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    • A full-scale strike at the firm could have an impact on the global supply chains of electronics.View the full article
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    • further polished WS using above suggestions and also included couple of more modifications highlighted in orange are those ok to include?   Background   1.1  The Defendant received the Parking Charge Notice (PCN) on the 06th of January 2020 following the vehicle being parked at Arla Old Dairy, South Ruislip on the 05th of December 2019.   Unfair PCN   2.1  On 19th December 2023 the Defendant sent the Claimant's solicitors a CPR request.  As shown in Exhibit 1 (pages 7-13) sent by the solicitors the signage displayed in their evidence clearly shows a £60.00 parking charge notice (which will be reduced to £30 if paid within 14 days of issue).  2.2  Yet the PCN sent by the Claimant is for a £100.00 parking charge notice (reduced to £60 if paid within 30 days of issue).   2.3        The Claimant relies on signage to create a contract.  It is unlawful for the Claimant to write that the charge is £60 on their signs and then send demands for £100.    2.4        The unlawful £100 charge is also the basis for the Claimant's Particulars of Claim.  No Locus Standi  3.1  I do not believe a contract with the landowner, that is provided following the defendant’s CPR request, gives MET Parking Services a right to bring claims in their own name. Definition of “Relevant contract” from the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012, Schedule 4,  2 [1] means a contract Including a contract arising only when the vehicle was parked on the relevant land between the driver and a person who is-   (a) the owner or occupier of the land; or   (b) Authorised, under or by virtue of arrangements made by the owner or occupier of the land, to enter into a contract with the driver requiring the payment of parking charges in respect of the parking of the vehicle on the land. According to https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2006/46/section/44   For a contract to be valid, it requires a director from each company to sign and then two independent witnesses must confirm those signatures.   3.2  The Defendant requested to see such a contract in the CPR request.  The fact that no contract has been produced with the witness signatures present means the contract has not been validly executed. Therefore, there can be no contract established between MET Parking Services and the motorist. Even if “Parking in Electric Bay” could form a contract (which it cannot), it is immaterial. There is no valid contract.  Illegal Conduct – No Contract Formed   4.1 At the time of writing, the Claimant has failed to provide the following, in response to the CPR request from myself.   4.2        The legal contract between the Claimant and the landowner (which in this case is Standard Life Investments UK) to provide evidence that there is an agreement in place with landowner with the necessary authority to issue parking charge notices and to pursue payment by means of litigation.   4.3 Proof of planning permission granted for signage etc under the Town and country Planning Act 1990. Lack of planning permission is a criminal offence under this Act and no contract can be formed where criminality is involved.   4.4        I also do not believe the claimant possesses these documents.   No Keeper Liability   5.1        The defendant was not the driver at the time and date mentioned in the PCN and the claimant has not established keeper liability under schedule 4 of the PoFA 2012. In this matter, the defendant puts it to the claimant to produce strict proof as to who was driving at the time.   5.2 The claimant in their Notice To Keeper also failed to comply with PoFA 2012 Schedule 4 section 9[2][f] while mentioning “the right to recover from the keeper so much of that parking charge as remains unpaid” where they did not include statement “(if all the applicable conditions under this Schedule are met)”.     5.3         The claimant did not mention parking period, times on the photographs are separate from the PCN and in any case are that arrival and departure times not the parking period since their times include driving to and from the parking space as a minimum and can include extra time to allow pedestrians and other vehicles to pass in front.    Protection of Freedoms Act 2012   The notice must -   (a) specify the vehicle, the relevant land on which it was parked and the period of parking to which the notice relates;  22. In the persuasive judgement K4GF167G - Premier Park Ltd v Mr Mathur - Horsham County Court – 5 January 2024 it was on this very point that the judge dismissed this claim.  5.4  A the PCN does not comply with the Act the Defendant as keeper is not liable.  