FAO Peternet

[Shovel]

As it seems you're working for UKCPS, Would you like to explain to us how you justify asking people to send in payment with their "appeal"? We'd all very much like to know!

[Max78]

I cannot speak for them but i can offer my opinion. I as a victim, feel once they receive the money they will forget and discontinue any correspondence with the victim (offender in their eyes). They will not want to know and will ignore any letters, emails and phone calls. They cannot do this if they have not yet received payment.

 

I will not be sending any money to them and they will respond to my appeal because i am taking it to small claims court.

[Al27]

Because there is no 'appeals' process

 

A person not familiar with [problem] tickets may think there is some legitimacy due to their apparently being an appeals procedure, and perhaps would actually think they would get their money back. We know a lot of these companies try to pass themselves off as council-like.

 

 

[lamma]

they just want your money. after sending payment they will claim you accepted liability.

[jasmin2008]

For sure.

 

If the PPCs thought they were 100% in the right, the court lists up and down the country would be full of court cases. They are not.

 

They don't have the bottle to take on the experts. PPCs are just a bunch of cowards.

[peternet]

I cannot speak for them but i can offer my opinion. I as a victim, feel once they receive the money they will forget and discontinue any correspondence with the victim (offender in their eyes). They will not want to know and will ignore any letters, emails and phone calls. They cannot do this if they have not yet received payment.

 

I will not be sending any money to them and they will respond to my appeal because i am taking it to small claims court.

 

Confused - you are taking UKCPS to court? Why have you paid for as ticket we havent given you?

[lamma]

Confused - you are taking UKCPS to court? Why have you paid for as ticket we havent given you?

 

ahh, only Peternet's invoices should be paid then...

[Shovel]

Care to answer the original question, Peter?

[peternet]

Care to answer the original question, Peter?

OK

Why we ask for payment with appeal.

By receiving payment up front we are certain that the person appealing is genuinely appealing and not (as encouraged on this forum) avoiding payment. Many people send in appeals without payment. We respond to these explaining the circumstances of the ticket (invoice) being issued - sometimes we can cancel the ticket - legitimate permit holder in hire vehicle, contractor who failed to obtain guest permit or was miss-informed by the on site concierge etc etc, other times the invoice is fully enforceable. Many people follow the legally incorrect advice offered on these forums that PPC invoices are not enforceable - well they are providing the contract has been properly entered into - on our part that means ample visible correct signage offering the contract terms at each site.

Now if we didn't ask for payment and make that a condition what would be the result? Many people would appeal without payment - their case would not be upheld - remember these parking tickets are invoices for contracting to park (as detailed by the signage) they would then be requested to pay plus the excess charges for late payment ( a very common and acceptable business practise). By settling the invoice at the earliest opportunity people avoid excess charges for late payment. If their ticket was incorrectly issued then they will receive a full refund - this has never been an issue for us at UKCPS. However if the ticket has been correctly issued - to people who have entered a contract by parking on private land and have failed to have a valid permit or authority or failed to pay the invoice - then they are in breach of contract (the contract is displayed on numerous signs around each site for all to read and either agree to and park or disagree to and drive off) and therefore chasing of payment is perfectly legitimate.

My question is this - why do so many people think they can park on private land without permission or payment - how would you feel and what would you do if I came and parked my car on your private drive?

[jasmin2008]

You would be agreeing to my contract where I can crush your car.

[lamma]

not the 'park on your drive stuff again'. yawn.

[Shovel]

Charges for late payment can be applied where a contract has been SIGNED to that effect. An appeal should be just that - and no payment should be requested until any dispute is resolved.

[peternet]

Charges for late payment can be applied where a contract has been SIGNED to that effect. An appeal should be just that - and no payment should be requested until any dispute is resolved.

 

Contracts do not need to be signed

[crem]

peternet your arguement only holds water (and only a small amount even then) where you are managing sites where absolutely no unauthorised parking should take place, i.e. someone is also trespassing in order to park in the first place. (and yes that would cover your repetitive example of parking on someone's drive coz you never should be there in the first place.)

 

Many of these invoices are issued in publicly accessable places for stupid "infringements" of apparent rules such as "not fully in bay", "stayed 2 minutes over a 2 hour limit" or as has been posted on these forums "parked in a mother/baby bay without a baby seat in car!" etc etc.

