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    • further polished WS using above suggestions and also included couple of more modifications highlighted in orange are those ok to include?   Background   1.1  The Defendant received the Parking Charge Notice (PCN) on the 06th of January 2020 following the vehicle being parked at Arla Old Dairy, South Ruislip on the 05th of December 2019.   Unfair PCN   2.1  On 19th December 2023 the Defendant sent the Claimant's solicitors a CPR request.  As shown in Exhibit 1 (pages 7-13) sent by the solicitors the signage displayed in their evidence clearly shows a £60.00 parking charge notice (which will be reduced to £30 if paid within 14 days of issue).  2.2  Yet the PCN sent by the Claimant is for a £100.00 parking charge notice (reduced to £60 if paid within 30 days of issue).   2.3        The Claimant relies on signage to create a contract.  It is unlawful for the Claimant to write that the charge is £60 on their signs and then send demands for £100.    2.4        The unlawful £100 charge is also the basis for the Claimant's Particulars of Claim.  No Locus Standi  3.1  I do not believe a contract with the landowner, that is provided following the defendant’s CPR request, gives MET Parking Services a right to bring claims in their own name. Definition of “Relevant contract” from the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012, Schedule 4,  2 [1] means a contract Including a contract arising only when the vehicle was parked on the relevant land between the driver and a person who is-   (a) the owner or occupier of the land; or   (b) Authorised, under or by virtue of arrangements made by the owner or occupier of the land, to enter into a contract with the driver requiring the payment of parking charges in respect of the parking of the vehicle on the land. According to https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2006/46/section/44   For a contract to be valid, it requires a director from each company to sign and then two independent witnesses must confirm those signatures.   3.2  The Defendant requested to see such a contract in the CPR request.  The fact that no contract has been produced with the witness signatures present means the contract has not been validly executed. Therefore, there can be no contract established between MET Parking Services and the motorist. Even if “Parking in Electric Bay” could form a contract (which it cannot), it is immaterial. There is no valid contract.  Illegal Conduct – No Contract Formed   4.1 At the time of writing, the Claimant has failed to provide the following, in response to the CPR request from myself.   4.2        The legal contract between the Claimant and the landowner (which in this case is Standard Life Investments UK) to provide evidence that there is an agreement in place with landowner with the necessary authority to issue parking charge notices and to pursue payment by means of litigation.   4.3 Proof of planning permission granted for signage etc under the Town and country Planning Act 1990. Lack of planning permission is a criminal offence under this Act and no contract can be formed where criminality is involved.   4.4        I also do not believe the claimant possesses these documents.   No Keeper Liability   5.1        The defendant was not the driver at the time and date mentioned in the PCN and the claimant has not established keeper liability under schedule 4 of the PoFA 2012. In this matter, the defendant puts it to the claimant to produce strict proof as to who was driving at the time.   5.2 The claimant in their Notice To Keeper also failed to comply with PoFA 2012 Schedule 4 section 9[2][f] while mentioning “the right to recover from the keeper so much of that parking charge as remains unpaid” where they did not include statement “(if all the applicable conditions under this Schedule are met)”.     5.3         The claimant did not mention parking period, times on the photographs are separate from the PCN and in any case are that arrival and departure times not the parking period since their times include driving to and from the parking space as a minimum and can include extra time to allow pedestrians and other vehicles to pass in front.    Protection of Freedoms Act 2012   The notice must -   (a) specify the vehicle, the relevant land on which it was parked and the period of parking to which the notice relates;  22. In the persuasive judgement K4GF167G - Premier Park Ltd v Mr Mathur - Horsham County Court – 5 January 2024 it was on this very point that the judge dismissed this claim.  5.4  A the PCN does not comply with the Act the Defendant as keeper is not liable.  