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    • Morning dx and thank you for your message.   With regards to your comment about them not needing to produce the deed, the additional directions ordered by the judge included 'a copy of any assignment o the debt or agreement relied upon'  so that is why I thought that point was relevant?
    • Sorry for the long post but I don't want to miss out any relevant information: My wife bought a car from Trade Centre UK and have been having nothing but trouble with it. Unfortunately we paid of the finance used to buy the car as we weren't expecting this much trouble with the car as we we though we would have protection as buying from a dealer. We are wondering if we can still reject the vehicle since the finance plan has been paid off. Timeline is as follows: 13/12/2023 -15/12/2023 Bought car from Trade Centre UK for £10548 £2000 deposit paid on credit card on 13/12/2023 £8548 on finance from Moneybarn (arranged through Trade Centre UK). picked up car on 15/12/2023 Also bought lifetime warranty for £50/month 25/12/2023 Engine Management Light comes on. The AA called out and diagnosed the following error codes: P0133 - Lambda sensor (bank 1, sensor 1) Oxygen Sensor. Error Message : Slow reaction. Error sporadic P0135 - Lambda sensor heat. circ.(bank1,sensor1) Oxygen Sensor. Error Message : Component defective Due to it being Christmas took a few days to get through to them but they booked me in for 28/12/2023 to run their own diagnostics. 28/12/2023 Took car in to Trade Centre so could check the car – They agreed it was the Oxygen Sensor and Booked me in for repair on 30/01/2024. I was told they had no earlier slots, and I would be fine to carry on driving car when I said I was afraid of problem worse. During diagnosing the problem, they reset the Engine Management Light. During drive home light comes back on. 29/12/2023 - 29/01/2024 I carry on driving the car but closer to the date, engine goes to reduced power every now and again – not being a mechanic I presumed that this was due to above fault. 20/01/2024 Not expecting any more problems paid off the finance on the car using personal loan from bank with lower interest rate. 30/01/2024 Trade Centre replace to O2 sensor (They also take it on a roughly 60mile road trip which seems a bit excessive to me – I can’t prove this as something prompted me take a picture of milage when I handed car in but I forgot take one on collection – only remembered next day.) 06/02/2024 Engine goes in reduced power mode again and engine management light comes on – Thinking the Trade centre’s 28 day warranty period was over I booked the car the into local garage for the next day to get problem fixed under the lifetime warranty package. Fault seems to clear after engine was switched off. 07/02/2024 In the Morning, I take it to local garage who say as the light gone off – the warranty company is unlikely to cover the cost of the repair or diagnostics and recommend I contact them when the light comes back on. In the evening the light comes back on and luckily I manage to get it back to the garage just before it shuts for the day. 08/02/2024 The Garage sends me a diagnostics video showing a lot error codes been picked up by their diagnostics machine including codes for Oxygen sensor and Nox Sensors, Accelerator pedal and several more. Video also shows EGR Hose not connected to the intake manifold properly, they believed this was confusing the onboard system as it is unlikely this many sensors would trigger at same the time but they couldn’t be certain until they repaired the hose. 13/02/2024 Finally get the car back as it took a while to get approval and payment for the repairs from the Warranty company. Garage told me to keep an eye the car as errors had cleared with the hose but couldn’t 100% certain that’s what caused the problem. 06/03/2024 Engine management light comes on again. Fed up I go into Trade Centre as I was just around the corner when it happened and asked them how to reject the car or have the problem fixed. They insist that as it’s over 28 days I need to get the car fixed under the warranty package I purchased and they could no longer fix the car as it was over 28 days. When I tried telling them it appeared to be the same or related problem they said they couldn’t help as I hadn’t contacted them earlier. I asked them if they were willing to connect the car to the diagnostics machine and tell me what the problem was, as a goodwill gesture, which he agreed to do and took the car to the back He came back around 30 minutes later and said they took a look at the sensor they replaced previously and there was nothing wrong with it and engine management light went off when they removed the sensor to check it. When I asked what the error code he couldn’t give me an exact fault but the said it one of the problems I told him earlier (Accelerator pedal). I have this visit audio recorded on my phone – I informed the reps I was recording several times. As the light wasn’t on, local garage couldn’t book me for a repair under warranty. 07/03/2024 Light came on so managed to book back into local garage for the 12/03/2024 Whilst waiting to take car into garage, I borrowed a OBD sensor and scanned for errors on the car. This showed the following errors: P11BE – Manufacturer specific code (Google showed this to be NOX sensor) P0133 - Oxygen (Lambda) Sensor B1 S1: Response too Slow 12/03/2024 Took car to local garage and the confirmed the above errors. This leads me to believe that either Trade Centre UK reps lied and just reset the light or just didn’t check properly (Obviously I am unable to prove this) 22/03/2024 Finally got the car back as according to garage, the warranty company took a long to time to pay for the repairs 28/04/2024 Engine management Light has come back on. Using the borrowed OBD scanner I am getting the following codes: P0133 - Oxygen (Lambda) Sensor B1 S1: Response too Slow P2138 - Accelerator Position Sensors (G79) / (G185): Implausible Correlation I have not yet booked into a garage as I wanted to see what my rights are in terms of rejecting the car as to me the faults seem related. I can’t keep using taxi or train to get to work every time the car goes into the garage as it is getting very expensive. Am I right in thinking that they have used up their chance to repair when they conducted the repair end of January or when they refused to repair it in February ? If I am still able to reject the vehicle could you point to any sample letters or emails I can use. Thankyou for your advice on my next steps.
    • Ok noted about the screenshot uploads. In terms of screwing up I had one previous ticket that defaulted and ended up in a CCJ from Southend airport because for some reason during COVID I didn't receive their claim form just a notice of default. This hospital ticket was the 2nd ticket that went to CCJ due to a lack of knowledge of the process. Maybe it's easier just to pay them in future I'm thinking though, I don't get them very often anyway
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      On 15/1/24 booked appointment with Big Motoring World (BMW) to view a mini on 17/1/24 at 8pm at their Enfield dealership.  