No Breach of Contract   6.1       No breach of contract occurred because the PCN and contract provided as part of the defendant’s CPR request shows different post code, PCN shows HA4 0EY while contract shows HA4 0FY. According to PCN defendant parked on HA4 0EY which does not appear to be subject to the postcode covered by the contract.  6.2         The entrance sign does not mention anything about there being other terms inside the car park so does not offer a contract which makes it only an offer to treat,  Interest  7.1  It is unreasonable for the Claimant to delay litigation for  Double Recovery   7.2  The claim is littered with made-up charges.  7.3  As noted above, the Claimant's signs state a £60 charge yet their PCN is for £100.  7.4  As well as the £100 parking charge, the Claimant seeks recovery of an additional £70.  This is simply a poor attempt to circumvent the legal costs cap at small claims.  7.5 Since 2019, many County Courts have considered claims in excess of £100 to be an abuse of process leading to them being struck out ab initio. An example, in the Caernarfon Court in VCS v Davies, case No. FTQZ4W28 on 4th September 2019, District Judge Jones-Evans stated “Upon it being recorded that District Judge Jones- Evans has over a very significant period of time warned advocates (...) in many cases of this nature before this court that their claim for £60 is unenforceable in law and is an abuse of process and is nothing more than a poor attempt to go behind the decision of the Supreme Court v Beavis which inter alia decided that a figure of £160 as a global sum claimed in this case would be a penalty and not a genuine pre-estimate of loss and therefore unenforceable in law and if the practice continued, he would treat all cases as a claim for £160 and therefore a penalty and unenforceable in law it is hereby declared (…) the claim is struck out and declared to be wholly without merit and an abuse of process.”  7.6 In Claim Nos. F0DP806M and F0DP201T, District Judge Taylor echoed earlier General Judgment or Orders of District Judge Grand, stating ''It is ordered that the claim is struck out as an abuse of process. The claim contains a substantial charge additional to the parking charge which it is alleged the Defendant contracted to pay. This additional charge is not recoverabl15e under the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012, Schedule 4 nor with reference to the judgment in Parking Eye v Beavis. It is an abuse of process from the Claimant to issue a knowingly inflated claim for an additional sum which it is not entitled to recover. This order has been made by the court of its own initiative without a hearing pursuant to CPR Rule 3.3(4)) of the Civil Procedure Rules 1998...''  7.7 In the persuasive case of G4QZ465V - Excel Parking Services Ltd v Wilkinson – Bradford County Court -2 July 2020 (Exhibit 4) the judge had decided that Excel had won. However, due to Excel adding on the £60 the Judge dismissed the case.  7.8        The addition of costs not previously specified on signage are also in breach of the Consumer Rights Act 2015, Schedule 2, specifically paras 6, 10 and 14.   7.9        It is the Defendant’s position that the Claimant in this case has knowingly submitted inflated costs and thus the entire claim should be similarly struck out in accordance with Civil Procedure Rule 3.3(4).   In Conclusion   8.1        I invite the court to dismiss the claim.  Statement of Truth  I believe that the facts stated in this witness statement are true. I understand that proceedings for contempt of court may be brought against anyone who makes, or causes to be made, a false statement in a document verified by a statement of truth without an honest belief in its truth.   
    • Well the difference is that in all our other cases It was Kev who was trying to entrap the motorist so sticking two fingers up to him and daring him to try court was from a position of strength. In your case, sorry, you made a mistake so you're not in the position of strength.  I've looked on Google Maps and the signs are few & far between as per Kev's MO, but there is an entrance sign saying "Pay & Display" (and you've admitted in writing that you knew you had to pay) and the signs by the payment machines do say "Sea View Car Park" (and you've admitted in writing you paid the wrong car park ... and maybe outed yourself as the driver). Something I missed in my previous post is that the LoC is only for one ticket, not two. Sorry, but it's impossible to definitively advise what to so. Personally I'd probably gamble on Kev being a serial bottler of court and reply with a snotty letter ridiculing the signage (given you mentioned the signage in your appeal) - but it is a gamble.  
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    • Hello,

