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The claim includes statutory interest under S.69 of the County Courts Act 1984 at a rate of 8% per annum from the date of assignment to the date of the issue of these proceedings in the sum of £49.15 The Claimant claims the sum of £972 What is the total value of the claim? £1112 Have you received prior notice of a claim being issued pursuant to paragraph 3 of the PAPDC (Pre Action Protocol) ? I dont know the details of the PAPDC to know if it was pursuant to paragraph 3, but I did receive a Letter of Claim with a questionaire/form to fill. Have you changed your address since the time at which the debt referred to in the claim was allegedly incurred? No Is the claim for - a Bank Account (Overdraft) or credit card or loan or catalogue or mobile phone account? Credit Card When did you enter into the original agreement before or after April 2007 ? no Do you recall how you entered into the agreement...On line /In branch/By post ? Online Is the debt showing on your credit reference files (Experian/Equifax /Etc...) ? Yes Has the claim been issued by the original creditor or was the account assigned and it is the Debt purchaser who has issued the claim. Assigned/purchaser Were you aware the account had been assigned – did you receive a Notice of Assignment? I was aware, I'm not certain I received a 'Notice of Assignment' from Capital One but may have been informed the account had been sold without such a title on the letter? Did you receive a Default Notice from the original creditor? Yes Have you been receiving statutory notices headed “Notice of Sums in Arrears”  or " Notice of Arrears "– at least once a year ? Not since the debt purchase, and not from Capital One. Why did you cease payments? I can't remember - it was the tail end of the pandemic and I may not have had enough income to keep up payments - I am self-employed and work in the event industry - at that time. I also had a bank account that didn't allow direct debits and may have just forgotten payments and became annoyed at fines for late payments. What was the date of your last payment? Appears to be 20/4/2022 Was there a dispute with the original creditor that remains unresolved? No Did you communicate any financial problems to the original creditor and make any attempt to enter into a debt management plan? No Here is my Defence: Defence - 1. The Defendant contends that the particulars of claim are vague and generic in nature. The Defendant accordingly sets out its case below and relies on CPR r 16.5 (3) in relation to any particular allegation to which a specific response has not been made. 2. Paragraph 1 is noted. I have in the past had an agreement with Capital One but do not recognise this specific account number or recollect any outstanding debt and have therefore requested clarification by way of a CPR 31.14 and section 78 request.. 3. Paragraph 2 is denied. I am unaware of having been served with a Default Notice pursuant to the Consumer Credit Act 1974. 4. Paragraph 3 is denied. I am unaware of any legal assignment or Notice of Assignment pursuant to the Law and Property Act 1925 Section 136(1) 5. The Defendant has sent a request by way of a section 78 pursuant to the Consumer Credit Act 1974, for a copy of the agreement, the Claimant has yet to comply and remains in default of said request. 6. A further request has been made via CPR 31.14 to the Claimants solicitor, requesting disclosure of documents on which the Claimant is basing their claim. The Claimant has not complied and to date nothing has been received. 7. It is therefore not accepted with regards to the Defendant owing any monies to the Claimant and the Claimant is put to strict proof to: a) show how the Defendant has entered into an agreement and; b) show how the Claimant has reached the amount claimed for and; c) show the nature of the breach and evidence by way of a Default Notice pursuant to sec 88 CCA1974 d) show how the Claimant has the legal right, either under statute or equity to issue a claim 8. As per Civil Procedure 16.5 it is expected that the claimants prove the allegation that the money is owed 9. On the alternative, as the Claimant is an assignee of a debt, it is denied that the Claimant has the right to lay a claim due to contraventions of section 136 of the Law of Property Act and section 82A of the Consumer Credit Act 1974 10. By reasons of the facts and matters set out above, it is denied that the Claimant is entitled to the relief claimed or any relief. .................. Please note that I had to write a defence quite quickly as I hit the deadline. At the time of writing the defence, I hadn't been able to find correspondence from Capital One, but had since found default letter etc. I submitted CCA request and CPR 31.14. However, I didn't get any proof of postage or use registered post for the CPR (an oversight) but did with the CCA request. I received a pack which included a letter from Overdales, going over the defence I'd filed, as well as letters of Lowells and reprints of letters from Capital One. But I have no idea if this pack is in response to the CCA request or the CPR ! I would have expected two separate responses ... although I do know they are both the same company. Looking over the pack today, and looking through old emails .. I find some discrepancies in the Capital One default letters (notice of default and Claim of default). They are both dated *before* an email I have stating that a default can be avoided. The one single page of agreement sent (so not the full agreement) has a 16 digit number at the top in small print, next to 'Capital One' which corresponds to a number called 'PURN' printed at the top of each of the 10 pages of ins and outs of the account (they're not official statements, but a list of monthly goings) yet no mention anywhere on either of the account number. I cant really scan them at the moment - I can later tomorrow, but that will be after the mediation call I'm sure. I guess I may be on my own for this mediation ... I am not certain the CCA request has been satisfied .. or if the CPR has been . And then I appear to have evidence that the Default notices provided are fabricated ? Yet, I do have (elsewhere ... not at home) Default letters from Capital One I can check ..
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Nationwide - just starting!


