Help with N244 form - set aside CCJ

[caller]

I think I better start a new thread in this title

 

I need help to fill the N244 form - set aside CCJ

 

Some help please to fill the form

 

On the N244 form, Paragraph 3

 

Qs3 . What order are you asking the court to make and why?

 

I intend to write this

Take Notice that the Defendant asked the court to set aside and stayed the County Court Judegement and the Charging Order as new evidence/developement could let the defendant to defense successfully asto the claimant's particular of claim

 

Qs 4 Have you attached a draft of the order you are applying for? Yes/No

 

Don't know what to say?

 

Qs 6 How long do you think the hearing will last?

 

Should I say 15..... or 30 minutes or 1 hour?

 

Qs 9 who should be served with this application?

 

And as on the claim form for the CCJ, there's a claimant (A )and the solicitor (B) on anothe box of ' the address for sending documents and payments.

 

Who should I put on the form? the claimant A or both A & B

 

------------------------------------------------------------

I am preparing some essay I think I would put it as the statement of case to attached with form and I try to make it clear and short.

 

I would like to say the alleged claim is not enforcement due to

 

1) no NoA

2) no DN

3) get big misleading advice from CAB and thus not doing the right thing at the right time to appeal with the CCJ

 

I know these point not sounding very promissing but I would give it a go.

 

Anyone? could you share your experience .....

 

Any opinion would be much appreciated.

 

 

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[Castlebest]

Hiya will try to sort you out

 

I think I better start a new thread in this title

 

I need help to fill the N244 form - set aside CCJ

 

Some help please to fill the form

 

On the N244 form, Paragraph 3

 

Qs3 . What order are you asking the court to make and why?

 

I intend to write this

Take Notice that the Defendant asked the court to set aside and stayed the County Court Judgment and the Charging Order as new evidence/development could let the defendant to defense successfully Astor the claimant's particular of claim

 

Your asking the court to do something for you and there is no need to try to copy legal jargon so just say what your asking for in simple English something like...

 

To set aside County Court Judgment and Charging Order due to the defendants lack of experience at the time of the claim and new evidence regarding the claimants particulars of claim which could result in a successful defense.

 

Or something like that

 

Qs 4 Have you attached a draft of the order you are applying for? Yes/No

 

Don't know what to say?

 

either no or what you want the judge to order how about...

 

The Judgment and Charging order is set aside pending submission of a revised defense document within the next 14 days.

 

 

Qs 6 How long do you think the hearing will last?

 

Should I say 15..... or 30 minutes or 1 hour?

 

say 15 minutes

 

Qs 9 who should be served with this application?

 

And as on the claim form for the CCJ, there's a claimant (A )and the solicitor (B) on anothe box of ' the address for sending documents and payments.

 

Who should I put on the form? the claimant A or both A & B

 

Both A and B let them both know

 

------------------------------------------------------------

I am preparing some essay I think I would put it as the statement of case to attached with form and I try to make it clear and short.

 

I would like to say the alleged claim is not enforcement due to

 

1) no NoA

2) no DN

3) get big misleading advice from CAB and thus not doing the right thing at the right time to appeal with the CCJ

 

You cant use faulty advice as a reason to lift a CCJ its your responsibility to get sound advice, all the forms say this

 

I know these point not sounding very promissing but I would give it a go.

 

Anyone? could you share your experience .....

 

Any opinion would be much appreciated.

 

 

 

 

 

Have you read the National Debt Lines advice sheet on setting aside CCJ's? have a look here

National Debtline England & Wales | Debt Advice | Factsheet 12 How To Set Aside A Judgment In The County Court

 

pete

[caller]

Thanks Castlebest(pete), thanks for all these useful advice

 

I have trouble to fill in the

 

Qs 10 what information will you be relying on, in support of your application?

 

1) the attached witness statement

2) the statement of case

3) the evidence set out in the box below

 

I was advised at other nice people in this forum I shoud use 2)

 

Could anyone tell me what is the difference of these all?

 

I had read some other threads, it seemed other people wrote a lot statement on the form N244.

 

I just have a few line about my case -

1. the DCA ignored my requests of NoA thus showing that they maybe not have one thus they are not entitle to chase the debt and collect it;
   
2. I had recently sent out SAR to the OC and still waiting to clear up everything;
   
3. I had never received DN thus the DCA was wrong to chase the debt even thought on their POA they claimed they had served it.
   
4. It take me sometime to do research and know better about my right as I was mislead by the CAB
   

i don't think I could use 3)

 

The more I read the more I am confused.... what is a draft statement, LBA...when do you use it. ~Should I use those in my case. Do I draft something to the court after I know the hearing date and sent it off, if I want to change something then I shoud sent out amendment of statement?