      On 15/1/24 booked appointment with Big Motoring World (BMW) to view a mini on 17/1/24 at 8pm at their Enfield dealership.  

      Car was dirty and test drive was two circuits of roundabout on entry to the showroom.  Was p/x my car and rushed by sales exec and a manager into buying the mini and a 3yr warranty that night, sale all wrapped up by 10pm.  They strongly advised me taking warranty out on car that age (2017) and confirmed it was honoured at over 500 UK registered garages.

      The next day, 18/1/24 noticed amber engine warning light on dashboard , immediately phoned BMW aftercare team to ask for it to be investigated asap at nearest garage to me. After 15 mins on hold was told only their 5 service centres across the UK can deal with car issues with earliest date for inspection in March ! Said I’m not happy with that given what sales team advised or driving car. Told an amber warning light only advisory so to drive with caution and call back when light goes red.

      I’m not happy to do this, drive the car or with the after care experience (a sign of further stresses to come) so want a refund and to return the car asap.

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    • We have finally managed to obtain the transcript of this case.

      The judge's reasoning is very useful and will certainly be helpful in any other cases relating to third-party rights where the customer has contracted with the courier company by using a broker.
      This is generally speaking the problem with using PackLink who are domiciled in Spain and very conveniently out of reach of the British justice system.

      Frankly I don't think that is any accident.

      One of the points that the judge made was that the customers contract with the broker specifically refers to the courier – and it is clear that the courier knows that they are acting for a third party. There is no need to name the third party. They just have to be recognisably part of a class of person – such as a sender or a recipient of the parcel.

      Please note that a recent case against UPS failed on exactly the same issue with the judge held that the Contracts (Rights of Third Parties) Act 1999 did not apply.

      We will be getting that transcript very soon. We will look at it and we will understand how the judge made such catastrophic mistakes. It was a very poor judgement.
      We will be recommending that people do include this adverse judgement in their bundle so that when they go to county court the judge will see both sides and see the arguments against this adverse judgement.
      Also, we will be to demonstrate to the judge that we are fair-minded and that we don't mind bringing everything to the attention of the judge even if it is against our own interests.
      This is good ethical practice.

      It would be very nice if the parcel delivery companies – including EVRi – practised this kind of thing as well.

       

      OT APPROVED, 365MC637, FAROOQ, EVRi, 12.07.23 (BRENT) - J v4.pdf
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Another reason for a CAG template is that the Banks may recognise it as such and realise "this one has got good help available and won't just go away" and do an "ex gratia" refund - as they did before OFT interference.

 

This might not be fair on non-CAGGERS - but they are always free to join!

 

BD

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Bookworm

 

Thanks for your reply. However I don't agree that the SC ruled that "the level of charges per se can not be challenged".

 

My reading of what I heard on BBC news is that they CAN under another part of UTCCR. that is why I would like a CAG template for this - based on the full written SC ruling - so we don't make ANY mistakes in our rebuttal of their lying letters.

 

BD

Then you're mistaken, as is -as so often- the BBC.

 

The SC has decided that the charges are part of a package, a "service", and therefore a core part of the contract, and as such, their LEVEL can not be challenged. Not by the OFT, not by us.

 

The difficulty in coming up with a hard-hitting alternative is because of that. What can be challenged IMO is the mechanism by which these charges occur.

 

For example: Let's say that on the same day, you have a £10 DD coming out which takes you over-limit. The bank either pays or doesn't pay, but EITHER WAY levies a charge. If they choose to refuse the payment, but still levy the charge (which they do), this still takes you over-limit, but the bank has created that debt, not you. That in itself may be arguable.

 

More interesting is the fact you went over-limit triggers has also triggered a monthly charge. When that comes out, it can send you further in the red, or if you had paid monies in, is enough to take you over again. And again. And again.

 

Thus the smallest hiccup on your behalf can trigger the snowball effect, and that IMO is what we can challenge in front of a judge.

 

My second Halifax case was exactly that: I went 12 pence over-limit, by the time they paid up 4 months later, they had taken £150 of charges with more in the pipeline.

 

Now, back to the beginning. I said you have a £10 DD. What if you haven't? Sometimes, it is the banks levying the interest on your account which will take you o/limit. At that point, it is the BANK taking money from your account that triggers money which the BANK will charge you, which means the only side benefiting at any time from this is the bank themselves. Even worse, you can stop any other payment on your instruction, but NOT the charges or interest. So the bank have the unfair advantage and that is where IMO we can use the UTCCR.