 

You can never justify these type of examples with your "private drive" quote that you keep coming up with.

[gwc1000]

By receiving payment up front we are certain that the person appealing is genuinely appealing

 

Only a PPC could come up with what is frankly a laughable answer. You try to justify your questionable methods with nonsense, hoping it will fool others. So you have people appealing who are not genuinely appealing? Are they falsely appealing? Are they appealing for the fun of it? Do they even know why they are appealing? Perhaps you should have a quiet word with yourself, and consider how riddiculous your post reads. Do you not see that by asking for money up front, at best your actions would be viewed as suspicious?

Are you suggesting then, that everybody who appeals Council issued parking tickets, because payment is not required up front, is not genuinely appealing against their ticket? Imagine the uproar if Councils insisted on payment before an appeal would be considered.

[electron99]

Is not asking for money up front with an appeal against BPA guidelines?

[pt2537]

Paying prior to appeal flies in the face of justice,

 

if you lose in court and appeal, the judgment against you is automatically stayed and no enforcement can be taken til such time as your appeal is heard

 

the same goes for a local authority, you appeal and only once your appeal is heard and decided then you become required to pay or not

 

 

to suggest that you should pay prior to appeal gives the company a argument that you do indeed accept liability and removes any defence that you may have, take ASDA for instance, they have a parking policy that says that you cant park in a parent and child bay without child under 12

 

now i have a Graco car seat which is removable and when i go to asda, i take the baby seat out and put him in the buggy ( anyone who knows the Graco travel system will know what i mean

 

Now i had a ticket the other day for not having a child seat,now if i had sent payment with my appeal, in the words of the company who enforce the site, i would have accepted the ticket and no appeal would have been considered

 

however, where i wrote to them and advised of the situation they did indeed revoke the ticket and issued an apology as their employee had failed to enforce the terms of the site correctly

 

so in the interests of fairness it would be correct not to pay prior to appeal but if your appeal was unsuccessful then that would be the correct time to pay the fine

[WebFerret]

Is not asking for money up front with an appeal against BPA guidelines?

 

I believe it is!

 

@peternet - care to comment on this?

[Bookworm]

take ASDA for instance, they have a parking policy that says that you cant park in a parent and child bay without child under 12

 

now i have a Graco car seat which is removable and when i go to asda, i take the baby seat out and put him in the buggy ( anyone who knows the Graco travel system will know what i mean

 

Now i had a ticket the other day for not having a child seat,now if i had sent payment with my appeal, in the words of the company who enforce the site, i would have accepted the ticket and no appeal would have been considered

Call me thicko if you like, but if it's for under 12, and your child is a big 10 for example, you wouldn't have a car seat anyway? :-?

[gwc1000]

So would it follow that any vehicle fitted with a child seat in one of these bays will not get a ticket? Now that could be open to abuse;)

[Bookworm]

The thought crossed my mind, gwc, I have to say... Talk of arbitrary. And where does it stop?

 

"in order for your appeal to succeed, please provide with proof of children. Please send us your children, complete with ID and DNA profile showing that the children are indeed yours..."

[pt2537]

The thought crossed my mind, gwc, I have to say... Talk of arbitrary. And where does it stop?

 

"in order for your appeal to succeed, please provide with proof of children. Please send us your children, complete with ID and DNA profile showing that the children are indeed yours..."

:lol::lol:

[crem]

The thought crossed my mind, gwc, I have to say... Talk of arbitrary. And where does it stop?

 

"in order for your appeal to succeed, please provide with proof of children. Please send us your children, complete with ID and DNA profile showing that the children are indeed yours..."

 

So if I have an adopted child can I not park there as I will be unable to provide such dna evidence? Seems so unfair to me

[kiptower]

just hang one of those " child on board " in the rear window

 

as for the pay and we will consider an appeal

 

think hes been eating to many pies in that funny cafe :lol:

 

if you go into a shop and ask to look @ something on the shelf, do you have to pay first ? NO

 

the quicker the LAWS are changed the better then the parasites can go back working for Mac Dee's

[Zamzara]

I have no real problem with people being asked to send payment with an appeal, provided it is made clear that the ticket is from a private company, this is just a request, and the request cannot be enforced.

 

If it is implied that it is a legal requirement to send payment, or to even appeal at all, then a criminal offence is committed.