HilaryFrances v Yorkshire Bank (Leeds)

[olden]

They are wonderful hils, tiring but gorgeous, Well what do you think of the OFT, taking the banks side again , but not stopping them levying charges against us until the after the test case.

[hilaryfrances]

good point val, I never thought of that

[Castlebest]

A number of judges have recognized that problem with the stays, and have either made further directions with the stay to limit the banks actions during the stay of have warned the banks that if they do take any actions during the stay the stay will be lifted immediately and the case will go to hearing.

 

Notable one of these was Carlisle v Clydesdale (was a Leeds case too) I have a transcript of the judgment in PDF format. If you want a copy PM me your email addy and I will send .

 

pete

[caro]

The transcript is also in this linked post. http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/show-post/post-1155075.html

[olden]

hello hils, when you told your court story you say to cut a long story short, could I beg you tell me the first part of your story to help me for friday? when you went infront of the judge, did he call you and ask you to speak first, what did you use did you read the skeleton argument out, and when did you present your expenditure list? that is the only item out of 98 pages I have not sent! I am getting worried already don't feel very confident about speaking out in court, never been on one!

[Castlebest]

Thanks Caro I can stop emailing it now lol

 

pete

[olden]

Hi there castle and Caro have read that now, its a bit complicated for the lay person, I would have difficulty getting involved in that, I thnk you must be very knowledgeable.

[caro]

Pleasure CB. I'll see if I can get it in the library.

[Castlebest]

Olden, read from point 11 on page 3, where the judge gives his thoughts on the banks actions during the period of the stay and Mr Toledo tries to query his decisions .

 

pete

[olden]

yes I read it again and it gets clearer, but it is all about the stopping the banks enforcement in reltaion to the charges already disputed and future

to stop them threatening is that it?

[Castlebest]

yes basically they are allowed to add charges to your account but not pursue you for recovery or inform the credit agency's of any supposed defaults.

 

If your still using your account this doesn't help a lot because the new charges will still just eat up your wages/benefits BUT if you open a parachute account and move all of your finances to that they can do what they like to your old account and they are stuck with it until after the test case

 

pete

[olden]

Hi castle about the banks may ask for costs, I thought if they consider that to have the stay, they won the hearing therby entitling them to costs?

[olden]

Hi castle, wait a minute here, you have really got me thinking now, are you saying that I can leave the overdraft which is about £4500,( under the £5000 limit ) and have all income and dds etc going into the parachue account i have opened in readiness ages ago, they write to me now and again asking questions about its non use.

[Castlebest]

its one hell of a penny when it drops isn't it you do have to make sure the recovery from your claim will cover the overdraft in your old account when all of this mess is over but basically yes.

 

If you can get your judge to use the Carlisle v Clydesdale judgment as a template there is nothing stopping you effectively putting the bank on hold too .

 

pete

[Castlebest]

Hi castle about the banks may ask for costs, I thought if they consider that to have the stay, they won the hearing therby entitling them to costs?

 

I'm honestly not sure how the costs work on appeals on county court fast track, I believe we have been very lucky to date in that costs haven't been asked for by the banks maybe zoot can shed more light on when costs do / do not apply.

 

pete

[olden]

maybe as in our particular 600 cases, the court issued the blanket stay, not the banks therefore they may not be entitled to costs??

[olden]

its one hell of a penny when it drops isn't it you do have to make sure the recovery from your claim will cover the overdraft in your old account when all of this mess is over but basically yes.

 

If you can get your judge to use the Carlisle v Clydesdale judgment as a template there is nothing stopping you effectively putting the bank on hold too .

 

pete

 

OK I think I will take 3 copies with me, but I doubt I will use it, as I will be struggling to put it into words if questioned, I am not quick enough in response to things out of my league, but it would help as I keep having to transfer money from 0% accounts tocut down the penalties, but each transfer costs 3%( all have increased from 2-2.5%) I think perhaps leave one tiny pension going in to cover the interest cost incurred on the overdraft, and tranfer others, my claim will not cover, (£1091) and I am too old to work!! and too busy with 8 grandchildren lol

[hilaryfrances]

hello Val, sorry I have not responded before but I did not see your question. Basically I got to speak first, I think this is because I was the only one who had done the job in the corredt manner. By the way none of the banks had prepared anything either and the solicitor representing YB was not even aware I was no longer a customer of theirs. The judge is not fierce, they realise we are out of our depth and not criminals, although he did remind everyone that it is a criminal offence to write out cheques for which there are insuffiecent funds in the account to cover. He did not seem to grasp the fact that YB pincjed your money before you had a chance to pay people. Once the judge has your bundle he will read it, before your hearing, so he will already have read your financial statement. Which court are you at? Hils

[olden]

Hi hils, Cardiff CC, the thing is I am one of those people who have run our own business on the accounts and wages side and am used to writing letters managing purchase and sales ledgers, chasing payments etc, but when it comes to speaking in public, I am what you might call shy of it.

 

Did you stand up and just read out your skeleton argument?

[hilaryfrances]

no I was not asked to do so, I was just asked to state my case. I believe it is normal to just read out your witness statement though. I was not asked to do this either. The hearing I was involved in was much "bigger" than I was expecting and much "bigger" than is the norm so dont worry. Everyone is nervous

[Castlebest]

All the HSBC barrister who was up against me said was all the points she wanted to make were contained in her skeleton argument, she didn't go into any detail verbally.

 

pete

[olden]

when you say the banks barrister said that her points contained in her sleleton argument, aren't they supposed to supply us and the court with paperwork before the hearing as we have? I thought the idea was that each others before the hearing

[Castlebest]

She did just before we went into court... I couldnt say a lot because I did exactly the same to her

 

pete

[olden]

so as I have submitted 98 pages including the skeleton, and they have sent me zilch, is that a point to raise?

[hilaryfrances]

could be olden, I was not quick enough to say something! Thought about it when I got home. ho hum hindsight is a wonderful thing, the solicitor was not even aware that I no longer had a YB account, thats how well prepared she was good luck missus HILS