 

But challenging the amount they charge? No, I repeat, that ship has sailed, thank you OFT and SC. :-(

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Bookworm

 

Thanks for that very full reply. If nothing better comes up (no offence) then this can form the essence of a great complaint letter to Mr Daniels, copied to John McFall before getting FOS involved if necessary.

 

However can I ask if you have read the suggested template developed by Govan Law Centre (on their web site) referring to the other parts of UTCCR which can be used against unfair charges?

 

My reading is that does still leave the door wide open to challenge all these charges without having to give way on the fact some of them seem to be "legal" according to the SC.

 

I would appreciate your comments on this.

 

BD

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I have two cases sitting with Birmingham County Court against Bank of Scotland.

 

After reading up on this site (as I did all along whilst starting my claims) the advice to apply for the stay to be removed was carefully followed.

 

I have recently recieved correspondence from the Court advising me that:

 

The application to remove the stay should be made in accordance with CPR Part 23 using form N244.

 

Any application for permission to amend the Particulars of Claim should be made at the same time. in the light of the decision of the Supreme Court in The Office of Fair Trading (respondents) v Abbey National plc & others (appellants) [2009] UKSC 6 the Particulars of Claim will require amendment if the Claimant intends to pursue the claim. A draft of the proposed amendment should accompany the application notice.

 

Unless the claimant is fee exempt, the applications will attract a court fee.

 

(surprise surpirse)

 

My Question: What happens now. Should I bother to apply for the removal and amendment? Any help advice appreciated.

:!:Currently at war with Bank of Scotland and Lowell

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I did -briefly- but haven't gone through them in details, for the simple reason that I have been heavily doped up on codeine the last couple of weeks, and it makes it a lickle bitt difficult to take in new legal arguments, lol, so I wouldn't feel comfortable commenting right now. I'll get back to you on that when the brain fog has cleared.

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What would the French do? :)

Can you explain that comment since the UK Supreme Court decision is not binding on the French?

.

FSA Waiver on Bank Charges:http://www.fsa.gov.uk/pages/Doing/Regulated/Notify/Waiver/pdf/dir_quart_0709.pdf

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Why are you asking the hypothetical situation which is irrelevant to this thread which involves UK not French law, which involves UK contracts not French contracts, and is quite frankly IRRELEVANT?

.

FSA Waiver on Bank Charges:http://www.fsa.gov.uk/pages/Doing/Regulated/Notify/Waiver/pdf/dir_quart_0709.pdf

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Why are you asking the hypothetical situation which is irrelevant to this thread which involves UK not French law, which involves UK contracts not French contracts, and is quite frankly IRRELEVANT?

 

Because I choose to. :)

 

Why are you so concerned? :roll:

What sort of world do you want your kids to grow up in?

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Because I choose to. :)

 

Why are you so concerned? :roll:

 

I was trying to work out whether you were making a xenophobic jibe at Bookworm(which I thought you were doing) or whether it was something else. Thankfully, I think it was something else. I am always concerned if xenophobia is the only argument someone has against a valid point being made by someone who has taken many hours out of their life to post on an internet forum.

.

FSA Waiver on Bank Charges:http://www.fsa.gov.uk/pages/Doing/Regulated/Notify/Waiver/pdf/dir_quart_0709.pdf

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I was trying to work out whether you were making a xenophobic jibe at Bookworm(which I thought you were doing) or whether it was something else. Thankfully, I think it was something else. I am always concerned if xenophobia is the only argument someone has against a valid point being made by someone who has taken many hours out of their life to post on an internet forum.

 

Bookworm and I don't agree on everything, but I think you will have her in stitches coming up with all that! :lol: Anyhow, the question remains. What would the French do?

 

Are you not going to add your name to the 'March For Fairness' thread then friend? You seemed like the decent sort that would be up for a peaceful protest... :)

What sort of world do you want your kids to grow up in?

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Bookworm can answer the french question cos je ne se pas por quoi(apologies to bookworm but unfortunately my GCSE French is not as good as my degree level Spanish is, sadly).