No Breach of Contract   6.1       No breach of contract occurred because the PCN and contract provided as part of the defendant’s CPR request shows different post code, PCN shows HA4 0EY while contract shows HA4 0FY. According to PCN defendant parked on HA4 0EY which does not appear to be subject to the postcode covered by the contract.  6.2         The entrance sign does not mention anything about there being other terms inside the car park so does not offer a contract which makes it only an offer to treat,  Interest  7.1  It is unreasonable for the Claimant to delay litigation for  Double Recovery   7.2  The claim is littered with made-up charges.  7.3  As noted above, the Claimant's signs state a £60 charge yet their PCN is for £100.  7.4  As well as the £100 parking charge, the Claimant seeks recovery of an additional £70.  This is simply a poor attempt to circumvent the legal costs cap at small claims.  7.5 Since 2019, many County Courts have considered claims in excess of £100 to be an abuse of process leading to them being struck out ab initio. An example, in the Caernarfon Court in VCS v Davies, case No. FTQZ4W28 on 4th September 2019, District Judge Jones-Evans stated “Upon it being recorded that District Judge Jones- Evans has over a very significant period of time warned advocates (...) in many cases of this nature before this court that their claim for £60 is unenforceable in law and is an abuse of process and is nothing more than a poor attempt to go behind the decision of the Supreme Court v Beavis which inter alia decided that a figure of £160 as a global sum claimed in this case would be a penalty and not a genuine pre-estimate of loss and therefore unenforceable in law and if the practice continued, he would treat all cases as a claim for £160 and therefore a penalty and unenforceable in law it is hereby declared (…) the claim is struck out and declared to be wholly without merit and an abuse of process.”  7.6 In Claim Nos. F0DP806M and F0DP201T, District Judge Taylor echoed earlier General Judgment or Orders of District Judge Grand, stating ''It is ordered that the claim is struck out as an abuse of process. The claim contains a substantial charge additional to the parking charge which it is alleged the Defendant contracted to pay. This additional charge is not recoverabl15e under the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012, Schedule 4 nor with reference to the judgment in Parking Eye v Beavis. It is an abuse of process from the Claimant to issue a knowingly inflated claim for an additional sum which it is not entitled to recover. This order has been made by the court of its own initiative without a hearing pursuant to CPR Rule 3.3(4)) of the Civil Procedure Rules 1998...''  7.7 In the persuasive case of G4QZ465V - Excel Parking Services Ltd v Wilkinson – Bradford County Court -2 July 2020 (Exhibit 4) the judge had decided that Excel had won. However, due to Excel adding on the £60 the Judge dismissed the case.  7.8        The addition of costs not previously specified on signage are also in breach of the Consumer Rights Act 2015, Schedule 2, specifically paras 6, 10 and 14.   7.9        It is the Defendant’s position that the Claimant in this case has knowingly submitted inflated costs and thus the entire claim should be similarly struck out in accordance with Civil Procedure Rule 3.3(4).   In Conclusion   8.1        I invite the court to dismiss the claim.  Statement of Truth  I believe that the facts stated in this witness statement are true. I understand that proceedings for contempt of court may be brought against anyone who makes, or causes to be made, a false statement in a document verified by a statement of truth without an honest belief in its truth.   
    • Well the difference is that in all our other cases It was Kev who was trying to entrap the motorist so sticking two fingers up to him and daring him to try court was from a position of strength. In your case, sorry, you made a mistake so you're not in the position of strength.  I've looked on Google Maps and the signs are few & far between as per Kev's MO, but there is an entrance sign saying "Pay & Display" (and you've admitted in writing that you knew you had to pay) and the signs by the payment machines do say "Sea View Car Park" (and you've admitted in writing you paid the wrong car park ... and maybe outed yourself as the driver). Something I missed in my previous post is that the LoC is only for one ticket, not two. Sorry, but it's impossible to definitively advise what to so. Personally I'd probably gamble on Kev being a serial bottler of court and reply with a snotty letter ridiculing the signage (given you mentioned the signage in your appeal) - but it is a gamble.  
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Ruthbridge Ltd & Hillesden Securities


