Ruthbridge Ltd & Hillesden Securities

[LAN01]

I sent a CCA request on the 21/3/07 to Ruthbridge Ltd after receiving a letter headed Notice before proceedings. On the 16/4/07 they sent me another letter and attached to this was a computer print out with a customer number and agreement ref number and a list of transactions. Definately no true copy of an agreement etc. So I sat patiently waiting for the 42 day deadline.

 

In the meantime I received my cr files and noticed that I have a default on one of my files regarding this debt but it was made by Hillesden Securities so I sent off a CCA to them with a view to if they cannot produce the agreement I would then push to have the default removed from my cr file.

Hillesden have acknowledge my letter and have stated they will contact their client for a copy of the orginal agreement and when this becomes available they will forward it to me. Secondly if they are unable for forwad a copy of the orignal they will supply a true copy of the document which will comply with section 78 of the consumer credit act 1974.

 

Today I have received another letter from Ruthbridge which says:

 

WITHOUT PREJUDICE

 

They are no longer prepared to correspond with me further regarding this matter and will be advising their client, no later than 18/5/07 to issue a petition for my bankruptcy etc etc.

 

However as a final opportunity to avoid legal proceedings they are prepared to accept a lump sum as full and final settlement and as an added incentive will mark my cr file as 'satisfied'

 

My questions are:

 

1. Can 2 dca's chase the same debt?

 

2. Ruthbridge will have committed an offence on Friday so what do I do next?

 

3. Who acutally owns the debt Hillesden or Ruthbridge?

 

The orginal debt was for Welcome finance back in 2002 and due a long term illnesss and losing my job as a result I was unable to continue payments.

 

 

Any help with this will be gratefully appreciated.

 

Lan

[tiglet]

I sent a CCA request on the 21/3/07 to Ruthbridge Ltd after receiving a letter headed Notice before proceedings. On the 16/4/07 they sent me another letter and attached to this was a computer print out with a customer number and agreement ref number and a list of transactions. Definately no true copy of an agreement etc. So I sat patiently waiting for the 42 day deadline.

 

In the meantime I received my cr files and noticed that I have a default on one of my files regarding this debt but it was made by Hillesden Securities so I sent off a CCA to them with a view to if they cannot produce the agreement I would then push to have the default removed from my cr file.

Hillesden have acknowledge my letter and have stated they will contact their client for a copy of the orginal agreement and when this becomes available they will forward it to me. Secondly if they are unable for forwad a copy of the orignal they will supply a true copy of the document which will comply with section 78 of the consumer credit act 1974.

 

Today I have received another letter from Ruthbridge which says:

 

WITHOUT PREJUDICE

 

They are no longer prepared to correspond with me further regarding this matter and will be advising their client, no later than 18/5/07 to issue a petition for my bankruptcy etc etc.

 

However as a final opportunity to avoid legal proceedings they are prepared to accept a lump sum as full and final settlement and as an added incentive will mark my cr file as 'satisfied'

 

My questions are:

 

1. Can 2 dca's chase the same debt?

 

2. Ruthbridge will have committed an offence on Friday so what do I do next?

 

3. Who acutally owns the debt Hillesden or Ruthbridge?

 

The orginal debt was for Welcome finance back in 2002 and due a long term illnesss and losing my job as a result I was unable to continue payments.

 

 

Any help with this will be gratefully appreciated.

 

Lan

 

1. No, they can't - it's against OFT guidelines. Report them.

 

2. They've already been naughty by pursuing you for the debt while not producing the CCA - again, agaisnt OFt guidelines, again - report them.

 

3. Absolutely no idea - it's very difficult to say under these circumstances. Contact your local TS and see if they can help you to get to the bottom of it.

[LAN01]

Thanks Tiglet I thought as much but just wanted to hear it from someone else

 

Is there a letter that I send to Ruthbridge re their non-compliance and offence and to notify that they are to remove my details etc from their records?

 

Lan

[tiglet]

Yup, look in the library.

[LAN01]

I can't find the letter I am looking for, can someone point me in the right direction.

 

I am looking for the letter to send to a dca who has failed to provide me my CCA request.

 

Thanks

[tiglet]

I can't find it, so amend this:

 

Your address

Their address

Date

Dear Sir/Madam

Re: − Reference Number xxxx

With reference to my letter dated xx/xx/xxwhich was delivered via recorded delivery to your offices on xx/xx/xx.

In my letter, I made a formal request for a copy of the signed, executed credit agreement for the above numbered xxx account under section 77(1) and section 78(1) of the Consumer Credit Act. In addition, a statement of my account should have been sent along with any other document mentioned in the credit agreement.

The Consumer Credit Act allows 12 working days for this request to be carried out before your company enter into a default situation. If the request is not satisfied after a further 30 calendar days, your company commit an offence. These time limits expired on xx/xx/xx and xx/xx/xx respectively.

As you are no doubt aware subsection (6) states:

“If the creditor under an agreement fails to comply with subsection (1)—

(a) He is not entitled, while the default continues, to enforce the agreement; and

(b) If the default continues for one month he commits an offence. “

Therefore as at xx/xx/xx this account became unenforceable at law and it is now my intention to refer this matter to the enforcement authorities should I not receive a satisfactory response within seven days.

