CCA'd GE Money and...

[Misscynical]

Hi all

 

I CCA'd GE Money on 27 October and received a letter back from them on 8 November enclosing

 

'copy of your original agreement together with a statement of account that we are also obliged to provide in accordance with the Consumer Credit Act 1974.'

 

There was just one photocopied page headed 'YOUR REQUEST TO OPEN A R & B ACCOUNT'.

 

It states 'The further terms of the agreement are given overleaf'. However, they haven't sent me copies of any other pages so even if it is a CCA is it enforceable?

 

It then says 'Only complete this application form.....' so is it actually a copy of the CCA does anyone know?

 

They've managed to reduce the copy to A5 size so the text is pretty small. Its dated September 1997 and has my signature at the bottom and and employee has signed their part.

 

I think I opened the account in-store. It looks like there was a tear-off part at the bottom but this is missing.

 

With regards to the 'Statement of Account' it consists of one page containing my account number, my name and address in the first box.

 

In the second box is states my account is uptodate, it gives the balance, amount due immediately, current arears and under 'Amount Due in the future: No current minimum monthly payment due' - huh? I still owe them at least £350.

 

As this account is the only one without a Direct Debit set up it has often been late and probably has a shedload of charges.

 

I wrote back to them yesterday saying they still hadn't fully complied with the CCA request and that the account was now in dispute. I'll wait and see what I hear from them. They are supposed to send me copies of statements going back to inception aren't they or at least last 6 years?

 

I am without a scanner at the mo but will scan what they've sent me as soon as I can.

 

Any comments welcome... as always:-) Thanks, Miss C

[PGH7447]

You will not get the statements on a cca request, you need to send a sar

 

if the agreement provided is unreadable then request another

[angel_1]

hiya,

 

welcome to this madness.lol

 

will post you link to my thread

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/general-debt-issues/160682-debenhams-sold-c-l.html

 

but looks like you have had exactly what i had and so again im disputing this with cl who ge sold debt to, well im still investigating that part

 

im off now for a few hours but have subscribed to your thread to see if i can help ciao for now - maz

[Misscynical]

Hi Maz, missed your post but just looked in as I've received a Default Notice from GE Money. How are things going with your investigations?? I'm just going to skip over to your thread thru the link you gave. Cheers, Miss C

[angel_1]

hiya miss c

 

you have had a default notice, best if you can scan it up here for us to view for your as it may not be in the correct legal format and thus also have you kept the envelope it came in?

 

pls delete any of your personal info of course and also any references or markings to identify you

 

any prbs let me know do you use bucketshop to scan documents?

 

oh just going over to update my thread had interesting stuff

 

laters angel x

[Misscynical]

Hi angel, have used photobucket to scan Default Notice.

 

 

Now I've set up my scanner I'm going to post up the 'Agreement' they sent me. Can't wait to skip over to your thread to see what news you have... sounds exciting!

 

Opened bundle of post before rushing out the door to my grandad's funeral. Shoved all the envelopes in the bin and didn't read the post til I got home. Bin bag is now buried under the contents of the bathroom in a skip so envelope now gone.

 

I did receive another missive this morning from them in a bright orange envelope headed on the outside 'TELEMESSAGE'! Haven't got a clue what this is about. It's from GE Capital but could be in connection with my House of Fraser Card or my Russell & Bromley one. It has a number to call and a reference but I'm wary about calling it - what to you think??? Have you ever had one of these?

 

Catch up in a bit, MissC x

Edited January 15, 2009 by Misscynical

[Misscynical]

Here's their or should I say my 'agreement'! They kindly reduced it to A5 just so I have to squint at it a bit more. Unfortunately I haven't found out how to enlarge on my scanner/copier yet but just the fact I've mastered the scanning is an achievement on its own!