martinwhite
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Hi,

 

I have a Flexaccount with them, and I'm about to get the ball rolling by sending a message using the secure messaging area of their website. I'm using the Data Protection request letter from the library.

 

I'm going to cut and paste the contents into a word file for the record, as there is no way of cc'ing to my email address from there.

 

Will keep you all posted!

 

Cheers,

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This is fine but you should also ask them for details of manual intervention in the raising of these charges. Do not tell them why you want this information - they will have had enough requests over the last few weeks to be able to work it out for themselves (maybe??) :)

The law, in its majestic equality, forbids the rich as well as the poor to sleep under bridges, to beg in the streets, and to steal bread.

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Hi Richard,

 

Was in a bit too much of a rush to get started with my 1st message. Realised that I might get flamed for not thoroughly reading the library items, so went off there and copied the letter. hence the modified 1st post here!!

 

Bombs away! Will let you know what happens. Just to clarify, the 40 days is 40 working days?

 

Thanks,

 

M

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Just for completeness' sake (and given the contents of the other thread "Nationwide - could this be useful) here is the message I sent to Nationwide via secure messaging:

 

Clearly the request for information regarding manual intervention is in there.

 

Martin

 

----------------------------------------------

 

Data Protection Act disclosure request

 

 

 

Dear Sir/Madam

 

 

ACCOUNT NUMBER: xxxxxxxx

 

 

Please supply me with a complete list of transactions and charges relating to my bank account since 2000. Alternatively a complete set of bank statements for that period will be acceptable.

 

Additionally where there has been any event in my account history over this period which has required manual intervention by any member of your staff or any other person, I require disclosure of any indication or notes which have either caused or resulted in that manual intervention or other evidence of that manual intervention in relation to my banking busines with you.

 

If you are unable to supply data relating to manual intervention because there has been no such manual intervention then please be kind as to confirm this in your response to this request.

 

You have 40 days in which to comply.

 

 

Yours faithfully,

 

Martin White

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Reply today re: my DPA request:

 

Dear Member,

 

Thank you for your message.

 

Please contact your account holding branch of Nationwide, where a member of staff will be happy to assist you further and apply the necessary steps to process your request.

 

Please use the following link to locate your nearest branch, agency or cash machine:

 

http://www.nationwide.co.uk/branchfinder

 

If you require any further assistance, please do not hesitate to contact us.

 

Regards,

 

Rafiq Miah

Nationwide Direct

 

http://www.nationwide.co.uk

Nationwide. Proud to be different.

 

I am assuming that I should just reiterate that the 40 days are counting down now and that failure to comply will result in a complaint to the Information Commissioner? Why should I care how their internal structures work? I've sent a perfectly valid request to the bank via my normal methods of communication.

 

Am I on the right track?

 

Thanks

 

M

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Yes. You are on the right track.

 

Here is a link to a thread where I have suggested a particular style of response.

http://www.bankactiongroup.co.uk/forum/viewtopic.php?t=1710

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I'm waiting for a response to my DPA request. Nothing has been heard since my last message telling them I've already sent them all they need.

 

My paper statements that I have go back to the beginning of last year. I have noticed a few interesting items.

 

There are a few, maybe five (in that timeframe), instances where a DD was returned for LESS than the value of the return fee. One was a DD for £5! They charged me £27.50 for that! Another was a standing order for £10. Another £20-odd.

 

I am aware that this example is VERY clearly mentioned in the case law as a classic definition of a penalty.

 

My question is, when writing to them with the preliminary and LBA letters, should I emphasise these instances, or would that make them focus on them rather than the whole claim, i.e. if I was claiming £1500, and these items that are as described above, total say £75, would that encourage them to say "ok, here's your £75, the others are lawful because the DD item was greater than the return fee".