 

I am very confused with all this staffs and procedure.

 

Try to submit the N244 asap before I received order of sale from the DCA

 

After i submit the form, I intend to write to the DCA requesting again the NoA, is it the right thing to do.

 

I am still waiting for the SAR, counting the 40 days time limit. If they don't, I learnt from the forum that I shoud send another letter.

 

any advice would be much appreciated

 

Caller

[r&b]

hi caller,

what were the circumstances of the original judgment?

was it a default judgment or did u put in defence or admission?

have u made any documentation requests to uphold ur claim for setting aside, if so, which ones and what have u had in return?

to set aside you need to show the ability to put a non-fanciful defence to the original claim.

[caller]

Hi, r&b, thanks for your reply.

 

what were the circumstances of the original judgment?

was it a default judgment or did u put in defence or admission

 

 

tick -full amount on the claim form...

 

The lady at the CAB filled up all the claim form and asked me to sign, she just thought I should go bankrupty (I went in there straight away I got the claim form & at that time I told her I had others debt too).

 

She ignored my plea that the amount was not right and I am not sure the account reference was right. she filled : admit all the amount and the debt. She thought I had debt with the OC and a DCA sending claim form then everything should be just go one direction. She asked me to sign and put it in a envelope, sealed it and tell me to post out straight afterwards.

 

I am so naive and always trust people ( at that moment I just feel thankful for all her help, she seemed very authority in a way).

 

After I got the judgement (no hearing not as the lady at CAB told me, I was hoping that I could plea to judge about monthly repayment), I went back, another lady told me to save money just send a letter in asking to transfer the case to local court, she didn't mention I could set aside or do anything at that specif time period (now I learnt from this forum, there actually something I do do at that specific period, I find this forum too late).

 

Anyway It's all my fault, things just swirlled and swirlled, while I waiting for any outcome after I sent the letter to court, I actually received is a hearing for CO instead, I hardly breath during all this chaos to handle the CO case (during all those time, now I reflect, maybe I could do something like asking the judge about set aside or vary the judgement).

 

I was so confusing for all those hearing and legal staffs.

 

Anyway after the CO, now then the DCA start to chase the money in full and they ignored any of my offer no matter what.

 

Now they just want to get the order of sale since I could not fulful the full amount (the judgement is granted for full amount of the debt).

 

Such push me to the edge and I find out N244 from the thread, I have to have a go OR I would lost my home.

 

The most problem is I had admitted the full amount at the claim form.

 

I don't know if I agrue the NoA, DN... Would it be wise to say now i challenge the claimed amount? Would it better leave it alone?

 

I could only show the court my letter requesting NoA to the DCA and the letter requesting SAR to the OC (still waiting).

 

sorry for such long thread...Any advice would be much appreciated.

Caller

[r&b]

hi caller,

well i had a similar issue with the CCCS so ur not alone. the adission may have some bearing on this im afraid. i put in for set aside on 2 such cases and lost, as there were (according to the 2 barristers for the other side) no grounds in the Civil Procedure Rules to set aside a judgment under full admission, obviously backed up by the DJ. that said there are aothers who have successfully used this route who havent run into such legal knowhow.

i am waiting for confirmation, as then only knowedge i have of this is what i was told by these barristers during the hearing, but i understand the correct route in law, to be the seeking of removal of the admission (down to the court to accept) due to new evidence and/or a fresh action appealing the original judgment.

i have tried to get the answers on this thread so maybe keep an eye out here if any answers are forthcoming:

http://consumeractiongroup.com/forum/legal-issues/213560-procedure-challenging-non-default.html

 

if i were you i would get as much documentation to back your case as possible.

[caller]

Hi, r&b, many thanks fot let me know about this (reading the thread now,still very confusing, all of this is fresh and open my eyes as I am still very low at this moment).

 

I am not sure would it be worser I rush down this road without properly know what I am doing.

 

Anyway, I have some development with my DCA, as I said before, they threathen me that they would apply 'order of sale' at the end of this week if I did not pay in full (they would not accept any of my offer, they want full amount now). I just received a letter asking me to contact them to discuss about the repayment.

 

I think I would stick with my monthly offer to them and wait for the SAR from the OC (I am worried sick now since I am so studpid I had provided my signature to the OC, I worry they would lift my signature etc, I would be more deep hot boiling water.)

 

I still want to set aside but this may buy me a bit time (the order of sale hanging on my head) and at the same time I could learn more at the forum to get a better picture what to do next.