Any default notices or adverse comments your company have recorded on my credit reference file should be immediately removed.

Failure to respond favourably to this letter within seven days of receipt will result in immediate litigation being commenced against your company without further notice.

I await your rapid response.

Yours faithfully

Name

[LAN01]

Thanks Tiglet you're a star

[tiglet]

No probs - let me know how you get on.

[LAN01]

I have received from Hillesden a copy of the credit agreement requested in my CCA request last week. Now Hillesden have not attempted to request payments, I have had no correspondence from them whatsoever. I only sent the CCA request as they had a default on my cr file.

 

I have been hounded by Ruthbridge for the said debt and threatening bankruptcy proceedings if I don't pay up. They have defaulted on the CCA request and on Friday will have committed an offence.

 

Where do I stand now?

 

1. Hillesden have provided the agreement but there is no terms and conditions.

 

2. They have never chased me for the debt only put a default on my cr file.

 

3 Ruthbridge haven't supplied anything and are still chasing me for payment.

 

Any suggestions?

 

Lan

[tiglet]

Are you sure it is a complete CCA? The fact that they have not provided T&C's sounds a bit dodgy to me. The fact Ruthbridge haven't provided one means that once they default they cannot then hound you for the debt until they provide it. Let them default for the further 30 calendar days before you report them.

 

Check that it isn't an application form, is signed by both parties and has all prescribed terms etc on. Alternatively, scan it in, removing all identifying features (your name, address, DOB etc) and we can have a look at it for you on here.

[LAN01]

Hi Tiglet

 

It is definately part of a Credit Agreement but refers to terms and conditions "over the page" (which have not been included), from what I can see but I will scan it and post later on tonight as I have to go to work shortly.

 

The debt is from 2002 and with Welcome Finance, Ruthbridge are already in default and the further 30 days is up on Friday (criminal offence commited so will be reported). At the moment Ruthbridge are the least of my worries, I just want to know who owns the debt Hillesden or Ruthbridge as surely they both can't!!

 

Both Ruthbridge and Hillesden refer to "their clients Welcome Finance" in their letters. I was of the understanding that only one dca was allowed to collect an alledged debt, because Hillesden say they are acting on behalf of Welcome Finance do they have the right to put a default notice on my cr file? Also if Ruthbridge are trying to collect why do Hillesden still have access to my info? Is this too not right and what can I do about this?

[tiglet]

Oh, I so sound like a stuck record on this forum . Report welcome finance to the OFT as you are right, they should not be using two DCA's for one account. However, it is possible that one of the DCA's is employing another DCA, so you may want to call them both and double check exactly who their client is.

 

It gets very confusing in their murky world, doesn't it?

[Sparkie1723]

I second what tiglet has advised & only add give both companies a reminder of Section 40 of the Administration of Justice Act.

 

sparkie1723

[LAN01]

Very confusing, I knew this wasn't going to be easy, but for heavens sake the left hand doens't seem to know what the right hand is doing with these lot!! I will contact them both in writing as they don't have my telephone number and I don't want them to start harrassing me over the phone at this stage! I have searched the internet and haven't found a connection between the 2 companies, but I will certainly be demanding to know what is what!!

[LAN01]

Heres the agreement:

 

[Sparkie1723]

This agreement does not comply with Sectin 60 2 (b)of the COnsumer Credit Act Form & content of agreements...which says must contain certain requirements to ensure that specified information is clearly brought to the attention of the debtor or hirer, and that one part of a document is not given insufficient or excessive prominence compared with another.

e.g the interst rate staes APR (big letters) but the mention that this can be varied is in the small print ( variation in accordance with clause b overleaf) this does not comply with that section.

the loan agreemnet should also state VERY cleary that it is a variale rate interest loan agreement and stated in the top section of the agreement (header). This is not a lawful agreement, it is full of holes.

 

sparkie1723

[tiglet]

I absolutely agree - the fact they did not provide the otehrs items they should have is a problem for them too.

 

Sorry, drinking wine - too stressed - will post in full tomorrow, no doubt with a splitting headache.

[LAN01]

Thank you so much you are stars!! and have just made my night!!!

[Sparkie1723]

Hi tiglet LAN01,

 

Just going to have one or to glsses of wine myself I've had a day and a half myself with my post.

 

Cheers both of you (hic )

 

sparkie1723

[LAN01]

I wish I could join you both but i'm poorly Ahh:(

[tiglet]

Whiskey - it will cure whatever ales you.

 

If it's flu, heat some lemon 7 honey and then add it to the whisky.

 

Not as mad as it sounds - honey has antiseptic properties and lemon has vitamin C.

 

Whiskey will help you sleep!

[LAN01]

Thanks for that Tiglet although it's not flu - yet!!!

[Sparkie1723]

Shame Lan01,

That means I'll have to have this one I'd put aside for you as well, hope you feel better soon.

 

sparkie1723

[LAN01]

Well I feel sooo much better this morning and I am ready to start fighting these idiots all the way!!

[LAN01]

Hi Tiglet and Sparkie

 

could you give me your thoughts on the above credit agreement sent by Hillesdens. I would like to get my facts right before I contact them again.

 

Cheers for all your help to date.

 

Lan