      Car was dirty and test drive was two circuits of roundabout on entry to the showroom.  Was p/x my car and rushed by sales exec and a manager into buying the mini and a 3yr warranty that night, sale all wrapped up by 10pm.  They strongly advised me taking warranty out on car that age (2017) and confirmed it was honoured at over 500 UK registered garages.

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    • We have finally managed to obtain the transcript of this case.

      The judge's reasoning is very useful and will certainly be helpful in any other cases relating to third-party rights where the customer has contracted with the courier company by using a broker.
      This is generally speaking the problem with using PackLink who are domiciled in Spain and very conveniently out of reach of the British justice system.

      Frankly I don't think that is any accident.

      One of the points that the judge made was that the customers contract with the broker specifically refers to the courier – and it is clear that the courier knows that they are acting for a third party. There is no need to name the third party. They just have to be recognisably part of a class of person – such as a sender or a recipient of the parcel.

      Please note that a recent case against UPS failed on exactly the same issue with the judge held that the Contracts (Rights of Third Parties) Act 1999 did not apply.

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      OT APPROVED, 365MC637, FAROOQ, EVRi, 12.07.23 (BRENT) - J v4.pdf
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How to raise a court action in Scotland when living in England


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I have gone through the process as advised in the website - obtained statements from RBS for last six years, written requesting the £7k in charges over the period and they have now offered me £1,800. I've rejected this and would like to lodge a court action. My account is with a scottish branch but I live in England. Do i lodge the action in England or Scotland ?

 

Thanks

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Hi

 

I looking at starting an action in the Sherriff Court next week and have found the court staff really helpful.

 

You can download the claim forms here

http://www.scotcourts.gov.uk/sheriff/small_claims/forms.asp

There is also a helpful information booklet

http://www.scotcourts.gov.uk/sheriff/small_claims/guidance_notes.asp

The CAB have some basic information here http://www.adviceguide.org.uk/scotland/your_rights/legal_system_scotland/small_claims_in_the_sheriff_court_scotland.htm

 

A couple of points you may want to consider regarding the difference between the two systems:

 

1. Limit for small claims is only £750 ( £5000 In England & Wales)

There is a process for a higher amount but a different form

 

2. Most small claim matter in England and Wales in my experience are held 'in Chambers' which is the District Judge's Office, although still formal it is less intimitating than open court.

 

In Scotland I understand that most civil issue such as Small claim are in open court.

 

One final thing, in our local court civil matters are only heard every 2 weeks on one particular day, so it may be a large County Court in England, which would be your local court anyway, may process any claim more quickly.

 

Good luck where ever you decision to go.

RBOS - £1435.00 LBA - 2/5/06 - rtn date 6/07 -hearing 13./07 Settled 1st claim of £740 + costs in full.