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I sent a CCA request on the 21/3/07 to Ruthbridge Ltd after receiving a letter headed Notice before proceedings. On the 16/4/07 they sent me another letter and attached to this was a computer print out with a customer number and agreement ref number and a list of transactions. Definately no true copy of an agreement etc. So I sat patiently waiting for the 42 day deadline.

 

In the meantime I received my cr files and noticed that I have a default on one of my files regarding this debt but it was made by Hillesden Securities so I sent off a CCA to them with a view to if they cannot produce the agreement I would then push to have the default removed from my cr file.

Hillesden have acknowledge my letter and have stated they will contact their client for a copy of the orginal agreement and when this becomes available they will forward it to me. Secondly if they are unable for forwad a copy of the orignal they will supply a true copy of the document which will comply with section 78 of the consumer credit act 1974.

 

Today I have received another letter from Ruthbridge which says:

 

WITHOUT PREJUDICE

 

They are no longer prepared to correspond with me further regarding this matter and will be advising their client, no later than 18/5/07 to issue a petition for my bankruptcy etc etc.

 

However as a final opportunity to avoid legal proceedings they are prepared to accept a lump sum as full and final settlement and as an added incentive will mark my cr file as 'satisfied'

 

My questions are:

 

1. Can 2 dca's chase the same debt?

 

2. Ruthbridge will have committed an offence on Friday so what do I do next?

 

3. Who acutally owns the debt Hillesden or Ruthbridge?

 

The orginal debt was for Welcome finance back in 2002 and due a long term illnesss and losing my job as a result I was unable to continue payments.

 

 

Any help with this will be gratefully appreciated.

 

Lan

No one can make you feel inferior without your consent :)

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I sent a CCA request on the 21/3/07 to Ruthbridge Ltd after receiving a letter headed Notice before proceedings. On the 16/4/07 they sent me another letter and attached to this was a computer print out with a customer number and agreement ref number and a list of transactions. Definately no true copy of an agreement etc. So I sat patiently waiting for the 42 day deadline.

 

In the meantime I received my cr files and noticed that I have a default on one of my files regarding this debt but it was made by Hillesden Securities so I sent off a CCA to them with a view to if they cannot produce the agreement I would then push to have the default removed from my cr file.

Hillesden have acknowledge my letter and have stated they will contact their client for a copy of the orginal agreement and when this becomes available they will forward it to me. Secondly if they are unable for forwad a copy of the orignal they will supply a true copy of the document which will comply with section 78 of the consumer credit act 1974.

 

Today I have received another letter from Ruthbridge which says:

 

WITHOUT PREJUDICE

 

They are no longer prepared to correspond with me further regarding this matter and will be advising their client, no later than 18/5/07 to issue a petition for my bankruptcy etc etc.

 

However as a final opportunity to avoid legal proceedings they are prepared to accept a lump sum as full and final settlement and as an added incentive will mark my cr file as 'satisfied'

 

My questions are:

 

1. Can 2 dca's chase the same debt?

 

2. Ruthbridge will have committed an offence on Friday so what do I do next?

 

3. Who acutally owns the debt Hillesden or Ruthbridge?

 

The orginal debt was for Welcome finance back in 2002 and due a long term illnesss and losing my job as a result I was unable to continue payments.

 

 

Any help with this will be gratefully appreciated.

 

Lan

 

1. No, they can't - it's against OFT guidelines. Report them.

 

2. They've already been naughty by pursuing you for the debt while not producing the CCA - again, agaisnt OFt guidelines, again - report them.

 

3. Absolutely no idea - it's very difficult to say under these circumstances. Contact your local TS and see if they can help you to get to the bottom of it.

All help is merely my opinion only - please seek legal advice if you need to as I am only qualified in SEN law.

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Thanks Tiglet I thought as much but just wanted to hear it from someone else :)

 

Is there a letter that I send to Ruthbridge re their non-compliance and offence and to notify that they are to remove my details etc from their records?

 

Lan

No one can make you feel inferior without your consent :)

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I can't find the letter I am looking for, can someone point me in the right direction.

 

I am looking for the letter to send to a dca who has failed to provide me my CCA request.

 

Thanks

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I can't find it, so amend this:

 

Your address

Their address

Date

Dear Sir/Madam

Re: − Reference Number xxxx

With reference to my letter dated xx/xx/xxwhich was delivered via recorded delivery to your offices on xx/xx/xx.

In my letter, I made a formal request for a copy of the signed, executed credit agreement for the above numbered xxx account under section 77(1) and section 78(1) of the Consumer Credit Act. In addition, a statement of my account should have been sent along with any other document mentioned in the credit agreement.

The Consumer Credit Act allows 12 working days for this request to be carried out before your company enter into a default situation. If the request is not satisfied after a further 30 calendar days, your company commit an offence. These time limits expired on xx/xx/xx and xx/xx/xx respectively.

As you are no doubt aware subsection (6) states:

“If the creditor under an agreement fails to comply with subsection (1)—

(a) He is not entitled, while the default continues, to enforce the agreement; and

(b) If the default continues for one month he commits an offence. “

Therefore as at xx/xx/xx this account became unenforceable at law and it is now my intention to refer this matter to the enforcement authorities should I not receive a satisfactory response within seven days.

Any default notices or adverse comments your company have recorded on my credit reference file should be immediately removed.

Failure to respond favourably to this letter within seven days of receipt will result in immediate litigation being commenced against your company without further notice.

I await your rapid response.

Yours faithfully

Name

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All help is merely my opinion only - please seek legal advice if you need to as I am only qualified in SEN law.

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No probs - let me know how you get on.

All help is merely my opinion only - please seek legal advice if you need to as I am only qualified in SEN law.