 

(I know that this isn't the legal position, and so do they, but the banks will try anything, won't they? :wink: )

 

Thanks,

M

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They are all subject to the same principle so my view is that they all carry equal weight. Furthermore, you are making one claim. As far as you are concerned it is not severable. treat it that way.

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Hang on, you didn't say in court. You were referring to your corespondence with the bank.

 

Of course in court you would emphasise every little bit of nastiness that you had suffered at the hands of the bank.

 

When you are dealing with the bank, you make it clear that all of their charges are unacceptable and that you do not distinguish between them

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I was just beginning to wonder about Nationwide. I made requests for DPA disclosures on 8th March and had only received a "contact your branch" reply in that time. I'd replied immediately with "bugger off, I've already done all I need to do, you need to review your legal obligations" (or words to that effect).

 

Lo and behold, today I have received the following message:

Dear Mr White,

 

Thank you for your message.

 

Please accept my sincerest apologies for any inconvenience caused in the delay in responding back to your message.

 

I confirm I have forwarded your message on to the Data Protection Team in order to action your request.

 

If you require any further assistance, please do not hesitate to contact us.

 

Regards,

 

Rafiq Miah

Nationwide Direct

 

http://www.nationwide.co.uk

Nationwide. Proud to be different.

 

 

 

-----Original Message-----

 

 

From: [email protected]

Sent: 14 Mar 06 21:13:15

To: [email protected]

Cc:

Subject: General

 

I have already sent a clearly marked Data Protection Act disclosure request to Nationwide Building Society through my normal channels of communication. As such the 40 days for compliance are already ticking away. I do not need to make contact with my Branch, as you have instructed, for this to be a valid request.

 

I am sure that I do not need to remind Nationwide of its statutory and contractual duty to comply with my reasonable requests under UK legislation, namely the Data Protection Act.

 

If I have not received the requested information before April 20th, I will be forced to make a written complaint to the Information Commissioner without further correspondence with you.

 

Best regards,

 

Martin White

--------------------- Original Message ---------------------

Subject: Re: General Received: 14 March 2006

Dear Member,

 

Thank you for your message.

 

Please contact your account holding branch of Nationwide, where a member of staff will be happy to assist you further and apply the necessary steps to process your request.

 

Please use the following link to locate your nearest branch, agency or cash machine:

 

http://www.nationwide.co.uk/branchfinder

 

If you require any further assistance, please do not hesitate to contact us.

 

Regards,

 

Rafiq Miah

Nationwide Direct

 

http://www.nationwide.co.uk

Nationwide. Proud to be different.

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Letter received today from Nationwide:

...The law allows 40 days for a subject access request to be completed from the time we are given sufficient information to carry out the request.

 

As you have made your request in order to obtain specific information, rather than all the personal information we hold, we may be able to provide the details you require in a shorter timescale.

 

I have today requested duplicate statements for the account you requested, however the letter we received has not been signed and we will require a signature before sending out the completed request, please sign and return the enclosed form, in the pre-paid envelope provided.

 

Should you require all the information Nationwide holds on this account or any others that you have, please let me know in writing, quoting the relevent account numbers. In addition if you have had dealings with other areas within Nationwide who may hold information on you please let us know so that we can check for your personal data in these areas. In order to find and additional information, we will need:

-The address of any branch, other than the branch where you opened the account, which you have used on a regular basis.

- Dates of your contact and details of other areas of the Society with which you have had dealings e.g. Customer Service Team, Lending Control, Member Service, On Line Bank

-Any other information which will assist us in locating your personal information.

 

blah blah blah

 

Christopher Swailes

Data Protection Administrator.

 

Not the reply I was hoping for. Firstly, those damned forms!! I don't need to write one out, and does the DPA really need a signature when a) the request came from a secure messaging area of the online banking site and b) it's being posted to the address where the account is registered.

 

My reply will be in writing, using their envelope, (can/should I still do recorded delivery?) along these lines.

 

"My requests were from your secure messaging area, so I do not believe that a signature is necessary, it is not a requirement of the Act.

 

I made two requests via this route, on the 8th and 9th of March, regarding my current account and credit card account, detailing my account numbers clearly in each message already. Both messages were clearly marked "Data Protection Act Disclosure Request". Both requests were quite clear and exact in specifying the information I require. The 40days, then, starts from 8th and 9th March respectively not the date you receive this letter.