 

Abbey - £1525.00 LBA- 8/5/06

 

Clydesdale -£1738.10 - LBA 16/06/06

"that will be my money, non?"

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Mags, Definitely England, where the small claims limit is £5000, not £750 like in Scotland. Because you are a consumer you can sue in the court nearest you. Use moneyclaim and do it for the first £5000 worth of charges only. Once that's all done and dusted (i.e. they've settled), do another one for the rest. Don't try and do two claims at the same time, or they'll just go to court and get them rolled into one big one, thereby taking you out of small claims.

 

When they offer settlement, make sure you don't agree to make it full and final for all sums ever, or you won't be able to go back for the second lot.

 

There are plenty of experienced people on the forum who will be happy to give you guidance and support, you only need to ask...

Robertxc v. Abbey - £3300 Settled in full

Robertxc v. Clydesdale - £750 Settled in full

Nationwide v. Robertxc - £2000 overdraft wiped out, Default removed by order of the sheriff

Robertxc v. Style Card - Default removed by order of the sheriff

Robertxc v. Abbey (1) - Data Protection Act action. £750 compensation

Robertxc v. Abbey (2) - Data Protection Act action. £2000 compensation, default removed

 

The opinions on this post are those of Robertxc and not necessarily the opinions of the group and do not constitute sound legal advice. You are advised to seek professional legal advice.

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Thanks this is good news ............. although I am still unclear as to how I can go through the moneyclaim site ie in England when the branch that has my account is in Scotland ie when asked for the defendants address it must be in England .....do I just pick my nearest RBS branch in Yorkshire ? If so do I need to write to that branch explaining my intentions etc and giving them the link with their scottish colleagues ??

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Ah. Good point, I had forgotten about that. Phone your nearest county court and ask them to send you the forms (or tell you where to download them). Moneyclaim is a bit funny that way. All it means is that you will have to fill in the claim by hand rather than online.

Robertxc v. Abbey - £3300 Settled in full

Robertxc v. Clydesdale - £750 Settled in full

Nationwide v. Robertxc - £2000 overdraft wiped out, Default removed by order of the sheriff

Robertxc v. Style Card - Default removed by order of the sheriff

Robertxc v. Abbey (1) - Data Protection Act action. £750 compensation

Robertxc v. Abbey (2) - Data Protection Act action. £2000 compensation, default removed

 

The opinions on this post are those of Robertxc and not necessarily the opinions of the group and do not constitute sound legal advice. You are advised to seek professional legal advice.

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If it any help at all, with people having accounts at RBS branches up and down the country and perhaps living in England/Wales with accounts in Scotland, one tip I could give is to state the registered office address of RBS as the Defendant's address on the claim form if you are issuing your claim in England/Wales.

 

Just because your account was held in Scotland and you now live in England/Wales - you do NOT have to start your claim in Scotland. You can start your claim at your local County Court (can't use Money Claim for defendants outside England/Wales).

 

Your Particulars of Claim MUST contain the following statement if you are using a defendant's address outside England/Wales:

 

"'I state that the High Court of England and Wales has power under the Civil Jurisdiction and Judgments Act 1982 to hear this claim and that no proceedings are pending between the parties in Scotland, Northern Ireland or another Convention territory of any contracting state as defined by section 1(3) of the Act."

 

Please note that if you do this, then the period of time for the defendant to file the acknowledgement of service or the admission is extended from 14 days to 21 days from the date of service of the claim (if the particulars of claim are served with the claim form) or 21 days from the date of service of the particulars of claim if they were not served with the claim form - remember, the deemed day of service is two days from when it was posted.

 

The time for filing a defence is 21 days from the date of service of the particulars of claim or 35 days from the date of service of the particulars of claim if the defendant has filed an acknowledgement of service.

 

So if a claim (with particulars of claim attached) was issued on 2 May and posted that same day, the date of service is 4 May. The date for filing the acknowledgement, defence or admission would be 25 May. If an acknowledgement was filed, then the date for filing the defence would be 8 June.

 

Sorry if this sounds confusing but it is quite simple really!

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This topic was closed on 09 March 2019.

If you have a problem which is similar to the issues raised in this topic, then please start a new thread and you will get help and support there.

If you would like to post up some information which is relevant to this particular topic then please flag the issue up to the site team and the thread will be reopened.

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