 

[angel_1]

hiya miss c

 

very sorry to hear of your grand dad,

 

dont worry about the envelope now if its gone, but you rec on 14 jan from date 10.01.07 guessing was sent poss 1st class this week

 

the only thing i dont understand if the default with it stating the breach should be remedied 21 days of receipt - what would happen if you said you didnt get it? legally i dont know if it would just be assumed you got it -ie judge would say you would have got it on so and so date, ie the 14th jan 09

 

however, the other thing as it states BEFORE THE DATE SHOWN in caps and underline, the default doesnt actually state a DATE, therefore could this be deemed as a defective default, i will post you info of what i was told on another of my threads where i got lots of info ref of how a default should be written and info to contain, will be back

 

am back see below there is another thread i will now link here for you to read more on okay will be back

 

here is the link very good info

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/legal-issues/170345-tale-dodgy-dn.html

 

****

 

Heres the info on DNs to help you,

 

35. Section 2 (5) and (6) of the Consumer Credit (Enforcement, Default and Termination Notices) Regulations 1983 sets out the following

(5) Where any statement is required to be in a form specified in a Schedule to these Regulations and is reproduced in the notice, then apart from any heading to the notice, trade names or names of parties to the agreement-

 

(a) the lettering in the statement shall be afforded more prominence (whether by capital letters, underlining, large or bold print or otherwise) than any other lettering in the notice; and

 

(b) where words are both shown in capital letters and underlined in any statement specified in a Schedule to these Regulations, they shall be afforded yet more prominence.

 

(6) The wording in any such statement shall be reproduced in the notice without any alteration or addition, and in relation to any statement to be contained in the notice the requirements of any note shall be complied with, except that the words "the creditor" may be replaced by the name of the creditor, by the expression by which he is referred to in the agreement or by an appropriate pronoun, and any consequential changes to pronouns and verbs may be used.

36. The notice fails to include the following statement in the form as shown

 

"IF THE ACTION REQUIRED BY THIS NOTICE IS TAKEN BEFORE THE DATE SHOWN NO FURTHER ENFORCEMENT ACTION WILL BE TAKEN IN RESPECT OF THE BREACH

 

37. Also the notice fails to set out the statement as set out below

 

"IF YOU DO NOT TAKE THE ACTION REQUIRED BY THIS NOTICE BEFORE THE DATE SHOWN THEN THE FURTHER ACTION SET OUT BELOW MAY BE TAKEN AGAINST YOU [OR A SURETY]"

 

 

38. The statements referred to in points 36 & 37 are laid out in schedule 2 of Consumer Credit (Enforcement, Default and Termination Notices Regulations 1983 (SI 1983/1561)

 

39. For a creditor to be entitled to terminate a regulated credit agreement where there is a breach, demand repayment in full or take any legal action to recover any monies due under the agreement, a creditor must serve a Default Notice under section 87(1) CCA 1974 which states

(1) Service of a notice on the debtor or hirer in accordance with section 88 (a "default notice ") is necessary before the creditor or owner can become entitled, by reason of any breach by the debtor or hirer of a regulated agreement,-

(a) to terminate the agreement, or

 

(b) to demand earlier payment of any sum, or

 

© to recover possession of any goods or land, or

 

(d) to treat any right conferred on the debtor or hirer by the agreement as terminated, restricted or deferred, or

 

(e)to enforce any security.

40. I note the opening part of section 88(1), which states

88. Contents and effect of default notice.

 

- (1) The default notice must be in the prescribed form.......

The word must makes it clear that no variation is acceptable. Therefore it cannot be dispensed with as a De Minimus issue

 

 

 

41. I note that the regulations do not allow any variation in the form of these statements and there fore it is suggested that where the statements are not as laid down in the regulations the default notice is rendered invalid as a consequence

Edited January 15, 2009 by angel_1

[Misscynical]

Fab, angel, thanks for post. I just asked on the Dodgy DN thread about whether the Notice was faulty and had a reply from Von Greenbach matching yours. Guess the next question I need to ask is what do I do now?? Oh dear!. Just off for a free 15 minute session at solicitors regarding a Redetermination Notice. It never ends. Had a scan over your thread but will get stuck into it later tonight.

Edited January 15, 2009 by Misscynical

[angel_1]

hiya miss c

im so pleased ive been able to pass on info sent to me when i was scared on my receipt of my first default notice,

 

im off to out tonight but i will log in later evening time

 

the trick now is not to contact them, dont talk to them and pray they terminate your account and get that letter and store it securely,

 

lets hope another one bites the dust, take care for now laters angel x

[guzzleguts]

Hi i received same default notice dated end of oct, and the 21 days from receipt, cant see how it can be valid with no date to comply to.

 

Good luck

 

just subbing to see how you get on if you want to look at my thread on g e money, it may help you.

 

GG