 

Regeneration, the thread stopped dead in December 2009 then had one post from yourself in January 2010 to which no one has responded.

 

You need aims, you need support, a venue, media attention, mass appeal message, and a date.

 

At the moment, I will look at that thread again(as I have only just found it today since no link to it even on your signature meant that I assumed it was CARO's thread you were on about). For info: Caro has a link on her signature which means people will look there so a tip for you might be to do the same so others view the thread when they see your posts. Hope that makes sense

.

FSA Waiver on Bank Charges:http://www.fsa.gov.uk/pages/Doing/Regulated/Notify/Waiver/pdf/dir_quart_0709.pdf

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Bookworm can answer the french question cos je ne se pas por quoi(apologies to bookworm but unfortunately my GCSE French is not as good as my degree level Spanish is, sadly).

 

Regeneration, the thread stopped dead in December 2009 then had one post from yourself in January 2010 to which no one has responded.

 

You need aims, you need support, a venue, media attention, mass appeal message, and a date.

 

At the moment, I will look at that thread again(as I have only just found it today since no link to it even on your signature meant that I assumed it was CARO's thread you were on about). For info: Caro has a link on her signature which means people will look there so a tip for you might be to do the same so others view the thread when they see your posts. Hope that makes sense

 

It would be nice to see you add your support on the thread with some helpful comments.

What sort of world do you want your kids to grow up in?

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It would be nice to see you add your support on the thread with some helpful comments.

 

I'll lay odds of 100 to 1 to anyone that he doesn't. :D Baron Renog always knows these things you see. You can all trust Baron Renog... :lol:

 

Any takers? :rolleyes:

What sort of world do you want your kids to grow up in?

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I'll lay odds of 100 to 1 to anyone that he doesn't. :D Baron Renog always knows these things you see. You can all trust Baron Renog... :lol:

 

Any takers? :rolleyes:

 

Renegotiation, what is the current amount of support you have on that thread? Less than 100???

 

Even the petitions on here get over 400 so clearly I'll look at it and give you some pointers where I think you need to go.

.

FSA Waiver on Bank Charges:http://www.fsa.gov.uk/pages/Doing/Regulated/Notify/Waiver/pdf/dir_quart_0709.pdf

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Renegotiation, what is the current amount of support you have on that thread? Less than 100???

 

Even the petitions on here get over 400 so clearly I'll look at it and give you some pointers where I think you need to go.

 

As I said, any support is welcome. All I ask, is that you get your name on the list and voice your support for massive peaceful demonstrations. I know you will stand with us on this. It's all pretty straightforward. :-)

 

I see you still haven't done so. Here's the link again:

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/campaign/234784-march-fair-financial-system-4.html

What sort of world do you want your kids to grow up in?

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I have heard from the Court, following the end of the test case, regarding a claim I have against Abbey for bank charges. The order from the Court, dated 23rd January 2010, is as follows -

 

" Upon it appearing that this claim relates to bank charges, and it is or may be within the categories considered by the Supreme Court . . . . . .

 

It is ordered that

 

1. The claim be further stayed generally;

 

2. Either party may apply to remove the stay on application to the Court. Such an application may be made by way of a letter (accompanied by the appropriate court fee) and copied to the opposing party;

 

3. The application must state:

 

a. By reference to the decision of the Supreme Court the grounds upon which the application to remove the stay are based, and

 

b. Whether, and if so, what attempts have been made to settle the claim;

 

 

4. If no such application to remove the stay is made by 10 February 2010, the claim shall be struck out without further order.

 

 

This seems to me to be more or less the end of the road for this, and similar, claims!!!!!

 

Has anyone else recieved similar from the Court dealing with their claim? I'd be VERY grateful if anyone has any advice on what to do now.

 

Many thanks.

I do my best to be helpful, but at the end of the day I'm not a professional - please seek further advice if you're not sure. On the other hand, if I have helped, please click my scales - thanks ;)

 

Current Claims (all for friends!) -

 

Abbey - over £4k - Court claim issued & AQ filed ('Tish vs Abbey'). Alloc'n Hearing 21 Sept - Claim stayed 29/8/07.