 

I mean if I apply and then fail, what would happen? More court fee and the debt bigger and bigger then over the small claim limit and I would face more hursh law rules tec.

 

I am thinkging I shall open a new thread to draw anyone's sharing of their experience and advices.

 

meanwhile any advice about 'set aside' would be much appreciated.

 

Caller

[sillygirl1]

Have you managed to complete the N244 now or do you need more help - I've been laid low for a few days with Swine Flu but am a lot better now, around until Wednesday if you need more help.

 

I don't think starting a new thread will help, it will only confuse things. You need to concentrate on the set aside - personally I would ignore the fact that you weren't helped with the original claim and stick to the fact that you have an outstanding SAR with the clients and at no time have they verified the ACTUAL amount of any arrears on the account nor the ORIGNAL sum owed.

[r&b]

hi SG,

i have a real worry about gong for set aside when the judgment is not a 'default'. under what section of the CPR could caller justifiably ask for the judgment to be set aside? as above this was a problem i ran into.

to stave off the issue of forced sale, a temp measure could be to try for a redetermination hearing to allow a reasonable, affordable payment perhaps?

[sillygirl1]

A Redetermination hearing would be a much better route - thanks for mentioning that r&B, it certainly would force the original creditor and DCA involved to provide the docucments they haven't already provided, ie default notice and notice of assignment. It would also keep the costs down as the request could include something line "costs to be kept to a minimum on both sides"

 

Nice one.... I've tipped your scales accordingly.

[caller]

Hi, many thanks to you, sillygilr11 & r&b,

 

I've been laid low for a few days with Swine Flu but am a lot better now, around until Wednesday if you need more help

 

Hi, sillygilr 11, I am so sorry to hear about that, hope you feeling better and better. So grateful to you as you are suffering and still thinking of me at this hard time.

 

I think I am going to negotable with the DCA right now as I received the DCA letter about the repayment.

 

Therefore I think I could hold them off for a while (as the order of sale still hanging over my head), therefore I think I better make sure to learn more before I submit the N244.

 

AGain,thanks to you both for the good advice, I am still confusing about...

 

What is 'A Redetermination hearing' is it something like asking the judge to vary the repayment by using the N245? I always thought by using N245, you just ask the judge to vary the amount since the debtor could not afford it and show the court evidence to justify the better agreement with the creditor.

 

At such hearing, could you do arguement like : the amount is not the rightful amount and claimed the DCA is not the rightful owner? And throw out the DCA claim at all, no more CCJ?

 

Sorry I just confused and my main goal is to get rid of this CCJ and then prepare for another round with the DCA with a new CCJ hearing.

 

Thanks of all both of your help. Hi, sillygirl11, Please let me know if you are better, best wish to you....

 

Caller

[caller]

Oh, forget to ask...

 

Could I ask for 'A Redetermination hearing' under my situation, would there be something like ..'you had admitted the full amount, now it's not right to do such and such...

 

And if I applied this, would the outcome affect N244 if I would like to submit it later...

 

Sorry loads of question from me, Thanks to you all from the bottom of my heart.

 

I still reading those thread related to r&b's case, eye opener and still try to absorb it all..

 

Thanks to you all.

Caller

[caller]

bump.

[r&b]

a redetermination hearing will put forward your income and expenditure, upon which the judge will decide a reasonable mthly payment. you basically show a mthly amount u can afford and as long as your i&e backs it up, the judge will make a decision based on that.

[caller]

Hi, r&b,

 

thanks for your reply. That's great help. How's you case develope? I wish you the best. I still reading all the threads you mentioned, it's so complicate for me to understand.

 

My question : AT the redetermination hearing, could I ask the judge to look at other things eg. the amount I do want to dispute, could you do that or I should do the N244 at the same time. Could the court allow you to do both, or one after the other.

 

really don't understand the 'procedure'.

 

Could anyone tell me what is these term - 'sketeton draft' 'defensive draft' when do one needs to do that?

 

Thanks in advance.

 

ps Sillygirl, I hope you feel better. best regards.

Caller

[caller]

Hi, I haven't back to the internet casue some problem at home.

 

I just get back the SAR file from the credit company.

 

They are all printed out paper, the credit agreement just a printed out paper without any signature etc.(sorry could not upload them as no facilities at the public library to do so)

 

Now I just received the DCA would accept my proposed monthly repayment, should I

 

(a)starting paying them and at the same time submit the N244 form

(b)not paying them and at the saome time submit the N244 form

©starting paying them without doing set aside as the chance to be granted is very small?

 

Any advice would be much much appreciated.