we will have no alternative to but to proceed with the execution of the liability order

 

the bailiff cant levy for there fees and the council cant give them permission to do this as we know fee are set by legislation

 

they cant proceed with the execution of the liability order by the time this letter was sent out there was no liability order the liability order had been paid

[hallowitch]

OK I see what your saying HW thanks..

 

Oct 20 Visit 1 charged 24.50

Oct 23 Paid liability order in full so no liability order now exists

Oct 26 Visit 2 chaged £18.00 I CAN CLAIM BACK

Feb 17th Attendance fee/Van £110 CANNOT CHARGE

Feb 17th Levy Fee £24.50 CANNOT CHARGE as not allowed to levy for own fees

 

yes you got it

 

 

do you still have a copy of the notice of seizure

 

you know if you pay something and receive a hand written receipt there a number on it e g 1 through to 100 so that each receipt runs concurrent does your notice of seizure have a number like this (I'm having a thought here )

[hallowitch]

Ive never had a notice of seizure only the notice of distress

 

POST 59

 

 

Envolope

http://i259.photobucket.com/albums/h...e/scan0001.jpg

 

Walking order 1st side

http://i259.photobucket.com/albums/h...e/scan0002.jpg

 

Walking order 2nd side

http://i259.photobucket.com/albums/h...e/scan0003.jpg

 

 

sorry for confusing you notice of seizure same thing as a notice os distress

[hallowitch]

not from here i cant but i can from post 59

 

do you see at the bottom of the page NOD 2/07 it may be possible to use this to your advantage

 

i would imagine the notice of distress that the bailiff wrote previous to yours will have Nod 2/06 the date of this notice will be march yours was delivered 10 march with Feb date

 

I would be threatening to ask for disclosure of the date of the previous notice of seizure though a form 4 complaint if necessary

[hallowitch]

Sorry HW Ive lost you on that comment..Maybe Its me, I had Bailiff removal letter on 17/02 popped in letter box then Final Notice on 26/02.. Had phone convo with Bailiff some time later then back dated NOD popped through letterbox on 10/03

 

 

no its me

 

your bailiff put a notice of distress through you door on 10th /03 dated 17/02

your NOD has a sequence number on it (bottom left of notice of distress)

so the NOD that was written out before yours will have a sequence number on it and will be filled in with a march date thus proving the bailiff backdated the NOD

 

 

jo bloges notice of distress dated 9 march sequence number NOD2/06

eggy 12 notice of distress dated 17 February sequence number NOD 2/07

jenny blogs notice of distress dated 11 march sequence number NOD 208

[hallowitch]

http://www.herefordshire.gov.uk/docs/Enforcement_Agent_Charges.pdf

 

 

 

2.- (1) In head B of the Table to paragraph 1, "the relevant amount" with respect to a levy means;-

(a) where the sum due at the time of the levy does not exceed £100, £24.50;

(b) where the sum due at the time of the levy exceeds £100, 24.5% on the first £100 of the sum due,

4% on the next £400, 2.5% on the next £1,500, 1% on the next £8,000 and 0.25% on any additional sum;

 

 

and the sum due at any time for these purposes means so much of the amount in respect of which the

liability order concerned was made as is outstanding at the time