Cap One - just under £2k - WON (just over 2k!)('Tish vs Cap One')

Cap One - just under £1000 - WON (just over £1k) Nov 07 (JimmyBoy vs Cap One)

Lloyds TSB - £3.5k - Court claim issued, defence rec'd and AQ filed; Alloc'n hearing 7th Sept Claim stayed 29/8/07! (JimmyBoy vs Lloyds')

MBNA - over £1k for mis-sold PPI - WON - approx £1500(IpswichWitch vs MBNA . . .)

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Its Ipswich County Court

I do my best to be helpful, but at the end of the day I'm not a professional - please seek further advice if you're not sure. On the other hand, if I have helped, please click my scales - thanks ;)

 

Current Claims (all for friends!) -

 

Abbey - over £4k - Court claim issued & AQ filed ('Tish vs Abbey'). Alloc'n Hearing 21 Sept - Claim stayed 29/8/07.

Cap One - just under £2k - WON (just over 2k!)('Tish vs Cap One')

Cap One - just under £1000 - WON (just over £1k) Nov 07 (JimmyBoy vs Cap One)

Lloyds TSB - £3.5k - Court claim issued, defence rec'd and AQ filed; Alloc'n hearing 7th Sept Claim stayed 29/8/07! (JimmyBoy vs Lloyds')

MBNA - over £1k for mis-sold PPI - WON - approx £1500(IpswichWitch vs MBNA . . .)

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Thanks tedney.

 

For the benefit of others this is the link to the relevant page of Govan Law Centre's site -

 

Govan Law Centre: Unfair bank charges: free help to amend existing complaint letters

 

There is no sign of any ammended POC's there yet though.

 

As regards my particular claim, I'm thinking of going down the route of applying to the Court to have the stay lifted, and asking for permission to ammend my Particulars of Claim.

 

However, I have to admit that I have a few concerns about this course of action, especially in light of the fact that the Govern Law Centre et al seem to be having significant problems in compiling a revised 'particulars of claim' - they have been promised within 2 weeks for the best part of 6 weeks now and still haven't appeared!

 

 

I'm concerned that if they don't appear within a very short time then the claim will be struck out, given that Ipswich County Court have (unilaterally!) only given me till 10th Feb to apply to lift the stay. I'd feel far happier proceeding in this way if the new POC's were actually available. Does anyone happen to know if it is permissable to ask the Court to continue the stay beyond 10th Feb, pending the gathering and compilation of new evidence with specific reference to the UTCCR's and Consumer Credit Act 1974 which was not covered by 'The Test Case'?

 

 

I am also concerned that if only a few people proceed in this way, especially if the new POC's don't appear, there is a very real chance of having to face Abbey / Santander's top notch leagal seagulls in Court, which I don't actually relish doing, and if we loose, being ordered to pay the bank's huge legal costs. Does anyone have any views on that?

I do my best to be helpful, but at the end of the day I'm not a professional - please seek further advice if you're not sure. On the other hand, if I have helped, please click my scales - thanks ;)

 

Current Claims (all for friends!) -

 

Abbey - over £4k - Court claim issued & AQ filed ('Tish vs Abbey'). Alloc'n Hearing 21 Sept - Claim stayed 29/8/07.

Cap One - just under £2k - WON (just over 2k!)('Tish vs Cap One')

Cap One - just under £1000 - WON (just over £1k) Nov 07 (JimmyBoy vs Cap One)

Lloyds TSB - £3.5k - Court claim issued, defence rec'd and AQ filed; Alloc'n hearing 7th Sept Claim stayed 29/8/07! (JimmyBoy vs Lloyds')

MBNA - over £1k for mis-sold PPI - WON - approx £1500(IpswichWitch vs MBNA . . .)

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  • 1 month later...

I've received a letter from Cardiff CC asking if I wish to continue with my claim against HSBC. I phoned court and they explained that HSBC have asked that the case be dismissed and that's why the court has written to me. I haven't heard anything about my Barclays claim yet, which means they haven't asked to have the case dismissed yet..............

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