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I have received from Hillesden a copy of the credit agreement requested in my CCA request last week. Now Hillesden have not attempted to request payments, I have had no correspondence from them whatsoever. I only sent the CCA request as they had a default on my cr file.

 

I have been hounded by Ruthbridge for the said debt and threatening bankruptcy proceedings if I don't pay up. They have defaulted on the CCA request and on Friday will have committed an offence.

 

Where do I stand now?

 

1. Hillesden have provided the agreement but there is no terms and conditions.

 

2. They have never chased me for the debt only put a default on my cr file.

 

3 Ruthbridge haven't supplied anything and are still chasing me for payment.

 

Any suggestions?

 

Lan

No one can make you feel inferior without your consent :)

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Are you sure it is a complete CCA? The fact that they have not provided T&C's sounds a bit dodgy to me. The fact Ruthbridge haven't provided one means that once they default they cannot then hound you for the debt until they provide it. Let them default for the further 30 calendar days before you report them.

 

Check that it isn't an application form, is signed by both parties and has all prescribed terms etc on. Alternatively, scan it in, removing all identifying features (your name, address, DOB etc) and we can have a look at it for you on here.

All help is merely my opinion only - please seek legal advice if you need to as I am only qualified in SEN law.

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Hi Tiglet

 

It is definately part of a Credit Agreement but refers to terms and conditions "over the page" (which have not been included), from what I can see but I will scan it and post later on tonight as I have to go to work shortly.

 

The debt is from 2002 and with Welcome Finance, Ruthbridge are already in default and the further 30 days is up on Friday (criminal offence commited so will be reported). At the moment Ruthbridge are the least of my worries, I just want to know who owns the debt Hillesden or Ruthbridge as surely they both can't!!

 

Both Ruthbridge and Hillesden refer to "their clients Welcome Finance" in their letters. I was of the understanding that only one dca was allowed to collect an alledged debt, because Hillesden say they are acting on behalf of Welcome Finance do they have the right to put a default notice on my cr file? Also if Ruthbridge are trying to collect why do Hillesden still have access to my info? Is this too not right and what can I do about this?

No one can make you feel inferior without your consent :)

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Oh, I so sound like a stuck record on this forum :) . Report welcome finance to the OFT as you are right, they should not be using two DCA's for one account. However, it is possible that one of the DCA's is employing another DCA, so you may want to call them both and double check exactly who their client is.

 

It gets very confusing in their murky world, doesn't it?

All help is merely my opinion only - please seek legal advice if you need to as I am only qualified in SEN law.

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Very confusing, I knew this wasn't going to be easy, but for heavens sake the left hand doens't seem to know what the right hand is doing with these lot!! I will contact them both in writing as they don't have my telephone number and I don't want them to start harrassing me over the phone at this stage! I have searched the internet and haven't found a connection between the 2 companies, but I will certainly be demanding to know what is what!!

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This agreement does not comply with Sectin 60 2 (b)of the COnsumer Credit Act Form & content of agreements...which says must contain certain requirements to ensure that specified information is clearly brought to the attention of the debtor or hirer, and that one part of a document is not given insufficient or excessive prominence compared with another.

e.g the interst rate staes APR (big letters) but the mention that this can be varied is in the small print ( variation in accordance with clause b overleaf) this does not comply with that section.

the loan agreemnet should also state VERY cleary that it is a variale rate interest loan agreement and stated in the top section of the agreement (header). This is not a lawful agreement, it is full of holes.

 

sparkie1723

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I absolutely agree - the fact they did not provide the otehrs items they should have is a problem for them too.

 

Sorry, drinking wine - too stressed - will post in full tomorrow, no doubt with a splitting headache.

All help is merely my opinion only - please seek legal advice if you need to as I am only qualified in SEN law.

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Whiskey - it will cure whatever ales you.

 

If it's flu, heat some lemon 7 honey and then add it to the whisky.

 

Not as mad as it sounds - honey has antiseptic properties and lemon has vitamin C.

 

Whiskey will help you sleep!

All help is merely my opinion only - please seek legal advice if you need to as I am only qualified in SEN law.

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Well I feel sooo much better this morning and I am ready to start fighting these idiots all the way!!

No one can make you feel inferior without your consent :)

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Hi Tiglet and Sparkie

 

could you give me your thoughts on the above credit agreement sent by Hillesdens. I would like to get my facts right before I contact them again.

 

Cheers for all your help to date.

 

Lan

No one can make you feel inferior without your consent :)

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