 

The form you have asked me to fill in is not a requirement of the Act and is not necessary for my message to be a Data Protection Act Disclosure request."

 

Does this seem ok?

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If I didn't know better, I would suspect that it's an attempt to fob me off!!

 

I am a bit undecided as to whether I should chort circuit the system and go to the branch as you say. Unfortunately, statements alone are not all the information I require. I want the disclosure of manual intervention too. They say that they have ordered the statements.....

 

I was a bit surprised to see in their letter "tell us where to look, and who you spoke to and when, and we might have a go at looking for you". Not good enough I thought.

 

I think the letter will have to go off along the lines I mentioned. Unless someone else has a better plan?

 

thanks,

 

Martin

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Message received from Nationwide re: DPR

 

Subject: Nationwide Building Society Received: 24 March 2006

Dear Mr White,

 

Thank you for your message.

 

I have spoken with our Data Protection Department today and they have confirmed that an acknowledgement letter was sent to you on 20 March 2006. Enclosed with this letter was a form that requires your signature. You will need to send this form back before your request can be actioned.

 

Please contact me again if you require any further assistance.

 

Regards,

 

Lynne Edwards

Nationwide Direct

 

My reply this evening:

 

Hi,

 

My requests were from your secure messaging area, so I do not believe that a signature is necessary, it is not a requirement of the Act. Please provide authority to the contrary if you have it.

 

I made two requests via this route, on the 8th and 9th of March, regarding my current account and credit card account, detailing my account numbers clearly in each message already. Both messages were clearly marked "Data Protection Act Disclosure Request". Both requests were quite clear and exact in specifying the information I require. The 40days, then, starts from 8th and 9th March respectively not the date you receive this message.

 

The form you have asked me to fill in is not a requirement of the Act and is not necessary for my message to be a Data Protection Act Disclosure request.

 

Please fulfill my reasonable requests without further prevarication or I will be forced to make a complaint to the Information Commissioner immediately without waiting the 40 days.

 

Best regards,

 

Martin White

 

 

If anyone spots any errors, please let me know.

 

Thanks

 

M

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I think that for DPA requests they are entitled to insist on writing and a signature. However, they are not entitled to insist n a particular form.

 

Vehck the IC's website which is linked in the library.

 

Also I notice that they say there that you can take the failure to comply with a DPA request to court just on its own.

They have a pamplet on their website called "Taking a case to court".

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Just checked the actual DPA 1998 as linked in the library. It may be worth pointing out the following for others: (as a result of my mistakes :oops:)

 

Section 7, subsection 2

A data controller is not obliged to supply any information under subsection (1) unless he has received-

 

(a) a request in writing, and

(b) except in prescribed cases, such fee (not exceeding the prescribed maximum) as he may require.

 

Section 7, subsection 3

A data controller is not obliged to comply with a request under this section unless he is supplied with such information as he may reasonably require in order to satisfy himself as to the identity of the person making the request and to locate the information which that person seeks.

 

Section 7 subsection 8

Subject to subsection (4) (disclosure of information relating to another person - Martin), a data controller shall comply with a request under this section promptly and in any event before the end of the prescribed period beginning with the relevant day.

 

Therefore the forty days would start from the first point at which they have the £10 (if they have requested it) and the written request.

 

It would appear that the request must be in writing - but can email or secure messages not be construed as writing? Emails have been held to have contractual significance. As for the request for a signature, this is reasonable enough to me, unless the request comes from a source from which identity has already been confirmed. To me this includes online banking. After all, the consequences of access to the account by someone other than the account holder are at least equivalent to the data being received by someone other than the account holder.

 

Hence I am inclined to believe that everything that I have said to Nationwide so far holds up.

 

Any other opinions?

 

Martin

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In addition it's worth noting the content of ss8 - the duty to act promptly. In other words waiting 39 days and then claiming that they couldn't act without a cheque, (or some other excuse) will not be a defence to not complying with the request.

 

Martin

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In addition it's worth noting the content of ss8 - the duty to act promptly. In other words waiting 39 days and then claiming that they couldn't act without a cheque, (or some other excuse) will not be a defence to not complying with the request.

 

Martin

I'm not sure that I agree with this. Subsection 2 which you have quoted above makes it clear that it is not a DPA "request" until the fee is paid.

Failure to pay a fee is a defence.

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